Those Command Platforms...a question.

virusdancer

So uh, I'll be upfront and say that I had a hissyfit with the leaked images before the announcement showing the wide variety of customization available...and...blew through all my Zen getting Lobi (never seen so many 4 Lobi boxes before, meh) for something else. So it's going to be a week or so before I actually have the Zen to grab a 3pack of the Command boats.

Does anybody have images of the passive bonuses that each of the platforms provide...or...even just the numbers?

Like the Kobali console, it provides +26.6% Hull Healing which is ~53.2 Starship Hull Repair skill (if it's working as described, will have to check later - could be a tooltip thing where it's actually just +26.2 Hull Repair, eh? Oh well, will check later and post the results of that here).

So I was wondering what the passives were on the various platforms.

Operations (Fleet Support Platform) says it's "a boost to maximum hull hit points"...what kind of boost?

Science (Tachyon Pulse Platform) says it's "a small boost to shield hardness and shield healing"...what kind of boost?

Tactical (Defense Platform) says it's "a moderate boost to projectile damage"...what kind of boost?

Thanks.

edit: Okay then, so doing a quick look at the Kobali console....

Starship Hull Repair: 187

w/o the console

AtS3 (70 Aux) - 6965.9
AtS3 (125 Aux) - 10144.6
ET3 - 13046.7
HE3 (70 Aux) - 18575.7
HE3 (125 Aux) - 27052.2
RM2 - 18845.3

w/ the console

AtS3 (70 Aux) - 7584.1
AtS3 (125 Aux) - 11044.9
ET3 - 14204.6
HE3 (70 Aux) - 20224.3
HE3 (125 Aux) - 29453
RM2 - 20517.8

Okay then, if we do the simplest comparison...

7584.1 / 6965.9 = 1.0887466084784449963393100676151
11044.9 / 10144.6 = 1.0887467223941801549592886856061
14204.6 / 13046.7 = 1.0887504119815738845838411245756
20224.3 / 18575.7 = 1.0887503566487400205645009340159
29453 / 27052.2 = 1.0887469410990603352037911888867
20517.8 / 18845.3 = 1.0887489188285673350915082275156

Gives us a relatively consistent value out to five decimal places of 1.0887, eh?

If we take a look at the ET3 (no Aux to worry about), and work it back w/o the console...

+0.005% per Starship Hull Repair
187 * 0.005 = 0.935%.

13046.7 / 1.935 = 6742.48...comes in a little low, hrmm. Should be 6750 for a bare ET3, no? ET2 being 1.33x ET1 and ET3 being 1.25x ET2? But anyway, it's close enough for this casual look, yeah?

So if we added +26.6 Starship Hull Repair without actually adding it to the skill, what would that give us?

(187 + 26.6) * 0.005 = 213.6 * 0.005 = 1.068 + 1 = 2.068 * 6750 = 13959

Which was not our ET3 with the console...so it's not adding +26.6 skill.

Adding 26.6% of the skill?

187 * 1.266 = 236.742 * 0.005 = 1.18371 + 1 = 2.18371 * 6750 = 14740.0425

And that's a wee bit high, eh? What if it's not 6750 but is actually that 6742.48, eh?

2.18371 * 6742.48 = 14723.6210008

Still too high...hrmm...what was the actual difference again?

14204.6 - 13046.7 = 1157.9
1157.9 / 6750 = 0.17154074074074074074074074074074

Nope, not that. Wait though, what about with say the AtS3 (70 Aux)...

7584.1 - 6965.9 = 618.2

618.2 / 0.1715 = 3604.6647230320699708454810495627

Nope, but hrmm... there's a formula over at STOwiki for the heal for AtS.

Heal = (Aux Power + 49.95) * ((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) * ((Rank + 2) / 3) * ((Skill / 200) + 1) * 6

So uh, let's see...w/o the console.

6965.9 = (70 + 49.95) * ((6 + 1) / 2) * ((3 + 2) / 3) * ((187 / 200) + 1) * 6
6965.9 = 119.95 * 3.5 * 1.67 * 1.935 * 6
6965.9 != 8139.8609775
No T6?
6977.023695

Hrmm, close there, yeah? (that also gets into jarvisandalfred's post about the lack of scaling of heals going to T5U/T6 there, T6 are just T5).


