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Dear Dev's KDF command ships WTF????

ssbn655ssbn655 Member Posts: 1,894 Arc User
Seriously WTF did you turn a 5 year old loose when you designed the look? They are just awful looking. Awe inspiring???? I had high hopes the design ethic of the Veteran Destroyer, Mogh and Matha would have carried through. But we got pre-school Fisher Price designed ships. Seriously WTF? The Rom faction ships are graceful, feds carry the design cues of Oddy, Vesta , and the Klingons get dog bones and fisher price building blocks stuck together. You blew it BIG TIME!
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Comments

  • eiledoneiledon Member Posts: 595 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    didnt you already make this point elsewhere.

    a lot of people seem to enjoy the brutal look of the new kdf ships. a lot of people dont. if you are one who doesnt you dont need to get one.
  • anazondaanazonda Member Posts: 8,399 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Looks perfectly like a Klingon ship?

    Are you just complaining to complain OP?
    Don't look silly... Don't call it the "Z-Store/Zen Store"...
    Let me put the rumors to rest: it's definitely still the C-Store (Cryptic Store) It just takes ZEN.
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  • ssbn655ssbn655 Member Posts: 1,894 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    LMAO Oh dear I don't have a right to complain?
  • crazyned1066crazyned1066 Member Posts: 198 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    eiledon wrote: »
    didnt you already make this point elsewhere.

    a lot of people seem to enjoy the brutal look of the new kdf ships. a lot of people dont. if you are one who doesnt you dont need to get one.

    I have to agree with the OP, the Klingon ships are pretty nasty looking. They remind me of something a kid would make out of LEGO blocks and toilet paper rolls.

    I found myself wondering if I could build a combination that isn't Butt-Ugly, if I had all three ships to work with. Maybe that was the intention?
  • ssbn655ssbn655 Member Posts: 1,894 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    That was just snippy of me.
  • mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,963 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Only the boxy ship is "nasty looking" (and even that had its fans).

    The others are pretty cool, and even the "nasty" looking ones has components that work pretty well.
    Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
  • anazondaanazonda Member Posts: 8,399 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    ssbn655 wrote: »
    LMAO Oh dear I don't have a right to complain?

    Sure you do, but I really don't see what you are on about?

    They look just like every other Klingon ship... As klingon as it gets.
    Don't look silly... Don't call it the "Z-Store/Zen Store"...
    Let me put the rumors to rest: it's definitely still the C-Store (Cryptic Store) It just takes ZEN.
    Like Duty Officers? Support effords to gather ideas
  • crazyned1066crazyned1066 Member Posts: 198 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Only the boxy ship is "nasty looking" (and even that had its fans).

    The others are pretty cool, and even the "nasty" looking ones has components that work pretty well.

    We all have our own vision of beauty...

    When I think of Klingons, I picture Birds of Prey, Raptors, or Negh'Var Battlecruisers. Sleek ships with flowing lines.

    I don't picture a flying brick.
  • goodscotchgoodscotch Member Posts: 1,680 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Kind of agree with the OP. The Federation and Romulan designs are at least similar to their older designs and the lines are instantly recognizable as Fed and Romulan. But the Klingon ships are a bit of a departure from their predecessors.

    I have zero interest precisely because there's little resemblance to previous models. They neither look like the K'tinga line nor do they have a resemblance to the Bird-of-Prey ships. One could argue that maybe one or two variations have a slight resemblance to the Bortasqu ship, but even that's slight. This is all opinion of course...beauty is in the eye of the beholder. But beauty or not, they should have lines that are unmistakably Klingon, like the new Federation and Romulan ships have unmistakable Fed and Romulan lines.

    Think of it this way...if those new Klingon ships were painted royal blue and assigned to an alien race...everyone in the game would buy into it without blinking an eye. But Klingon...?
    klingon-bridge.jpg




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  • gazurtoidgazurtoid Member Posts: 423 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    So the KDF gets an equal number of new ships in a release compared to the Feds/Roms, and people still complain?

    ...
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  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    gazurtoid wrote: »
    So the KDF gets an equal number of new ships in a release compared to the Feds/Roms, and people still complain?

