I'm sorry, but your friend Nirett needs a serious attitude adjustment. People "won't find folks like us to carry them cause they're forumites"?! Seriously?! That's one of the most preposterous statements I've ever seen made here. If for nothing else because... here it comes... YOU'RE a forumite too. "You ppl suck because you post on the forum regularly." LOL. That's one for the books.
What @tunebreaker is trying to do here is to build a bridge. Hehe, he always does that. With my friends and his, with my sources of information and his. It’s part of the reason why he is such a great guy because that is how life works.
Although Nirett’s comment is a bit harsh it is sadly true for so many players around here and the very reason why performance players tend to give STO forums rather a wide berth than let the negative parts of attitude pull them down. It’s not about bad players or evil persons or anything it’s just the general attitude that is off.
I mean we have players in forums which spend an unbelievable amount of time criticizing the very core aspects how this game works in PvE. They witnessed the most drastic shifts in meta and instead of embracing the good aspects of what could work for them rather reject it all on purpose. They do the same with advice and any helping hand they get offered. They will come up with every kind of excuse ranging from “I have the resources and time to get it done” up to “I have no one to tend to in game”.
As of right now there's no incentive to actually help others learn how to improve or even have them discover builds that fit their playstyle. Its all cookie cutter flavor builds of the current meta.
And honestly all these cookie cutter builds take some of the fun out of shipbuilding because "in order to be as awesome as X person you require EXACTLY this and this and this and this and a billion ECs..."
If everyone flew the same cookie cutter builds... what's the point of being able to customize the builds to suit individual playstyles in the first place?
There is so incredibly much wrong and false about this that I would not even know where to start.
The term “cookie cutter build” does not exist for players who like to have a successful gaming experience. They just take the useful parts out of example builds and add them to their own benefit and build ideal. The scrub sadly can’t do that as it would force him a slightly bit more towards some sort of competitive plain where he is afraid of.
Build examples were never meant to be copied and pasted, they are just meant to educate and give ideas as to what could lead to better results out of a near infinite combination of bad choices. I never copied builds; I just analyzed and look what I could use. While it is true that the 12 builds I ended up with share some similarities there more than enough differences to give me an entirely different experience on each of them. Most of the builds even get adjusted and optimized on the different maps I use them on.
Why and how does this work for me and not for others? The answer is plain and simple the attitude!
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
There is so incredibly much wrong and false about this that I would not even know where to start.
The term “cookie cutter build” does not exist for players who like to have a successful gaming experience. They just take the useful parts out of example builds and add them to their own benefit and build ideal. The scrub sadly can’t do that as it would force him a slightly bit more towards some sort of competitive plain where he is afraid of.
Build examples were never meant to be copied and pasted, they are just meant to educate and give ideas as to what could lead to better results out of a near infinite combination of bad choices. I never copied builds; I just analyzed and look what I could use. While it is true that the 12 builds I ended up with share some similarities there more than enough differences to give me an entirely different experience on each of them. Most of the builds even get adjusted and optimized on the different maps I use them on.
Why and how does this work for me and not for others? The answer is plain and simple the attitude!
At this point, anytime I see someone say that DPS oriented builds are 'cookie cutter' I just discount that users opinion. People need to learn to stop speaking about things they don't understand. If anything, copying builds is discouraged in the DPS community and has been for as long as I remember. Build templates are given for suggestion, evaluations are done on skills and traits that have the most use on certain types of builds and that information is made public. How it's used always has been and always will be up to the individual. Usually, when I post a build in response to someone seeking help I always try and make it clear that my build post is just for suggestion, so that they can go through it and pick and choose the aspects that they find personally appealing and give it a try. Of course, if someone wants to carbon copy the build, then I have no problem with that, but I always encourage people to mix in their own flavor.
Currently, I have 7 characters, none of them run the same build. Yes, there are aspects that are shared, but there are differences in all of them. I run with fleet mates that all have different builds from me as well and play differently then I do. I have certain things I prefer on a build that aren't part of the 'standard' but they work for me so I use them. Most players are the same way, they pick and choose what works for them. Sure, there will always be those that just copy the posted build, and if that makes them happy then why worry about it? If someone copies my build.. it doesn't hurt me in any way, but I always try and encourage them to find their own path.
For the thousandth time.. the 'cookie cutter DPS build' does not exist.
Currently, I have 7 characters, none of them run the same build. Yes, there are aspects that are shared, but there are differences in all of them. I run with fleet mates that all have different builds from me as well and play differently then I do. I have certain things I prefer on a build that aren't part of the 'standard' but they work for me so I use them. Most players are the same way, they pick and choose what works for them. Sure, there will always be those that just copy the posted build, and if that makes them happy then why worry about it? If someone copies my build.. it doesn't hurt me in any way, but I always try and encourage them to find their own path.
Hard to put into words how happy it makes me to read such stuff! As a matter of fact, if I had to bring it down to one single experience, one reason as to why it was/is worthwhile for me to log into this place it is that I got a chance to meet you in here and now can play alongside you in STO.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Also for giving ship building advice, I tend to be the opposite of you. I will give general advice for ship building, but if they need help on a specific ship with whatever restrictions they have, I give out entire builds that should be followed in it's entireity. Not taken pieces at a time. I pretty much always find that when I suggest that they can take parts of the build they like, they take the WRONG parts and than come back and complain that it doesn't work. So I find it easier to go, just do this. Use it until you can figure out better on your own. Or don't...because the cookie cutter builds I provide work just fine. Although, is ship build custom to your needs really cookie cutter? Shurg, in anycase, it is meant to be copied and run.
As always, you make some great points. There are usually things in a build that I will need to specify need to be used in conjunction, obviously someone shouldn't copy my DoFF assignments and assign 3 technicians if they are running a drake build or use Redirecting Arrays trait with cannons.. some of that stuff I kind of take for granted as obvious which I maybe shouldn't do. There are certain aspects of the build that if you're going to take that part, you have to take other parts.. generally though I mean they should use whatever weapons they like, consoles, engines, shields, etc. For example, I don't like Torps in this game, I don't use them on any of my builds but many do. When using my build as a template they will need to change BoFF powers and skills to accommodate that change.. I usually try to specify that, but overall you are right most builds work with a synergistic principal which makes it necessary to copy the build as given.
I have no issue with new players just carbon copying a build either, but I still encourage them to play it and learn how it works and then make tweaks to it if they want to change the way the build works. Heck, even experienced players do that.. I change up my builds all the time, but mostly because they keep adding new things or nerfing old stuff.
Hard to put into words how happy it makes me to read such stuff! As a matter of fact, if I had to bring it down to one single experience, one reason as to why it was/is worthwhile for me to log into this place it is that I got a chance to meet you in here and now can play alongside you in STO.
Thanks man, you too. Hooking up with OCD is what has kept my interest in this game and kept me playing. Otherwise, I likely would have quit a long time ago.
