Generations would've been better overall in that department had they just eliminated the Klingons from the plot entirely and replaced them with the Romulans. The trilithium Soran needs belongs to them, and they could have struck a deal where he "weaponizes" it for them, while also getting to use it for his own plans. This way you'd have the Enterprise-D facing a D'deridex-class warbird, with Tomalak as their opponent, instead of the comedy Klingons we ended up with.
Tomalak would of been a great finally antagonist to end the D with sense picard and tomalak have been going at it sense season one
there's actually nothing wrong with how the yamato went out, there is even a good tech accurate reasoning behind it, unlike how they handled cause and effect, and generations.
the iconions are like the final boss of the galaxy, the yamato got one of their viruses that DID literally prevent the 100 fail safes in place from preventing core failure from working, its totally believable that the iconions could make a virus do that much damage. the same thing happened to the D, but for basically no reason at all, thats the difference.
and i don't know how i forgot the EPS conduits, of course all the plasma and reaction chambers are also in magnetic fields. still, they cant have been so easy to fail with out a physical breach in the core or conduits themselves, damage to the nacelle can not cause this, there would be thousands of places to close the valve on EPS conduits, even backup force fields could be placed inside of them is those fail. and there would be a 3rd method as well, triple redundancy is on literally everything is how starfleet engineers things. unfortunately, its pretty hard to write around that, so they just don't, mechanical catastrophe is good for ratings.
I remember when I was in the theater for ST3, and was nearly mind blown when Kirk selfdestructed the Enterprise . Even knowing the situation in the story, I still felt it was a weak way for the ship to go down. The D wasnt the only Enterprise to go down like a punk
I remember when I was in the theater for ST3, and was nearly mind blown when Kirk selfdestructed the Enterprise . Even knowing the situation in the story, I still felt it was a weak way for the ship to go down. The D wasnt the only Enterprise to go down like a punk
Yeah, but it was much more believable. The Enterprise was still getting put back together from a battle to the death with Reliant, during which the Enterprise got sucker-punched in the first round. Then, you've automated the ship so 5 people can run the whole thing from the bridge. Ordinarily, the Enterprise could stomp a BoP. One hit caused a lot of damage and without a full crew to repair that, Kirk was low on options. Blowing up the Enterprise to prevent its capture by the Klingons while simultaneously taking out most of Kruge's crew was win-win in a lousy situation.
The D getting taken out by a BoP that it should have stomped, shields or no shields, was a joke.
"After a time, you may find that having is not so pleasing a thing after all as wanting. It is not logical, but it is often true. Except for a T5 Connie. That would be f*%#ing awesome." - Mr. Spock
The 'death' of the Enterprise D was just too ignoble. There are so many better ways for her to go then 'ancient BOP getting lucky shots'. How about 'Battle Section detonates warp core to seal/repel the nexus' - or 'warp jumping into the path of the Trilithium warhead - and the warhead doing insane damage.
Actually I don't think that the Trilithium warhead would've done massive damage.
It's not a Death Star destroying a planet with brute force. A Trilithium Torpedo basically halts the normal nuclear reactions in a star causing a core collapse. Allowing gravity to win...and then the star goes boom. However that wouldn't do anything to a starship's shields.
No, we got the Cleavage sisters cheating and a crash landing.
I have no problem with the cleavage sisters or the crash landing...I'm actually quite fond of B'Etor. :cool:
Generations would've been better overall in that department had they just eliminated the Klingons from the plot entirely and replaced them with the Romulans. The trilithium Soran needs belongs to them, and they could have struck a deal where he "weaponizes" it for them, while also getting to use it for his own plans. This way you'd have the Enterprise-D facing a D'deridex-class warbird, with Tomalak as their opponent, instead of the comedy Klingons we ended up with.
Damn...I never thought of that before. That's really good. That's perfect.
Also the hijacking of LaForge's VISOR is absolutely consistent with previous Romulan tactics and scientific capability. And it's concretely known that they were already aware of LaForge's tactical weakness.
The question then becomes, how do they get the win? This might take a minute, though it would certainly carry the Galaxy class' reputation to the next level if they pull a Keogh and just fire a way and hull tank the TRIBBLE out of a D'deridex and win the fight straight up only for everything to collapse at the end from the extreme damage.
there's actually nothing wrong with how the yamato went out, there is even a good tech accurate reasoning behind it, unlike how they handled cause and effect, and generations.
the iconions are like the final boss of the galaxy, the yamato got one of their viruses that DID literally prevent the 100 fail safes in place from preventing core failure from working, its totally believable that the iconions could make a virus do that much damage. the same thing happened to the D, but for basically no reason at all, thats the difference.
Agreed.
and i don't know how i forgot the EPS conduits, of course all the plasma and reaction chambers are also in magnetic fields. still, they cant have been so easy to fail with out a physical breach in the core or conduits themselves, damage to the nacelle can not cause this, there would be thousands of places to close the valve on EPS conduits, even backup force fields could be placed inside of them is those fail. and there would be a 3rd method as well, triple redundancy is on literally everything is how starfleet engineers things. unfortunately, its pretty hard to write around that, so they just don't, mechanical catastrophe is good for ratings.
Well on that we can agree, that's why I say complete design flaw and will agree to bad writing. I'd have a six layer failsafe system myself.
I remember when I was in the theater for ST3, and was nearly mind blown when Kirk selfdestructed the Enterprise . Even knowing the situation in the story, I still felt it was a weak way for the ship to go down. The D wasnt the only Enterprise to go down like a punk
I've always thought it was a G move.
