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Civilian Faction

ghost#6367 ghost Member Posts: 4 Arc User
Anyone else think a civilian/independent Faction would be fun to have? There are multiple starships in Star Trek that were civilian operated like the SS Vico NAR-18834 (an Oberth class Starship), and the SS Raven NAR-32450 (as seen in Voyager).
Post edited by baddmoonrizin on
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    rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 58,018 Community Moderator
    Would not fit into the narrative of STO. How would a civilian fit into the Iconian War or the Temporal War or fighting the Hur'q...
    db80k0m-89201ed8-eadb-45d3-830f-bb2f0d4c0fe7.png?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7InBhdGgiOiJcL2ZcL2ExOGQ4ZWM2LTUyZjQtNDdiMS05YTI1LTVlYmZkYmJkOGM3N1wvZGI4MGswbS04OTIwMWVkOC1lYWRiLTQ1ZDMtODMwZi1iYjJmMGQ0YzBmZTcucG5nIn1dXSwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmZpbGUuZG93bmxvYWQiXX0.8G-Pg35Qi8qxiKLjAofaKRH6fmNH3qAAEI628gW0eXc
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
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    ghost#6367 ghost Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited August 2021
    A civilian/independent faction could fit into the story there are mercenaries and independents (such as the Fenris Rangers) in Star Trek. With how bad the Iconian War was going the they did employ some in the war, there was a civilian named Ferix who commanded a ship in the Delta Fight mission.
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    paradox#7391 paradox Member Posts: 1,777 Arc User
    ghost#6367 wrote: »
    Anyone else think a civilian/independent Faction would be fun to have? There are multiple starships in Star Trek that were civilian operated like the SS Vico NAR-18834 (an Oberth class Starship), and the SS Raven NAR-32450 (as seen in Voyager).

    A Civilian faction like the Romulan Republic? It's literally their first rank.
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    phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 5,504 Arc User
    The thing is, it isn't a faction as much as just a background story for the characters. I already have a few of those, even a Federation one who's background was the Fed equivalent of merchant marine who were approached to do anti-pirate action and keep getting caught up in bigger conflicts.
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    davefenestratordavefenestrator Member Posts: 10,512 Arc User
    The thing is, it isn't a faction as much as just a background story for the characters. I already have a few of those, even a Federation one who's background was the Fed equivalent of merchant marine who were approached to do anti-pirate action and keep getting caught up in bigger conflicts.

    Yep. And one of my Federation captains is a mirror universe defector who crossed over with his Paradox ship and crew.

    You don't need anything new to have a civilian captain.
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    rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 58,018 Community Moderator
    You just need imagination. And maybe outfits. ;)
    db80k0m-89201ed8-eadb-45d3-830f-bb2f0d4c0fe7.png?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7InBhdGgiOiJcL2ZcL2ExOGQ4ZWM2LTUyZjQtNDdiMS05YTI1LTVlYmZkYmJkOGM3N1wvZGI4MGswbS04OTIwMWVkOC1lYWRiLTQ1ZDMtODMwZi1iYjJmMGQ0YzBmZTcucG5nIn1dXSwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmZpbGUuZG93bmxvYWQiXX0.8G-Pg35Qi8qxiKLjAofaKRH6fmNH3qAAEI628gW0eXc
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
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    spiritbornspiritborn Member Posts: 4,263 Arc User
    I mean my main is both a Starfleet officer and a(n honorary) member of the Royal Guard of her homeworld (sure said world is a Federation member but still), which is why her ship has Alliance vanity shield (as the white and yellow color scheme is similar to the colors I use for the Royal Guard).

    So it's not like you can't RP your character being something special, that said a full third faction is very unlikely as it would need rebuilding of several parts of the game.
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    lianthelialianthelia Member Posts: 7,825 Arc User
    ghost#6367 wrote: »
    A civilian/independent faction could fit into the story there are mercenaries and independents (such as the Fenris Rangers) in Star Trek. With how bad the Iconian War was going the they did employ some in the war, there was a civilian named Ferix who commanded a ship in the Delta Fight mission.

    When did Starfleet ever employ mercenaries? That wouldn't be their way...they wouldn't put civilians in harms way. You can say the Dominion war was going nearly as badly as the Iconian war...we never saw them use civilians.
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    paradox#7391 paradox Member Posts: 1,777 Arc User
    ghost#6367 wrote: »
    A civilian/independent faction could fit into the story there are mercenaries and independents (such as the Fenris Rangers) in Star Trek. With how bad the Iconian War was going the they did employ some in the war, there was a civilian named Ferix who commanded a ship in the Delta Fight mission.