I'm sorry, but your friend Nirett needs a serious attitude adjustment. People "won't find folks like us to carry them cause they're forumites"?! Seriously?! That's one of the most preposterous statements I've ever seen made here. If for nothing else because... here it comes... YOU'RE a forumite too. "You ppl suck because you post on the forum regularly." LOL. That's one for the books.
What @tunebreaker is trying to do here is to build a bridge. Hehe, he always does that. With my friends and his, with my sources of information and his. It’s part of the reason why he is such a great guy because that is how life works.
Although Nirett’s comment is a bit harsh it is sadly true for so many players around here and the very reason why performance players tend to give STO forums rather a wide berth than let the negative parts of attitude pull them down. It’s not about bad players or evil persons or anything it’s just the general attitude that is off.
For starters, my own post was a wee harsh too, so I appreciate you not retaliating in full, and instead explain what he meant. Pure class!
Thinking about it some more today, I figured maybe some language barrier might be at play here, either on Nirett's end (or on mine, LOL). And that he probably meant something like 'Someone who rather argues and fights on forums, rather than ingame learn and socialize.' And THAT would make sense, btw. Because, to me, 'forumite' has a rather neutral meaning, little beyond 'someone who posts on a forum a lot.'
Again, kudos to you for explaining this!
As for the 'cookie cutter build', honestly, all I can say, is that I never understood comments like that. For one, if it were as simple as just copying your build, I'd be flying along in the same high echelon as you, LOL (which clearly, I'm not). It's always piloting skills, and understanding the game. Especially the latter, when it comes to ppl like you. Same -- while we're at it -- for Epic gear. I have almost everything Epic, and all the fanciest Lobi gear. Yet, no, Epic gear does not mean you become a top player. All having Epic hear does (in my case) is have you reach the ceiling of your own abilities: aka, you'll do well with the skills you have, but nothing magically beyond. Again, if only.
There is so incredibly much wrong and false about this that I would not even know where to start.
The term “cookie cutter build” does not exist for players who like to have a successful gaming experience. They just take the useful parts out of example builds and add them to their own benefit and build ideal. The scrub sadly can’t do that as it would force him a slightly bit more towards some sort of competitive plain where he is afraid of.
Build examples were never meant to be copied and pasted, they are just meant to educate and give ideas as to what could lead to better results out of a near infinite combination of bad choices. I never copied builds; I just analyzed and look what I could use. While it is true that the 12 builds I ended up with share some similarities there more than enough differences to give me an entirely different experience on each of them. Most of the builds even get adjusted and optimized on the different maps I use them on.
Why and how does this work for me and not for others? The answer is plain and simple the attitude!
At this point, anytime I see someone say that DPS oriented builds are 'cookie cutter' I just discount that users opinion. People need to learn to stop speaking about things they don't understand. If anything, copying builds is discouraged in the DPS community and has been for as long as I remember. Build templates are given for suggestion, evaluations are done on skills and traits that have the most use on certain types of builds and that information is made public. How it's used always has been and always will be up to the individual. Usually, when I post a build in response to someone seeking help I always try and make it clear that my build post is just for suggestion, so that they can go through it and pick and choose the aspects that they find personally appealing and give it a try. Of course, if someone wants to carbon copy the build, then I have no problem with that, but I always encourage people to mix in their own flavor.
Currently, I have 7 characters, none of them run the same build. Yes, there are aspects that are shared, but there are differences in all of them. I run with fleet mates that all have different builds from me as well and play differently then I do. I have certain things I prefer on a build that aren't part of the 'standard' but they work for me so I use them. Most players are the same way, they pick and choose what works for them. Sure, there will always be those that just copy the posted build, and if that makes them happy then why worry about it? If someone copies my build.. it doesn't hurt me in any way, but I always try and encourage them to find their own path.
For the thousandth time.. the 'cookie cutter DPS build' does not exist.
Not quite. There are cookie cutter builds. New players do it all the time actually. They grab a build from somebody and run with it because they don't know why or how it works...just that it works.
I'm not even sure *that* is true. I mean 'they don't know why or how it works...just that it works' is a rather tricky concept. Take tune's Constriction Anchor, for example (the one he used in the vid). I have it, but never really used it, thinking "What would I want with this rather meh console?!" Until I saw tune use it in his vid, LOL. And now I may know *that* it works, but still don't know how to use it properly. And, in my hands, I would likely still fail miserably with it.
Flying a ship is not like driving a car, where basically all you have to do is move. But a ship in STO requires considerable skill to use properly: not just to move around, but to fight with.
I'm sure all you top players are busy with your pre-made runs with all your longstanding contacts but for those of us mere mortals down here in the dirt we're looking at a very dead endgame. That's the sad state of things right now. I'ts easy to see things as nice and rosy when you're up on top above the clouds. Down here it's not so great a situation.
Right... before going on, I'll quote my friend Nirett here:
None of those forumites will manage a tough map because they're forumites. They won't find folks like us to carry them cause they're forumites. Perhaps they should try not being forumites.
I'm sorry, but your friend Nirett needs a serious attitude adjustment. People "won't find folks like us to carry them cause they're forumites"?! Seriously?! That's one of the most preposterous statements I've ever seen made here. If for nothing else because... here it comes... YOU'RE a forumite too. "You ppl suck because you post on the forum regularly." LOL. That's one for the books.
The word "forumite" (in his vocabulary at least) describes more the attitude towards the game. Those are people who have absolutely no knowledge about the game, yet they feel they are the smartest person in the world and it's incredibly unfair that they aren't listened to all the time. And they have the constant holier than thou attitude - "oh, even though you have those formulas that were approved by the devs, I still don't believe they're enough to prove what you say." "I know I only do 10k DPS, but I have an incredible amount of knowledge about the high-end DPS situation in the game, hence Cryptic should only listen to my solutions." And it is true that overwhelming majority of people who post on those forums very well fit that description.
I don't really get the forums. You complain about there being too much dps and how that ruins your fun in maps, about how stuff should be nerfed more. You want challenging content and then when it does come along you complain that you can't do that content cause it's too hard, cause you refuse to use builds that would actually work for that content. You also complain about how the queues are all dead anyway but you won't do queues like this cause it's too hard and you don't do well enough in pug groups. It's a bit like repeatedly punching yourself in the face and wondering why your face hurts.
I mean, this is exactly every active poster on those forums in a nutshell, not counting like perhaps 5-10 ppl (and no, I never considered you to be a forumite - have I been wrong about that assessment?).
I don't really have anything in this as I'm an average player on console...but I saw a couple of posts where someone complained about players coming into queues and 'riding coattails' or generally not being up to snuff for that queue.