Kirk was out of moves so he lured his opponents in to point blank range and burned his own house down around them. Though we know he was strictly winging it after he got down to the planet. But he definitely played on Kruge's ego... that said Kruge was still one of the most boss Klingons ever seen. Though he disobeyed Kahless' statement that only a fool fights in a burning house.
With a crew the shields would have been raised and the BoPs torpedo would have done minimal damage. Kirk would have then easily destroyed the BoP and beamed up Spock, Saavik as well as David.
Yep. But as said, the Enterprise never "healed" from the fight with the Reliant...and Khan wore the Enterprise's backside OUT.
There's also irony. In the encounter with Khan, Kirk lost before he began because he wouldn't raise the shields. Now, a few weeks later he lost again, because he couldn't raise the shields, directly as a consequence of the fact that he wouldn't raise the shields back then. His beloved ship...too bad there wasn't a Weyoun available to remark on him being fond of that ship.
The moral of this story of course is always listen to Saavik.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
i just assumed the shield system was just damaged from the last battle with the reliant and was never repaired. remember starfleet was talking about decommissioning the enterpise before they stole it. they where never going to fix it so all the quick patch repair scotty did before they made it to the starbase was all it got. it might of even had parts removed in prep for the decommissioning for use on other ships
also i would really like to read the first draft of generations. it really feels like the klingons where thrown in last minute just so they could use star trek 6 footage. as thinking over ti the main plot works better and makes more sense with a D'D and romulans
even though in one rewrite of the script it was suppose to be a Vor'Cha
Yeah, but it was much more believable. The Enterprise was still getting put back together from a battle to the death with Reliant, during which the Enterprise got sucker-punched in the first round. Then, you've automated the ship so 5 people can run the whole thing from the bridge. Ordinarily, the Enterprise could stomp a BoP. One hit caused a lot of damage and without a full crew to repair that, Kirk was low on options. Blowing up the Enterprise to prevent its capture by the Klingons while simultaneously taking out most of Kruge's crew was win-win in a lousy situation.
The D getting taken out by a BoP that it should have stomped, shields or no shields, was a joke.
I know what you are saying and where you are coming from but it still felt fairly empty of a death of THE Enterprise ( back then, there was only one).
Damn...I never thought of that before. That's really good. That's perfect.
Also the hijacking of LaForge's VISOR is absolutely consistent with previous Romulan tactics and scientific capability. And it's concretely known that they were already aware of LaForge's tactical weakness.
The question then becomes, how do they get the win? This might take a minute, though it would certainly carry the Galaxy class' reputation to the next level if they pull a Keogh and just fire a way and hull tank the TRIBBLE out of a D'deridex and win the fight straight up only for everything to collapse at the end from the extreme damage.
That was sort of my first thought too, though they'd also have an advantage after realising that the Romulans had accessed LaForge's visor, the crew then devise a plan to use that same link to gain some kind of advantage themselves over the warbird.
Fully healed no but definitely operational or "patched up".
No way. The Enterprise had taken no damage. Kirk says shields up. They stop half way. That's not patched. Scotty even said "I didn't expect to take her into battle". He sealed up the hull breaches and made her space worthy again, but she was the Going Merry going to Ennies Lobby, she was not fully operational. A lot of the damage the Enterprise had was gonna need a spacedock to fix, and when they got to the spacedock, they weren't allowed to work on her.
Unfortunately the Enterprise was not set up to be fully automated and Scotty's program wasn't more robust. Perhaps if he had more time the ship would have been ready...like the M5 automation set up.
Yeah, the M5 would've blown the Bird of Prey out of the stars before she decloaked.
i just assumed the shield system was just damaged from the last battle with the reliant and was never repaired. remember starfleet was talking about decommissioning the enterpise before they stole it. they where never going to fix it so all the quick patch repair scotty did before they made it to the starbase was all it got. it might of even had parts removed in prep for the decommissioning for use on other ships
Agreed. Admiral Morrow made it seem like there was no hope for the Enterprise.
also i would really like to read the first draft of generations. it really feels like the klingons where thrown in last minute just so they could use star trek 6 footage. as thinking over ti the main plot works better and makes more sense with a D'D and romulans
even though in one rewrite of the script it was suppose to be a Vor'Cha
Well the earlier drafts would've shown the Romulans Attacking Armagosa, but Jeri Taylor nixed that idea for something more charming, I can only assume Data's emotion chip woes or perhaps Worf's promotion ceremony.
You might be interested to know that another thing that got cut was the Duras sisters surviving the destruction of their Bird and fighting the Enterprise crew in the jungles of Veridian III.
As usual this can be blamed at least in part on the studio....
With the start of preproduction, Berman battled the studio over budget figures, the film cut in cost to an estimated US$35 million. [2] Hopes for location shooting in Hawaii and Idaho were dropped in favor of more local shoots in Hollywood, Marina del Rey, Pasadena, Lone Pine, and the Valley of Fire State Park near Las Vegas, Nevada. By 16 March 1994, Moore and Braga's script reflected budget and cast changes.
That was sort of my first thought too, though they'd also have an advantage after realising that the Romulans had accessed LaForge's visor, the crew then devise a plan to use that same link to gain some kind of advantage themselves over the warbird.
I thought the same, the only issue is them actually figuring it out since that didn't factor into the defeat of the Duras sisters. Though I suppose it's fair leap since the Romulans had done it before. Just investigating in the heat of battle. That said, it's a very Star Trek solution to use the VISOR against them and it's certainly something I'd go with.
