I still find it amusing how many of the complaints are really little more than " I don't like it."
In another recent feedback thread somebody also said that simply stating "I don't like it" wasn't sufficient. It's still feedback. You don't don't state why you find it amusing
No, I mean the multi-page manifestos where someone writes out an exceptionally elaborate, if incoherent, explanation of why Discovery sucks/shouldn't be canon/etc... and when you read it the actual reason is accurately summed up as "I don't like it." Case in point, the one Patrick posted just above.
I still find it amusing how many of the complaints are really little more than " I don't like it."
In another recent feedback thread somebody also said that simply stating "I don't like it" wasn't sufficient. It's still feedback. You don't don't state why you find it amusing
No, I mean the multi-page manifestos where someone writes out an exceptionally elaborate, if incoherent, explanation of why Discovery sucks/shouldn't be canon/etc... and when you read it the actual reason is accurately summed up as "I don't like it." Case in point, the one Patrick posted just above.
Ah, my bad. Tough thread to keep up. I usually find Patrick quite coherent though, but it's not my thing usually to engage in long debates regarding what's canon or the finer things of this and that.
I don't mind Discovery, think it's a positive thing that the game can actually be paired up with an active Star Trek TV show, and like many others said or thought to myself whenever a "new" series came out that it was going to be garbage at first and never live up to the previous one and then ended up enjoying them all. Seems to be a common pattern
I don't mind Discovery, think it's a positive thing that the game can actually be paired up with an active Star Trek TV show, and like many others said or thought to myself whenever a "new" series came out that it was going to be garbage at first and never live up to the previous one and then ended up enjoying them all. Seems to be a common pattern
I find the problem with this is that it is making STO into canon. If it is just going from Discovery influencing STO, then it is fine. However, if STO is influencing Discovery, then it is problematic. It already looks like Discovery Season 2 has Iconians and they look like STO's Iconians even though we just saw a silhouette of an Iconian.
> @angrytarg said: >This is false. I know youbare referring to a earlier trekmovie.com (?) article, but that turned out to be untrue. DSC's visuals are purely chosen for aesthetic/artistic reasons as stated by - I think - Kurtzmann. I am on my phone and can't source it right now but it should not be hidden too deep. >
I stand corrected, although I was referring to the interview John Eaves gave.
I don't mind Discovery, think it's a positive thing that the game can actually be paired up with an active Star Trek TV show, and like many others said or thought to myself whenever a "new" series came out that it was going to be garbage at first and never live up to the previous one and then ended up enjoying them all. Seems to be a common pattern
I find the problem with this is that it is making STO into canon. If it is just going from Discovery influencing STO, then it is fine. However, if STO is influencing Discovery, then it is problematic. It already looks like Discovery Season 2 has Iconians and they look like STO's Iconians even though we just saw a silhouette of an Iconian.
Why would that be "problematic"? It sounds awesome to me!
I don't mind Discovery, think it's a positive thing that the game can actually be paired up with an active Star Trek TV show, and like many others said or thought to myself whenever a "new" series came out that it was going to be garbage at first and never live up to the previous one and then ended up enjoying them all. Seems to be a common pattern
I find the problem with this is that it is making STO into canon. If it is just going from Discovery influencing STO, then it is fine. However, if STO is influencing Discovery, then it is problematic. It already looks like Discovery Season 2 has Iconians and they look like STO's Iconians even though we just saw a silhouette of an Iconian.
Cryptic Studios STO could be influencing the development of ST:D? Wow, that would be some feather in their cap and a big compliment to their writers, artists, and staff.
Ugh, TRIBBLE in STO? No Thanks. The Federation in Gene Roddenberry's eyes should be enlightened and good. In TRIBBLE the characters shout at each other all the time, and the Federation resembles the Borg more than the TOS and TNG Federation. How? The Federation in TRIBBLE is encroaching on the Klingon's borders. The Klingons fear getting assimilated into this mega-melting pot and simply wish the "Remain Klingon". Well, they have every right to do so. They are a sovereign species and if they want nothing to do with the Federation... bravo, that's their choice. This blows up in the SJW creator's faces as they stated "Remain Klingon" was parallel to MAGA and the Klingons were Trump Supporters (they actually stated this, you can search quotes online). The culturally diverse Federation is more like the Borg, assimilating everyone in their path. Congrats, SJWs made the Federation evil. TRIBBLE isn't Star Trek. It's a perversion of everything good. What is good? The Prime Directive. The Federation of Picard would have left the Klingon's alone and not encroach into their space. For all it's faults and violations, at least TNG, Voyager, DS9, and Enterprise entertained the idea of discussing the implications of violating the Prime Directive when they did so, and when they did, they had the moral high ground. In TRIBBLE, it wasn't even brought up. TRIBBLE is more like shouting and fighting in space, nothing enlightened. TRIBBLE is Anakin Skywalker's tantrums wrapped up and badged as Star Trek. Please do not make this perversion part of STO.