Now if that player is new to the queue...maybe trying it for the first time or bringing a new build or even just to see if they can play the more advanced queues...do you try to communicate with them and offer advice? Do you just get angry that maybe they messed up your run and ignore them? Do you tell them 'get gud noob' (obviously I don't think anyone here would do that, but I include it for completeness as some players will do this).
There are many players who know nothing of the forums and might feel bad about getting trashed at an advanced queue, might be embarrassed to talk to others first for fear of being trash talked.
That expanding circle of players starts with everyone.
Its very tough to communicate on the console, but I usually try to offer a word on my plan at the start (I'll cover left etc) or a GG at the end and chat with anyone who says howdy...added a few friends that way as well...but it's important not to always dump on inexperience players.
Just a thought after reading your comments, sorry to butt in.
Thing is, with most advanced maps that I pug, it's hard to even notice when someone fails or not, cause I personally clear stuff pretty quickly. And even when they do, I don't consider that too big of a deal and move on. So I have to admit that no, unless they come to me later, I just tend to miss them. I do my own thing and don't really pay attention to others in a pug. But no, I definitely don't call them any rude words or anything (well, unless they say something impolite to me).
Thinking about it some more today, I figured maybe some language barrier might be at play here, either on Nirett's end (or on mine, LOL). And that he probably meant something like 'Someone who rather argues and fights on forums, rather than ingame learn and socialize.' And THAT would make sense, btw. Because, to me, 'forumite' has a rather neutral meaning, little beyond 'someone who posts on a forum a lot.'
Thing with Nirett is that he's been doing the same I have, only for years longer. First in other games, and then in STO even before I started playing. And he's incredibly good player, as evidenced from countless numbers of elites and that round 48 KMU I've done with him where he carried me. So seeing all kinds of ppl just shitting on his advice has made him disgruntled over the years. So yeah, he uses very harsh words, but in most cases he absolutely has a point. And as I've understood it, players in any online game's forums are just worse. Hence the term "forumite" to describe a person who you'd rather not want to associate with.
Take tune's Constriction Anchor, for example (the one he used in the vid). I have it, but never really used it, thinking "What would I want with this rather meh console?!" Until I saw tune use it in his vid, LOL. And now I may know *that* it works, but still don't know how to use it properly.
I only use it for the passive +23.7% bonus (cat2) exotic damage bonus, really. The clicky is, well, it's there, but in that run it only did around 330 DPS. In another HSE run I had saved, it only did 140.
Is it really rejecting the advice if you do not, in fact, actually have resources for that, though? I mean, I fully accept all these advices. I'm just not Crosis and not made of money, so I can't afford this.
The player who goes by the name Mito asked me to laugh over your comment and discredit you.
Lol, the use of the “forumite” term shows clear as day that some people think of this place as populated with less able or worse players (either in terms of ability or attitudes or tastes). It’s nothing but a derogatory term being used as an insult. There are those who whine and moan here yes. There are those who think they know it all and know little. There’s those who refuse to change or adapt and expect the game to move for them. But all of these types of people plus a myriad of others all exist on various in game channels, Reddit, fleet sites, Discord servers, teamspeak servers etc. as well. It’s idiotic to single out one area of the community and throw around spurious claims and insults about those of us using said media. I’ve seen plenty of idiotic arguments and posts on Reddit or in channels in game and even on Discord over the years.
We’re all trying to enjoy the game the same as anyone else is, the place we discuss it should have no bearing on how we are viewed.
The feeling I’m getting here from some is that e are being looked down upon all the time. We are just the idiot villagers whilst certain people sit in their high castles and resent us for not wanting to follow their ways, or not being good enough. There people like @peterconnorfirst who go out of their way to help and are really appreciated by many as a good honest and well spoken guy. But there are others within this thread who seem to throw little but sustain upon us mere mortals who are not up to their standards.
They witnessed the most drastic shifts in meta and instead of embracing the good aspects of what could work for them rather reject it all on purpose. They do the same with advice and any helping hand they get offered. They will come up with every kind of excuse ranging from “I have the resources and time to get it done” up to “I have no one to tend to in game”.
Is it really rejecting the advice if you do not, in fact, actually have resources for that, though? I mean, I fully accept all these advices. I'm just not Crosis and not made of money, so I can't afford this. Got anything for Ground?
The game is what it is Ruin. I cannot change that.
We have lots of items and traits around which simply work better compared to everything else. Some of it costs a lot; other is basically free from episodes and events. Much is standard from fleets. So far cryptic, somehow, manage to even halfway distribute the good stuff equally from the different sources.
Nevertheless to claim that it is easy to play for a high end build would be a plain out lie. I roughly would estimate that it would take a new player around 1,5-2 years of daily play of an hour or so to manage to set one up for a single character. The moment one has that I think we look at more like 20 minutes a day to keep a toon near top with max dil refining and ec generation being the top priority. And sure, the danger of nerfs and shifts in what works best is always there. If you have the resources, either because you play a lot or choose the path for RL money purchases you can speed things up a great deal of course.
The question as to if that is wanted, well worth it, has do be settled individually. Also how many toons do need to be on top? For me it may have become a bit extreme as I don’t play other games. But hey, there is not only top or bottom here; there is a wide range in between where peeps can end up playing the content successfully. Only if one fails to manage to uphold the fun in a game activity one would like to tend to because of the difficulty, then I think it’s time to act and make a few baseline decisions.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Lol, the use of the “forumite” term shows clear as day that some people think of this place as populated with less able or worse players (either in terms of ability or attitudes or tastes). It’s nothing but a derogatory term being used as an insult.
There are those who whine and moan here yes. There are those who think they know it all and know little. There’s those who refuse to change or adapt and expect the game to move for them.
But all of these types of people plus a myriad of others all exist on various in game channels, Reddit, fleet sites, Discord servers, teamspeak servers etc. as well.
It’s idiotic to single out one area of the community and throw around spurious claims and insults about those of us using said media. I’ve seen plenty of idiotic arguments and posts on Reddit or in channels in game and even on Discord over the years.
We’re all trying to enjoy the game the same as anyone else is, the place we discuss it should have no bearing on how we are viewed.
The feeling I’m getting here from some is that e are being looked down upon all the time. We are just the idiot villagers whilst certain people sit in their high castles and resent us for not wanting to follow their ways, or not being good enough.
There people like @peterconnorfirst who go out of their way to help and are really appreciated by many as a good honest and well spoken guy. But there are others within this thread who seem to throw little but sustain upon us mere mortals who are not up to their standards.
Sadly the game does not do much to educate. This is bad. Players rely on off game sources to get information.
Flying through STO and trying to figure it out on your own is like traveling at impulse while the help that is offered on the league HP (or reddit which I’m not that familiar with but what seems to work well for so many peeps) accelerates a player to warp speed.
I never look down to others and I know Tune does not do so either. Why should we? We know where we come from. I know for sure that he would like nothing more for you than to have a good time in game.