I'd have LaForge look at their weapon frequencies so that they would adjust their shields to something that would block them, but have the reading falsified so it would instead allow the Enterprise to fire through their shields.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
sorry to interupt but in the last priority podcast gecko mentioned that the most succesfull ( in term of sell ) ship is the galaxy x.
and i am sure that the galaxy retrofit is not far behind so that really show that many people would paid for a tier 6 version of them.the potential is here.
gecko was speaking about the sell of the command ship, they are the most succesfull sell of ship that the game ever have in that short time.
the galaxy x sell more but only because it was here for about almost 5 years now.
but imagine for a moment that those ships ( galaxy ) were OP like the scimitar, they would have litteraly obliterated the scoreboard!
Actually shields weren't responding and then Scotty said it was the automation circuit was overloaded not that the shields weren't capable of being raised. In fact everyone was shocked the shields didn't respond. In the opening scene Kirk tells Scotty that's he's "fixed the bar door after the horse has come home".
But yes due to Scotty being required to work on Excelsior there was no time to get the Enterprise even remotely 100% on full automation.
The M5 was a complete install with a full crew to prepare it. But it shows what could have been done with proper prep time.
it must have been a long trip back to space dock after the genesis planet was created, if you look at the damage in star trek 3, the ship is twice as banged up as it was since the last hit it took from the reliant.
sorry to interupt but in the last priority podcast gecko mentioned that the most succesfull ( in term of sell ) ship is the galaxy x.
and i am sure that the galaxy retrofit is not far behind so that really show that many people would paid for a tier 6 version of them.the potential is here.
gecko was speaking about the sell of the command ship, they are the most succesfull sell of ship that the game ever have in that short time.
the galaxy x sell more but only because it was here for about almost 5 years now.
but imagine for a moment that those ships ( galaxy ) were OP like the scimitar, they would have litteraly obliterated the scoreboard!
must be why they are so confused, how can we be unhappy? the ship made us the most money! doesn't that mean everyone's happy and there's nothing to complain about?
proud non supporter of the galaxy X here, one of the few ships i haven't bought.
thats kinda gross though, the command ships being such a success. you cant even use any command skills till you grind out 10 levels on the damn specialization. literally how can people keep buying ships, with the way the game is now
Well there was time to reassign most of the cadet crew.
After so much damage they barely had main power and would limp back to ESD giving Scotty time for repairs.
Scotty wasn't assuming he would be leaving for Excelsior and resisted said command so he wanted to get things fixed asap on the way back.
no your missing my key point. the enterprise filming model has more then twice the damage on it in ST3 then it did at the end of ST2. implying it got in an even bigger battle off camera on the way back to earth?
Or just put it down to another Great Movie Mistake
I doubt the Enterprise got into another battle, the extra damage between Khan and Spock could quite simply have been for dramtic value as the heroes return to Spacedock and the reception party waiting for them gets to see the deep scars left from the Khan fight in visual form. We got to see the emotional effect it had on the crew at the end of Khan.
sorry to interupt but in the last priority podcast gecko mentioned that the most succesfull ( in term of sell ) ship is the galaxy x.
and i am sure that the galaxy retrofit is not far behind so that really show that many people would paid for a tier 6 version of them.the potential is here.
gecko was speaking about the sell of the command ship, they are the most succesfull sell of ship that the game ever have in that short time.
the galaxy x sell more but only because it was here for about almost 5 years now.
but imagine for a moment that those ships ( galaxy ) were OP like the scimitar, they would have litteraly obliterated the scoreboard!
Galaxy X sold well because its stats were better then the Galaxy R. I find it hard to believe the Galaxy X is more popular then the Galaxy R because there are a bunch of forums asking for a better Galaxy R and nothing about the Galaxy X. I personally don't like the galaxy x its an ugly ship compare to orginal Galaxy.
The Gal-X probably outsells the R due to being far more useful than the R. But goes to show how popular the Galaxy is and kinda fuels the speculation that the R is in such a sorry state as Cryptic do fear giving the R decent stats, other/future ship sales might suffer.
I thought I saw something somewhere about possibly the Enterprise got into a battle with the Klingons on the way home from Genesis to Spacedock. I don't remember where I got that from - I'm pretty sure it isn't canon. But, I find it an interesting notion.
Also, I have a strong suspicion that the Galaxy R is purposely left in a sorry state by the powers that be because if they made it a really good ship, a majority of people would be flying around in the "Enterprize-D" and Picarding well into the night. Where would that leave ship/lockbox key sales?
I know, she's not everyone's cup 'o Earl Grey, but I suspect that a majority of players either went from TOS into TNG, or started with TNG as their first Star Trek. Either way, TNG is the sweet spot.
"After a time, you may find that having is not so pleasing a thing after all as wanting. It is not logical, but it is often true. Except for a T5 Connie. That would be f*%#ing awesome." - Mr. Spock
The Gal-X probably outsells the R due to being far more useful than the R. But goes to show how popular the Galaxy is and kinda fuels the speculation that the R is in such a sorry state as Cryptic do fear giving the R decent stats, other/future ship sales might suffer.
I imagine this is probaly the same reason why the Defiant Class and Constitution Class ships havent been made proper to what is portrayed on the shows. People would buy those three ships and then never buy any other ship again, well except for those STF and PvP Guys.