    "As for Mercs go the Orion Syndicate are your best option, Nausicaans are slightly worst compared to the Orions but they still get the job done, Ferengi are a no go, they'll try to ask for latinum up front, try to sell you the crappy versions of their goods, then ask you to pay double the price for goods you already paid for plus their loyalty can be bought by the highest bidder, Personally I'm not sure if Romulans count as Mercs but they do get hired a lot by Klingon Great Houses." -The Klingon's Guide to Mercenaries PG 24
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    paradox#7391 paradox Member Posts: 1,777 Arc User
    "As for Mercs go the Orion Syndicate are your best option, Nausicaans are slightly worst compared to the Orions but they still get the job done, Ferengi are a no go, they'll try to ask for latinum up front, try to sell you the crappy versions of their goods, then ask you to pay double the price for goods you already paid for plus their loyalty can be bought by the highest bidder, Personally I'm not sure if Romulans count as Mercs but they do get hired a lot by Klingon Great Houses." -The Klingon's Guide to Mercenaries PG 24

    PLS don't look up this book up, it's completely fictional and made up, You can tell that that writer isn't a Klingon by how neat the writing is, safe to assume he/she/they probably sealed their fate the moment they wrote something Bad/Dishonorable about the Klingon High Council.
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    captainwellscaptainwells Member Posts: 718 Arc User
    edited August 2021
    As mentioned by others, one's own head canon view of their character is entirely optional. However within the narrative frame of STO an additional faction seems problematic as hell to me?

    Now, I would very much enjoy seeing the devs flesh out each of the factions that they do have by adding new featured story content in events that they can fit into the games meta. Frankly pushing the story content that was seems to have been eclipsed by the grand opportunity to entwine anything and everything that is part of CBS All Access (or I suppose now Paramount+) Trek series.

    But Discovery is now set further than our own 2411 time frame and that leaves an awful lot of wiggle room for following up on story threads that had served this game for its decade plus existence. Let's do try and get back to some of that too, shall we?
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    paradox#7391 paradox Member Posts: 1,777 Arc User
    edited August 2021
    As mentioned by others, one's own head canon view of their character is entirely optional. However within the narrative frame of STO an additional faction seems problematic as hell to me?

    Now, I would very much enjoy seeing the devs flesh out each of the factions that they do have by adding new featured story content in events that they can fit into the games meta. Frankly pushing the story content that was seems to have been eclipsed by the grand opportunity to entwine anything and everything that is part of CBS All Access (or I suppose now Paramount+) Trek series.

    But Discovery is now set further than our own 2411 time frame and that leaves an awful lot of wiggle room for following up on story threads that had served this game for its decade plus existence. Let's do try and get back to some of that too, shall we?

    I'm fine with another Faction I have at least one of each, however I wonder when Disco Andorians will become a priority again, they're not in game yet, they did say they were planning on adding other races to the disco faction besides Humans, Vulcans and Aliengen around when it launched.
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    chastity1337chastity1337 Member Posts: 1,606 Arc User
    this whole BS of no ideas is getting old. yes they have disco now and its being pushed to death.

    the fact they have no imagination or ability to come up with content should be whats discussed. even if CBS has been the culprit for lack of content, then maybe someone at the studio should grow some and tell them they need to loosen the grip a bit.

    im sick of hearing about the limited vision they have and that they only had maybe 2 arcs left to do. ugh.
    It has nothing to do with a lack of imagination, thats just a hand-wave buzzword people like to use to try to fling TRIBBLE without actually having to look at the situation.

    While the Star Trek IP is very large, much of it doesn't make for good game material, or has already been done.

    Just think about how many episodes of DS9 were about the Dominion War for example. Each of those episodes led into the next episode of the war, which in turn led into the next episode of the war, etc. etc. until the war ended at the end of DS9. While STO picks up from where that left off, it doesn't need to do a story for every, or even most, episodes of the war, since we already knew where the story of those episodes went. It just needs to pick up a select few episodes with actual dangling plot threads like "Sacrifice of Angels" with the missing 2800 fleet. The same is true of the smaller, but still rather long, Temporal Cold War/Xindi arc from Enterprise. Many of those episodes were just building on each other, and we covered that plot in STO as is. Those two story arcs combined are over 100 episodes of Trek, over 1/8 of all the episodes in Trek.