The three of us have one thing in common: We are PvEer, sadly a dying species in game. If you don’t mind the high performance some of us can deliver by simply utilizing what the game offers there would not be anything hindering us from playing along just fine. I know and tune knows that you can handle yourself in PvE very well and we would rather tend it together with you than with players we don’t know.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Lol, the use of the “forumite” term shows clear as day that some people think of this place as populated with less able or worse players (either in terms of ability or attitudes or tastes).
Yes. That's exactly what I think. Happy now? I'm in complete agreement that there are fair share of absolutely clueless idiots everywhere. And again, not everyone who posts on forums is a forumite. But nowhere else are they present in such a concentration than forums (well, perhaps only matched by Zone chat and some obscure in-game channels I'm not part of). Nowhere else in game I've managed to see such a display of utter stupidity than in here. In other places, there are plenty of people who can actively filter the bad seeds out, but not in here, because you've driven all the people who actually know something about the game away. Game and Cryptic's behaviour is stressful anyway, why try to even intensify it by hanging out in a place where you know you won't get any respect.
And you don't get it either... instead of trying maybe better yourself, oh no, you curl up and yell even more how all the others are just evil folks riding in on their high horses.
resent us for not wanting to follow their ways, or not being good enough.
Now you described yourself, or well, the forumites. I've never said to anyone that they should just go "DPS or bust" and there's no other ways to enjoy the game. But when you all constantly cry that you can't do this or that, and I then point out what you could do to improve, and then you figuratively kick me in the nuts and say "no, i want to do this or that, but *without* following your suggestions", then really, what can I do? Smile and nod my head "yes, yes, of course let's nerf Hive and remove the challenge from the content I very much enjoy in it's current form, just because you're not able to complete it?"
When people just come for me to get advice, I don't act elitist at all, and some people in here can confirm that. But when you, before or during asking that advice, constantly try to prove how bad of a person I am for whatever reasons, then you can't expect much respect from me either, can you?
That's easy for MITO to say, people just give him whatever he wants when he begs for it.
Since you have given stuff to Mito yourself, I don't think you should be complaining how poor you are. And I'm completely sure your net worth in game is at least hundreds of times bigger than mine, but you don't see me crying how I can't afford this or that.
Since you have given stuff to Mito yourself, I don't think you should be complaining how poor you are. And I'm completely sure your net worth in game is at least hundreds of times bigger than mine, but you don't see me crying how I can't afford this or that.
I believe Ruin built up his own Fleet, from scratch, and was the first person to have completed all of Dranuur even, way ahead of everyone else (quite an impressive feat, actually). So, his assets may not be liquid, but I always have a hard time fathoming ruin as space poor.
People always accuse me of being space rich all the time, which assuredly I'm not. But I suppose anyone with Epic gear is either 'Elitist' (when they're good, on top of allegedly being wealthy), or flat-out 'space rich.'
FFS Peter I was clearly aiming that post at someone else. Of course I respect your skill and advice. I can’t always follow it and sometimes I just feel happier being in my comfort zone. If that means I can not play elite stuff anymore I’ll accept that and move on. Some of us just are not physically capable of your level of play. It’s not about builds, it’s about reaction times, understanding the maths behind things, seeing things happening before they do. Skill in a game is not natural to everyone and some of us just want a bit of casual fun. I never called for HSE to get nerfed, in fact I’ve nearly always argued in favour of more elite content to keep you tip end players from being stuck with us people so you can enjoy a decent challenge.
People will either take advice or not, no point getting so wound up about it. And this place is no worse than anywhere else. The only difference is that it’s run by the game so to speak whereas so ever like Reddit is player run so can filter out the “unwanted” discussion I guess to make the place look superior. Even posting a build for advice on Reddit must be done with a specific format so it’s even then limiting what can be posted. Here, it’s just open to anyone and anything. Unless you go all out idiotic and a mod lock the thread anything can be posted from details build threads in any format to simple clueless newbie questions. And you know what? We all try to help out when we can.
I think a lot of this thread boils down to some people find the game hard and others find it too easy. And both sides are never going to see eye to eye on what should or could be done. You and your friends dislike seeing people ask for things to be toned down and people (for whatever reasons refusing help) and less able players don’t like being constantly told to buy x,y,z or told to “get good” by some people. The disrespect goes both ways and it helps nobody. Top players don’t like people disrespecting their achievements and ignoring their advice; less able players don’t like elitist attitudes and being treated like idiots.
I never look down to others and I know Tune does not do so either. Why should we? We know where we come from. I know for sure that he would like nothing more for you than to have a good time in game.
Truth right there. Even though there are so many people in here who have insulted me for oh how many times, at the end I just wish that they'd all have their own fun playing the game, just without having it at the expense of me or anyone else. If it weren't like that, why do you think I even hang out here anymore, trying to always give out advice as well as I can?
Since you have given stuff to Mito yourself, I don't think you should be complaining how poor you are. And I'm completely sure your net worth in game is at least hundreds of times bigger than mine, but you don't see me crying how I can't afford this or that.
I believe Ruin built up his own Fleet, from scratch, and was the first person to have completed all of Dranuur even, way ahead of everyone else (quite an impressive feat, actually). So, his assets may not be liquid, but I always have a hard time fathoming ruin as space poor.
People will either take advice or not, no point getting so wound up about it.
But then stop crying that everything's bad. You say you don't like something, I tell you what you could do to fix it, you tell me how you don't like my suggestion and... continue crying how you don't like it.
The only difference is that it’s run by the game so to speak whereas so ever like Reddit is player run so can filter out the “unwanted” discussion I guess to make the place look superior.
Oh yeah, I too remember last time Zooey deleted a post when someone told her that her Kumari was weak and should use different boff abilities... oh no, wait, it was instead when she got a death threat. I'm not going on a comparison between them and forum mods, since that'd probably be against the rules, but Reddit mods do their job very well and fairly.
Even posting a build for advice on Reddit must be done with a specific format so it’s even then limiting what can be posted. Here, it’s just open to anyone and anything.
No, it doesn't. It's just preferable cause Reddit build layout is just incredibly well-done and it's easy to exactly understand what the person uses, but you can use pretty much anything, from stoacademy to screenshots.
I think a lot of this thread boils down to some people find the game hard and others find it too easy. And both sides are never going to see eye to eye on what should or could be done. You and your friends dislike seeing people ask for things to be toned down and people (for whatever reasons refusing help) and less able players don’t like being constantly told to buy x,y,z or told to “get good” by some people. The disrespect goes both ways and it helps nobody. Top players don’t like people disrespecting their achievements and ignoring their advice; less able players don’t like elitist attitudes and being treated like idiots.