Galaxy X sold well because its stats were better then the Galaxy R. I find it hard to believe the Galaxy X is more popular then the Galaxy R because there are a bunch of forums asking for a better Galaxy R and nothing about the Galaxy X. I personally don't like the galaxy x its an ugly ship compare to orginal Galaxy.
the galaxy x didn't sold well just because its stats were better than the galaxy retrofit, but because it was a galaxy first, and a more efficient one, second.
the regent got better stats than the assault cruiser, but this was not sufficient to make it a top seller ship, in fact, from gecko own word, this ship was a disapointement in term of sell.
and better stats, well yes, but you better have to said it quick.
indeed this ship ( galaxy x ) didn't have hangar back in the day, neither the separation console, it didn't have 4 tact console, not even 3... but 2. it didn't have 4 weapons slot in the back... but 3. the phaser lance use to have a 3 min cooldown instead of the nowaday 2min and the base firepower was cut by half.
there is also an other explanation concerning the "least" number of sell of the galaxy retrofit compared to the x during these product lifetime.
the galaxy retrofit, as well as the defiant and intrepid was given for free when the season 2 ancient enemy was launched as a reward for reaching the new level cap of vice admiral 51 ( yes not 50).
so there a bunch of people that litterally didn't buy the ship, wich right from the start cripple it sell stats.
i don't deny the desire of people in this game to have a more tactical or agressive galaxy, thus explaining the good sell of the galaxy x, but i am also convinced that if the galaxy retrofit was suited with better stats from the start, it would have largely been able to compete with the number of sell of the galaxy x.
I imagine this is probaly the same reason why the Defiant Class and Constitution Class ships havent been made proper to what is portrayed on the shows. People would buy those three ships and then never buy any other ship again, well except for those STF and PvP Guys.
i am a pvp guy... well at least i use to be before delta rising:rolleyes:.
and bielieve it or not but i when i got my hands on how the game work and stop experimenting, i only fly the galaxy x.
and i mean, really!, just that ship!
Hell why not just let us put the Galaxy skin on either the X or the Guardian.
However to help keep some money in Cryptics pocket, whichever one they did, you have to own both ships in order to unlock the Galaxy skin to use on X or Guardian.
TBH i'll admit if i could take the extra parts off the X and make her look like a normal Galaxy or use the Galaxy skin on the Guardian, other than a Akira and Nebula i'd probably have the majority of my Fed toons in the Galaxy and try to make it work with whatever career that toon may be. I can't mothball the Nebula or Akira as both are ships of beauty
I imagine this is probaly the same reason why the Defiant Class and Constitution Class ships havent been made proper to what is portrayed on the shows. People would buy those three ships and then never buy any other ship again, well except for those STF and PvP Guys.
say what? especially in the early game, the defiant was the ONLY ship cryptic actually got exactly right, being exclusively tactical heavy. and thanks to it, the galaxy and intrepid had to endure it's station setup model, even though such a heavily 1 sided setup was the polar opposite for accurate on ether ship. there's several factors that we can blame for the galaxy R being so terrible, but the defiant's setup starting a trend is at least in the top 3.
sorry to interupt but in the last priority podcast gecko mentioned that the most succesfull ( in term of sell ) ship is the galaxy x.
and i am sure that the galaxy retrofit is not far behind so that really show that many people would paid for a tier 6 version of them.the potential is here.
gecko was speaking about the sell of the command ship, they are the most succesfull sell of ship that the game ever have in that short time.
the galaxy x sell more but only because it was here for about almost 5 years now.
but imagine for a moment that those ships ( galaxy ) were OP like the scimitar, they would have litteraly obliterated the scoreboard!
I would agree with the others that part of the Galaxy-X's success is things like the referral reward and level cap reward.
That said, I did buy one. I loved it ever since I first saw her decloak in All Good Things, and my first alt was always going to be flying one as a matter of RP. For a tier 6 version I would certainly buy one again. Especially if they finally can get her Phaser Lance and shuttlebay control on the damn center line of the ship. And the warp trail from the midships nacelle.All are off center.
I think the Command ships sold well partially off of the looks and the customization (except those Klingon ships). I've seen a LOT of people flying them though, so the idea of them flying off the shelves matches up with what I'm seeing flying around.
Legitimately if the Scimitar in game is to be taken as the exact Scimitar displayed in Nemesis, then the Galaxy-X as portrayed in All Good Things should be in the same weight and hitting class.
it must have been a long trip back to space dock after the genesis planet was created, if you look at the damage in star trek 3, the ship is twice as banged up as it was since the last hit it took from the reliant.
I have heard of that book, with the Enterprise being attacked by Klingons.
must be why they are so confused, how can we be unhappy? the ship made us the most money! doesn't that mean everyone's happy and there's nothing to complain about?
proud non supporter of the galaxy X here, one of the few ships i haven't bought.
thats kinda gross though, the command ships being such a success. you cant even use any command skills till you grind out 10 levels on the damn specialization. literally how can people keep buying ships, with the way the game is now
I think you underestimate how willing to grind some people are. Giving us the Kobali Command Engineer also probably helped a lot as well.
But yeah I can see why they could draw confusion that people aren't happy with the best seller. It seems to be a Cena situation.
And yes the Defiant is brilliantly canon. I can only imagine better now that people can upgrade quad cannons to MK XIV EPIC. Though I saw someone asking for dual quantum torpedo launchers. There's also a feeling that many devs are DS9 fans and thus give preferential treatment to the Defiant, but the fact is, she's pretty much as she appeared in the show. Tough and Dangerous
the galaxy x didn't sold well just because its stats were better than the galaxy retrofit, but because it was a galaxy first, and a more efficient one, second.
the regent got better stats than the assault cruiser, but this was not sufficient to make it a top seller ship, in fact, from gecko own word, this ship was a disapointement in term of sell.
