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Dilithium issue? I have a solution.

lsegnlsegn Member Posts: 594 Arc User
So we are all well aware of the massive and seemingly neverending influx of dilithium and the havoc it's wreaking on the F2P economy so i have some ideas to fix it.

- Put stuff in the dilithium store actually worth buying

Beyond just space barbie set up a real micro-store with desireable goods. The best idea i've had is expanding the selection of Holo Emitters to include popular or iconic ships... Say the TOS connie for example? Can you imagine how much people would pay?

Give the Holo Emitter a reasonable time limit and price and i gauruntee they'll fly off the shelf. The best part about this is it would be a constant sink since they expire.

A nice set of iconic ships especially canon ships or TOS skins without the need for building a whole new ship would likely do extremely well. Getting creative and adding new features would also help. Perhaps offer an infinite holo emitter too for a very hefty price that wouldn't expire. That would likely attract more attention.

You could even let people port a custom ship skin and make their own holo emitter giving a potentially limitless amount of things to buy.

- Promo packs

This idea is more vague but it involves gambling so i imagine you'll love it. Basically let people buy a box with dilithium that gives a small chance to give a random promo pack including retired ones like the Bulwark. Maybe have some booby prizes too like consoles from low level C-store ships and large packs of common doffs for fleet project use. I'd advise pricing it low per unit that way people wouldn't think twice about popping a few on a regular basis such as casual players. That should suck the dilithium right out of the game.

I'm sure there's other ways you could expand the dilithiun store even further and i think it's likely a very good way to depress the dilithium in the game.

Oh and how about stop giving it away all the damn time? Why not use another currency like Energy Credits as event rewards?

Targeting wealthy players is a waste of time, they didn't become wealthy by spending their space cash on frivolous trash. You need to target the average joe or atleast the middleclass ones. Make them happy to part with their money.
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Comments

  • cidjackcidjack Member Posts: 2,017 Arc User
    As a P2W player, I will tell you right now, I personally run a cost to benefit analysis on any bug ticket item purchases before buying anything. I have uet to purchase anything from the dil store. Even with the items you are suggesting I would not purchase.

    Nice try though, keep grinding, the dil exchange needs fresh dil.
    Armada: Multiplying fleet projects in need of dilithium by 13."
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  • lsegnlsegn Member Posts: 594 Arc User
    It's all about the cost-reward ratio which cryptic has trouble figuring out sometimes. They should atleast follow up when they fail and adjust the ratio.
  • jorantomalakjorantomalak Member Posts: 7,133 Arc User
    Ok OP though your idea is nice i will lay the facts bare

    Dil is an infinite resource everyone has it, everyone gets more and more each day , so aslong as this model continues we can expect hyper inflation, dil sinks only work in a moderate manner and usually flame out over time.

    A solution would be ( these are just options for a solution)

    1) Stop the production of dil so the it becomes a finite resource with a limited supply

    2) Like neverwinter have exchange goods be purchasable by dilithium only, which is the best of the 2 option imo
  • lopequillopequil Member Posts: 1,226 Arc User
    I'm sorry, what? Dil unlimited?! Between fleet projects and gear upgrades I rarely have much dil. Are we even playing the same game?
    Q9BWcdD.png
  • hanover2hanover2 Member Posts: 1,053 Arc User
    Knew before I opened this thread that the "issue" is exchange rates the OP finds undesirable. Boo hoo the free market doesn't service my false sense of entitlement.
  • sheldonlcoopersheldonlcooper Member Posts: 4,042 Arc User
    check out the phoenix pack. I believe we have finally found a solution!
    Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."

