Based on the value of the KDF Admiralty Tour of Duty 10 of 10 reward, the 4x Romulan Admiralty Tour of Duty 10 of 10 reward would need a much higher Technology Point Value or they should award many more of them.
The Federation 10 of 10's 2x Spec Points is massively nerfed if you fill all current Spec Trees. 5,760 Dilithium in no way equates to the KDF 30k.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Based on the value of the KDF Admiralty Tour of Duty 10 of 10 reward, the 4x Romulan Admiralty Tour of Duty 10 of 10 reward would need a much higher Technology Point Value or they should award many more of them.
The Federation 10 of 10's 2x Spec Points is massively nerfed if you fill all current Spec Trees. 5,760 Dilithium in no way equates to the KDF 30k.
I've always been baffled by the way some players act like dilithium is the ONLY cost to upgrading...
And if you don't want specialization points because you're capped... maybe don't run Federation assignments?
forgot to add this, but if you're having upgrading issues and haven't found any decent help with it, be sure to read this and check out the links near the bottom.
It's not the point of capping on Spec Points, it's the value of the 10 of 10. Two maintain value, and one doesn't.
Of course Dilithium is not the only cost for the Upgrade but also a Superior Tech Upgrade for example. That requires a PAAD (which requires 200 Dilithium, 2,500 EC, and 5 Uncommon Materials), two Rare Components (which requires a varying number of Rare Materials), a Very Rare Material, and 15,000 EC. OR I could buy one of those Superior Tech Upgrades off the Exchange for 120k - 180k EC. I could go on, but you get the point.
And I could provide a conversion of Dilithium to Zen for Keys to sell for EC and vice versa to make comparisons there as well. So lets go the easy route and just buy the Superior Tech Upgrades. Let's settle on the 180k EC cost on the Exchange.
That would be approximately 30 of those Upgrades per Key. That would be between 3 and 4 Zen per Upgrade. At a current rate of Exchange of let's say 350 Dilithium per Zen, that's another 1,050 to 1,400 Dilithium. That's a total cost of 2,475 Dilithium at the high end. Since the Romulan Tech Upgrade provides 15,000 Tech Points instead of 12,800 each, we need to multiply that 2,475 Dilithium by a factor of 1.17 or 2,900 Dilithium value for each. About 10 of those Romulan Techs is a rough equivalent to the 30k Dilithium given by the KDF Campaign. Now I did take basic math quite a while ago but even back then in the before times 4 < 10 (by a factor of 250%).
It's too few Romulan Techs or too few Tech Points per for that 10 of 10.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Well the Romulan ones are a little bit higher tech points, so technically they give a better return on tech point catalysts, but really at this point the Phoenix Tech boom should account for any catalysts being used for a long long time .
So lets flip the question. From a design perspective you've just proven the Klingon Campaign gives far too much dilithium ore. So how much does it need to be nerfed before people quit complaining about the Romulan option?
It's not the point of capping on Spec Points, it's the value of the 10 of 10. Two maintain value, and one doesn't.
Ok, this may only be a technicality but what happens when you get 10/10 KDF Admiralty while at 10,000,000 unrefined dilithium and 10,000,000 refined dilithium? So actually two of three don't maintain value. Ok, I was just kidding.
Also while we're on the subject, I've maxed out my spec trees and I have 20 spec points to spare. I thought that the system was changed so that you could not stack that many extra spec points anymore.
When you see "TRIBBLE" in my posts, it's because I manually typed "TRIBBLE" and censored myself.
In some games I've played, not only did upgrading gear rely on random chance like this, but you actually had a chance of your gear getting worse or breaking.
Of course, they sold cash shop items to keep the item from breaking. But in either game, you could spend a fair chunk of money and come away with worse equipment than you started with.
In some games I've played, not only did upgrading gear rely on random chance like this, but you actually had a chance of your gear getting worse or breaking.
Of course, they sold cash shop items to keep the item from breaking. But in either game, you could spend a fair chunk of money and come away with worse equipment than you started with.
One thing I didn't like about DCUO was that your gear in the game all had durability meters.... I forget what happened if the durability reached 0.... So in that game your stuff was never safe....
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
yeah high level gear in D2 was in part judged by it's repair cost. Certain effects were avoided because they added an obscene amount to repair costs. Most notably spell charges. Those had a repair cost that was a function of the number of mods on the gear. On high level gear using them would cost a fortune. Then there was +skill abilities on melee weapons.... Melee weapons would lose durability just because you hit an enemy with them. Thus +skill on them would make them insanely expensive to repair. Needless to say the most highly coveted mod on any piece of endgame gear was indestructibility.