I think I can pinpoint the issue with the Regent as an owner and proud Sovereign fan.
The Regent while a beautiful ship in its own rights, it's relation to the chicken design not withstanding, wasn't precisely what Sovereign fans wanted.
The dev team treats the Sovereign as if they didn't see it in Nemesis. The Sovereign Class in game is the Insurrection version. We want the Nemesis beast that went toe to toe with the predator and lived to tell the tale. Nowadays for a Tier 5U cruiser, yeah the layout is fine. But the model...it doesn't have the perfect version smooth transition to the saucer, the extra torpedo launcher placements, the slightly raised nacelles, the little tweaks made in that movie.
Even worse than that, the parts of the Regent did NOT blend well with the other Assault cruiser models at all. I run an assault cruiser with the Noble saucer, pylons, and nacelles with the Sovereign Stardrive and a Noble neck...I would prefer a Nemesis Sovereign neck because it's smooth.
But if you look at the mountain of options the Command Ships give and their sales, you can see that the customization is important in ship sales outside of the specifics. There's no need to allow kitbashing on an Excelsior for instance.
and better stats, well yes, but you better have to said it quick.
indeed this ship ( galaxy x ) didn't have hangar back in the day, neither the separation console, it didn't have 4 tact console, not even 3... but 2. it didn't have 4 weapons slot in the back... but 3. the phaser lance use to have a 3 min cooldown instead of the nowaday 2min and the base firepower was cut by half.
there is also an other explanation concerning the "least" number of sell of the galaxy retrofit compared to the x during these product lifetime.
the galaxy retrofit, as well as the defiant and intrepid was given for free when the season 2 ancient enemy was launched as a reward for reaching the new level cap of vice admiral 51 ( yes not 50).
so there a bunch of people that litterally didn't buy the ship, wich right from the start cripple it sell stats.
i don't deny the desire of people in this game to have a more tactical or agressive galaxy, thus explaining the good sell of the galaxy x, but i am also convinced that if the galaxy retrofit was suited with better stats from the start, it would have largely been able to compete with the number of sell of the galaxy x.
You're probably right.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
the galaxy x didn't sold well just because its stats were better than the galaxy retrofit, but because it was a galaxy first, and a more efficient one, second.
the regent got better stats than the assault cruiser, but this was not sufficient to make it a top seller ship, in fact, from gecko own word, this ship was a disapointement in term of sell.
(...)
That doesn't really make much sense, does it? I mean you can put the Sovereign skin on the Regent, it isn't even is named "regent" but "assault cruiser refit". And as far as I know the FACR is still one of the "best" out there.
EDIT: I'm sorry, I misunderstood. I somehow thought you meant it didn't sell better than the original assault cruiser but that's a free ship anyway. Just ignore what I said, I completely botched that XD
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Despite the Sovereign being a nice looking ship and she def shares some lines with the Excelsior. look at them together port/starboard. The Sovereign doesn't hold the same affection for a lot of TNG fans as it was a movie ship, it was a tool in the movies, whereas the Galaxy in the T.V was part of the cast.
The Sovereign in this game is one of the top cruisers and fun to use, she's everything the Galaxy is not. She can tank, can maneuver pretty well, play support or just wade in and blow **** up with little effort. Only thing she lacks as a Regent/Fleet Regent is science abilities as all she has the lt uni.
The Galaxy on the other hand can tank, can support, but without serious console, traits, boffs and major investment as a DPS ship or simply to make her maneuverable requires more work than any other Fed cruiser in game to achieve.
To use a Galaxy compared to other Fed cruisers is like driving Manual stick compared to a Automatic. Going from a Galaxy to another Fed cruiser is a smooth easy transition, going the other way is like jumping out a luxury car into a old banger where the gears stick, the engine skips and no power steering.
Despite the Sovereign being a nice looking ship and she def shares some lines with the Excelsior. look at them together port/starboard. The Sovereign doesn't hold the same affection for a lot of TNG fans as it was a movie ship, it was a tool in the movies, whereas the Galaxy in the T.V was part of the cast.
I think I hold such great affection for the Sovereign because the Star Trek the movie sketch book that covered Generations and First Contact was one of the first Star Trek books that I ever got (and lost....I'm not crying!). But I got to see the inner workings of how they crafted her so I hold her in high regard. That said I feel that the Enterprise-E was as much a member of the cast as the Enterprise no bloody A, B, C, or D Retrofit was for the TOS movies.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
Despite the Sovereign being a nice looking ship and she def shares some lines with the Excelsior. look at them together port/starboard. The Sovereign doesn't hold the same affection for a lot of TNG fans as it was a movie ship, it was a tool in the movies, whereas the Galaxy in the T.V was part of the cast.
The Sovereign in this game is one of the top cruisers and fun to use, she's everything the Galaxy is not. She can tank, can maneuver pretty well, play support or just wade in and blow **** up with little effort. Only thing she lacks as a Regent/Fleet Regent is science abilities as all she has the lt uni.
The Galaxy on the other hand can tank, can support, but without serious console, traits, boffs and major investment as a DPS ship or simply to make her maneuverable requires more work than any other Fed cruiser in game to achieve.
To use a Galaxy compared to other Fed cruisers is like driving Manual stick compared to a Automatic. Going from a Galaxy to another Fed cruiser is a smooth easy transition, going the other way is like jumping out a luxury car into a old banger where the gears stick, the engine skips and no power steering.