    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

  • antonine3258antonine3258 Member Posts: 2,391 Arc User
    Okay, this is a decent non-Lobi solution to getting old prizes in - please do these every year or so.
    Fate - protects fools, small children, and ships named Enterprise Will Riker

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  • e30erneste30ernest Member Posts: 1,794 Arc User
    I don't buy Zen with Dil, but I do sell Zen for Dil. That said, the inflation problem is accelerated by dil farmers with lots of alts. If you really want to slow inflation down, you'd want to slow down Dilithium gains. Now the problem with that is that it will hurt casuals. IMO the best solution is to raise the refinement cap and then switch it from per character to account-wide.

    An account-wide cap over a per character cap has several benefits:
    • It won't hurt casuals. The only real people that would be affected are those running so many alts just to farm dilithium.
    • It encourages players to focusing on a lesser number of characters, and will hopefully increase the quality of STFs in general.
    • It would allow Cryptic to give higher payouts on STFs since the system won't be gamed by alt-a-holics anymore.
    • It creates a true dilithium production limit.

    It won't make a difference in the short-term but as the game goes on, the old dil created by the current system will eventually run out and dilithium influx will be at a more manageable level.
  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,573 Arc User
    As of tomorrow, for one week you can buy the Phoenix Prize Pack in the Dilithium Store. This gamble box lets you claim Character Bound previous special items.
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
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  • jaguarskxjaguarskx Member Posts: 5,945 Arc User
    edited November 2016
    lsegn wrote: »
    So we are all well aware of the massive and seemingly neverending influx of dilithium and the havoc it's wreaking on the F2P economy so i have some ideas to fix it.

    - Promo packs

    This idea is more vague but it involves gambling so i imagine you'll love it. Basically let people buy a box with dilithium that gives a small chance to give a random promo pack including retired ones like the Bulwark. Maybe have some booby prizes too like consoles from low level C-store ships and large packs of common doffs for fleet project use. I'd advise pricing it low per unit that way people wouldn't think twice about popping a few on a regular basis such as casual players. That should suck the dilithium right out of the game.

    Your wish has been granted. Now fork over your Dilithium!!!!!

    Phoenix Prize Pack

    http://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/10287833-phoenix-prize-pack
  • lsegnlsegn Member Posts: 594 Arc User
    I should point out im not poorinither in-game or in real life so it doesn't affect me a great deal directly im just trying to help the game. I have 51 character slots i can use should i feel so inclined...
  • lsegnlsegn Member Posts: 594 Arc User
    Wow i like that, i hope they make it a regular thing.
  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    lsegn wrote: »
    So we are all well aware of the massive and seemingly neverending influx of dilithium and the havoc it's wreaking on the F2P economy so i have some ideas to fix it.

    What 'massive and seemingly neverending influx of dilithium' are we talking about here? My Dilithium influx is exactly 8K a day, steady as the Northern Star. What comes in as unrefined is irrelevant: I have millions of those. Half of it can never be cashed in, like ever (the game's longevity won't allow it); and the rest can still only trickle down to me at 8K per day. I use(d) most of it for Upgrades, keep a small amount to buy Elite pets and such, and donate the rest of it to my Fleet.
    3lsZz0w.jpg
  • lsegnlsegn Member Posts: 594 Arc User
    More dilithium is being put on the exchange because more players currently value Zen over things they can buy with dilithium. My point is to simply add some shinnies on the dilithium side to rebalance the market equilibrium. If the inflation continues we could hit the 500 cap and that would crash the dilithiun economy if Neverwinter and past STO experience is any indication which is bad for everyone.
  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    lsegn wrote: »
    More dilithium is being put on the exchange because more players currently value Zen over things they can buy with dilithium. My point is to simply add some shinnies on the dilithium side to rebalance the market equilibrium. If the inflation continues we could hit the 500 cap and that would crash the dilithiun economy if Neverwinter and past STO experience is any indication which is bad for everyone.