Funny, but more modern shows did a bang-up job of making the 60;s aesthetic look pretty damn good (Enterprise-"In a Mirror, Darkly" and DS9-"Trials and Tribble-lations"), despite it's dated look and effects.
Dated look for a set designed to look like its from the future is precisely why the 60's aesthetic applied literally doesn't work in the same way as it did in the original time period. TOS wasn't speculating on precise course of architecture through the next several hundred years, such that the time period in question was selected as the most likely point found by a generalized linear model for a revival of 60's fashions and stylistic sensibilities.
They made space look more relatable to its audience than other pop sci-fi did at the time (which largely indulged in creating distance between their subject matter and the audience to accentuate the mystique of their fantastical settings, which was their most vivid appeal) in order to help deliver more relatable character stories and moral problems which were central to that production (and all those that followed.) Discovery cannot be the kind of show every other Star Trek series and movie has been if it faithfully replicated the exact look of TOS. Even if it was competently composed, looking good is not the end of audience engagement, whether they care to think about it or not.
This is basic to understanding how art influences visual story telling. Let's stop pretending it doesn't apply to Discovery for the sake of convenience, apathy, or worse. This is one area that the production team got right with Discovery, and the visuals are one of the most easily translated elements to a modern video game (with writing, it's more difficult to carry over between passive and interactive media.)
So, basically, this is a long winded way of saying that the "look" has been updated to something more familiar to a modern audience. And I'm well aware of that fact.
I neither slam or praise TRIBBLE for it's visuals. I was just pointing out the fact that the old style was replicated nicely in those episodes. Nothing more, nothing less. Don't assume motive where none exists.
Ugh, TRIBBLE in STO? No Thanks. The Federation in Gene Roddenberry's eyes should be enlightened and good. In TRIBBLE the characters shout at each other all the time, and the Federation resembles the Borg more than the TOS and TNG Federation. How? The Federation in TRIBBLE is encroaching on the Klingon's borders. The Klingons fear getting assimilated into this mega-melting pot and simply wish the "Remain Klingon". Well, they have every right to do so. They are a sovereign species and if they want nothing to do with the Federation... bravo, that's their choice. This blows up in the SJW creator's faces as they stated "Remain Klingon" was parallel to MAGA and the Klingons were Trump Supporters (they actually stated this, you can search quotes online). The culturally diverse Federation is more like the Borg, assimilating everyone in their path. Congrats, SJWs made the Federation evil. TRIBBLE isn't Star Trek. It's a perversion of everything good. What is good? The Prime Directive. The Federation of Picard would have left the Klingon's alone and not encroach into their space. For all it's faults and violations, at least TNG, Voyager, DS9, and Enterprise entertained the idea of discussing the implications of violating the Prime Directive when they did so, and when they did, they had the moral high ground. In TRIBBLE, it wasn't even brought up. TRIBBLE is more like shouting and fighting in space, nothing enlightened. TRIBBLE is Anakin Skywalker's tantrums wrapped up and badged as Star Trek. Please do not make this perversion part of STO.
That is exactly what I meant earlier of "hamfisted" when it comes to TRIBBLE's approach to "social commentary" (which in this case, is the production team's and writers' biased political commentary). The social commentary of previous shows, with some exceptions, explored issues of the day with a good story, allowing the viewer to make up their on minds, and hopefully opening up discussion between fans.
With TRIBBLE, they tell you via the viewer's expectations based on their viewing of past shows. Federation (Regressive Left)=Good Guys. Klingons (Trump Supporters, Right Wing In General)=Bad Guys. The problem is that the current team seems to have forgotten that the Federation wasn't some leftist utopian pipe dream (except perhaps portrayed as such in the first two seasons of TNG, which was more hippy-trippy than leftist). The Federation has it warts. It has a very real dark side that made you question what was really the UFP's goals; and made the struggle between our idealistic heroes who bought into the party line against the enemy within much more engrossing. Instead of being the "good guys", the Federation was the "gray man" in the room, who will reach out to shake your hand and smile, but you don't know if he has his fingers crossed behind his back. Or worse, a knife ready to stab you with when you turn around.
