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Yet another DSC tangent
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in Ten Forward
This discussion was created from comments split from: why do people hate on this game?.
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Kahlesste kaase, I wish people would stop using YouTube videos to "prove" things. I could use YouTube right now to "prove" the Slenderman is real, and is stalking a group of twentysomethings in Alabama (as well as appearing in Florida, and being one of several supernatural influences behind a demonic-possession case in New Jersey). Doesn't mean any of it actually happened.
Speaking as someone who's watched the doggone show since 1966, I can attest that the idea that Trek has the sort of hardcore canon that can be "violated" by DSC is laughable. TOS itself couldn't decide how the warp scale worked, what their weapons could do exactly, the limitations of transporters, what Sulu's flipping job was... the list continues.
So Discovery is canon, but it exists in a new timeline created by the Red Angel.
Actually, the displays and consoles look like they cold evolve into what we see in ST5/6 quite easily. And there are still some push buttons and toggle switches.
Out of universe... its a product of modern advancement in technology and set design, as well as a much bigger budget. You can't expect something from the 1960s to ALWAYS look cutting edge vs something that can be made today.
Star Trek: First Contact - USS Enterprise viewscreen is holographic. Replaced with standard viewscreen in Insurrection and Nemesis.
There is also the possibility that the viewscreen on Deep Space Nine is holographic due to the fact that when inactive it shows what is behind the ring thing that acts as the viewscreen.
We also know in regards to the holographic comm system, that it apparently has some significant flaws, as shown by the damage caused to USS Enterprise that kicked off season 2. Hence why Pike takes command of Discovery. That kind of issue on one of the more prominent ships commanded by a highly decorated Captain recommending its removal would lead to the system being reassessed by Starfleet. It wouldn't be until DS9 that we have a more stable platform, and even then I think it was juryrigged into USS Defiant, and required a similar rig on the other side.
EDITED TO ADD:
Well, if it did it wasn't in the scene that I thought it was. I may be remembering dialogue that never happened. It is demonstrated though, as I mentioned above.
I know, I know... "Youtube as evidence," and all that. The last minute and 20 seconds or so demonstrate what I'm talking about.
It depends on when he was going to start a war with the Federation. As I said in another thread, he could have used the momentum of his victory in the Battle of the Binary Stars to start uniting all the Klingon Houses before his war with the Federation, but that would take time. T'Kuvma's main goals were uniting the Great Houses and preventing the Federation from corroding the Klingon culture. So T'Kuvma's actions could have resulted in the Cold War situation we had in TOS instead of the immediate war we had in Discovery. Also, having Kol in power instead of T'Kuvma would have changed a few aspects of the Klingons' plans. Kol was not interested in uniting the Great Houses since he expelled a bunch of them from the Klingon High Council. Without having to worry about what the other Great Houses have to say, then Kol could immediately start his war against the Federation.
In Season 1, the only presence we had of Section 31 was a guard when Burnham first boarded the Discovery which could have belonged to some other organization that wore black badges for all we knew at the time and Georgiou's recruitment scene. We never even heard of Section 31 in Season 1, but every episode in Season 2 has Section 31. Now Section 31 is everywhere, has a few highly advanced ships, and apparently its own starbase. Section 31 has more power now than before the Klingon War due to the Klingon War negatively affecting people.
We only know that the Enterprise has a problem with holographic systems not that other ships in Starfleet have problems. Discovery seems to have absolutely no problems with them and has far better food replicators than Enterprise. If the Enterprise-D has a Holodeck, then it should have been able to have a simple holographic communications system. All they would need is a prop on the ground for the holographic communication system and have someone stand in the the middle of the prop.
There is a difference between A holodeck creating an environment and holographic communications. Holodecks don't transmit.
Not only that, the Defiant didn't make regular use of that Holo comm rig.
Holographic communications are a simple technology compared to solid holograms so it makes far more sense for Starfleet ships to have holographic communications than it does for them to have only Holodecks.
It is easy for TOS to have a Holodeck and TNG to have holographic communications. Holographic displays would be either extremely difficult or impossible at the time. All that is needed for TOS to have a Holodeck is to have a closed door prop that disappears when needed. Holographic communications just requires a prop on the ground. So there is absolutely no valid excuse for why TNG never had holographic communications.
Also I want to point out that when Burnham was brought aboard Discovery and they saw guards with the Section 31 black badge, it was pretty clear those badges were atypical. Burnham didn't ID them as S31.
The reason for Pike being familiar with them is pretty much already layed out for us. He knows someone on the inside. Seems as though Leland and Pike have some history. Which to me indicates that Pike has had prior contact with S31. And being the guy who's trying to earn the trust of an untrusting crew, Pike may have decided to reveal more about S31 to them. Its not that S31 has gone public. Its that someone already knew.
Since we never saw how T'Kuvma was going to act after the Battle of the Binary Star, then it is pure speculation about what he would do if Burnham didn't kill him. He could have immediately attacked the Federation with a few Great Houses or he could have united the Great Houses and then attacked the Federation with all of the Great Houses united as one. If T'Kuvma wanted to unite all the Klingon Great Houses, then he needed the momentum created by the victory at the Battle of the Binary Stars. With T'Kuvma's death, Kol stole that momentum to take over the Klingon High Council and expel any Great House that didn't ally with him.
All that is known is that Burnham's presence changed the outcome of the Battle at the Binary Star with her attempted mutiny and killing T'Kuvma. Burnham killing the original Torchbearer might have also changed the outcome. After all, Burnham was not present at the Battle of the Binary Stars in the original timeline to attempt a mutiny and kill the Torchbearer and T'Kuvma.
The main problem is which timeline is TOS timeline. With the original timeline being TOS timeline and Discovery existing in a new timeline, then it doesn't matter if there is the Spore Drive, Section 31 having a massive presence in the 23rd Century, or whatever crazy new stories that Discovery comes up with that might violate established canon. Discovery could have a Borg invasion if they wanted to since it is in a new timeline. If Discovery is in TOS timeline, then Discovery has to explain its various inconsistencies. The Discovery is in a new timeline due to Burnham theory is a way for certain people to accept Discovery as canon since Star Trek is full of new timelines being created. The series finale of Voyager is all about creating a new timeline.
There are about 10 years between this and TOS. So there is time in universe for things to line up.
The spore drive would probably be dismantled altogether since it was damaging an ecosystem say. There are many reasons the holocommunicator could be phased out too.
Section 31 being actually known to people can also easily change. They could do something atrocious that forces them to officially disappear or choose to for the security of the federation or so they say.
Speaking of, Georgiou has 10 years of knowledge on everyone. Working on the assumption that we are not in a new timeline then the Defiant from a decade later took all that knowledge with it to Empress Sato.
There are a lot of possibilities and while there have been some bad decisions in the first half of season 1, it certainly cant be waved off. Mostly because it's still in progress.
I know this argument happened a lot with Enterprise that it was in a new timeline created as a result of first contact. And some people with more age in wisdom than I informed me that people once didn't consider tng canon.
Fanbase disgruntlement seems to be the most consistent thing.
If you are curious to how you found your way here? Freeze-dried rule. Just add water and you have a new one at the wink of an eye.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
-When will these become FCT's?
-What is the direct connection between this thread and playing the game Star Trek Online?