    Ah, I see, you meant influx into the Exchange. :) My bad.
    3lsZz0w.jpg
  • jaguarskxjaguarskx Member Posts: 5,945 Arc User
    Well, if the exchange rate jumps to 500, then I will definitely buy some Dil.
  • gavinrunebladegavinruneblade Member Posts: 3,894 Arc User
    You have a false definition of "the problem" OP. The problem is dil inequality, not dil surplus. Some players have so much dil they can disrupt the market. Targeting them needs to happen to some degree to drain that stockpile. Some people cannot get enough even with all the rewards and events. Any dil sink needs to not hurt these people. Many players are earning more than they use causing the steady upward pressure on the exchange rate.

    Account wide higher refining limit will be worse than the current situation, farmers will just use multiple accounts, many already do. Hell I do but not specifically for dil farming.

    Opening the auction house to dil is a complex issue. It will remove ec as a currency, which may be good or bad. It will also remove all limits on the dil:zen exchange rate. From a market purist standpoint this is a potential positive. But When I stopped playing neverwinter the exchange was void of sales because on the auction house you could get a 650:1 return. Is that healthy for STO? I do not know. But I prefer having both ec and dil as viable currency.

    The devs need to balance multiple competing interests. It is not just that there is too much dil. It is that some people have too much and others too little.

    Sometimes I think the temporary rage involved with removing all dil and adding a new currency to replace it might be the best answer. I know it isn't, but sometimes it feels that way.
  • lsegnlsegn Member Posts: 594 Arc User
    I think theres a difference between a dilithium tax and a dilithium sink. A tax is when they attach exhorbitant dilithium costs to EVERYTHING which i think discourages many players from doing it at all. Thats what we have now and i think its couterproductive. For a dilithium sink i think its something we should WANT to spend dilithium on which we need more of but is ultimately something you can do without if your poor.

    Positive incentives over negative ones.

    An account dilithium cap would make it even easier to farm with multiple account because you'd only need one character.
  • gavinrunebladegavinruneblade Member Posts: 3,894 Arc User
    That is a good way to look at it isegn the tax vs sink issue. A tax hurts the dil poor, a sink doesn't.
  • lsegnlsegn Member Posts: 594 Arc User
    And that's really all i was trying to do. When they target rich players everyone else gets caught in cross-fire and even if the rich players bite it barely makes a dent in their wealth.
  • trekpuppytrekpuppy Member Posts: 446 Arc User
    Adding to the list of things I'd buy for dilithium:
    - LTS
    - Warp-To-Friend token
    ---
    "-Grind is good!" --Gordon Geko
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  • nekofury86nekofury86 Member Posts: 181 Arc User
    Along with things like the Phoenix Prize Pack, just put a limit on Dilithium buy/sell and people will stop abusing it so much. When I first started playing, the exchange rate was somewhere around 150, now it's 430, same with keys on the exchange, they were 1.5 mill when I started, 5.7 mill now. Things are becoming out of reach for newer players that haven't quite gotten the hang of things, and seeing such high prices with such low income as a beginner could drive them away with thought''s like "10 keys 57 mill... I could never afford that without spending cash" or "3,000 Zen, 1.3mill dilithium, 8k per day, 161 days, TRIBBLE that, i quit" I just think there needs to be some limits in place, otherwise you're really just keeping this game alive for the veterans, or new people willing to throw down a few hundred $$$$ every few months or so. I can see the prices being too intimidating for new players, that's all. Put a limit on Dil to Zen and Zen to Dil exchange rates. Also, having a lower Zen to Dilithium rate could mean more money in Cryptic's pockets. For those of us who buy say 5,000 Zen for Dilithium only, you may get more money if we were getting 200 Dil per Zen vs 400.... we just might need an extra 500k Dil... another $25, just a thought.
  • lsegnlsegn Member Posts: 594 Arc User
    edited December 2016
    Stable and relatively moderate inflation over time is a positive sign that the game and playerbase are doing well and growing so EC doesn't concern me too much but it would be better if it wasn't a deregulated currency and we had ways to earn and spend it from Cryptic.