In any case, I found myself sympathizing more with the Klingons, rather than the "heroic" Starfleet types in the first season (yes, I actually watched it. Wish I could get that time back), and I suspect others will or do as well. I have a sneaking suspicion that wasn't the show's intent.
Ugh, TRIBBLE in STO? No Thanks. The Federation in Gene Roddenberry's eyes should be enlightened and good. In TRIBBLE the characters shout at each other all the time, and the Federation resembles the Borg more than the TOS and TNG Federation. How? The Federation in TRIBBLE is encroaching on the Klingon's borders. The Klingons fear getting assimilated into this mega-melting pot and simply wish the "Remain Klingon". Well, they have every right to do so. They are a sovereign species and if they want nothing to do with the Federation... bravo, that's their choice. This blows up in the SJW creator's faces as they stated "Remain Klingon" was parallel to MAGA and the Klingons were Trump Supporters (they actually stated this, you can search quotes online). The culturally diverse Federation is more like the Borg, assimilating everyone in their path. Congrats, SJWs made the Federation evil. TRIBBLE isn't Star Trek. It's a perversion of everything good. What is good? The Prime Directive. The Federation of Picard would have left the Klingon's alone and not encroach into their space. For all it's faults and violations, at least TNG, Voyager, DS9, and Enterprise entertained the idea of discussing the implications of violating the Prime Directive when they did so, and when they did, they had the moral high ground. In TRIBBLE, it wasn't even brought up. TRIBBLE is more like shouting and fighting in space, nothing enlightened. TRIBBLE is Anakin Skywalker's tantrums wrapped up and badged as Star Trek. Please do not make this perversion part of STO.
That is exactly what I meant earlier of "hamfisted" when it comes to TRIBBLE's approach to "social commentary" (which in this case, is the production team's and writers' biased political commentary). The social commentary of previous shows, with some exceptions, explored issues of the day with a good story, allowing the viewer to make up their on minds, and hopefully opening up discussion between fans.
With TRIBBLE, they tell you via the viewer's expectations based on their viewing of past shows. Federation (Regressive Left)=Good Guys. Klingons (Trump Supporters, Right Wing In General)=Bad Guys. The problem is that the current team seems to have forgotten that the Federation wasn't some leftist utopian pipe dream (except perhaps portrayed as such in the first two seasons of TNG, which was more hippy-trippy than leftist). The Federation has it warts. It has a very real dark side that made you question what was really the UFP's goals; and made the struggle between our idealistic heroes who bought into the party line against the enemy within much more engrossing. Instead of being the "good guys", the Federation was the "gray man" in the room, who will reach out to shake your hand and smile, but you don't know if he has his fingers crossed behind his back. Or worse, a knife ready to stab you with when you turn around.
In any case, I found myself sympathizing more with the Klingons, rather than the "heroic" Starfleet types in the first season (yes, I actually watched it. Wish I could get that time back), and I suspect others will or do as well. I have a sneaking suspicion that wasn't the show's intent.
The Federation lives in a post-scarcity civilization where it has enough resources for any Liberal policies. IMO, it used to be the main difference between the right and left was pragmatism and idealism. The right would always ask how much this policy will cost while the left would only care about how much this would help now without thinking about the long term effect. If the bill never comes, then all types of idealistic policies are possible without having to worry about the eventual consequences.
Ugh, TRIBBLE in STO? No Thanks. The Federation in Gene Roddenberry's eyes should be enlightened and good. In TRIBBLE the characters shout at each other all the time, and the Federation resembles the Borg more than the TOS and TNG Federation.[...]
Maybe it's time for a little darkness in Star Trek, both in ST:D and STO. After 5 decades and 8 years respectively, all this goodness is getting stale.
I don't mind Discovery, think it's a positive thing that the game can actually be paired up with an active Star Trek TV show, and like many others said or thought to myself whenever a "new" series came out that it was going to be garbage at first and never live up to the previous one and then ended up enjoying them all. Seems to be a common pattern
I find the problem with this is that it is making STO into canon. If it is just going from Discovery influencing STO, then it is fine. However, if STO is influencing Discovery, then it is problematic. It already looks like Discovery Season 2 has Iconians and they look like STO's Iconians even though we just saw a silhouette of an Iconian.