Yeah, but why not try to buy x,y,z and in the process, get good? It's not like majority of advice given is "buy those traits that cost in total of 100m, and then a DPRM that's another 200m". We give budget suggestions constantly, stuff easy to swap out. When people are struggling and complaining about it, the only logical assumption is that they want to improve. But when the players who are good are met with hostility and claims that they're elitist after trying to help, then something's wrong, isn't it?
And the treating like an idiot part partly comes from the fact that we're trying to cover all the bases. For example, recently I was building my tank and I was complaining to a friend that it didn't perform as expected, at all. He asked me do I have Honored Dead, a pretty cheap trait that's used on majority of tank builds these days. Now, if I actually had it, I would've probably (jokingly) said that "hey, don't think I'm an idiot or something!". But turned out I had completely overlooked it, so I got the trait and my performance improved. It's just hard to know what a person exactly thought about something or not, that's why we sometimes ask questions that could seem obvious.
You and your friends dislike seeing people ask for things to be toned down and people (for whatever reasons refusing help) and less able players don’t like being constantly told to buy x,y,z or told to “get good” by some people.
That's not what's happening at all.
The reason you have Normal, Advanced, and Elite difficulties is so that everyone can play according to their own skill or gear. Players aren't told to get good equipment to 'get good' it's because by design.. it's required to handle Elite Queues. These queues are designed with the intent that players will have top of the line gear and traits so yes.. we ask people to get that stuff before playing Elites. Even then, they don't have to have a perfect build by any means, the ship I play HSE with the most often has Mark XIV Ultra Rare Fleet Cannons. Not special at all but I still use traits and skills that optimize what I have.
To be perfectly honest, yes.. it's annoying to see players that don't or can't play Elites asking for nerfs on those queues. If the content is too difficult for them then they have two choices, adapt in whatever way they see fit in order to be able to handle the content, or play other content. In the case of Option two, Advanced Queues are available. I understand you're not asking for anything to be nerfed I am just explaining how some of us feel.
You and your friends dislike seeing people ask for things to be toned down and people (for whatever reasons refusing help) and less able players don’t like being constantly told to buy x,y,z or told to “get good” by some people.
That's not what's happening at all.
The reason you have Normal, Advanced, and Elite difficulties is so that everyone can play according to their own skill or gear. Players aren't told to get good equipment to 'get good' it's because by design.. it's required to handle Elite Queues. These queues are designed with the intent that players will have top of the line gear and traits so yes.. we ask people to get that stuff before playing Elites. Even then, they don't have to have a perfect build by any means, the ship I play HSE with the most often has Mark XIV Ultra Rare Fleet Cannons. Not special at all but I still use traits and skills that optimize what I have.
To be perfectly honest, yes.. it's annoying to see players that don't or can't play Elites asking for nerfs on those queues. If the content is too difficult for them then they have two choices, adapt in whatever way they see fit in order to be able to handle the content, or play other content. In the case of Option two, Advanced Queues are available. I understand you're not asking for anything to be nerfed I am just explaining how some of us feel.
I agree with Seaofsorrows here. It can be incredibly frustrating, when some people request or "demand" nerfs to the few queues we have left that have any real sort of challenge left. This is even more surprising, when people request it of the advance version of the queue. Which usually, demanding on the queue, can give you a small taste or consideration of what the elite version might be.
I browse the reddit forum, and build forum quite frequently. The people there are extremely helpful. and always willing to listen to people who say "i cant afford that, or it will take too long" and then they will suggest a cheaper alternative.
Sadly, some players are getting more and more angry or vicious when you try to offer them advice, This can led to some of this "gap" between player capability. It's saddening to see. Couple that with barely anyone talks or wants to talk in a queue, it seems for a good portion of the community, we are more disconnected or further from one another than ever.
There are multiple people who are responded in this thread, who are buckling that and trying to continue to keep the information flowing and communication channels. My hat always goes off to them. But these days, they are few and far between, and even they, can get worn down.
I’m not even sure what’s going on in this thread now tbh.
I’ve never called for nerfs to content, I’d prefer more content better suited to all abilities of players.
I’ve argued in favour of better incentives to get players into queues, because at the end of the day despite talk of channel x or y to get players, 99% of players dont encounter these, don’t read this forum/Reddit and as such are still going to miss out.
I’ll admit to difference of opinion with a few people here but I’ll never go and call them “filthy dps’ers” or discredit an entire section of the community based on where they choose to hang out. I’ll only get defensive when someone starts making assumptions that the part of the community I call home is worse than everywhere else (backing that up with offensive quotes from their friends as if to push the idea).
I’ve run queues with a few here, I’ve been in channels with some too. I’ll not deny I’ve had some good times with them over the years. But I’ll not hang around places I get threatened or insulted or told to lull myself by members due to difference of opinions. That’s not what I signed up for. That’s also why I find it hard to find matches nowadays, tmits difficult to find people if you’re casual and not aware of where to go to look for friends.
You what I really want? I want a nice casual game I can relax in without needing to chase the latest meta, and without needing to seek out specialist circles to play within all the time. I’d like a game with actual endgame that is popular and with a diverse range of queues that pop. The state of the game now is shocking and it’s pushing divisions within the player community in even worse directions.
I’ll admit to difference of opinion with a few people here but I’ll never go and call them “filthy dps’ers” or discredit an entire section of the community based on where they choose to hang out. I’ll only get defensive when someone starts making assumptions that the part of the community I call home is worse than everywhere else (backing that up with offensive quotes from their friends as if to push the idea).
We have differed on a few opinions, but that's fine. I just want to clarify that I have enjoyed the respectful exchange of ideas and opinions and also have no problem with anyone that feels differently.
In the end, that's what sites like this are for, respectful exchange of ideas. I actually think there is a lot of good discussion in this thread and am pleased that it's been allowed to progress.
I’ll admit to difference of opinion with a few people here but I’ll never go and call them “filthy dps’ers” or discredit an entire section of the community based on where they choose to hang out. I’ll only get defensive when someone starts making assumptions that the part of the community I call home is worse than everywhere else (backing that up with offensive quotes from their friends as if to push the idea).
We have differed on a few opinions, but that's fine. I just want to clarify that I have enjoyed the respectful exchange of ideas and opinions and also have no problem with anyone that feels differently.
In the end, that's what sites like this are for, respectful exchange of ideas. I actually think there is a lot of good discussion in this thread and am pleased that it's been allowed to progress.
I like a good exchange too, but I must say I feel somewhat disheartened seeing everyone qualified as 'scrubs' ("not counting like perhaps 5-10 ppl"). That shows a disdain for, well, literally almost everybody here. And frankly, it makes me somewhat uncomfortable. As for myself, I'll stick to what LaughingTrendy said: "Your fun isn't wrong!"
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What @tunebreaker is trying to do here is to build a bridge. Hehe, he always does that. With my friends and his, with my sources of information and his. It’s part of the reason why he is such a great guy because that is how life works.