That's part of the challenge I enjoy: taking that crappy setup the Galaxy has and making it relevant. Also, DPS aside, I don't think it's as difficult as you make it seem.
"After a time, you may find that having is not so pleasing a thing after all as wanting. It is not logical, but it is often true. Except for a T5 Connie. That would be f*%#ing awesome." - Mr. Spock
To use a Galaxy compared to other Fed cruisers is like driving Manual stick compared to a Automatic. Going from a Galaxy to another Fed cruiser is a smooth easy transition, going the other way is like jumping out a luxury car into a old banger where the gears stick, the engine skips and no power steering.
you sorta got that analogy backwards. the galaxy is the automatic, all you can do is steer it and its uninspired to operate. its just about anything else thats more like a manual, you wield a scalpel, your tool is very responsive, you're in total control and every action can have profound effect.
That's part of the challenge I enjoy: taking that crappy setup the Galaxy has and making it relevant. Also, DPS aside, I don't think it's as difficult as you make it seem.
thats all any of us have ever been able to do with it, try to make it good enough despite itself. but then i'd jump into my constellation and i can do the same thing only considerably better. not great, but actually in the realm of good enough. from there i jump in the excelsior and it only gets better. then my avenger and it pretty much can't get better then that. until DR happened.
That's part of the challenge I enjoy: taking that crappy setup the Galaxy has and making it relevant. Also, DPS aside, I don't think it's as difficult as you make it seem.
Besides, there's nothing wrong with a manual gear box :P
That said I feel that the Enterprise-E was as much a member of the cast as the Enterprise no bloody A, B, C, or D Retrofit was for the TOS movies.
The loss of the original NCC-1701 in Search for Spock was a major moment and I couldn't believe it when I saw it. The look on the crews' faces as the Enterprise's hulk was burning on decent through the atmosphere; Poor Scotty's look as HIS Enterprise was now gone.
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Tomalak would of been a great finally antagonist to end the D with sense picard and tomalak have been going at it sense season one
the iconions are like the final boss of the galaxy, the yamato got one of their viruses that DID literally prevent the 100 fail safes in place from preventing core failure from working, its totally believable that the iconions could make a virus do that much damage. the same thing happened to the D, but for basically no reason at all, thats the difference.
and i don't know how i forgot the EPS conduits, of course all the plasma and reaction chambers are also in magnetic fields. still, they cant have been so easy to fail with out a physical breach in the core or conduits themselves, damage to the nacelle can not cause this, there would be thousands of places to close the valve on EPS conduits, even backup force fields could be placed inside of them is those fail. and there would be a 3rd method as well, triple redundancy is on literally everything is how starfleet engineers things. unfortunately, its pretty hard to write around that, so they just don't, mechanical catastrophe is good for ratings.
Yeah, but it was much more believable. The Enterprise was still getting put back together from a battle to the death with Reliant, during which the Enterprise got sucker-punched in the first round. Then, you've automated the ship so 5 people can run the whole thing from the bridge. Ordinarily, the Enterprise could stomp a BoP. One hit caused a lot of damage and without a full crew to repair that, Kirk was low on options. Blowing up the Enterprise to prevent its capture by the Klingons while simultaneously taking out most of Kruge's crew was win-win in a lousy situation.
The D getting taken out by a BoP that it should have stomped, shields or no shields, was a joke.
Actually I don't think that the Trilithium warhead would've done massive damage.
It's not a Death Star destroying a planet with brute force. A Trilithium Torpedo basically halts the normal nuclear reactions in a star causing a core collapse. Allowing gravity to win...and then the star goes boom. However that wouldn't do anything to a starship's shields. I have no problem with the cleavage sisters or the crash landing...I'm actually quite fond of B'Etor. :cool: Damn...I never thought of that before. That's really good. That's perfect.
Also the hijacking of LaForge's VISOR is absolutely consistent with previous Romulan tactics and scientific capability. And it's concretely known that they were already aware of LaForge's tactical weakness.
The question then becomes, how do they get the win? This might take a minute, though it would certainly carry the Galaxy class' reputation to the next level if they pull a Keogh and just fire a way and hull tank the TRIBBLE out of a D'deridex and win the fight straight up only for everything to collapse at the end from the extreme damage. Agreed.
Well on that we can agree, that's why I say complete design flaw and will agree to bad writing. I'd have a six layer failsafe system myself.
I've always thought it was a G move.
Kirk was out of moves so he lured his opponents in to point blank range and burned his own house down around them. Though we know he was strictly winging it after he got down to the planet. But he definitely played on Kruge's ego... that said Kruge was still one of the most boss Klingons ever seen. Though he disobeyed Kahless' statement that only a fool fights in a burning house.
Yep. But as said, the Enterprise never "healed" from the fight with the Reliant...and Khan wore the Enterprise's backside OUT.
There's also irony. In the encounter with Khan, Kirk lost before he began because he wouldn't raise the shields. Now, a few weeks later he lost again, because he couldn't raise the shields, directly as a consequence of the fact that he wouldn't raise the shields back then. His beloved ship...too bad there wasn't a Weyoun available to remark on him being fond of that ship.
The moral of this story of course is always listen to Saavik.
also i would really like to read the first draft of generations. it really feels like the klingons where thrown in last minute just so they could use star trek 6 footage. as thinking over ti the main plot works better and makes more sense with a D'D and romulans
even though in one rewrite of the script it was suppose to be a Vor'Cha
I know what you are saying and where you are coming from but it still felt fairly empty of a death of THE Enterprise ( back then, there was only one).