Why would that be "problematic"? It sounds awesome to me!
It is the principle of the matter rather than about making Discovery better by having STO influence Discovery. Hard canon is always supposed to influence soft canon not the other way around. Besides STO is supposed to be about resolving various events in previous Star Trek series. The more Discovery introduces revelations from the other Star Trek series, the more the fans will wonder why the events in Discovery wasn't mentioned in TNG, DS9, or Voyager.
The Borg and Iconians were first introduced in TNG with the Iconians only being treated as a myth until Contagion. With the Borg in Enterprise and a huge possibility of Iconians in Discovery, it doesn't make sense for Picard to not know about previous encounters. Something similar to the Omega Directive where all information is revealed to the Captain when the ship encounters Borg and Iconian technology makes far more sense than keeping all high-ranking Starfleet Captains in the dark. Which is why I believe that Archer never encountered the Borg and Pine never encountered Iconians in the original timeline assuming that Iconians are in Season 2.
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
If STO becomes STDO, then we can just move on to greener pastures.
I for one will be enjoying it.
I'd bet you'd enjoy Eve Online if you like science fiction in general (not just Star Trek).
May want to give it a whirl....never know, you might like it.
BWAHAHAAHAAHAH!!!!
Sociopathy Simulator in Space? no thanks!
Besides I LIKE the idea of Discovery stuff in STO.
An interesting aspect of touch screens in Star Trek - they might actually have haptic feedback. With today's technology, we can use vibrations to create something like t hat, but usually that would be over the entire touch screen, not individual buttons. But in Star Trek, they could probably use force fields or other more advanced tech to create button-specific feedback. So a button could be harder to press, o rif you get close to it, you feel a light resistance, or a prickling sensation, or something like that.
Posted this in another thread, but just as relevant here:
Another thing I love about Discovery actually - the consoles, and how they work, make sense to the viewer.
Compare:
To
The DSC one simply makes more sense to US - the viewer. The buttons actually display their function. The button that activates the spore drive actually SAYS "spore drive". From the viewer's perspective TOS console buttons were just a random jumble of pretty coloured buttons, and TNG's consoles were just a jumble of colours and numbers that meant NOTHING to us as viewers.
The USS Discovery's Captain's chair interface is the best example of how clear the ship's console functions can be. Not some silly coloured buttons that tells us nothing about their function - clearly labelled buttons with actual TEXT on them:
:
While it may take longer to train someone to use TOS controls, it would also make it harder for invading forces from figuring out the controls. Think of the Klingons beaming aboard the refitted NCC-1701 in the Search for Spock. They had no idea that the ship was set to self-destruct, let alone how to shut it down.
> @starkaos said: > markhawkman wrote: » > > starkaos wrote: » > > protoneous wrote: » > > I don't mind Discovery, think it's a positive thing that the game can actually be paired up with an active Star Trek TV show, and like many others said or thought to myself whenever a "new" series came out that it was going to be garbage at first and never live up to the previous one and then ended up enjoying them all. Seems to be a common pattern > > > > I find the problem with this is that it is making STO into canon. If it is just going from Discovery influencing STO, then it is fine. However, if STO is influencing Discovery, then it is problematic. It already looks like Discovery Season 2 has Iconians and they look like STO's Iconians even though we just saw a silhouette of an Iconian. > > > > Why would that be "problematic"? It sounds awesome to me! > > > > > It is the principle of the matter rather than about making Discovery better by having STO influence Discovery. Hard canon is always supposed to influence soft canon not the other way around. Besides STO is supposed to be about resolving various events in previous Star Trek series. The more Discovery introduces revelations from the other Star Trek series, the more the fans will wonder why the events in Discovery wasn't mentioned in TNG, DS9, or Voyager. > > The Borg and Iconians were first introduced in TNG with the Iconians only being treated as a myth until Contagion. With the Borg in Enterprise and a huge possibility of Iconians in Discovery, it doesn't make sense for Picard to not know about previous encounters. Something similar to the Omega Directive where all information is revealed to the Captain when the ship encounters Borg and Iconian technology makes far more sense than keeping all high-ranking Starfleet Captains in the dark. Which is why I believe that Archer never encountered the Borg and Pine never encountered Iconians in the original timeline assuming that Iconians are in Season 2.
