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Forums > Home› Star Trek Online General Discussion

Fix Damn Queued Missions

macroniusmacronius Member Posts: 2,526
edited November 2014 in Star Trek Online General Discussion
Simple enough request. There is no point in having hard mode queued missions that fail 99% of the time because an optional is missed.

If you do nothing else then do this. Otherwise, there is 0 end game for the vast majority of players. No progression ... no point.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

- Judge Aaron Satie
Post edited by macronius on
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Comments

  • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,556 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    The Advanced Queues should have all optionals be optional. Elite Queues should have all optionals be mandatory.
  • peter1z9peter1z9 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    An unintended effect of mandatory "optionals" is that it is now far easier for beginners/trolls to accidentally/force fail an entire STF. Last night in an ISA, we were attacking the right transformer when someone put a grav well on it. In the past that would have just wrecked the bonus. Now that fails the entire STF. :mad:
    "Our Bugs are working as intended" - Cryptic
  • ussdelphin2ussdelphin2 Member Posts: 525 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Why are they still called optionalif they are not optional?
    How I picture a lot of the forumites :P
  • lilithene666lilithene666 Member Posts: 49 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    peter1z9 wrote: »
    An unintended effect of mandatory "optionals" is that it is now far easier for beginners/trolls to accidentally/force fail an entire STF. Last night in an ISA, we were attacking the right transformer when someone put a grav well on it. In the past that would have just wrecked the bonus. Now that fails the entire STF. :mad:

    I run into people who make the stfs fail on purpose all the time now, to the point where I hardly do stfs anymore. I have no interest in playing for a half hour to an hour only to have someone make it fail at the last few minutes on purpose. :(
    31zGn5b.jpg
  • peterconnorfirstpeterconnorfirst Member Posts: 6,225 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    No matter if normal, advanced, elite or nightmare many of the fail criteria are plain and simple annoying and not challenging.

    - Background mission timer lead to strict DPS pre-requirements. I don’t feel challenged when others don’t have that in my team.
    - Any form of 1 time mistake instant fails by a team member are not challenging either because I can’t correct them.

    I hardly see any challenge in most of them as in coordinated team work. Cryptic should abandon a lot of them swiftly because the way they are designed the only challenge they provide is the decision to queue up or better not to.
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    felisean wrote: »
    teamwork to reach a goal is awesome and highly appreciated
  • autumnturningautumnturning Member Posts: 743 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    peterconnorfirst wrote: »
    Cryptic should abandon a lot of them swiftly because the way they are designed the only challenge they provide is the decision to queue up or better not to.

    GREETINGS PROFESSOR FALKEN.

    STRANGE GAME. THE WINNING MOVE IS NOT TO PLAY...

    { lights switch on }
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    Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
    Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground
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  • vsilverwings1vsilverwings1 Member Posts: 572 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Cryptic were told we want a challenge and they gave us a new Elite. Okay they didn't implement the kind of challenge we wanted but they did it. Having done a chunk of the Elites I can say some are easither than others but with a good team that knows what it's doing they can be done. This is more or less what Cryptic said though I've not played every elite and so some may just not be possible.

    Way back when they announced this I knew where we were heading. Players who want the best rewards but don't care how %^&%^ they are. Players who enter Nukara without an EV suit or don't know how to equip and turn one on. Is this Cryptic's fault? Not directly. Forcing us to grind yes but there is normal and advanced and yet players rush past these to play elite. It doesn't matter if they don't know what to do the team will carry them.

    Injuries system...I really wonder what's the point of it? The really good players barely die and if they do they heal up immediately or after the mission. Bad players either don't or can't be bothered and so drag the team down with them.

    I hear the usual stories of players not even knowing how to do CGA or remodulating their weapons?!!? Amazinly players saying it's their first time in KGA. Why didn't you do normal? Every answer I get is either nothing or can't be bothered. This is not Cryptic's fault as shocking as it may sound and I'm not a fan of Cryptic at this time.

    We're heading towards the topic of evaulation i.e IQ tests (which wouldn't be a bad idea though that's not fair for some) and could only really test - do you have an ev suit? Even then you could turn up on advance and not done the mission before. You actually get to a point you can only do normal I think but obviously players powerlevel past it to do advanced rather than try normal.