Although Nirett’s comment is a bit harsh it is sadly true for so many players around here and the very reason why performance players tend to give STO forums rather a wide berth than let the negative parts of attitude pull them down. It’s not about bad players or evil persons or anything it’s just the general attitude that is off.
I mean we have players in forums which spend an unbelievable amount of time criticizing the very core aspects how this game works in PvE. They witnessed the most drastic shifts in meta and instead of embracing the good aspects of what could work for them rather reject it all on purpose. They do the same with advice and any helping hand they get offered. They will come up with every kind of excuse ranging from “I have the resources and time to get it done” up to “I have no one to tend to in game”.
We call this phenomenon scrubs: http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/introducingthe-scrub
I’m sorry, but just look at this:
There is so incredibly much wrong and false about this that I would not even know where to start.
The term “cookie cutter build” does not exist for players who like to have a successful gaming experience. They just take the useful parts out of example builds and add them to their own benefit and build ideal. The scrub sadly can’t do that as it would force him a slightly bit more towards some sort of competitive plain where he is afraid of.
Build examples were never meant to be copied and pasted, they are just meant to educate and give ideas as to what could lead to better results out of a near infinite combination of bad choices. I never copied builds; I just analyzed and look what I could use. While it is true that the 12 builds I ended up with share some similarities there more than enough differences to give me an entirely different experience on each of them. Most of the builds even get adjusted and optimized on the different maps I use them on.
Why and how does this work for me and not for others? The answer is plain and simple the attitude!
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At this point, anytime I see someone say that DPS oriented builds are 'cookie cutter' I just discount that users opinion. People need to learn to stop speaking about things they don't understand. If anything, copying builds is discouraged in the DPS community and has been for as long as I remember. Build templates are given for suggestion, evaluations are done on skills and traits that have the most use on certain types of builds and that information is made public. How it's used always has been and always will be up to the individual. Usually, when I post a build in response to someone seeking help I always try and make it clear that my build post is just for suggestion, so that they can go through it and pick and choose the aspects that they find personally appealing and give it a try. Of course, if someone wants to carbon copy the build, then I have no problem with that, but I always encourage people to mix in their own flavor.
Currently, I have 7 characters, none of them run the same build. Yes, there are aspects that are shared, but there are differences in all of them. I run with fleet mates that all have different builds from me as well and play differently then I do. I have certain things I prefer on a build that aren't part of the 'standard' but they work for me so I use them. Most players are the same way, they pick and choose what works for them. Sure, there will always be those that just copy the posted build, and if that makes them happy then why worry about it? If someone copies my build.. it doesn't hurt me in any way, but I always try and encourage them to find their own path.
For the thousandth time.. the 'cookie cutter DPS build' does not exist.
Hard to put into words how happy it makes me to read such stuff! As a matter of fact, if I had to bring it down to one single experience, one reason as to why it was/is worthwhile for me to log into this place it is that I got a chance to meet you in here and now can play alongside you in STO.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
As always, you make some great points. There are usually things in a build that I will need to specify need to be used in conjunction, obviously someone shouldn't copy my DoFF assignments and assign 3 technicians if they are running a drake build or use Redirecting Arrays trait with cannons.. some of that stuff I kind of take for granted as obvious which I maybe shouldn't do. There are certain aspects of the build that if you're going to take that part, you have to take other parts.. generally though I mean they should use whatever weapons they like, consoles, engines, shields, etc. For example, I don't like Torps in this game, I don't use them on any of my builds but many do. When using my build as a template they will need to change BoFF powers and skills to accommodate that change.. I usually try to specify that, but overall you are right most builds work with a synergistic principal which makes it necessary to copy the build as given.
I have no issue with new players just carbon copying a build either, but I still encourage them to play it and learn how it works and then make tweaks to it if they want to change the way the build works. Heck, even experienced players do that.. I change up my builds all the time, but mostly because they keep adding new things or nerfing old stuff.
Thanks man, you too. Hooking up with OCD is what has kept my interest in this game and kept me playing. Otherwise, I likely would have quit a long time ago.
For starters, my own post was a wee harsh too, so I appreciate you not retaliating in full, and instead explain what he meant. Pure class!
Thinking about it some more today, I figured maybe some language barrier might be at play here, either on Nirett's end (or on mine, LOL). And that he probably meant something like 'Someone who rather argues and fights on forums, rather than ingame learn and socialize.' And THAT would make sense, btw. Because, to me, 'forumite' has a rather neutral meaning, little beyond 'someone who posts on a forum a lot.'
Again, kudos to you for explaining this!
As for the 'cookie cutter build', honestly, all I can say, is that I never understood comments like that. For one, if it were as simple as just copying your build, I'd be flying along in the same high echelon as you, LOL (which clearly, I'm not). It's always piloting skills, and understanding the game. Especially the latter, when it comes to ppl like you. Same -- while we're at it -- for Epic gear. I have almost everything Epic, and all the fanciest Lobi gear. Yet, no, Epic gear does not mean you become a top player. All having Epic hear does (in my case) is have you reach the ceiling of your own abilities: aka, you'll do well with the skills you have, but nothing magically beyond. Again, if only.
I'm not even sure *that* is true. I mean 'they don't know why or how it works...just that it works' is a rather tricky concept. Take tune's Constriction Anchor, for example (the one he used in the vid). I have it, but never really used it, thinking "What would I want with this rather meh console?!" Until I saw tune use it in his vid, LOL. And now I may know *that* it works, but still don't know how to use it properly. And, in my hands, I would likely still fail miserably with it.
Flying a ship is not like driving a car, where basically all you have to do is move. But a ship in STO requires considerable skill to use properly: not just to move around, but to fight with.
The word "forumite" (in his vocabulary at least) describes more the attitude towards the game. Those are people who have absolutely no knowledge about the game, yet they feel they are the smartest person in the world and it's incredibly unfair that they aren't listened to all the time. And they have the constant holier than thou attitude - "oh, even though you have those formulas that were approved by the devs, I still don't believe they're enough to prove what you say." "I know I only do 10k DPS, but I have an incredible amount of knowledge about the high-end DPS situation in the game, hence Cryptic should only listen to my solutions." And it is true that overwhelming majority of people who post on those forums very well fit that description. I mean, this is exactly every active poster on those forums in a nutshell, not counting like perhaps 5-10 ppl (and no, I never considered you to be a forumite - have I been wrong about that assessment?).
Thing is, with most advanced maps that I pug, it's hard to even notice when someone fails or not, cause I personally clear stuff pretty quickly. And even when they do, I don't consider that too big of a deal and move on. So I have to admit that no, unless they come to me later, I just tend to miss them. I do my own thing and don't really pay attention to others in a pug. But no, I definitely don't call them any rude words or anything (well, unless they say something impolite to me).
