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Increase the maximum ec and the maximum ec to sell in exchange

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  • nikephorusnikephorus Member Posts: 2,744 Arc User
    The last time they raised the ec cap the price of promo ships did not increase. They remained relatively the same, but now players could just get them on the exchange instead of having to seek out the players selling promo ships. The increase in prices for everything that we see now over the last couple years is tied to the price of dilithium/zen. The exchange rate only 2ish years ago was 300 to 1. Now we are at 500/1.
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  • nikephorusnikephorus Member Posts: 2,744 Arc User
    nikephorus wrote: »
    The last time they raised the ec cap the price of promo ships did not increase. They remained relatively the same, but now players could just get them on the exchange instead of having to seek out the players selling promo ships. The increase in prices for everything that we see now over the last couple years is tied to the price of dilithium/zen. The exchange rate only 2ish years ago was 300 to 1. Now we are at 500/1.

    Part of that can be chalked up to the fact that there's a whole lot more (and ever-increasing) demand for zen, whereas the game has, at best, a drip-feed worth of new things added to do with dilithium. And some of that was outright eliminated when Klingon admiralty campaign changed to fleet ore vouchers. Furthermore, being that the game is F2P, as the player population goes up, the demand for zen goes up and so does the supply of dilithium, further magnifying the preexisting imbalance between them.

    Agreed. The lack of dilithium sinks has lowered the value of dilithium. The huge fleet project dilithium sinks kept that in check way back when, but right now the only dilithium sink I can think of are the phoenix boxes. Those are also really a temp sink and once your character(s) are epic'd out there isn't much reason for you to blow dilthium on those anymore so you might as well just convert to zen even with the terrible exchange rate.
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  • peterconnorfirstpeterconnorfirst Member Posts: 6,225 Arc User
    edited March 2021
    > @keepcalmchiveon said:
    > to be fair, while you and others (as a rule and whole, not to get targeted towards any single person) may have all your fleet projects completed, etc, in order to discuss dil details, please understand that some fleets are not done, and then there are those that are new and just starting. so those huge sinks are still a thing for people, just maybe not you or your fleet.


    Cool to see that not everybody thinks about himself in such discussions. :)

    Players who request dil sinks in form of fleet holding expansions aren’t the ones going for them. Their display of hypocrisy is beyond words in my opinion. As money spender for STO I don‘t mind to keep the game running for for everybody but I think a bit of honesty is not too much to ask for from the free2play crowds in return.
    Post edited by peterconnorfirst on
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  • doctorstegidoctorstegi Member Posts: 1,181 Arc User
    I doubt its necessary. This would benefit the few Exchange Market Players but surely not average Joe. There is other things in this games likes bugs that needs to be addressed first. The needs of the many outweigh the riches of the few.
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  • husanakxhusanakx Member Posts: 1,588 Arc User
    > @keepcalmchiveon said:
    > to be fair, while you and others (as a rule and whole, not to get targeted towards any single person) may have all your fleet projects completed, etc, in order to discuss dil details, please understand that some fleets are not done, and then there are those that are new and just starting. so those huge sinks are still a thing for people, just maybe not you or your fleet.


    Cool to see that not everybody thinks about himself in such discussions. :)

    Players who request dil sinks in form of fleet holding expansions aren’t the ones going for them. Their display of hypocrisy is beyond words in my opinion. As money spender for STO I don‘t mind to keep the game running for for everybody but I think a bit of honesty is not too much to ask for from the free2play crowds in return.

    That isn't at all true. I will say we need dil and EC sinks in new holdings. Yes there are new players no doubt.... but the game is mostly filled with people who have been playing for at least 5 years, and I would say there is still a good 1/4 of the player base that has been here for a decade. Of course there are still people working on the last sink the colony... but most of us are done yes. A new holding requiring more sink is required to keep the old players dumping their DIL and EC. The old holding are still there for new players sure. But anyone coming new to a 10 year old game is going to have a bigger hill to climb. Cryptic has done things to make those hills smaller but that is just the way it is. (and to be frank if you start a new fleet today there are a few holdings you can skip at this point or level to the first tier and ask for invites as most of their offerings have been power creeped out of relevance.)

    I am asking for another Sink holding... and my main toon occupies the #1 spot on my fleets finished colony. lol I have no issues dumping DIL and EC into my fleets holdings.... and to be honest its been nice to have the free dil.

    Its also not selfish to ask for sinks cause you understand it will help fix inflation. Inflation hurts new player retention much more then having 1001 things to donate to. STO has a lot of systems and is overwhelming for new players. However I would suggest many new players in any MMO take a look at all the real shiney cool stuff. I would suggest when many figure out that one cool promo box ship they want to make their long term goal costs 2-3 billion EC (assuming the cap does get raised and inflation continues ramping) they may just say ya never mind. Where as they are not going to start counting up how many GROUP projects are going to be asking them to donate $100s of dollars worth of Dil. Figuring out the more complicated systems isn't a first week thing.
  • husanakxhusanakx Member Posts: 1,588 Arc User
    > @coldnapalm said:
    > 1) If you tax the exchange, it is a given that private trade is disabled. If you can't even fathom that level out, maybe you don't understand nearly as much as you think you do.
    >
    > 2) Who said anything about 10%? I never said a percentage. That amount will vary depend on the game...but most are looking at 15% at least. 33% on the higher end. The percentage can be played around with until the amount that works is found for the game.