That was sort of my first thought too, though they'd also have an advantage after realising that the Romulans had accessed LaForge's visor, the crew then devise a plan to use that same link to gain some kind of advantage themselves over the warbird.
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
Yeah, the M5 would've blown the Bird of Prey out of the stars before she decloaked.
Agreed. Admiral Morrow made it seem like there was no hope for the Enterprise.
Well the earlier drafts would've shown the Romulans Attacking Armagosa, but Jeri Taylor nixed that idea for something more charming, I can only assume Data's emotion chip woes or perhaps Worf's promotion ceremony.
You might be interested to know that another thing that got cut was the Duras sisters surviving the destruction of their Bird and fighting the Enterprise crew in the jungles of Veridian III.
As usual this can be blamed at least in part on the studio....
With the start of preproduction, Berman battled the studio over budget figures, the film cut in cost to an estimated US$35 million. [2] Hopes for location shooting in Hawaii and Idaho were dropped in favor of more local shoots in Hollywood, Marina del Rey, Pasadena, Lone Pine, and the Valley of Fire State Park near Las Vegas, Nevada. By 16 March 1994, Moore and Braga's script reflected budget and cast changes.
I thought the same, the only issue is them actually figuring it out since that didn't factor into the defeat of the Duras sisters. Though I suppose it's fair leap since the Romulans had done it before. Just investigating in the heat of battle. That said, it's a very Star Trek solution to use the VISOR against them and it's certainly something I'd go with.
I'd have LaForge look at their weapon frequencies so that they would adjust their shields to something that would block them, but have the reading falsified so it would instead allow the Enterprise to fire through their shields.
and i am sure that the galaxy retrofit is not far behind so that really show that many people would paid for a tier 6 version of them.the potential is here.
gecko was speaking about the sell of the command ship, they are the most succesfull sell of ship that the game ever have in that short time.
the galaxy x sell more but only because it was here for about almost 5 years now.
but imagine for a moment that those ships ( galaxy ) were OP like the scimitar, they would have litteraly obliterated the scoreboard!
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
it must have been a long trip back to space dock after the genesis planet was created, if you look at the damage in star trek 3, the ship is twice as banged up as it was since the last hit it took from the reliant.
must be why they are so confused, how can we be unhappy? the ship made us the most money! doesn't that mean everyone's happy and there's nothing to complain about?
proud non supporter of the galaxy X here, one of the few ships i haven't bought.
thats kinda gross though, the command ships being such a success. you cant even use any command skills till you grind out 10 levels on the damn specialization. literally how can people keep buying ships, with the way the game is now
no your missing my key point. the enterprise filming model has more then twice the damage on it in ST3 then it did at the end of ST2. implying it got in an even bigger battle off camera on the way back to earth?
I doubt the Enterprise got into another battle, the extra damage between Khan and Spock could quite simply have been for dramtic value as the heroes return to Spacedock and the reception party waiting for them gets to see the deep scars left from the Khan fight in visual form. We got to see the emotional effect it had on the crew at the end of Khan.
Galaxy X sold well because its stats were better then the Galaxy R. I find it hard to believe the Galaxy X is more popular then the Galaxy R because there are a bunch of forums asking for a better Galaxy R and nothing about the Galaxy X. I personally don't like the galaxy x its an ugly ship compare to orginal Galaxy.
Also, I have a strong suspicion that the Galaxy R is purposely left in a sorry state by the powers that be because if they made it a really good ship, a majority of people would be flying around in the "Enterprize-D" and Picarding well into the night. Where would that leave ship/lockbox key sales?
I know, she's not everyone's cup 'o Earl Grey, but I suspect that a majority of players either went from TOS into TNG, or started with TNG as their first Star Trek. Either way, TNG is the sweet spot.
out of universe is they got rid of the damaged model and had to re-damage it and pretty much forgot exactly where the damage was placed
I imagine this is probaly the same reason why the Defiant Class and Constitution Class ships havent been made proper to what is portrayed on the shows. People would buy those three ships and then never buy any other ship again, well except for those STF and PvP Guys.
the galaxy x didn't sold well just because its stats were better than the galaxy retrofit, but because it was a galaxy first, and a more efficient one, second.
the regent got better stats than the assault cruiser, but this was not sufficient to make it a top seller ship, in fact, from gecko own word, this ship was a disapointement in term of sell.
and better stats, well yes, but you better have to said it quick.
indeed this ship ( galaxy x ) didn't have hangar back in the day, neither the separation console, it didn't have 4 tact console, not even 3... but 2. it didn't have 4 weapons slot in the back... but 3. the phaser lance use to have a 3 min cooldown instead of the nowaday 2min and the base firepower was cut by half.
there is also an other explanation concerning the "least" number of sell of the galaxy retrofit compared to the x during these product lifetime.
the galaxy retrofit, as well as the defiant and intrepid was given for free when the season 2 ancient enemy was launched as a reward for reaching the new level cap of vice admiral 51 ( yes not 50).
so there a bunch of people that litterally didn't buy the ship, wich right from the start cripple it sell stats.
i don't deny the desire of people in this game to have a more tactical or agressive galaxy, thus explaining the good sell of the galaxy x, but i am also convinced that if the galaxy retrofit was suited with better stats from the start, it would have largely been able to compete with the number of sell of the galaxy x.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
i am a pvp guy... well at least i use to be before delta rising:rolleyes:.
and bielieve it or not but i when i got my hands on how the game work and stop experimenting, i only fly the galaxy x.
and i mean, really!, just that ship!