    How about doing normal X times? Seems players don't like this either and I'm on the fence since it means alts get a raw deal. Maybe they could do a sponsorship thing whereby do normal X times and it allows alt tokens. If it helps improve advanced and elite I'd be willing to do normal to show I've got some knowledge of the mission.

    Either way Cryptic cannot stop the bad kind of pug getting in to Elite and people are resistant to putting up barriers.
  • woodwhitywoodwhity Member Posts: 2,636 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Advanced doesnt fail when advanced optionals are missed. It only fails if a integral part of the difficulty is missed. Get that in your head.
  • sheldonlcoopersheldonlcooper Member Posts: 4,042 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    woodwhity wrote: »
    Advanced doesnt fail when advanced optionals are missed. It only fails if a integral part of the difficulty is missed. Get that in your head.

    If they put in elite versions of the borg missions and crystalline will you shut up about advanced or keep demanding that 90% of the playerbase gets locked out of pugging until the game closes and you're left in the dark basement alone?
    Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."

    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
  • fudgemonkfudgemonk Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    As a new player seeing these que's so deserted felt like a slap in my face, everything is fancy till u hit 60 finish the story and are left wondering what now. Wel, I need these modules or whatever to be able to buy some sets so let's start practicing these stf's.... Only to find them all dead for a few that are easy and no way to practice them since the normal que's are more dead then the advanced ones already are.

    So, as a noob, this leaves me a few options;

    1. Be a noob and makes everyone's life in advanced a hell for not knowing what to do.
    2. Stay in a que for two hours and then just give up

    OR

    3. Quit the game because it looks like no one is playing this game if I judge it by the que's.

    Luckily for cryptic I can see thru this and find other ways of entertainment in this game, also my fleet is full of cool people so that makes it all easier as well. Now if I was a new player who never played an mmo before I would have given up on this game.
  • bareelbareel Member Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Pre DR I would run:

    Infected Space Elite
    Crystalline Catastrophe Elite
    Defend Rhilho Station Elite
    Storm the Spire Elite
    The Cure Space Elite
    Undine Infiltration Elite
    Vicious Cycle Elite

    Post DR I now run:
    Bug Hunt Elite
    Crystalline Catastrophe Advanced
    Infected Space Elite


    Seeing a problem here.
    http://www.helpscout.net/75-customer-service-facts-quotes-statistics/
  • macroniusmacronius Member Posts: 2,526
    edited November 2014
    I really can't understand how making it hard to pug these missions makes any sense. This doesn't slow down progression. It kills it. I have borg sets on all my ships but was looking to get some Delta sets for ground for fun.

    Guess that ain't happening. Progression to 60 is even slower and I stopped doing the missions and patrols. Poor XP and rewards. There is 0 reason to play.

    I am glad my fellow captains are taking Cryptic to tasks for this disastrous expansion.
    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

    - Judge Aaron Satie
  • bobtheskull99bobtheskull99 Member Posts: 706 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    fudgemonk wrote: »
    As a new player seeing these que's so deserted felt like a slap in my face, everything is fancy till u hit 60 finish the story and are left wondering what now. Wel, I need these modules or whatever to be able to buy some sets so let's start practicing these stf's.... Only to find them all dead for a few that are easy and no way to practice them since the normal que's are more dead then the advanced ones already are.

    So, as a noob, this leaves me a few options;

    1. Be a noob and makes everyone's life in advanced a hell for not knowing what to do.
    2. Stay in a que for two hours and then just give up

    OR

    3. Quit the game because it looks like no one is playing this game if I judge it by the que's.

    Luckily for cryptic I can see thru this and find other ways of entertainment in this game, also my fleet is full of cool people so that makes it all easier as well. Now if I was a new player who never played an mmo before I would have given up on this game.


    this unfortunately is one of the biggest sources of the problem, because everyone jumps to advanced it leaves the normal ques empty(with a few exeptions). So even if you are a new player and WANT to try an STF on normal first you can't PUG it because virtually no one else is. Sadly I found this was the case even pre-DR

    I think the suggestion of making players complete a normal version x number of times before unlocking the higher tiers of difficulty is a good one, it would force more players into the normal ques making pugging them quicker
  • woodwhitywoodwhity Member Posts: 2,636 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    sheldonlcooper wrote: »
    If they put in elite versions of the borg missions and crystalline will you shut up about advanced or keep demanding that 90% of the playerbase gets locked out of pugging until the game closes and you're left in the dark basement alone?