Of course Dilithium is not the only cost for the Upgrade but also a Superior Tech Upgrade for example. That requires a PAAD (which requires 200 Dilithium, 2,500 EC, and 5 Uncommon Materials), two Rare Components (which requires a varying number of Rare Materials), a Very Rare Material, and 15,000 EC. OR I could buy one of those Superior Tech Upgrades off the Exchange for 120k - 180k EC. I could go on, but you get the point.
I'm building Superior Upgrades all the time. They cost no PADDs and no extra Dil.
"Logic is a little tweeting bird chirping in a meadow. Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers which smell BAD." - Spock
What i personally do is manufacture an item, very rare, with the mods i want at level 2, then use the Phoenix upgrade on them, it works quite well! (low levels dont require dilithium)
^^This, mostly, but I don't know if I'd use a Phoenix
If you do the math, (sorry, Liberal Arts majors), it's far more cost efficient to make MK II items until you get just the mods you want. You're burning white/green materials which are cheap as grass and easy to get. Then you use an EXPERIMENTAL Superior upgrade and an accelerator, and you're set to go until at least MK VII.
Now, granted, this isn't always possible. If you are, like me, one who worships at the altar of Part Gens (aka EPG), then you need a *Conductive RCS Accelerator with [EPG] mod. Those can only be made at MK XII, and you can't see the mod until it goes UR. If you have the right R&D DOFF and your Engineering R&D is at level 20, you have a basic 32% chance to fabricate it at UR. With a pair of +50 Catalysts, that goes to 46%
Given the cost of the materials, (the seven purple components alone will cost you 2.1 million on the Exchange), and the number of other mods possible, well, you can see the problem.
Anyhow, I have wandered a bit afield, but...erm, yes, HEY LOOK A SQUIRREL!!!!
*Conductive RCS Accelerator is the second premium item for the Engineering school of R&D, after the Aegis engine
One thing I didn't like about DCUO was that your gear in the game all had durability meters.... I forget what happened if the durability reached 0.... So in that game your stuff was never safe....
yeah but even totally broken gear is repairable at any merchant npc. the rub is that the cost gets pretty nasty after tier 5 gear and even people that have spent $100 or more, but don't subscribe are limited to really TRIBBLE low amounts of cash
You are correct about the PADD, none needed. Don't know why I said that, as I have created hundreds of Superior Upgrades (and a bunch of Standard when the UI failed to move to the new School I switched to after slotting all three Research Projects in the original School). (Too much quick clicking).
As far as the Spec Points, the character that I had all Spec Trees maxed before the Temporal Tree came out, had 28 points, and got 2 more on the day it released. I had about 8 points beyond that when they changed it to stop providing Spec Points when maxed. I maintained those and have continued to keep accumulating to about 16 now.
I have been playing my Temporal Recruit almost exclusively since AoY released. That Character maxed out all Spec Trees in early October. The first point beyond max was converted to Dilithium immediately. I had thought that the Spec Points Characters gained between Levels 51-60, did not count towards that current 150 point max.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Previously, Spec Points for FE Weekly Rewards, C-Store giveaways, and the Federation 10 of 10 could be accumulated.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I have read ALL of your posts. And I HEAR you. All I'm saying is that it is PAINFUL to invest in "chances". You give and give and give...but when you finally click on the "execute" button, nothing happens. THAT is what I do not like! I would rather there be a set price to upgrade the quality of an item...NOT pouring in hard-earned (time and REAL money earned) resources into a CHANCE to upgrade the quality! "Chance"= rip-off! I've said this many times and I stick by it!
"As with all living things, each according to his gifts."
I have read ALL of your posts. And I HEAR you. All I'm saying is that it is PAINFUL to invest in "chances". You give and give and give...but when you finally click on the "execute" button, nothing happens. THAT is what I do not like! I would rather there be a set price to upgrade the quality of an item...NOT pouring in hard-earned (time and REAL money earned) resources into a CHANCE to upgrade the quality! "Chance"= rip-off! I've said this many times and I stick by it!
You had me until you said Ripoff. As it has been said before, working as intended.
I have read ALL of your posts. And I HEAR you. All I'm saying is that it is PAINFUL to invest in "chances". You give and give and give...but when you finally click on the "execute" button, nothing happens. THAT is what I do not like! I would rather there be a set price to upgrade the quality of an item...NOT pouring in hard-earned (time and REAL money earned) resources into a CHANCE to upgrade the quality! "Chance"= rip-off! I've said this many times and I stick by it!