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
However to help keep some money in Cryptics pocket, whichever one they did, you have to own both ships in order to unlock the Galaxy skin to use on X or Guardian.
TBH i'll admit if i could take the extra parts off the X and make her look like a normal Galaxy or use the Galaxy skin on the Guardian, other than a Akira and Nebula i'd probably have the majority of my Fed toons in the Galaxy and try to make it work with whatever career that toon may be. I can't mothball the Nebula or Akira as both are ships of beauty
say what? especially in the early game, the defiant was the ONLY ship cryptic actually got exactly right, being exclusively tactical heavy. and thanks to it, the galaxy and intrepid had to endure it's station setup model, even though such a heavily 1 sided setup was the polar opposite for accurate on ether ship. there's several factors that we can blame for the galaxy R being so terrible, but the defiant's setup starting a trend is at least in the top 3.
I would agree with the others that part of the Galaxy-X's success is things like the referral reward and level cap reward.
That said, I did buy one. I loved it ever since I first saw her decloak in All Good Things, and my first alt was always going to be flying one as a matter of RP. For a tier 6 version I would certainly buy one again. Especially if they finally can get her Phaser Lance and shuttlebay control on the damn center line of the ship. And the warp trail from the midships nacelle.All are off center.
I think the Command ships sold well partially off of the looks and the customization (except those Klingon ships). I've seen a LOT of people flying them though, so the idea of them flying off the shelves matches up with what I'm seeing flying around.
Legitimately if the Scimitar in game is to be taken as the exact Scimitar displayed in Nemesis, then the Galaxy-X as portrayed in All Good Things should be in the same weight and hitting class.
I have heard of that book, with the Enterprise being attacked by Klingons.
I think you underestimate how willing to grind some people are. Giving us the Kobali Command Engineer also probably helped a lot as well.
But yeah I can see why they could draw confusion that people aren't happy with the best seller. It seems to be a Cena situation.
And yes the Defiant is brilliantly canon. I can only imagine better now that people can upgrade quad cannons to MK XIV EPIC. Though I saw someone asking for dual quantum torpedo launchers. There's also a feeling that many devs are DS9 fans and thus give preferential treatment to the Defiant, but the fact is, she's pretty much as she appeared in the show. Tough and Dangerous
I think I can pinpoint the issue with the Regent as an owner and proud Sovereign fan.
The Regent while a beautiful ship in its own rights, it's relation to the chicken design not withstanding, wasn't precisely what Sovereign fans wanted.
The dev team treats the Sovereign as if they didn't see it in Nemesis. The Sovereign Class in game is the Insurrection version. We want the Nemesis beast that went toe to toe with the predator and lived to tell the tale. Nowadays for a Tier 5U cruiser, yeah the layout is fine. But the model...it doesn't have the perfect version smooth transition to the saucer, the extra torpedo launcher placements, the slightly raised nacelles, the little tweaks made in that movie.
Even worse than that, the parts of the Regent did NOT blend well with the other Assault cruiser models at all. I run an assault cruiser with the Noble saucer, pylons, and nacelles with the Sovereign Stardrive and a Noble neck...I would prefer a Nemesis Sovereign neck because it's smooth.
But if you look at the mountain of options the Command Ships give and their sales, you can see that the customization is important in ship sales outside of the specifics. There's no need to allow kitbashing on an Excelsior for instance.
You're probably right.
That doesn't really make much sense, does it? I mean you can put the Sovereign skin on the Regent, it isn't even is named "regent" but "assault cruiser refit". And as far as I know the FACR is still one of the "best" out there.
EDIT: I'm sorry, I misunderstood. I somehow thought you meant it didn't sell better than the original assault cruiser but that's a free ship anyway. Just ignore what I said, I completely botched that XD
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The Sovereign in this game is one of the top cruisers and fun to use, she's everything the Galaxy is not. She can tank, can maneuver pretty well, play support or just wade in and blow **** up with little effort. Only thing she lacks as a Regent/Fleet Regent is science abilities as all she has the lt uni.
The Galaxy on the other hand can tank, can support, but without serious console, traits, boffs and major investment as a DPS ship or simply to make her maneuverable requires more work than any other Fed cruiser in game to achieve.
To use a Galaxy compared to other Fed cruisers is like driving Manual stick compared to a Automatic. Going from a Galaxy to another Fed cruiser is a smooth easy transition, going the other way is like jumping out a luxury car into a old banger where the gears stick, the engine skips and no power steering.
That's part of the challenge I enjoy: taking that crappy setup the Galaxy has and making it relevant. Also, DPS aside, I don't think it's as difficult as you make it seem.
you sorta got that analogy backwards. the galaxy is the automatic, all you can do is steer it and its uninspired to operate. its just about anything else thats more like a manual, you wield a scalpel, your tool is very responsive, you're in total control and every action can have profound effect.
thats all any of us have ever been able to do with it, try to make it good enough despite itself. but then i'd jump into my constellation and i can do the same thing only considerably better. not great, but actually in the realm of good enough. from there i jump in the excelsior and it only gets better. then my avenger and it pretty much can't get better then that. until DR happened.
Besides, there's nothing wrong with a manual gear box :P
The loss of the original NCC-1701 in Search for Spock was a major moment and I couldn't believe it when I saw it. The look on the crews' faces as the Enterprise's hulk was burning on decent through the atmosphere; Poor Scotty's look as HIS Enterprise was now gone.