So oh well, no idea how 26.6% becomes that 8.87%...beyond me, maybe somebody else can figure it out.

mreeves7a

For my level 60 Fed Sci:

Fleet Support Platform: +5% Maximum Hull Capacity (75,799 hull -> 78,727 hull)

Tachyon Pulse Platform: Reduces Damage to Shields by 2.5%, Shield Heals Improved by 10% (EPtS1 +1,292.8 All Shields -> 1,335.9 All Shields)

Defense Platform: +25% Torpedo and Mine Damage (Mk XII Neutronic Torp 6,490.1 kin dmg -> 6,954.8 kin dmg, rad dmg unchanged)

I am unsure of the types of buffs, strength vs. bonus and all that, so I included some numbers incase they help.

virusdancer

mreeves7a wrote: »

For my level 60 Fed Sci:

Fleet Support Platform: +5% Maximum Hull Capacity (75,799 hull -> 78,727 hull)

Tachyon Pulse Platform: Reduces Damage to Shields by 2.5%, Shield Heals Improved by 10% (EPtS1 +1,292.8 All Shields -> 1,335.9 All Shields)

Defense Platform: +25% Torpedo and Mine Damage (Mk XII Neutronic Torp 6,490.1 kin dmg -> 6,954.8 kin dmg, rad dmg unchanged)

I am unsure of the types of buffs, strength vs. bonus and all that, so I included some numbers incase they help.

That was awesome, thanks.

jarvisandalfred

virusdancer wrote: »

Hrmm, close there, yeah? (that also gets into jarvisandalfred's post about the lack of scaling of heals going to T5U/T6 there, T6 are just T5).


So oh well, no idea how 26.6% becomes that 8.87%...beyond me, maybe somebody else can figure it out.[/COLOR]

Just to drop in my two cents: I'm having the same issue with the Samsar console, it's coming out to be ~11%, though I don't stack perhaps as much hull rep as I should. I haven't a clue how it's calculating things; I took a quick look at it adding to hull rep, it being a multiplier somewhere in hull rep, a general multiplier, and all I think I figured out is that whatever it is, it doesn't care about biotech patch, which is a nice variable to isolate.

Secondly, the Command 4-set is a category 1 buff, same type as a tac console. I'll hop on tribble and reply about a few numbers on the rest of the consoles later tonight.

virusdancer

I was just kind of surprised to see the numbers all appear to be modified by the same amount. Based on those formulas from STOwiki...

Engineering Team: Heal = ((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) * ((Ability Rank + 2) / 3) * ((Skill / 200) + 1) * 1350

Auxiliary to Structural: Heal = (Aux Power + 49.95) * ((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) * ((Rank + 2) / 3) * ((Skill / 200) + 1) * 6

Hazard Emitters: Heal = (Aux Power + 49.95) * ((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) * ((Ability Rank + 2) / 3) * ((Skill / 200) + 1) * 16

Hrmmm, and you said you were getting ~11 compared to my ~8.87%...hrmmm.

Let me play around some here with an ET1. So I strip everything away until I'm down just to the 99 Starship Hull Repair.

ET1 states it's a 6054.8 heal.

Run that through the formula...

((5+1)/2)*((1+2)/3)*((99/200)+1)*1350=3*1*1.495*1350=6054.75...with rounding, 6054.8 as listed.

Slot the Kobali console.

6592.1 is the new heal.

6592.1 / 6054.75 = 1.0887485032412568644452702423717

I'm still getting that 8.887% that I got earlier.

I switch to a T5U ship (from the Samsar to an Apex), and I'm still getting that same 8.87% boost.

Do you have something that might be boosting the boost?

jarvisandalfred

virusdancer wrote: »

I switch to a T5U ship (from the Samsar to an Apex), and I'm still getting that same 8.87% boost.

Do you have something that might be boosting the boost?

On my level 60 Rom-KDF, I'm getting exactly 8.87%. On a level 54 Fed Engi, I'm getting exactly 8%, because the console's only showing up as a 24% boost. 26.6/24=8.87/8, so there's consistency there... Even weirder, because it was my level 54 that was previously showing it being at ~11%.