I’m sure the Borg were in ENT. Weren’t there remains found on a frozen planet then am not sure if it was same episode but didn’t they assimilate a ship and escape
I’m sure the Borg were in ENT. Weren’t there remains found on a frozen planet then am not sure if it was same episode but didn’t they assimilate a ship and escape
There is a difference between the original timeline and the timeline that Enterprise existed in. In the original timeline, there was no Borg Invasion in the 21st Century. Therefore, there was no Borg to discover by Archer in the 22nd Century in the original timeline. First Contact created a new timeline where Archer discovered Borg in the Arctic Circle not a frozen planet.
With the amount of time travel in Enterprise, I have serious doubts about whether the events of TOS, TNG, DS9, and Voyager happened. Changing the past changes the present. It can be a minor change with little impact or something major like Earth being completely assimilated by the Borg or millions of descendants erased from existence due to the Xindi attack.
There is the concept of predestination paradox where the Borg and Enterprise-E's crew had to travel to the 21st Century due to history stating that they already went to the 21st Century, but there is zero evidence that First Contact involved a predestination paradox. Just stop the villain from changing the past and restoring the timeline so it is close to the status quo. After all, restoring the timeline to 99.99% of the original timeline is better than it being completely screwed up.
Posted this in another thread, but just as relevant here:
Another thing I love about Discovery actually - the consoles, and how they work, make sense to the viewer.
Compare:
To
The DSC one simply makes more sense to US - the viewer. The buttons actually display their function. The button that activates the spore drive actually SAYS "spore drive". From the viewer's perspective TOS console buttons were just a random jumble of pretty coloured buttons, and TNG's consoles were just a jumble of colours and numbers that meant NOTHING to us as viewers.
The USS Discovery's Captain's chair interface is the best example of how clear the ship's console functions can be. Not some silly coloured buttons that tells us nothing about their function - clearly labelled buttons with actual TEXT on them:
:
I'll grant you that the ST:TOS controls needed updating and were silly at times, however, USS Discovery's controls are not appealing as the consoles or controls of a military vessel of the 23rd century in my opinion (and this is a matter of personal tastes). That said, I think it needs pointing out here the obvious reason why USS Discovery has "soft" controls. Isn't it supposed to be a science vessel? It's not a warship like Enterprise is right? If Enterprise has "soft" controls, or any other Federation military starship of that era is shown to have "soft" controls, then that's going to be rather silly in my opinion.
Advanced should not mean lesser quality or "soft".
A good example of what I'm talking about can be expressed like this.
Take an old rotary phone and hit it with a 5-pound sledgehammer--once--and chances are it will still function.
Do that to a cell-phone and see what happens.
That is "hard" vs "soft".
ST:TUC had a very nice balance of "hard" and "soft" controls.
The Enterprise-D doesn't have "hard" controls, but it also has children onboard, and is more of an armed cruise ship (Galaxy Exploration vessel) than an actual warship if I remember correctly.
However, the controls for the USS Hathaway in ST:TNG has "Hard" controls as we can see here where Riker and Worf are repairing wiring and printed circuit boards in classic Star Trek cheesy style.
The Constellation class was a warship (or at least in ST:TNG it is declared a warship).
In ST:KT the USS Enterprise has "hard" controls on it (kudos to JJ-Abrams for doing that).
Port side of bridge:
Starboard side of bridge:
Helm/Navigation/front:
There are push-buttons, control sticks, two flight sticks, throttle controls, etc., mixed in with touch-screens. Not as many "hard" controls as I think a Heavy Cruiser should have, but that's just my personal taste. I still think JJ Abrams did a fine job with ST:KT's Enterprise.
I admit that part of my disappointment with TRIBBLE is that is does not look like ST:KT.
I understand the legal reasons for that, but it doesn't matter. I can get past the Uruk hai=Necromonger look even though it is annoying. What is not something I can overlook--call it a weakness of an artist--is the total disregard for the Matt Jefferies style of starships. I don't mean the smooth hull, or having it look EXACTLY like the 1960s. I mean a total redesign that doesn't fit into the era of the STE-ST:TOS time period. If this were a totally new Star Trek Universe/Timeline, that would be fine. Maybe the Klingons developed entirely differently in a different reality and that would be great to explore. However, Aaron Harberts made the claim that this was "Prime" universe/timeline. Harberts went so far as to say he would show in season 2 how this fits into the "Prime Timeline".
Clearly he's not going to since he got fired (in my opinion that is a good thing).