    I might, as its than not the top difficulty for it. On the other hand, the tears and rage of third rates like yourself is just too amusing to miss.
  • gwassalorgwassalor Member Posts: 164
    edited November 2014
    Let me put it like this: mandatory optional objective is oxymoron.
  • bobtheskull99bobtheskull99 Member Posts: 706 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    gwassalor wrote: »
    Let me put it like this: mandatory optional objective is oxymoron.

    because only a moron calls something that's mandatory "optional" and then complain afterward :cool:
  • shpoksshpoks Member Posts: 6,967 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    woodwhity wrote: »
    I might, as its than not the top difficulty for it. On the other hand, the tears and rage of third rates like yourself is just too amusing to miss.

    Do you really think that you and your 20-30 buds can keep the entire game afloat, oh mighty one? :rolleyes: I certainly hope you're rich, cause Cryptic is a hungry mouth to feed.
    HQroeLu.jpg
  • sheldonlcoopersheldonlcooper Member Posts: 4,042 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    woodwhity wrote: »
    I might, as its than not the top difficulty for it. On the other hand, the tears and rage of third rates like yourself is just too amusing to miss.

    Yeah, I speak to promote the health of the game - not for my personal benefit or point of view. It's a complex viewpoint. But enjoy stroking yourself alone in the dark.
    Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."

    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
  • woodwhitywoodwhity Member Posts: 2,636 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    shpoks wrote: »
    Do you really think that you and your 20-30 buds can keep the entire game afloat, oh mighty one? :rolleyes: I certainly hope you're rich, cause Cryptic is a hungry mouth to feed.

    Your (and that of your mindpartner fake-shelly) basic assumption about me is wrong. Ill leave the meaning of this for you to figure out, but its a very basic thing.

    skollulfr wrote: »
    100k dps scimitars would need to find new tactics fast if the borg where able to turn that fire power back on them in a way that wouldnt severly hit most of the playerbase.

    And we both know those capable of building 60k+ (lets take it easy ;) ) scimis will have already adapted after reading the patch notes while others will cry at least as loud as they do now. Adaptive shielding, FBP for everything bigger as a sphere, EPtS, TT, ET, Subnuk for Taccubes and above. Yeah, something like this would be elite. But something like this would hit the oh so casual playerbase even harder than a bit higher HP and some mostly easy new integral tasks.

    The problem is not the DPS-Players. The Problem is cryptic. And after cryptic its the playerbase unwilling to adapt to anything new.
  • lordsteve1lordsteve1 Member Posts: 3,492 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    It really is simple:

    Normal - essentially a training mode for STFs. Low HP bad guys and basic objectives to get people used to running in a team or to learn the basics of the mission.

    Advanced. - harder enemies (more HPs, more abilities), added optionals to allow players to improve by aiming for higher rewards. Timers on some aspects of the mission. You'd need to have a basic understanding of the mission and a basic willingness to work with others or at least pay attention to them.

    Elite - super-tough bad guys with massive HPs and tonnes of abilities and in bigger numbers. No optionals, everything mandatory. Any timers reduced. Players are expected to communicate and work as a team (in fact it's essential for victory) and not understanding the mission at hand will cause failure.

    This lets newbie players have a practice run and then improve for advanced to go earn some better rewards.
    Average players have some tougher end-game content with decent rewards and some challenge to it.

    The elitist E-peen club can go hide in their own dark corner and try to out-do each other in how god-like they think they are and leave the rest of use alone to enjoy the game.

    This is essentially what players were asking for pre-DR!!!!!!!!!
    SulMatuul.png
  • caylenrcaylenr Member Posts: 126 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    macronius wrote: »
    Simple enough request. There is no point in having hard mode queued missions that fail 99% of the time because an optional is missed.

    If you do nothing else then do this. Otherwise, there is 0 end game for the vast majority of players. No progression ... no point.

    Oh yeah, totally simple request. Reprogramming complicated multi-user interactive experiences is something any kid in a sandbox can accomplish with a plastic shovel and cat turds.

    These people...
  • woodwhitywoodwhity Member Posts: 2,636 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    sheldonlcooper wrote: »
    Yeah, I speak to promote the health of the game - not for my personal benefit or point of view. It's a complex viewpoint. But enjoy stroking yourself alone in the dark.