    ...
    people complain about everything.... there's a thread where someone tried to say that Cryptic giving people free ships is a sinister plot to force us to buy more ship slots.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
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  • olessiusolessius Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    ssbn655 wrote: »
    Seriously WTF did you turn a 5 year old loose when you designed the look? They are just awful looking. Awe inspiring???? I had high hopes the design ethic of the Veteran Destroyer, Mogh and Matha would have carried through. But we got pre-school Fisher Price designed ships. Seriously WTF? The Rom faction ships are graceful, feds carry the design cues of Oddy, Vesta , and the Klingons get dog bones and fisher price building blocks stuck together. You blew it BIG TIME!

    This is something that annoys me. The new ships are VERY Klingon in appearance, and I would argue that they are more traditionally Klingon in appearance than either the Bortasqu', Mogh or Peghqu' are. In fact, they are not all that different from the Negh'Var, Vor'Cha or other, similar battlecruisers in terms of design aesthetic.

    I feel like people are complaining just because they've gotten so used to it by this point, that many of the people who complain quite honestly didn't like the traditional Klingon design aesthetic as much as they thought they did, or that they never really understood the Klingon aesthetic in the first place, because as cool as they certainly do look, the ships I mentioned earlier are very much an exception to what should be considered the iconic Klingon ship design.

    Klingon ships always followed a Soviet-inspired, utilitarian, brutalist style. These new ships do a great job of following that aesthetic.
  • kdfrulzfeddroolzkdfrulzfeddroolz Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    ssbn655 wrote: »
    Seriously WTF did you turn a 5 year old loose when you designed the look? They are just awful looking. Awe inspiring???? I had high hopes the design ethic of the Veteran Destroyer, Mogh and Matha would have carried through. But we got pre-school Fisher Price designed ships. Seriously WTF? The Rom faction ships are graceful, feds carry the design cues of Oddy, Vesta , and the Klingons get dog bones and fisher price building blocks stuck together. You blew it BIG TIME!

    Quoted for truth! The only thing really Klingon about them is the fact that people keep calling them Klingon! LOL! :rolleyes:

    The closest designs Cryptic ever did to anything I'd ever consider as going in the right direction, IMO, were the Vor'kang and Kamarang but even they weren't great, just ok.

    The Command ships wow... the horror that has been seen cannot be unseen. :eek:
  • dalolorndalolorn Member Posts: 3,655 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    Quoted for truth! The only thing really Klingon about them is the fact that people keep calling them Klingon! LOL! :rolleyes:

    The closest designs Cryptic ever did to anything I'd ever consider as going in the right direction, IMO, were the Vor'kang and Kamarang but even they weren't great, just ok.

    The Command ships wow... the horror that has been seen cannot be unseen. :eek:

    Honestly, I'm inclined to agree.

    These three ships are a drastic departure from just about any Klingon design characteristics displayed previously on the shows, particularly the one with the trapezoid head.

    'Traditional Klingon design aesthetic'? 'Soviet-inspired, utilitarian, brutalist style'? The D-7 is the archetypal Klingon ship, and this thing bears no similarity whatsoever to it.

    Okay, maybe a Raptor? *pause* Nope. Not a Raptor, either.

    D-5 or whatever that ENT bird of prey was called? Naaah.

    Ah, but maybe it was an evolution from the D-7! Let's see...

    It's no B'rel/K'vort. (Admittedly, not the same design family.)

    Maybe it's a successor to the Vor'cha or the Negh'var? No, those ships actually looked like a fairly decent, 'utilitarian' evolution from the D-7 and Vor'cha, respectively.

    Bortasqu'? Mogh? Peghqu'? Nope, don't see the evolution there either.

    Do you get the point, olessius?

    Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.p3OEBPD6HU3QI.jpg
  • alcyoneserenealcyoneserene Member Posts: 2,414 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    ssbn655 wrote: »
    Seriously WTF did you turn a 5 year old loose when you designed the look? [...] pre-school Fisher Price designed ships. [...] Klingons get dog bones and fisher price building blocks stuck together.

    You're certainly not alone on that observation.
    I found myself wondering if I could build a combination that isn't Butt-Ugly, if I had all three ships to work with. Maybe that was the intention?

    That may well be the intent. Release something that looks somewhat klingon, add one or more parts on each ship that just look completely off -by design-, and make the final generic product achievable only with all three ships - and do a rush job of it so all the parts fit together, nevermind it looking like some toy.
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  • zeuxidemus001zeuxidemus001 Member Posts: 3,357 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    You're certainly not alone on that observation.