I've said this repeatedly and will continue to express it. We can only hope that Alex Kurtzman will make TRIBBLE into the Discovery-Timeline (then its acronym will become ST:DT for me, which would make some of you happy I'm sure. )
Yeah and the crew want everything so readily made on DSC that if boarded and taken over they could just hit the "Push to go BOOM" or "Push to stop BOOM" button..There is a reason people get trained for stuff EVEN in real life..DSC is just a joke of a bunch of people, ally or foe, who have everything at their finger tips labelled big and bold..Sorry but DSC just doesnt work forme as a fan since the 1990's..
I'm expecting Batman-style labels on everythimg on board of my star ship. Everything. And it needs the prefix "Space-" xD
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Posted this in another thread, but just as relevant here:
Another thing I love about Discovery actually - the consoles, and how they work, make sense to the viewer.
Compare:
To
The DSC one simply makes more sense to US - the viewer. The buttons actually display their function. The button that activates the spore drive actually SAYS "spore drive". From the viewer's perspective TOS console buttons were just a random jumble of pretty coloured buttons, and TNG's consoles were just a jumble of colours and numbers that meant NOTHING to us as viewers.
The USS Discovery's Captain's chair interface is the best example of how clear the ship's console functions can be. Not some silly coloured buttons that tells us nothing about their function - clearly labelled buttons with actual TEXT on them:
:
I'll grant you that the ST:TOS controls needed updating and were silly at times, however, USS Discovery's controls are not appealing as the consoles or controls of a military vessel of the 23rd century in my opinion (and this is a matter of personal tastes). That said, I think it needs pointing out here the obvious reason why USS Discovery has "soft" controls. Isn't it supposed to be a science vessel? It's not a warship like Enterprise is right? If Enterprise has "soft" controls, or any other Federation military starship of that era is shown to have "soft" controls, then that's going to be rather silly in my opinion.
Advanced should not mean lesser quality or "soft".
A good example of what I'm talking about can be expressed like this.
Take an old rotary phone and hit it with a 5-pound sledgehammer--once--and chances are it will still function.
Do that to a cell-phone and see what happens.
That is "hard" vs "soft".
ST:TUC had a very nice balance of "hard" and "soft" controls.
The Enterprise-D doesn't have "hard" controls, but it also has children onboard, and is more of an armed cruise ship (Galaxy Exploration vessel) than an actual warship if I remember correctly.
However, the controls for the USS Hathaway in ST:TNG has "Hard" controls as we can see here where Riker and Worf are repairing wiring and printed circuit boards in classic Star Trek cheesy style.
The Constellation class was a warship (or at least in ST:TNG it is declared a warship).
In ST:KT the USS Enterprise has "hard" controls on it (kudos to JJ-Abrams for doing that).
Port side of bridge:
Starboard side of bridge:
Helm/Navigation/front:
There are push-buttons, control sticks, two flight sticks, throttle controls, etc., mixed in with touch-screens. Not as many "hard" controls as I think a Heavy Cruiser should have, but that's just my personal taste. I still think JJ Abrams did a fine job with ST:KT's Enterprise.
I admit that part of my disappointment with TRIBBLE is that is does not look like ST:KT.
I understand the legal reasons for that, but it doesn't matter. I can get past the Uruk hai=Necromonger look even though it is annoying. What is not something I can overlook--call it a weakness of an artist--is the total disregard for the Matt Jefferies style of starships. I don't mean the smooth hull, or having it look EXACTLY like the 1960s. I mean a total redesign that doesn't fit into the era of the STE-ST:TOS time period. If this were a totally new Star Trek Universe/Timeline, that would be fine. Maybe the Klingons developed entirely differently in a different reality and that would be great to explore. However, Aaron Harberts made the claim that this was "Prime" universe/timeline. Harberts went so far as to say he would show in season 2 how this fits into the "Prime Timeline".
Clearly he's not going to since he got fired (in my opinion that is a good thing).
I've said this repeatedly and will continue to express it. We can only hope that Alex Kurtzman will make TRIBBLE into the Discovery-Timeline (then its acronym will become ST:DT for me, which would make some of you happy I'm sure. )
Yeah and the crew want everything so readily made on DSC that if boarded and taken over they could just hit the "Push to go BOOM" or "Push to stop BOOM" button..There is a reason people get trained for stuff EVEN in real life..DSC is just a joke of a bunch of people, ally or foe, who have everything at their finger tips labelled big and bold..Sorry but DSC just doesnt work forme as a fan since the 1990's..
lolwut...