U.S.S. Buteo Regalis - Brigid Multi-Mission Surveillance Explorer build
R.R.W. Ri Maajon - Khopesh Tactical Dreadnought Warbird build
My Youtube channel containing STO videos.
Thing with Nirett is that he's been doing the same I have, only for years longer. First in other games, and then in STO even before I started playing. And he's incredibly good player, as evidenced from countless numbers of elites and that round 48 KMU I've done with him where he carried me. So seeing all kinds of ppl just shitting on his advice has made him disgruntled over the years. So yeah, he uses very harsh words, but in most cases he absolutely has a point. And as I've understood it, players in any online game's forums are just worse. Hence the term "forumite" to describe a person who you'd rather not want to associate with.
I only use it for the passive +23.7% bonus (cat2) exotic damage bonus, really. The clicky is, well, it's there, but in that run it only did around 330 DPS. In another HSE run I had saved, it only did 140.
The player who goes by the name Mito asked me to laugh over your comment and discredit you.
U.S.S. Buteo Regalis - Brigid Multi-Mission Surveillance Explorer build
R.R.W. Ri Maajon - Khopesh Tactical Dreadnought Warbird build
My Youtube channel containing STO videos.
There are those who whine and moan here yes. There are those who think they know it all and know little. There’s those who refuse to change or adapt and expect the game to move for them.
But all of these types of people plus a myriad of others all exist on various in game channels, Reddit, fleet sites, Discord servers, teamspeak servers etc. as well.
It’s idiotic to single out one area of the community and throw around spurious claims and insults about those of us using said media. I’ve seen plenty of idiotic arguments and posts on Reddit or in channels in game and even on Discord over the years.
We’re all trying to enjoy the game the same as anyone else is, the place we discuss it should have no bearing on how we are viewed.
The feeling I’m getting here from some is that e are being looked down upon all the time. We are just the idiot villagers whilst certain people sit in their high castles and resent us for not wanting to follow their ways, or not being good enough.
There people like @peterconnorfirst who go out of their way to help and are really appreciated by many as a good honest and well spoken guy. But there are others within this thread who seem to throw little but sustain upon us mere mortals who are not up to their standards.
The game is what it is Ruin. I cannot change that.
We have lots of items and traits around which simply work better compared to everything else. Some of it costs a lot; other is basically free from episodes and events. Much is standard from fleets. So far cryptic, somehow, manage to even halfway distribute the good stuff equally from the different sources.
Nevertheless to claim that it is easy to play for a high end build would be a plain out lie. I roughly would estimate that it would take a new player around 1,5-2 years of daily play of an hour or so to manage to set one up for a single character. The moment one has that I think we look at more like 20 minutes a day to keep a toon near top with max dil refining and ec generation being the top priority. And sure, the danger of nerfs and shifts in what works best is always there. If you have the resources, either because you play a lot or choose the path for RL money purchases you can speed things up a great deal of course.
The question as to if that is wanted, well worth it, has do be settled individually. Also how many toons do need to be on top? For me it may have become a bit extreme as I don’t play other games. But hey, there is not only top or bottom here; there is a wide range in between where peeps can end up playing the content successfully. Only if one fails to manage to uphold the fun in a game activity one would like to tend to because of the difficulty, then I think it’s time to act and make a few baseline decisions.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Sadly the game does not do much to educate. This is bad. Players rely on off game sources to get information.
Flying through STO and trying to figure it out on your own is like traveling at impulse while the help that is offered on the league HP (or reddit which I’m not that familiar with but what seems to work well for so many peeps) accelerates a player to warp speed.
I never look down to others and I know Tune does not do so either. Why should we? We know where we come from. I know for sure that he would like nothing more for you than to have a good time in game.
The three of us have one thing in common: We are PvEer, sadly a dying species in game. If you don’t mind the high performance some of us can deliver by simply utilizing what the game offers there would not be anything hindering us from playing along just fine. I know and tune knows that you can handle yourself in PvE very well and we would rather tend it together with you than with players we don’t know.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Yes. That's exactly what I think. Happy now? I'm in complete agreement that there are fair share of absolutely clueless idiots everywhere. And again, not everyone who posts on forums is a forumite. But nowhere else are they present in such a concentration than forums (well, perhaps only matched by Zone chat and some obscure in-game channels I'm not part of). Nowhere else in game I've managed to see such a display of utter stupidity than in here. In other places, there are plenty of people who can actively filter the bad seeds out, but not in here, because you've driven all the people who actually know something about the game away. Game and Cryptic's behaviour is stressful anyway, why try to even intensify it by hanging out in a place where you know you won't get any respect.
And you don't get it either... instead of trying maybe better yourself, oh no, you curl up and yell even more how all the others are just evil folks riding in on their high horses.
Now you described yourself, or well, the forumites. I've never said to anyone that they should just go "DPS or bust" and there's no other ways to enjoy the game. But when you all constantly cry that you can't do this or that, and I then point out what you could do to improve, and then you figuratively kick me in the nuts and say "no, i want to do this or that, but *without* following your suggestions", then really, what can I do? Smile and nod my head "yes, yes, of course let's nerf Hive and remove the challenge from the content I very much enjoy in it's current form, just because you're not able to complete it?"
When people just come for me to get advice, I don't act elitist at all, and some people in here can confirm that. But when you, before or during asking that advice, constantly try to prove how bad of a person I am for whatever reasons, then you can't expect much respect from me either, can you?
Since you have given stuff to Mito yourself, I don't think you should be complaining how poor you are. And I'm completely sure your net worth in game is at least hundreds of times bigger than mine, but you don't see me crying how I can't afford this or that.
U.S.S. Buteo Regalis - Brigid Multi-Mission Surveillance Explorer build
R.R.W. Ri Maajon - Khopesh Tactical Dreadnought Warbird build
My Youtube channel containing STO videos.
I believe Ruin built up his own Fleet, from scratch, and was the first person to have completed all of Dranuur even, way ahead of everyone else (quite an impressive feat, actually). So, his assets may not be liquid, but I always have a hard time fathoming ruin as space poor.
People always accuse me of being space rich all the time, which assuredly I'm not. But I suppose anyone with Epic gear is either 'Elitist' (when they're good, on top of allegedly being wealthy), or flat-out 'space rich.'
Of course I respect your skill and advice. I can’t always follow it and sometimes I just feel happier being in my comfort zone. If that means I can not play elite stuff anymore I’ll accept that and move on. Some of us just are not physically capable of your level of play. It’s not about builds, it’s about reaction times, understanding the maths behind things, seeing things happening before they do. Skill in a game is not natural to everyone and some of us just want a bit of casual fun.
I never called for HSE to get nerfed, in fact I’ve nearly always argued in favour of more elite content to keep you tip end players from being stuck with us people so you can enjoy a decent challenge.