    That may well be the intent. Release something that looks somewhat klingon, add one or more parts on each ship that just look completely off -by design-, and make the final generic product achievable only with all three ships - and do a rush job of it so all the parts fit together, nevermind it looking like some toy.

    Don't forget the fact that a lot of long time players if they are still playing having to relearn what every single new looking icon does. Then the fact you have to go through every boff on every character and redo their powers. Then deal with the fact that its just another bunch of bortasqu's that will fail and be for the next 3-4 years the reason to say KDF development should come to an end.
  • mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,963 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    dalolorn wrote: »
    Honestly, I'm inclined to agree.

    These three ships are a drastic departure from just about any Klingon design characteristics displayed previously on the shows, particularly the one with the trapezoid head.

    'Traditional Klingon design aesthetic'? 'Soviet-inspired, utilitarian, brutalist style'? The D-7 is the archetypal Klingon ship, and this thing bears no similarity whatsoever to it.

    Okay, maybe a Raptor? *pause* Nope. Not a Raptor, either.

    D-5 or whatever that ENT bird of prey was called? Naaah.

    Ah, but maybe it was an evolution from the D-7! Let's see...

    It's no B'rel/K'vort. (Admittedly, not the same design family.)

    Maybe it's a successor to the Vor'cha or the Negh'var? No, those ships actually looked like a fairly decent, 'utilitarian' evolution from the D-7 and Vor'cha, respectively.

    Bortasqu'? Mogh? Peghqu'? Nope, don't see the evolution there either.

    Do you get the point, olessius?

    Oh come on - the lineage with the D7/Vor'Cha/Neg'Var line of Klingon Ships is quite obvious. You have the wins with the nacelles, the head with a torpedo launcher that is attached on a neck leading back to the wings, the super structure in the rear middle part of the wings.

    It are pretty obviously different possible evolutions from there - you can still dislike them, of course. Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder.
    Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
  • olessiusolessius Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    dalolorn wrote: »
    Honestly, I'm inclined to agree.

    These three ships are a drastic departure from just about any Klingon design characteristics displayed previously on the shows, particularly the one with the trapezoid head.

    'Traditional Klingon design aesthetic'? 'Soviet-inspired, utilitarian, brutalist style'? The D-7 is the archetypal Klingon ship, and this thing bears no similarity whatsoever to it.

    Okay, maybe a Raptor? *pause* Nope. Not a Raptor, either.

    D-5 or whatever that ENT bird of prey was called? Naaah.

    Ah, but maybe it was an evolution from the D-7! Let's see...

    It's no B'rel/K'vort. (Admittedly, not the same design family.)

    Maybe it's a successor to the Vor'cha or the Negh'var? No, those ships actually looked like a fairly decent, 'utilitarian' evolution from the D-7 and Vor'cha, respectively.

    Bortasqu'? Mogh? Peghqu'? Nope, don't see the evolution there either.

    Do you get the point, olessius?

    No. Maybe I'd understand it better if you were a just bit more pointlessly insulting. :rolleyes:

    The line of development, as I see it, goes like this: D7 > Vor'Cha > Negh'Var > Command BCs. The Mogh and Peghqu' certainly don't fit into this line (over-sized and over-designed nacelles, stanchions that aren't wing-like enough and necks that don't differ enough from the main hulls in terms of size), and I personally feel that the Command BCs do a better job of adhering to the classic Klingon look than the Bortasqu' does (though I do enjoy the Bortasqu's look as well).
  • shpoksshpoks Member Posts: 6,967 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    dalolorn wrote: »
    'Traditional Klingon design aesthetic'? 'Soviet-inspired, utilitarian, brutalist style'? The D-7 is the archetypal Klingon ship, and this thing bears no similarity whatsoever to it.

    Actually, the An'Quat fits that description perfectly. And all of these ships have a lot of those "Soviet-inspired" utalitarian elements.

    But more importantly, I've just finished watching the livestream with Nick and Ian, 2 of the "ship devs". They explained that this time the concept artist was given much more freedom with the KDF designs, in order to break the mold and come up with something that would be reckognizable, but still jumps out of the lineage. They said that after comming up with the initial designs/sketches they also had a pause and thorough debates what to do. In the end, they decided to go with something a bit new and unconvential, because these were to be battlecruisers and that particular part of the KDF lineup is very fleshed out, so they didn't want to end up with something that would resemble all the other battlecruisers too much.