    Dilithium is slightly more concerning because a great deal of the games economy and appeal rely on the exchange being healthy. My only concern is what happens when we reach the 500 cap. Fluctuations are good for a healthy market but we've been on a steep inflation curve the last several months. It is Cryptic's responsibility to keep an eye on these things because every change is a direct result of their actions. This isn't a real economy so we have only one input source, Cryptic.
    Post edited by lsegn on
  • e30erneste30ernest Member Posts: 1,794 Arc User
    Account wide higher refining limit will be worse than the current situation, farmers will just use multiple accounts, many already do. Hell I do but not specifically for dil farming.

    I may be missing something, but how do they transfer the dil or the Zen between the accounts?

    Granted, they can sell stuff for EC (for those EC hoarders). Are you referring to this?
  • lsegnlsegn Member Posts: 594 Arc User
    Dilithium > Zen > Keys > EC

    Rinse. Repeat.

    It's actually very simple in principle it just takes a massive time investment.
  • lsegnlsegn Member Posts: 594 Arc User
    edited December 2016
    Wealthy players are not evil in fact just like in real life they supply a lot of goods to the market mostly from gamble boxes or related. They simply find ways to make money in Cryptic's system as best they can. You can't fault people for being intelligent and hardworking.
  • ssbn655ssbn655 Member Posts: 1,894 Arc User
    lsegn wrote: »
    So we are all well aware of the massive and seemingly neverending influx of dilithium and the havoc it's wreaking on the F2P economy so i have some ideas to fix it.

    - Put stuff in the dilithium store actually worth buying

    Beyond just space barbie set up a real micro-store with desireable goods. The best idea i've had is expanding the selection of Holo Emitters to include popular or iconic ships... Say the TOS connie for example? Can you imagine how much people would pay?

    Give the Holo Emitter a reasonable time limit and price and i gauruntee they'll fly off the shelf. The best part about this is it would be a constant sink since they expire.

    A nice set of iconic ships especially canon ships or TOS skins without the need for building a whole new ship would likely do extremely well. Getting creative and adding new features would also help. Perhaps offer an infinite holo emitter too for a very hefty price that wouldn't expire. That would likely attract more attention.

    You could even let people port a custom ship skin and make their own holo emitter giving a potentially limitless amount of things to buy.

    - Promo packs

    This idea is more vague but it involves gambling so i imagine you'll love it. Basically let people buy a box with dilithium that gives a small chance to give a random promo pack including retired ones like the Bulwark. Maybe have some booby prizes too like consoles from low level C-store ships and large packs of common doffs for fleet project use. I'd advise pricing it low per unit that way people wouldn't think twice about popping a few on a regular basis such as casual players. That should suck the dilithium right out of the game.

    I'm sure there's other ways you could expand the dilithiun store even further and i think it's likely a very good way to depress the dilithium in the game.

    Oh and how about stop giving it away all the damn time? Why not use another currency like Energy Credits as event rewards?

    Targeting wealthy players is a waste of time, they didn't become wealthy by spending their space cash on frivolous trash. You need to target the average joe or atleast the middleclass ones. Make them happy to part with their money.

    Better yet just send it to me...
  • altran3301altran3301 Member Posts: 170 Arc User
    Account wide higher refining limit will be worse than the current situation, farmers will just use multiple accounts, many already do. Hell I do but not specifically for dil farming.

    How do you safely transfer zen or dil between accounts then? Characters I know, but accounts?
    tnl3Zwx.png
  • gavinrunebladegavinruneblade Member Posts: 3,894 Arc User
    As stated above dil>zen>item>email.

    Move keys, fleet modules, raw ec, etc. this is a big part of how that particular gold seller operates.
  • e30erneste30ernest Member Posts: 1,794 Arc User
    I think it would still keep Dilithium production lower than it is now, and individual accounts will have less Dilithium to exchange for Zen per exchange transaction.

    It won't stop EC farming but it would slow them down without really affecting casuals.
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