You said you heard us.
But that is not the same as listening to us.
If you are so very incensed by what you view as an unfair practice then why are you still here?
Real Money? I've dropped 5 large on this game. That is US $5,000.00.
Unless you've spent as much, which I doubt, I do not see where you have any business complaining so loudly and so publicly.
Lastly, there are none so blind as those who refuse to see the truth. Never thought I'd meant someone whose life is an affirmation of this.
A six year old boy and his starship. Living the dream.
I have read ALL of your posts. And I HEAR you. All I'm saying is that it is PAINFUL to invest in "chances". You give and give and give...but when you finally click on the "execute" button, nothing happens. THAT is what I do not like! I would rather there be a set price to upgrade the quality of an item...NOT pouring in hard-earned (time and REAL money earned) resources into a CHANCE to upgrade the quality! "Chance"= rip-off! I've said this many times and I stick by it!
The pricing is based on RNG.
If you want 100% success you must pay more. I already explained how you could do this using the Exchange. Problem solved!
I dont bother with it past purple mkXII but isnt it that once you hit XIV everything you dump into it goes into quality upgrade chance??
so eventually you will get all gold xiv if you spend enough time?
True. Once you get to XIV, all progress on Quality Percentage is retained as you complete each 'Pseudo'-Level. That Percentage only resets to zero when you get a Quality Upgrade. Then rinse and repeat until you reach Epic (assuming that's how high you want to go).
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I dont bother with it past purple mkXII but isnt it that once you hit XIV everything you dump into it goes into quality upgrade chance??
so eventually you will get all gold xiv if you spend enough time?
Not really the time people get annoyed about, but the amount of dilithium. I can understand the frustration having spent several hundred thousand upgrading a single rep item, but as I said in an earlier post you will eventually upgrade your primary set (IE the set you use most of the time) and after that the upgrade system isn't really as annoying.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I dont bother with it past purple mkXII but isnt it that once you hit XIV everything you dump into it goes into quality upgrade chance??
so eventually you will get all gold xiv if you spend enough time?
Not really the time people get annoyed about, but the amount of dilithium. I can understand the frustration having spent several hundred thousand upgrading a single rep item, but as I said in an earlier post you will eventually upgrade your primary set (IE the set you use most of the time) and after that the upgrade system isn't really as annoying.
well the alternative is even simpler.... stop obsessing over having to have xiv gold items when green mkXII will do all endgame content except elite queues
a lot of old games have durability...diablo, diablo 2, arcanum, morrowind, oblivion, and all manner of other RPGs
luckily, very few new ones use such an annoyingly cumbersome system anymore
Only thing I found bad in a game like oblivion was the weight of the multiple hammers I had to carry around until I reached level 75(?) to have an unbreakable hammer. Yes, it can be annoying at times, and isn't strictly necessary, but both in TES and older Fallouts, I didn't mind stuff breaking. I would though, if it broke for good beyond repair.
Comments
The Federation 10 of 10's 2x Spec Points is massively nerfed if you fill all current Spec Trees. 5,760 Dilithium in no way equates to the KDF 30k.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I've always been baffled by the way some players act like dilithium is the ONLY cost to upgrading...
And if you don't want specialization points because you're capped... maybe don't run Federation assignments?
http://sto.gamepedia.com/Gear_Upgrade_System
Of course Dilithium is not the only cost for the Upgrade but also a Superior Tech Upgrade for example. That requires a PAAD (which requires 200 Dilithium, 2,500 EC, and 5 Uncommon Materials), two Rare Components (which requires a varying number of Rare Materials), a Very Rare Material, and 15,000 EC. OR I could buy one of those Superior Tech Upgrades off the Exchange for 120k - 180k EC. I could go on, but you get the point.
And I could provide a conversion of Dilithium to Zen for Keys to sell for EC and vice versa to make comparisons there as well. So lets go the easy route and just buy the Superior Tech Upgrades. Let's settle on the 180k EC cost on the Exchange.
That would be approximately 30 of those Upgrades per Key. That would be between 3 and 4 Zen per Upgrade. At a current rate of Exchange of let's say 350 Dilithium per Zen, that's another 1,050 to 1,400 Dilithium. That's a total cost of 2,475 Dilithium at the high end. Since the Romulan Tech Upgrade provides 15,000 Tech Points instead of 12,800 each, we need to multiply that 2,475 Dilithium by a factor of 1.17 or 2,900 Dilithium value for each. About 10 of those Romulan Techs is a rough equivalent to the 30k Dilithium given by the KDF Campaign. Now I did take basic math quite a while ago but even back then in the before times 4 < 10 (by a factor of 250%).