    Basically, they made the ships for people like olessius. They knew that some would hate them, but some would fancy them. And they said there are more comming, some of which would be to the taste of players who desire more traditional Klingon designs.
    I'm personally still on the fence about these, but I understand the thought process. And I'm glad that the concept artists have been given more freedom cause you never know when they'll make a real KDF gem.

    They knew these will raise eyebrows and they took a gamble. And like it or not, they are raising eyebrows. One way or antoher, these have been the hot topic these last few days - much more than the Federation or Romulan ones.
    HQroeLu.jpg
  • kelshandokelshando Member Posts: 887 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    shpoks wrote: »
    Actually, the An'Quat fits that description perfectly. And all of these ships have a lot of those "Soviet-inspired" utalitarian elements.

    But more importantly, I've just finished watching the livestream with Nick and Ian, 2 of the "ship devs". They explained that this time the concept artist was given much more freedom with the KDF designs, in order to break the mold and come up with something that would be reckognizable, but still jumps out of the lineage. They said that after comming up with the initial designs/sketches they also had a pause and thorough debates what to do. In the end, they decided to go with something a bit new and unconvential, because these were to be battlecruisers and that particular part of the KDF lineup is very fleshed out, so they didn't want to end up with something that would resemble all the other battlecruisers too much.

    Basically, they made the ships for people like olessius. They knew that some would hate them, but some would fancy them. And they said there are more comming, some of which would be to the taste of players who desire more traditional Klingon designs.
    I'm personally still on the fence about these, but I understand the thought process. And I'm glad that the concept artists have been given more freedom cause you never know when they'll make a real KDF gem.

    They knew these will raise eyebrows and they took a gamble. And like it or not, they are raising eyebrows. One way or antoher, these have been the hot topic these last few days - much more than the Federation or Romulan ones.

    I watched it as well and when combining the ships you could come up with a pretty nice looking ship.. but the problem is I'm pretty sure you have to own all 3 to be able to do that. so if you cant afford all 3 ships your stuck.. Where as the Fed and romulan ships can hold there own with out mix and matching.

    unless you get all 3 customizations even if you buy only one ship but I highly doupt that.
  • coupaholiccoupaholic Member Posts: 2,188 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    OK. KDF get front line bruisers, literal flying fortresses...and we're complaining because they don't look girly enough?

    Aww poor warrior. Don't worry, get some pink fluffy dice for the viewscreen. That'll help I'm sure.
  • shpoksshpoks Member Posts: 6,967 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    kelshando wrote: »
    I watched it as well and when combining the ships you could come up with a pretty nice looking ship.. but the problem is I'm pretty sure you have to own all 3 to be able to do that. so if you cant afford all 3 ships your stuck.. Where as the Fed and romulan ships can hold there own with out mix and matching.

    unless you get all 3 customizations even if you buy only one ship but I highly doupt that.

    No, you're right - you have to have each of the variants in order to use it's parts in the mixmatching process. However, Smirk did make a really cool looking combination buy mixing parts form the 3 ships in the livestream.

    I'll give you that the Romulan designs can hold on their own, but not the Fed. ones - those need mixmathcing of at least 2 of them to make something work, at least for me.
    In fact all Romulan ships are good to hold their own as single designs, then the KDF Ty'Gokor can partially/somewhat hold it's own based on taste and all the others need mixmatching to create something that would be attractive.
    But that's just me and personal tastes are beyond debate, I'm sure there are people that love the Geneva while to me it looks like a pigeon with a spinal disorder. *shrugs*
    HQroeLu.jpg
  • shpoksshpoks Member Posts: 6,967 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    coupaholic wrote: »
    OK. KDF get front line bruisers, literal flying fortresses...

    That An'Quat Class makes me think of planetary assault/invasion.
    HQroeLu.jpg
  • kelshandokelshando Member Posts: 887 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    shpoks wrote: »
    No, you're right - you have to have each of the variants in order to use it's parts in the mixmatching process. However, Smirk did make a really cool looking combination buy mixing parts form the 3 ships in the livestream.