...

Level 54 Engi, 99 to hull repair, no personal/rep traits, ET3 should be 10091.25, shows up at 10091.2, so that's right.

Add the Samsar console, in theory it'd be that *1.24 (since the console levels with you a bit?), but it's actually 10898.6, an 8% boost flat.

Wait... 24/8=3 (Half-Life 3 confirmed).

Let's revisit the formula:

Heal = ((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) * ((Ability Rank + 2)/ 3) * ((Skill / 200) + 1) * 1350

The obvious solution is that the somehow put the 1.24 multiplier in a place where it's being divided by 3, which coincidentally does occur...

Checking my T1 T'liss (back to my level 60 Romulan, so console's showing as 26.6% again)...

2018.2 without it, which checks out

2555.6 with it

...That's a 26.6% difference. So, the issue is that it's based on ship tier?

That would make the formula for without the console (swapping back to comparing to my level 54's numbers because .24 is easier to work with:

Heal = (((5 + 1) / 2) * (( 3 + 2) / 3) * ((99 / 200 + 1) *1350 =

(((6 / 2) * ((5 / 3) * (299/200) * 1350 =

3 * 5 / 3 * 299 / 200 * 1350 = 10091.25, which is right



And the formula for with the Samsar console:

Heal = ((((5 + 1) / 2) + .24) * (( 3 + 2)))/ 3) * ((99 / 200 + 1) *1350 =

((6 / 2 ) +.24 ) * (5 / 3 ) * (299/200) * 1350 =

3.24 * 5 / 3 * 299 / 200 * 1350 = 10898.55, which is spot on...

The same formula works for my T'Liss, FYI.

So, my Engineering Team formula now reads:

Heal = (((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) + (bonus healing percent from Samsar console)* ((Ability Rank + 2) / 3) * ((Skill / 200) + 1) * 1350 (*1.2 if you have Biotech Patch).

Does that agree with what you see?

Because, if so, that's a bug report that needs to be submitted.

And also, can you think of any good explanation for why it would be coded that way?

virusdancer

Hrmmm, if I take the formulas...

Engineering Team: Heal = ((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) * ((Ability Rank + 2) / 3) * ((Skill / 200) + 1) * 1350

Auxiliary to Structural: Heal = (Aux Power + 49.95) * ((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) * ((Rank + 2) / 3) * ((Skill / 200) + 1) * 6

Hazard Emitters: Heal = (Aux Power + 49.95) * ((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) * ((Ability Rank + 2) / 3) * ((Skill / 200) + 1) * 16

...and modify them with that bit, the 0.266 - wait, let me get a different number there, a quick check showed it off a bit (rounding/truncating).

0.08875 * 3 = 0.26625

So let me run the ET3, AtS3(70 Aux), HE3(70 Aux) through the modified versions of the formulas for the console...

ET3: (((5 + 1) /2) + 0.26625) * ((3 + 2) / 3) * ((187 / 200) + 1) * 1350 = ((6 / 2) + 0.26625) * (5 / 3) * (0.935 + 1) * 1350 = 3.26625 * 1.667 * 1.935 * 1350 = 14223.2800246875

Tooltip showed 14204.6; so my rounding was off somewhere.

AtS3: (70 + 49.95) * (((5 + 1) / 2) + 0.26625) * ((3 + 2) / 3) * ((187 / 200) + 1) * 6 = 119.95 * ((6 / 2) + 0.26625) * (5 / 3) * (0.935 + 1) * 6 = 119.95 * 3.26625 * 1.667 * 1.935 * 6 = 7582.588617605625

Tooltip showed 7584.1; so this one was closer.

HE3: (70 + 49.95) * (((5 + 1) / 2) + 0.26625) * ((3 + 2) / 3) * ((187 / 200) + 1) * 16 = 119.95 * ((6 / 2) + 0.26625) * (5 / 3) * (0.935 + 1) * 16 = 119.95 * 3.26625 * 1.667 * 1.935 * 16 = 20220.236313615

Tooltip showed 20224.3; so again this one was closer.

