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What do you want to see from Star Trek: Section 31?

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  • jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 10,354 Arc User
    The original formulation of General Order One was "no interference in the normal development of a viable prespaceflight culture". Presumably once a species has left their homeworld, they can expect to find aliens in the Trek universe where almost every system has a habitable planet. And of course it left a lot of wiggle room for a captain to interpret "normal" and "viable" - and clearly, if something is about to cause an entire species to go extinct, that's not "viable", even if you might call it "normal". Also, it applies only to Starfleet - in TOS:"Patterns of Force", John Gill wasn't going to be prosecuted for violating the PD, because he wasn't bound by Starfleet regulations. (He was, however, going to get into trouble for going to a prespaceflight planet in the first place, because he never got the necessary permits, and he was probably also going to lose tenure at whatever facility he taught at, because he clearly wasn't that great a historian.)

    In TNG and later, it was turned into a shackle for captains and a hiding place for Federation politicians. I mean, you've got a frigging treaty with the Klingon Empire - assisting them during an uprising, particularly one backed by a foreign power, is not a violation of General Order One as given in TOS, as the primary criterion of "prespaceflight" is not met at all. But it might require the Federation Council to make a decision, and worse a potentially unpopular decision, so they hide behind the PD that doesn't even bind them.

    (Incidentally, that last should also be read a few more times by those who thought it "unrealistic" that the Council might want to wash their hands of the Romulan rescue mission after the devastation of Mars in PIC. There are those worlds that don't think the Federation should be worrying about helping anyone who isn't a member, and, as we saw in TOS:"Journey to Babel", don't particularly want to add new member worlds.)
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  • captainbrian11captainbrian11 Member Posts: 733 Arc User
    on the other hand they've clearly added new memebr worlds (Bajor was being GROOMED for it) so obviously things have changed on the wanting new members front. and honestly trhe Klingon decision was the right one, (I saw Picard invoking it as him playing politics more then anything) if starfleet had gone to Gowron's aide, they would have confirmed what Duras was saying about him, and Gowron would basicly have been branded a federation puppet in the eyes of the empire. (you'll note when the romulan assistance to Duras was publicly revealed their support collapsed) had starfleet helped Gowron with direct military support, they'd never have been able to leave. and when they eventualy did you could expect the new klingon regime to be hostile
  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,963 Arc User
    edited February 2020
    jonsills wrote: »
    The original formulation of General Order One was "no interference in the normal development of a viable prespaceflight culture". Presumably once a species has left their homeworld, they can expect to find aliens in the Trek universe where almost every system has a habitable planet. And of course it left a lot of wiggle room for a captain to interpret "normal" and "viable" - and clearly, if something is about to cause an entire species to go extinct, that's not "viable", even if you might call it "normal". Also, it applies only to Starfleet - in TOS:"Patterns of Force", John Gill wasn't going to be prosecuted for violating the PD, because he wasn't bound by Starfleet regulations. (He was, however, going to get into trouble for going to a prespaceflight planet in the first place, because he never got the necessary permits, and he was probably also going to lose tenure at whatever facility he taught at, because he clearly wasn't that great a historian.)

    In TNG and later, it was turned into a shackle for captains and a hiding place for Federation politicians. I mean, you've got a frigging treaty with the Klingon Empire - assisting them during an uprising, particularly one backed by a foreign power, is not a violation of General Order One as given in TOS, as the primary criterion of "prespaceflight" is not met at all. But it might require the Federation Council to make a decision, and worse a potentially unpopular decision, so they hide behind the PD that doesn't even bind them.

    (Incidentally, that last should also be read a few more times by those who thought it "unrealistic" that the Council might want to wash their hands of the Romulan rescue mission after the devastation of Mars in PIC. There are those worlds that don't think the Federation should be worrying about helping anyone who isn't a member, and, as we saw in TOS:"Journey to Babel", don't particularly want to add new member worlds.)

    Honestly, the Klingon Civil War another place where I think the Prime Directive is a red herring. Even without it, and even if Gowron wants Federation involvement, it's still not really a good idea to intervene, and not because of Federation politics but because of Klingon politics.

    The reason for the uprising is, Gowron is politically weak. Besides the fact he's a career politician in a society that reveres warriors above all others, he didn't win the chancellorship the "proper" way: he was just the last man standing after Worf killed Duras for reasons that didn't have anything to do with him. There's a perception among Klingon nationalists that he's a Federation puppet, and the Federation intervening to help him defeat a domestic political opponent would only reinforce that perception. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

    Fortunately, the same logic applies to Duras: exposing him as a puppet of the Klingons' most hated enemy (as opposed to a respected frenemy like the Federation) makes him look even worse, so his support quickly evaporates once the connection is proven.
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    — Sabaton, "Great War"
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    Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
  • alyxvixen#3895 alyxvixen Member Posts: 128 Arc User
    While I do not like Section 31 as an organisation, I did like that it was considered rumour, conjecture, myth, basically the boogeyman that lived under the stairs of Starfleet Intelligence.

    From Enterprise, all the way through the timeline (pre-Discovery being made) to the end of DS9 and Voyager, no one was 100% sure Section 31 was an actual thing, that they actually existed. And I like that about them.
    They worked better as a shadow in the background, not parading around in the light.
  • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,556 Arc User
    While I do not like Section 31 as an organisation, I did like that it was considered rumour, conjecture, myth, basically the boogeyman that lived under the stairs of Starfleet Intelligence.

    From Enterprise, all the way through the timeline (pre-Discovery being made) to the end of DS9 and Voyager, no one was 100% sure Section 31 was an actual thing, that they actually existed. And I like that about them.
    They worked better as a shadow in the background, not parading around in the light.

    Before Discovery, it could have been argued that Section 31 was a code used by Starfleet Intelligence for when they needed to do something extremely shady. If a Starfleet Intelligence officer is assigned the Section 31 code and isn't caught, then they go back to their regular Starfleet Intelligence post. If they get caught, then they are a rogue Starfleet Intelligence officer that believed they worked for an organization that never existed.
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