Have you seen ST:III? The Klingons who boarded the Enterprise didn't even realise the ship was set to self destruct despite the massive countdown on the visual displays everywhere! What makes you think someone boarding a ship would automatically be able to read and understand what the controls and signage meant.
Plus the flipside of the issue is that any time we see our heros beam over to the alien of the week ship, they always seem able to work the controls and pilot the thing within minutes anyway, regardless of the language differences.
Comments
My character Tsin'xing
I don't mind Discovery, think it's a positive thing that the game can actually be paired up with an active Star Trek TV show, and like many others said or thought to myself whenever a "new" series came out that it was going to be garbage at first and never live up to the previous one and then ended up enjoying them all. Seems to be a common pattern
I find the problem with this is that it is making STO into canon. If it is just going from Discovery influencing STO, then it is fine. However, if STO is influencing Discovery, then it is problematic. It already looks like Discovery Season 2 has Iconians and they look like STO's Iconians even though we just saw a silhouette of an Iconian.
>This is false. I know youbare referring to a earlier trekmovie.com (?) article, but that turned out to be untrue. DSC's visuals are purely chosen for aesthetic/artistic reasons as stated by - I think - Kurtzmann. I am on my phone and can't source it right now but it should not be hidden too deep.
>
I stand corrected, although I was referring to the interview John Eaves gave.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/comicbook.com/startrek/amp/2018/04/15/star-trek-discovery-enterprise-design-legal/
It wasn't that hidden.
Either way, as I said before, visual rebooting is a Trek thing.
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So, basically, this is a long winded way of saying that the "look" has been updated to something more familiar to a modern audience. And I'm well aware of that fact.
I neither slam or praise TRIBBLE for it's visuals. I was just pointing out the fact that the old style was replicated nicely in those episodes. Nothing more, nothing less. Don't assume motive where none exists.
That is exactly what I meant earlier of "hamfisted" when it comes to TRIBBLE's approach to "social commentary" (which in this case, is the production team's and writers' biased political commentary). The social commentary of previous shows, with some exceptions, explored issues of the day with a good story, allowing the viewer to make up their on minds, and hopefully opening up discussion between fans.
With TRIBBLE, they tell you via the viewer's expectations based on their viewing of past shows. Federation (Regressive Left)=Good Guys. Klingons (Trump Supporters, Right Wing In General)=Bad Guys. The problem is that the current team seems to have forgotten that the Federation wasn't some leftist utopian pipe dream (except perhaps portrayed as such in the first two seasons of TNG, which was more hippy-trippy than leftist). The Federation has it warts. It has a very real dark side that made you question what was really the UFP's goals; and made the struggle between our idealistic heroes who bought into the party line against the enemy within much more engrossing. Instead of being the "good guys", the Federation was the "gray man" in the room, who will reach out to shake your hand and smile, but you don't know if he has his fingers crossed behind his back. Or worse, a knife ready to stab you with when you turn around.
In any case, I found myself sympathizing more with the Klingons, rather than the "heroic" Starfleet types in the first season (yes, I actually watched it. Wish I could get that time back), and I suspect others will or do as well. I have a sneaking suspicion that wasn't the show's intent.
Mmm.... awesome.
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The Federation lives in a post-scarcity civilization where it has enough resources for any Liberal policies. IMO, it used to be the main difference between the right and left was pragmatism and idealism. The right would always ask how much this policy will cost while the left would only care about how much this would help now without thinking about the long term effect. If the bill never comes, then all types of idealistic policies are possible without having to worry about the eventual consequences.
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It is the principle of the matter rather than about making Discovery better by having STO influence Discovery. Hard canon is always supposed to influence soft canon not the other way around. Besides STO is supposed to be about resolving various events in previous Star Trek series. The more Discovery introduces revelations from the other Star Trek series, the more the fans will wonder why the events in Discovery wasn't mentioned in TNG, DS9, or Voyager.
The Borg and Iconians were first introduced in TNG with the Iconians only being treated as a myth until Contagion. With the Borg in Enterprise and a huge possibility of Iconians in Discovery, it doesn't make sense for Picard to not know about previous encounters. Something similar to the Omega Directive where all information is revealed to the Captain when the ship encounters Borg and Iconian technology makes far more sense than keeping all high-ranking Starfleet Captains in the dark. Which is why I believe that Archer never encountered the Borg and Pine never encountered Iconians in the original timeline assuming that Iconians are in Season 2.
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#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Sociopathy Simulator in Space? no thanks!