    Then there are all the smaller(compared to the above) multi-episode stories STO has covered
    • Seska and the Kazon(VOY)
    • The Borg stuff(TNG, VOY)
    • The Sons of Mogh vs Duras(TNG, DS9)
    • The fall of the Terran Empire/Rise of the Terran Rebellion(TOS, DS9)
    • The founding of the Federation(ENT)
    • The Fed-Klingon War, the Mirror Universe, and Control arcs(DSC)
    • Two parters like Unification, Time's Arrow, Year of Hell
    Among others. Which means dozens more episodes covered there.

    Then you have to think about all the one off episodes Cryptic has covered(Omega Molecules, the Kobali, the neural parasites, Iconians, Elachi, Solanae, the Dyson Spheres, etc.) or added the tech from into the game(Echo Papa drones, the android duplicates, the manheim device, Nomad, etc.)

    Even then, theres plenty of Trek episodes just about basic things like "an asteroid is heading toward a planet and the crew has to stop it", or "this planet's core is slowing down causing global freezing" all of which get totally resolved by the episode's end, leaving nothing for the game to pick up on.

    Out of the 802 currently aired episodes of Trek theres like... maybe 20 I could see them still using in STO. Most of which are the things I already listed.

    /handwave tl:dr mate.

    your BS meter is getting old. how much are they paying you anyway?

    This, exactly, and I've been saying it for a while now...

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    faxmachine#9639 faxmachine Member Posts: 120 Arc User
    /handwave tl:dr mate.

    your BS meter is getting old. how much are they paying you anyway?
    Ahh yes the typical "I can't actually refute the argument so I'm going to call BS and accuse you of being paid" response.

    Amusing to see the 4chan style of debate is still alive in late 2021.

    hey @rattler2 this guy is trolling again. pelase dont let him ruin the forums for everyone else.
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    phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 5,504 Arc User
    Only having one or two arc ideas left is not that farfetched, it is a form of writer's block. There are various ways around it though sometimes the best way is to write out "the only idea(s) left" and when you get to the end of that something else almost always appears.

    The infamous The Great Vegetable Rebellion from Lost in Space was just such a situation, but the deadline was so close that the writer did not have time to write anything else after writing the (in this case silly) idea out of his head to break the writer's block and the show ended up having to use the script to stay on schedule. He got a number of ideas once it was largely finished and some of those appeared in later episodes.

    There is no reason to think the STO writers would not follow that same pattern, only having those few ideas until they clear them out of their heads and into the game.

    There are a lot of potential storylines (though the devs might be waiting to see what happens in the shows this season instead of going for something totally original, which is understandable), even some potentially epic length arc ones, like for instance the idea that the Fesarians are so paranoid because they are sitting on some barely contained interdimensional (or whatever) threat that they don't want disturbed.

    There is also Delta, only a rather narrow corridor across a vast area is known to the Alliance and there is plenty of room for threats to appear out of the unexplored regions (the same is true of Gamma if you trust Jeffrey Combs and the DS9 writers when they say that Weyoun was lying as part of his propaganda job, among other things exaggerating the size and power of the Dominion to intimidate the Federation.

    And since it is hinted that PIC is going for a deep dive into time travel and alternate timelines care of Q, that could open a lot more story ideas as history thrashes around (especially since STO in general seems to be in a sort of relative calm eye of the storm where time/dimensional things happen around it more than directly to it).
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    paradox#7391 paradox Member Posts: 1,777 Arc User
    Only having one or two arc ideas left is not that farfetched, it is a form of writer's block. There are various ways around it though sometimes the best way is to write out "the only idea(s) left" and when you get to the end of that something else almost always appears.

    The infamous The Great Vegetable Rebellion from Lost in Space was just such a situation, but the deadline was so close that the writer did not have time to write anything else after writing the (in this case silly) idea out of his head to break the writer's block and the show ended up having to use the script to stay on schedule. He got a number of ideas once it was largely finished and some of those appeared in later episodes.

    There is no reason to think the STO writers would not follow that same pattern, only having those few ideas until they clear them out of their heads and into the game.