People will either take advice or not, no point getting so wound up about it. And this place is no worse than anywhere else. The only difference is that it’s run by the game so to speak whereas so ever like Reddit is player run so can filter out the “unwanted” discussion I guess to make the place look superior.
Even posting a build for advice on Reddit must be done with a specific format so it’s even then limiting what can be posted. Here, it’s just open to anyone and anything. Unless you go all out idiotic and a mod lock the thread anything can be posted from details build threads in any format to simple clueless newbie questions.
And you know what? We all try to help out when we can.
I think a lot of this thread boils down to some people find the game hard and others find it too easy. And both sides are never going to see eye to eye on what should or could be done. You and your friends dislike seeing people ask for things to be toned down and people (for whatever reasons refusing help) and less able players don’t like being constantly told to buy x,y,z or told to “get good” by some people. The disrespect goes both ways and it helps nobody. Top players don’t like people disrespecting their achievements and ignoring their advice; less able players don’t like elitist attitudes and being treated like idiots.
Truth right there. Even though there are so many people in here who have insulted me for oh how many times, at the end I just wish that they'd all have their own fun playing the game, just without having it at the expense of me or anyone else. If it weren't like that, why do you think I even hang out here anymore, trying to always give out advice as well as I can?
Yep, I've also heard that story.
U.S.S. Buteo Regalis - Brigid Multi-Mission Surveillance Explorer build
R.R.W. Ri Maajon - Khopesh Tactical Dreadnought Warbird build
My Youtube channel containing STO videos.
I do not know as I do not care. Teamed PvE is the only reason I play. If it decays to a point where I could not play anymore I would be gone.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
But then stop crying that everything's bad. You say you don't like something, I tell you what you could do to fix it, you tell me how you don't like my suggestion and... continue crying how you don't like it.
Oh yeah, I too remember last time Zooey deleted a post when someone told her that her Kumari was weak and should use different boff abilities... oh no, wait, it was instead when she got a death threat. I'm not going on a comparison between them and forum mods, since that'd probably be against the rules, but Reddit mods do their job very well and fairly.
No, it doesn't. It's just preferable cause Reddit build layout is just incredibly well-done and it's easy to exactly understand what the person uses, but you can use pretty much anything, from stoacademy to screenshots.
Yeah, but why not try to buy x,y,z and in the process, get good? It's not like majority of advice given is "buy those traits that cost in total of 100m, and then a DPRM that's another 200m". We give budget suggestions constantly, stuff easy to swap out. When people are struggling and complaining about it, the only logical assumption is that they want to improve. But when the players who are good are met with hostility and claims that they're elitist after trying to help, then something's wrong, isn't it?
And the treating like an idiot part partly comes from the fact that we're trying to cover all the bases. For example, recently I was building my tank and I was complaining to a friend that it didn't perform as expected, at all. He asked me do I have Honored Dead, a pretty cheap trait that's used on majority of tank builds these days. Now, if I actually had it, I would've probably (jokingly) said that "hey, don't think I'm an idiot or something!". But turned out I had completely overlooked it, so I got the trait and my performance improved. It's just hard to know what a person exactly thought about something or not, that's why we sometimes ask questions that could seem obvious.
U.S.S. Buteo Regalis - Brigid Multi-Mission Surveillance Explorer build
R.R.W. Ri Maajon - Khopesh Tactical Dreadnought Warbird build
My Youtube channel containing STO videos.
That's not what's happening at all.
The reason you have Normal, Advanced, and Elite difficulties is so that everyone can play according to their own skill or gear. Players aren't told to get good equipment to 'get good' it's because by design.. it's required to handle Elite Queues. These queues are designed with the intent that players will have top of the line gear and traits so yes.. we ask people to get that stuff before playing Elites. Even then, they don't have to have a perfect build by any means, the ship I play HSE with the most often has Mark XIV Ultra Rare Fleet Cannons. Not special at all but I still use traits and skills that optimize what I have.
To be perfectly honest, yes.. it's annoying to see players that don't or can't play Elites asking for nerfs on those queues. If the content is too difficult for them then they have two choices, adapt in whatever way they see fit in order to be able to handle the content, or play other content. In the case of Option two, Advanced Queues are available. I understand you're not asking for anything to be nerfed I am just explaining how some of us feel.
I agree with Seaofsorrows here. It can be incredibly frustrating, when some people request or "demand" nerfs to the few queues we have left that have any real sort of challenge left. This is even more surprising, when people request it of the advance version of the queue. Which usually, demanding on the queue, can give you a small taste or consideration of what the elite version might be.
I browse the reddit forum, and build forum quite frequently. The people there are extremely helpful. and always willing to listen to people who say "i cant afford that, or it will take too long" and then they will suggest a cheaper alternative.
Sadly, some players are getting more and more angry or vicious when you try to offer them advice, This can led to some of this "gap" between player capability. It's saddening to see. Couple that with barely anyone talks or wants to talk in a queue, it seems for a good portion of the community, we are more disconnected or further from one another than ever.
There are multiple people who are responded in this thread, who are buckling that and trying to continue to keep the information flowing and communication channels. My hat always goes off to them. But these days, they are few and far between, and even they, can get worn down.
I’ve never called for nerfs to content, I’d prefer more content better suited to all abilities of players.
I’ve argued in favour of better incentives to get players into queues, because at the end of the day despite talk of channel x or y to get players, 99% of players dont encounter these, don’t read this forum/Reddit and as such are still going to miss out.
I’ll admit to difference of opinion with a few people here but I’ll never go and call them “filthy dps’ers” or discredit an entire section of the community based on where they choose to hang out. I’ll only get defensive when someone starts making assumptions that the part of the community I call home is worse than everywhere else (backing that up with offensive quotes from their friends as if to push the idea).
I’ve run queues with a few here, I’ve been in channels with some too. I’ll not deny I’ve had some good times with them over the years. But I’ll not hang around places I get threatened or insulted or told to lull myself by members due to difference of opinions. That’s not what I signed up for. That’s also why I find it hard to find matches nowadays, tmits difficult to find people if you’re casual and not aware of where to go to look for friends.
You what I really want? I want a nice casual game I can relax in without needing to chase the latest meta, and without needing to seek out specialist circles to play within all the time. I’d like a game with actual endgame that is popular and with a diverse range of queues that pop. The state of the game now is shocking and it’s pushing divisions within the player community in even worse directions.
We have differed on a few opinions, but that's fine. I just want to clarify that I have enjoyed the respectful exchange of ideas and opinions and also have no problem with anyone that feels differently.
In the end, that's what sites like this are for, respectful exchange of ideas. I actually think there is a lot of good discussion in this thread and am pleased that it's been allowed to progress.
I like a good exchange too, but I must say I feel somewhat disheartened seeing everyone qualified as 'scrubs' ("not counting like perhaps 5-10 ppl"). That shows a disdain for, well, literally almost everybody here.
Fly safe!