Besides I LIKE the idea of Discovery stuff in STO.
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While it may take longer to train someone to use TOS controls, it would also make it harder for invading forces from figuring out the controls. Think of the Klingons beaming aboard the refitted NCC-1701 in the Search for Spock. They had no idea that the ship was set to self-destruct, let alone how to shut it down.
> markhawkman wrote: »
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> protoneous wrote: »
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> I don't mind Discovery, think it's a positive thing that the game can actually be paired up with an active Star Trek TV show, and like many others said or thought to myself whenever a "new" series came out that it was going to be garbage at first and never live up to the previous one and then ended up enjoying them all. Seems to be a common pattern
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> I find the problem with this is that it is making STO into canon. If it is just going from Discovery influencing STO, then it is fine. However, if STO is influencing Discovery, then it is problematic. It already looks like Discovery Season 2 has Iconians and they look like STO's Iconians even though we just saw a silhouette of an Iconian.
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> Why would that be "problematic"? It sounds awesome to me!
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> It is the principle of the matter rather than about making Discovery better by having STO influence Discovery. Hard canon is always supposed to influence soft canon not the other way around. Besides STO is supposed to be about resolving various events in previous Star Trek series. The more Discovery introduces revelations from the other Star Trek series, the more the fans will wonder why the events in Discovery wasn't mentioned in TNG, DS9, or Voyager.
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> The Borg and Iconians were first introduced in TNG with the Iconians only being treated as a myth until Contagion. With the Borg in Enterprise and a huge possibility of Iconians in Discovery, it doesn't make sense for Picard to not know about previous encounters. Something similar to the Omega Directive where all information is revealed to the Captain when the ship encounters Borg and Iconian technology makes far more sense than keeping all high-ranking Starfleet Captains in the dark. Which is why I believe that Archer never encountered the Borg and Pine never encountered Iconians in the original timeline assuming that Iconians are in Season 2.
I’m sure the Borg were in ENT. Weren’t there remains found on a frozen planet then am not sure if it was same episode but didn’t they assimilate a ship and escape
There is a difference between the original timeline and the timeline that Enterprise existed in. In the original timeline, there was no Borg Invasion in the 21st Century. Therefore, there was no Borg to discover by Archer in the 22nd Century in the original timeline. First Contact created a new timeline where Archer discovered Borg in the Arctic Circle not a frozen planet.
With the amount of time travel in Enterprise, I have serious doubts about whether the events of TOS, TNG, DS9, and Voyager happened. Changing the past changes the present. It can be a minor change with little impact or something major like Earth being completely assimilated by the Borg or millions of descendants erased from existence due to the Xindi attack.
There is the concept of predestination paradox where the Borg and Enterprise-E's crew had to travel to the 21st Century due to history stating that they already went to the 21st Century, but there is zero evidence that First Contact involved a predestination paradox. Just stop the villain from changing the past and restoring the timeline so it is close to the status quo. After all, restoring the timeline to 99.99% of the original timeline is better than it being completely screwed up.
Yeah and the crew want everything so readily made on DSC that if boarded and taken over they could just hit the "Push to go BOOM" or "Push to stop BOOM" button..There is a reason people get trained for stuff EVEN in real life..DSC is just a joke of a bunch of people, ally or foe, who have everything at their finger tips labelled big and bold..Sorry but DSC just doesnt work forme as a fan since the 1990's..
Adu-Uss Firefox NCC-93425-F (LVL 65 FED AoY ENG) UR/VR MKXV Fleet Intel Assault Cruiser (July 2016)
Jean-Uss Seratoga Ravenna (LVL 60 FED Delta ENG) UC/R MKVI Bajoran Escort (April 2018)
Dubsa-RRW Mnaudh (LVL 50 FED allied ROM Delta ENG) Warbird (May 2018)
Marop-IKS Orunthi (LVL 50 KNG Delta ENG) BoP (May 2018)
Kanak'lan-TRIBBLE (LVL 65 DOM Gamma ENG) TRIBBLE (June 2018)
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lolwut...
Have you seen ST:III? The Klingons who boarded the Enterprise didn't even realise the ship was set to self destruct despite the massive countdown on the visual displays everywhere! What makes you think someone boarding a ship would automatically be able to read and understand what the controls and signage meant.
Plus the flipside of the issue is that any time we see our heros beam over to the alien of the week ship, they always seem able to work the controls and pilot the thing within minutes anyway, regardless of the language differences.