    I do not think that direct trade would need to be disabled here. There will be some who would use that rout for expensive stuff (they do so now already) but I don’t think that many will bother with trading channels or begin to run after others to sell their poo poo just to avoid taxes of 15-20%. I certainly could not be bothered with it. The exchange is too much of a help for my time. Moreover it’s not as if personale trades couldn’t be taxed as well the moment ec is flowing there.


    I‘m sorry @husanakx

    You present your arguments with lots of dedication and all. I understand that but can’t help to think that you only bring them up as you would not come out as winner in the scenario we discuss.

    Of course trading taxes would not correct inflation by tomorrow but it’s not as if had progressed that far overnight in the first place. It will correct things slowly in the long run and everybody will contribute to his respective capabilities.

    I have stakes in it as well. Both as somebody who grinds for EC by selling stuff but also as somebody who uses RL money for his gaming experience.

    15-20% trading taxes will not hurt anybody or ruin the in game economy.

    Like I said before I rarely have more then 40 items posted at a time unless I'm cleaning doffs off a toon or something. Taxes are going to hurt the listings of large items. Taking trade windows... I can't recall ever seeing that in any game. So taxing the exchange just promotes the thing raising the cap wants to fix. Which is forcing people to black market trading for expensive items. Which I get new players feel a little iffy about. If I ground the game for 5 or 6 months to trade for one item... I wouldn't want to be trading with a stranger either.

    The one reality I think we all forget about STO is that its a very small MMO. Yet of all the games I have played it has one of the most lively exchange/auction house experiences. I have played many MMOs with 10x the player base and the markets just don't move the same way. Cryptic has done a good job of leaving most items open to trade... and encouraging people to trade them easily. Taxes in every game I have ever played simply expand the trade channels... it makes it harder for players to grab things. Hey I play some odd hours sometimes, and in many games during those hours I either can't find the thing I want to trade for... or the people on at that time looking to trade don't even speak English. lol We don't want that for STO with its relatively small player base.

    Cryptic can sink EC in this game without... requiring everyone to pay a toll every time they want to buy something. It is always the buyers that end up paying the price... sellers just adjust up which is funny as inflation is what people seem to think a tax will fix... it causes inflation in the short term and with the amount of existing EC in this game that short term could be counted in years. At some point it will make a dent but considering the amount of EC many people have amassed don't expect that to happen very fast.

    IMO Cryptic simply needs to expand some sinks/fix some things/and add a couple new things.

    This is exactly the low effort things I would do to fix EC inflation IMO relatively quickly.
    1) - set the vender value of all reputation loot to zero. (we all have a reputation mark->dil sink 10k EC per one hour project... but the drop boxes reward anywhere from 7-14k back when you vender the junk making this sink pointless)
    2) - add EC costs to fleet gear. Right now fleet gear costs Fleet marks and Dil... no idea why they don't also have a nominal EC cost. Consoles could easily have a 50k EC cost added... weapons 100k... superior traits a million. The numbers don't need to be crazy high but some cost could help. New and old players are constantly buying fleet stuff.
    3) - Clean up the Infinity box loot table. I know this is my mission goal and it might seem self serving. However yes we need to drastically increase the supply of items of value in the market. I have posted about it at length but EC sequestration is a thing... and more people with supplies of items to plug pricing holes keeps costs down.

    Down the road with new holdings ect Cryptic could decide at that point if they need sinks for Dil or EC and how much... I do believe things to actually do with EC is a better way of destroying it. Then throwing a big wet blanket on the market or on trading or both. The market is one of the high points of Cryptics game... its one of the only areas of the game where I can say without a doubt they are doing this part of their game better then anyone else in the F2P game segment.
  • mikewallace#2209 mikewallace Member Posts: 106 Arc User
    edited March 2021
    I doubt its necessary. This would benefit the few Exchange Market Players but surely not average Joe. There is other things in this games likes bugs that needs to be addressed first. The needs of the many outweigh the riches of the few.

    I agree...not sure why this is still being talked about. It only benefits the gold sellers and those who play the market rather than STO. I would propose the opposite and decrease the caps.
    As soon as they increased the last one... lots of gold sellers saw $$$$ and started to ask for more. If caps are not ok just use the many Trade channels. They will never be happy with ANY increase amount...and sounds more like....


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  • davefenestratordavefenestrator Member Posts: 10,501 Arc User
    edited March 2021
    I doubt its necessary. This would benefit the few Exchange Market Players but surely not average Joe. There is other things in this games likes bugs that needs to be addressed first. The needs of the many outweigh the riches of the few.

    I agree...not sure why this is still being talked about. It only benefits the gold sellers and those who play the market rather than STO. I would propose the opposite and decrease the caps.
    As soon as they increased the last one... lots of gold sellers saw $$$$ and started to ask for more. If caps are not ok just use the many Trade channels. They will never be happy with ANY increase amount...and sounds more like....

    Nope. Right now some ships are only being sold through trade channels, which makes it harder and less safe for me to buy one. It was the same way before the last cap increase. After the increase the ships moved back to the exchange where everyone could find them and where sellers competed directly against each other to set lower prices and make the sale.

    I've never sold a T6 ship on the exchange. I've bought more than 10 ships from the exchange, because that's cheaper and safer than opening the gamble boxes.

    Gold farmers are (probably, I've never used one) happy to use trade, since they don't need to make their farmed items visible on the exchange, they can just "trade" them to the buyer for 1 credit. Assuming they don't just steal your money, account, and/or identity and run.
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