    There are a lot of potential storylines (though the devs might be waiting to see what happens in the shows this season instead of going for something totally original, which is understandable), even some potentially epic length arc ones, like for instance the idea that the Fesarians are so paranoid because they are sitting on some barely contained interdimensional (or whatever) threat that they don't want disturbed.

    There is also Delta, only a rather narrow corridor across a vast area is known to the Alliance and there is plenty of room for threats to appear out of the unexplored regions (the same is true of Gamma if you trust Jeffrey Combs and the DS9 writers when they say that Weyoun was lying as part of his propaganda job, among other things exaggerating the size and power of the Dominion to intimidate the Federation.

    And since it is hinted that PIC is going for a deep dive into time travel and alternate timelines care of Q, that could open a lot more story ideas as history thrashes around (especially since STO in general seems to be in a sort of relative calm eye of the storm where time/dimensional things happen around it more than directly to it).

    With PIC season 1 we got some insight into romulan culture, it's not much but we still learn more about them than the previous entries.
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    protoneousprotoneous Member Posts: 2,985 Arc User
    /handwave tl:dr mate.

    your BS meter is getting old. how much are they paying you anyway?
    Ahh yes the typical "I can't actually refute the argument so I'm going to call BS and accuse you of being paid" response.

    Amusing to see the 4chan style of debate is still alive in late 2021.

    It's not so much an argument. I find the "only 1-2 more story arc ideas left for STO" statement rather hard to believe as well. It's just my personal belief so I wouldn't read anything into it. No idea what four channel is, I just play STO :smile:
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    phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 5,504 Arc User
    protoneous wrote: »
    /handwave tl:dr mate.

    your BS meter is getting old. how much are they paying you anyway?
    Ahh yes the typical "I can't actually refute the argument so I'm going to call BS and accuse you of being paid" response.

    Amusing to see the 4chan style of debate is still alive in late 2021.

    It's not so much an argument. I find the "only 1-2 more story arc ideas left for STO" statement rather hard to believe as well. It's just my personal belief so I wouldn't read anything into it. No idea what four channel is, I just play STO :smile:

    It is not "four channel", it is 4-chan, a chat site that has a very bad reputation for trolling, extreme flaming, extreme views, and other bad and questionable behavior.
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    protoneousprotoneous Member Posts: 2,985 Arc User
    protoneous wrote: »
    /handwave tl:dr mate.

    your BS meter is getting old. how much are they paying you anyway?
    Ahh yes the typical "I can't actually refute the argument so I'm going to call BS and accuse you of being paid" response.

    Amusing to see the 4chan style of debate is still alive in late 2021.

    It's not so much an argument. I find the "only 1-2 more story arc ideas left for STO" statement rather hard to believe as well. It's just my personal belief so I wouldn't read anything into it. No idea what four channel is, I just play STO :smile:

    It is not "four channel", it is 4-chan, a chat site that has a very bad reputation for trolling, extreme flaming, extreme views, and other bad and questionable behavior.

    Thanks. Had no idea. People have to watch reading that sort of thing. Too much of it might encourage paranoia and thinking everything is a conspiracy theory.
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    paradox#7391 paradox Member Posts: 1,777 Arc User
    edited August 2021
    It is not "four channel", it is 4-chan, a chat site that has a very bad reputation for trolling, extreme flaming, extreme views, and other bad and questionable behavior.

    The same could be said about Twitter, However we should get to the Topic at hand, Civilian/Merc faction would be hard, I could see the KDF or the Romulans hiring mercs but there's no way the Federation would use mercs to get things done they're all high and mighty and morally in your face about it with their so call Prime Directive, If you're a civilian can just ask the Federation for help unless you and your species haven't invented warp travel in which case you are doomed to die a horrible death and the Federation won't lift a finger to help you.
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    nixie50nixie50 Member Posts: 1,268 Arc User
    there is a LOT that can be revisited, especially from TOS. of the 60 odd episodes, probably half have not been looked at that could spawn a stand alone episode and be completely outside of the iconian narrative.
    Lower decks touched one. the Landru planet had started worshiping the computer again ( who was the idiot who repaired it?)
    There could be something going on with the gangster planet.

    From TNG we could return to the planet where the Irish and the clones were put together.

    a story along the lines of the first Cochrane story, a sentient energy cloud diverts a shuttle with the captain and 2 boffs

    u7acy6aymfw7.gif
    We Need BERETS in the tailor
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