    I'll give you that the Romulan designs can hold on their own, but not the Fed. ones - those need mixmathcing of at least 2 of them to make something work, at least for me.
    In fact all Romulan ships are good to hold their own as single designs, then the KDF Ty'Gokor can partially/somewhat hold it's own based on taste and all the others need mixmatching to create something that would be attractive.
    But that's just me and personal tastes are beyond debate, I'm sure there are people that love the Geneva while to me it looks like a pigeon with a spinal disorder. *shrugs*

    That's the crux of it.. as a LTS and pre that already spent well over a hundred before buying a LTS I'm not forking out more cash so I can buy 3 ships to make one look ok. I may.. and that's a big may save up and buy the Romulan tac.. but that's only do to the fact I do not own a T6Romulan faction ship yet, I bought my Fed and KDF ones 1st.

    Now if they had all 3 customizations even if you owned only one ship then I maybe would get a KDF one but as of now..it's just to much.
  • shpoksshpoks Member Posts: 6,967 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    kelshando wrote: »
    That's the crux of it.. as a LTS and pre that already spent well over a hundred before buying a LTS I'm not forking out more cash so I can buy 3 ships to make one look ok. I may.. and that's a big may save up and buy the Romulan tac.. but that's only do to the fact I do not own a T6Romulan faction ship yet, I bought my Fed and KDF ones 1st.

    Now if they had all 3 customizations even if you owned only one ship then I maybe would get a KDF one but as of now..it's just to much.

    Yeah, that's what I'm thinking more or less as well. The Romulan set is gorgeous and I don't own a Romulan T6 yet, so this may be it.
    I'm still not completely sold on the KDF desings, but may pick them up somewhere down the road to support the faction. For now the Mat'ha and Qib are just too good to give them a break.
    Since these "command" technically unbreakable ships suit my preferred playstyle perfectly, there's a good chance I'll pick the Federation set as well sometime in the future, but by the time I do I'll probably sing the ENT theme song "It's been a loooong grind, getting from there to here..." :P because for the salty 12k Zen for the mega-bundle....yeah, I'd rather take it step by step.
    HQroeLu.jpg
  • kelshandokelshando Member Posts: 887 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    shpoks wrote: »
    Yeah, that's what I'm thinking more or less as well. The Romulan set is gorgeous and I don't own a Romulan T6 yet, so this may be it.
    I'm still not completely sold on the KDF desings, but may pick them up somewhere down the road to support the faction. For now the Mat'ha and Qib are just too good to give them a break.
    Since these "command" technically unbreakable ships suit my preferred playstyle perfectly, there's a good chance I'll pick the Federation set as well sometime in the future, but by the time I do I'll probably sing the ENT theme song "It's been a loooong grind, getting from there to here..." :P because for the salty 12k Zen for the mega-bundle....yeah, I'd rather take it step by step.

    Shpoks and Kelshando agreeing and being civil to one another... oh what has Cryptic done.....
  • shpoksshpoks Member Posts: 6,967 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    kelshando wrote: »
    Shpoks and Kelshando agreeing and being civil to one another... oh what has Cryptic done.....

    Clearly a Borg lockbox is in the making.....:P
    HQroeLu.jpg
  • abystander0abystander0 Member Posts: 649 Arc User
    edited February 2015
    coupaholic wrote: »
    OK. KDF get front line bruisers, literal flying fortresses...and we're complaining because they don't look girly enough?

    Aww poor warrior. Don't worry, get some pink fluffy dice for the viewscreen. That'll help I'm sure.

    I think this sums it up best.

    Aesthetics for the Klingons hew toward the utilitarian. Efficiency and utility over beauty. For them function dictates form.

    Klingons would prefer a function blade with a well worn hilt that has seen combat, over one that is chased in gold and studded in gems that would get nicked and fail in the first battle.

    Real life example: A10-Thunderbolt II aka Warthog.

    This plane is not at all sleek or sexy like supersonic fighters. It's blocky and square. Not even the air force likes it. What it is, is a deadly ground attack aircraft that is built around one of the biggest gatling guns that could be fitted onto an aircraft. It is built to be survivable against damage that would down another aircraft, take off and land on rough unpaved airfields, and be serviced with minimal equipment.

    While I do have a few quibbles over certain parts of the new ships, over all I think they are good.

    If the answer to the question "Can I kill my enemies with it, and live to see the next battle?" is "yes", then you have a good design.



    Also: Feds don't hang fuzzy dice over the main viewscreen as it is against regulations. There were too many redshirts getting impaled when they flew off the hook when a ship took any damage. However, curtains when properly secured, are acceptable as long as the match they rest of the ship's decor.
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