But yeah, that would appear to be the formula as it is applying.

The Kobali% is being added in there to the Ship Tier part of the various formulas.

((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) is (((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) + Kobali%)

Which results in it offering 1/3rd the boost displayed in the tooltip...

...hrmmm, meh. Thanks for figuring that out, heh...but meh, yeah? Meh...

warmaker001b

I really hate how cryptic this game goes about doing its stats, bonuses. We can't even look at a stat that's supposed to be a bonus and wonder if it's one type of bonus or a different kind of bonus altogether. Because the types of bonuses have 2 totally differrent values of worth to a player. I'll go on to say that the vast majority of the player base don't even know the difference that the bonus from something like TAC Consoles are totally different from something like Nukara Space Set, 8472 Weapon Set 2 piece bonuses.

Because we look at things face value and trust the developers own damn descriptions for it to do exactly what it says. But they frequently don't.

Then you have this TRIBBLE here... +26% hull healing but it's really a ******n 8%? Dafuq Cryptic?

jarvisandalfred

virusdancer wrote: »

Tooltip showed 14204.6; so my rounding was off somewhere.

AtS3: (70 + 49.95) * (((5 + 1) / 2) + 0.26625) * ((3 + 2) / 3) * ((187 / 200) + 1) * 6 = 119.95 * ((6 / 2) + 0.26625) * (5 / 3) * (0.935 + 1) * 6 = 119.95 * 3.26625 * 1.667 * 1.935 * 6 = 7582.588617605625

Tooltip showed 7584.1; so this one was closer.

HE3: (70 + 49.95) * (((5 + 1) / 2) + 0.26625) * ((3 + 2) / 3) * ((187 / 200) + 1) * 16 = 119.95 * ((6 / 2) + 0.26625) * (5 / 3) * (0.935 + 1) * 16 = 119.95 * 3.26625 * 1.667 * 1.935 * 16 = 20220.236313615

Tooltip showed 20224.3; so again this one was closer.

But yeah, that would appear to be the formula as it is applying.

The Kobali% is being added in there to the Ship Tier part of the various formulas.

((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) is (((Ship Tier + 1) / 2) + Kobali%)

Which results in it offering 1/3rd the boost displayed in the tooltip...

...hrmmm, meh. Thanks for figuring that out, heh...but meh, yeah? Meh...

Thanks for confirming that that's basically what's going on.

I'm assuming that's a bug, here's the submitted bug report.

As to your rounding errors, I'm assuming that you have the Assimilated Module or some other fractional amount of hull repair on that's messing you up, and fractional power levels are likely doing the same thing for the aux-based heals.

lucho80

Lol, I could use virus' insane MMO math skills to try and figure out the power drain from Tyken's and shield drain from Tachyon Beam since Aux plays into those.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure that Tachyon platform from the command ships scales with flow caps. Someone put it in chat and when I looked at the stats in system space they went up versus ground. Pretty impressive numbers when running high flow caps for an AoE console.

jarvisandalfred

lucho80 wrote: »

Lol, I could use virus' insane MMO math skills to try and figure out the power drain from Tyken's and shield drain from Tachyon Beam since Aux plays into those.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure that Tachyon platform from the command ships scales with flow caps. Someone put it in chat and when I looked at the stats in system space they went up versus ground. Pretty impressive numbers when running high flow caps for an AoE console.

Yup, they do.

virusdancer

lucho80 wrote: »

Lol, I could use virus' insane MMO math skills to try and figure out...

All I did was babble some numbers, throw my hands up in the air, and...well, that's pretty much it. jarvisandalfred came along with the eureka, figuring it out. I might go on and on about damage, but that's a formula that's been refined over years...starting out with a similar situation as here, me babbling numbers and saying this makes no sense...somebody stepping in to bring some sense to it.

Some folks might be concerned about how they come off looking, rambling on with numbers like an idiot like I do at times...completely lost, lol....but I don't how I look, I'm curious and if I can't figure something out with my wee brain, I'll ask in the most gooftastic fashion possible if necessary. I'm grateful that folks wade through my stuff to answer at times. It's greatly appreciated.