    Stroking? Pls, I just enforce my principles. Unlike a leech like you, I believe in hard work, gaining knowledge and thinking outside the box.

    I hope for you your nation does have a good social system.
  • sheldonlcoopersheldonlcooper Member Posts: 4,042 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    woodwhity wrote: »
    Stroking? Pls, I just enforce my principles. Unlike a leech like you, I believe in hard work, gaining knowledge and thinking outside the box.

    I hope for you your nation does have a good social system.

    Well, I guess I'll mention for the 10th time or so I have no problem completing any of the content. 100% success on any mission in a premade team. 100% success in ISA CCA pugs.

    That's not the point here. The point is that pugs will never communicate. Any mission that requires this with a timer = fail = more people quit. I would like to see the game survive for years. For that to happen people aside from annoying "elite gamers" have to play.

    I recently tracked some dps. Many advanced ISA teams had 3 people under 1500 each. About the same as one of my frigates. This is the reality. But keep on with your little leet circle pull until the server is shut down.
    Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."

    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
  • jellico1jellico1 Member Posts: 2,719
    edited November 2014
    caylenr wrote: »
    Oh yeah, totally simple request. Reprogramming complicated multi-user interactive experiences is something any kid in a sandbox can accomplish with a plastic shovel and cat turds.

    These people...

    They reprogramed it to TRIBBLE it up !!......yes it is a simple request....If you can TRIBBLE something up you can also fix it too

    Remove the garbage from advanced so it doesn't have a fail or a timer, replace the loot and rewards that were stolen from normal and advanced/Elite

    Add the Fails timers and whatever to Elite

    What they said they were going to do.......until they lied about it

    Or just accept the near empty Q's and cryptics utter failure with the new STFs
    Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
    Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
    Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng

    JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
  • woodwhitywoodwhity Member Posts: 2,636 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    sheldonlcooper wrote: »
    That's not the point here. The point is that pugs will never communicate.

    I recently tracked some dps. Many advanced ISA teams had 3 people under 1500 each. About the same as one of my frigates. This is the reality. But keep on with your little leet circle pull until the server is shut down.


    It works quite fine in other games. Some People need to fail before they learn. If they are unable or unwilling to learn, failure is deserved.
  • sheldonlcoopersheldonlcooper Member Posts: 4,042 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    woodwhity wrote: »
    It works quite fine in other games. Some People need to fail before they learn. If they are unable or unwilling to learn, failure is deserved.

    The problems is the shocking change from Star Trek casual game to a more hardcore gamer game.

    Add to this the fact that very few games have failqueues. Most allow many tries until you give up or succeed.

    I like the idea of the harder content. But it seems very clear that the vast majority hates it.

    Maybe they will move on and be replaced. If so, then fine. But I doubt they can be replaced. I will be here until the lights go off regardless.
    Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."

    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
  • talonxvtalonxv Member Posts: 4,257 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    autumnturning wrote: »
    greetings Professor Falken.

    Strange Game. The Winning Move Is Not To Play...

    { Lights Switch On }

    Priceless!
    afMSv4g.jpg
    Star Trek Battles member. Want to roll with a good group of people regardless of fleets and not have to worry about DPS while doing STFs? Come join the channel and join in the fun!

    http://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1145998/star-trek-battles-channel-got-canon/p1
  • macroniusmacronius Member Posts: 2,526
    edited November 2014
    caylenr wrote: »
    Oh yeah, totally simple request. Reprogramming complicated multi-user interactive experiences is something any kid in a sandbox can accomplish with a plastic shovel and cat turds.

    These people...

    Actually, it is quite easy ... speaking as software engineer. It is nothing but a bool (true / false) expression. Is this condition required to "pass" the mission? Yes or no. It is the ABC of programming. So your argument is totally bogus.

    Btw, that is exactly what they had prior to DR. Either you are trolling or just don't understand basic logic.
    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

    - Judge Aaron Satie
  • macroniusmacronius Member Posts: 2,526
    edited November 2014
    autumnturning wrote: »
    GREETINGS PROFESSOR FALKEN.

    STRANGE GAME. THE WINNING MOVE IS NOT TO PLAY...

    { lights switch on }

    +1 Internets. Love the quote.
    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

    - Judge Aaron Satie
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