It's too few Romulan Techs or too few Tech Points per for that 10 of 10.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
So lets flip the question. From a design perspective you've just proven the Klingon Campaign gives far too much dilithium ore. So how much does it need to be nerfed before people quit complaining about the Romulan option?
Also while we're on the subject, I've maxed out my spec trees and I have 20 spec points to spare. I thought that the system was changed so that you could not stack that many extra spec points anymore.
Of course, they sold cash shop items to keep the item from breaking. But in either game, you could spend a fair chunk of money and come away with worse equipment than you started with.
or no equipment at all.
My character Tsin'xing
luckily, very few new ones use such an annoyingly cumbersome system anymore
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
My character Tsin'xing
I'm building Superior Upgrades all the time. They cost no PADDs and no extra Dil.
^^This, mostly, but I don't know if I'd use a Phoenix
If you do the math, (sorry, Liberal Arts majors), it's far more cost efficient to make MK II items until you get just the mods you want. You're burning white/green materials which are cheap as grass and easy to get. Then you use an EXPERIMENTAL Superior upgrade and an accelerator, and you're set to go until at least MK VII.
Now, granted, this isn't always possible. If you are, like me, one who worships at the altar of Part Gens (aka EPG), then you need a *Conductive RCS Accelerator with [EPG] mod. Those can only be made at MK XII, and you can't see the mod until it goes UR. If you have the right R&D DOFF and your Engineering R&D is at level 20, you have a basic 32% chance to fabricate it at UR. With a pair of +50 Catalysts, that goes to 46%
Given the cost of the materials, (the seven purple components alone will cost you 2.1 million on the Exchange), and the number of other mods possible, well, you can see the problem.
Anyhow, I have wandered a bit afield, but...erm, yes, HEY LOOK A SQUIRREL!!!!
*Conductive RCS Accelerator is the second premium item for the Engineering school of R&D, after the Aegis engine
yeah but even totally broken gear is repairable at any merchant npc. the rub is that the cost gets pretty nasty after tier 5 gear and even people that have spent $100 or more, but don't subscribe are limited to really TRIBBLE low amounts of cash
As far as the Spec Points, the character that I had all Spec Trees maxed before the Temporal Tree came out, had 28 points, and got 2 more on the day it released. I had about 8 points beyond that when they changed it to stop providing Spec Points when maxed. I maintained those and have continued to keep accumulating to about 16 now.
I have been playing my Temporal Recruit almost exclusively since AoY released. That Character maxed out all Spec Trees in early October. The first point beyond max was converted to Dilithium immediately. I had thought that the Spec Points Characters gained between Levels 51-60, did not count towards that current 150 point max.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Previously, Spec Points for FE Weekly Rewards, C-Store giveaways, and the Federation 10 of 10 could be accumulated.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
"As with all living things, each according to his gifts."
You had me until you said Ripoff. As it has been said before, working as intended.
But that is not the same as listening to us.
If you are so very incensed by what you view as an unfair practice then why are you still here?
Real Money? I've dropped 5 large on this game. That is US $5,000.00.
Unless you've spent as much, which I doubt, I do not see where you have any business complaining so loudly and so publicly.
Lastly, there are none so blind as those who refuse to see the truth. Never thought I'd meant someone whose life is an affirmation of this.
The pricing is based on RNG.
If you want 100% success you must pay more. I already explained how you could do this using the Exchange. Problem solved!
so eventually you will get all gold xiv if you spend enough time?
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Not really the time people get annoyed about, but the amount of dilithium. I can understand the frustration having spent several hundred thousand upgrading a single rep item, but as I said in an earlier post you will eventually upgrade your primary set (IE the set you use most of the time) and after that the upgrade system isn't really as annoying.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
well the alternative is even simpler.... stop obsessing over having to have xiv gold items when green mkXII will do all endgame content except elite queues
Only thing I found bad in a game like oblivion was the weight of the multiple hammers I had to carry around until I reached level 75(?) to have an unbreakable hammer. Yes, it can be annoying at times, and isn't strictly necessary, but both in TES and older Fallouts, I didn't mind stuff breaking. I would though, if it broke for good beyond repair.
And here I thought I was paying much... then again, the devs probably want money for food and clothing (devs can be selfish like that), so good on you