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I hate how quiet our CM and Devs are.

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  • iconiansiconians Member Posts: 6,987 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Trekkies + MMO players = perfect storm of complaining
    nabreeki wrote: »
    This is really all that needs to be said.
    I logged on just to respond - that's the truest thing ever said on these forums.

    A cascade of THIS.
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  • kozar2kozar2 Member Posts: 602 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Want the game fixed (and it is terribly broken since 9.5 IMO as it was based on Doffing which isn't working for a large number of player)? Simple. Don't buy zen, don't trade dil for zen and don't spend zen. The truth is that as long as people do these 3 things there is little motivation for PW to prioritize fixing the game. If revenue streams don't change neither will most companies (of course in the long run that usually leads to financial ruin but that's a whole other discussion). If you are still enabling PW to make money through any of the above mentioned ways yet are here complaining about their product or service delivery then you deserve what you get.

    Now if you believe that everything is working as intended or are satisfied with the current state then spend away and enjoy.

    Each must make their own decision but not spending according to your opinion is counter productive no matter which way you view things.
  • berginsbergins Member Posts: 3,453 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    iconians wrote: »
    What, you mean being compared to serial killers, animals, and commie TRIBBLE wouldn't endear you to your customers?

    Being told that getting treated like dirt underneath someone's fingernails is part of your job would somehow make you more hesitant to communicate with people?

    It's almost as if the rhetoric and toxic vitriol around these parts urges devs to stay away and concentrate on their own work.

    And telling them that putting up with said rhetoric and toxic vitriol is part of their job is likewise counter-productive.
    A large part of the toxicity originates from the lack of communication. Granted, the Devs' jobs shouldn't be that communication. That is why they hired Community Managers. They need to be in here putting out the fires. If there are not enough of them to at least make it look like there is an effort, perhaps they need to hire more. Not sure who makes THAT call, but I bet it is a step or two over Trendy and Trev's immediate supervisor. Oh, speaking of that, just a reminder that that person would have been Brandon if he had stayed. Telling me that the person in line behind him is the one sitting on Trev and Trendy's hands and keeping them from doing their job? Hard for me to believe. I find it hard to believe that the management that recognized Bran's talents would fill the void with... the opposite. So, IF there is some evil PWE overlord keeping TnT from doing their jobs, it is coming from a bit higher up, or they need to reevaluate the Community Team.
    "Logic is a little tweeting bird chirping in a meadow. Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers which smell BAD." - Spock
  • snoggymack22snoggymack22 Member Posts: 7,084 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    So these other games/projects that the community managers are working on for PWE ... are they releasing a new expansion in the next couple of months?

    If not ... then I still have to raise the topic of criticism for the current marketing strategy of the expansion.

    The lack of hype, lack of information and general lack of push for something that should be the marketing peoples' jobs to be shouting about off of the proverbial rooftops, seems, I don't know ... ineffective at best.

    Near as I can tell, it was stated that within 3 weeks of Vegas there would be information about what was announced at Vegas.

    That's next week right?

    There were supposedly 40 dev blogs ready to go. There's been 3 posts, that masquerade as blogs but weren't listed as blogs and one was just a clarification of the previous one, and a new intelligence thingie that was posted but was only the beginning of an interface type thing to flesh out the species listed, so really lore centric, but still way not finished.

    That's it.

    The defense of this nadir of marketing collateral thus far has been:

    1- The Devs and CMs work hard so lay off (what I call the Leave Britney Alone Defense, which is always entertaining to read).
    2- The CMs are working on other projects. (Which is fine, but again, seems like a specious defense when right now is expansion time for this game, which normally would require extra focus and marketing push).
    3- There's some shadow middle manager choking the flow of information (which again seems very counter productive when we realize ... there's an expansion coming!)


    So I don't know, I think some of you need to try harder in your defense of this information vaccuum.

    It might have worked in February or whatever. But Post Vegas ... Post ANNOUNCING the new expansion, I need something stronger to justify the dearth of information about the fancy new expansion that the company actually wants to you know generate buzz about to attract new players and eventually customers of the bundles they plan to sell for this.

    Saying Smirk has to do tweets about other PWE projects falls short when we're this close to a new expansion being released.

    Come back with something stronger yo!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • snoggymack22snoggymack22 Member Posts: 7,084 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    nabreeki wrote: »
    I think one misconception here is that many of us want/ have to defend an information vacuum.

    But reading your previous posts, you are defending the information vacuum.
    I honestly don't care.

    If that were honestly the case, you wouldn't consistently reply in threads like this. Unless that's a hobby of yours.
    does not consume me to the point of anger everyday I fail to see adev blog.

    You seemed consumed enough in that one thread you yourself started awhile back.
    but I have enough money, hobbies, work, of a life to not waste my time getting worked up about it.

    I've never found the "I have a life" defense to really work when the context of the discussion is that we're both here, on this forum, having this discussion. If those of us who post about this don't have a life, and you're here in this thread posting about it ...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • snoggymack22snoggymack22 Member Posts: 7,084 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    nabreeki wrote: »
    I don't know what to tell you.

    You could go into more detail about how that's a productive use of your time when you just got done stating:

    "but I have enough money, hobbies, work, of a life to not waste my time getting worked up about it."

    I'm unclear on the difference.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • aelfwin1aelfwin1 Member Posts: 2,896 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    So I don't know, I think some of you need to try harder in your defense of this information vacuum.

    It might have worked in February or whatever. But Post Vegas ... Post ANNOUNCING the new expansion, I need something stronger to justify the dearth of information about the fancy new expansion that the company actually wants to you know generate buzz about to attract new players and eventually customers of the bundles they plan to sell for this.

    Yeah .
    Each day they move away from Vegas and stay silent & regurgitate info just makes the Vegas trip that more pointless as a PR move and makes it more like a paid vacation for staff and friends .

    They can still whip up a media frenzy (you know ... as much as excitement about Talaxians and Kazon will allow...) , but each passing day makes Vegas more obsolete , not only for the 'in crowd' (us) but for any potential new blood .
    The Devs and CMs work hard so lay off (what I call the Leave Britney Alone Defense, which is always entertaining to read).

    Heh . :)

    As for myself , I have "detox-ed" :
    Any curiosity about more info dissipated and I reverted back to apathy and zero expectation .
    I'm not alone in those feelings either .


    ... that's what happens when you don't feed me Seymour ...
  • vesterengvestereng Member Posts: 2,252 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Announcing t6 early only problem I have is people stop spending and I'd say that indicates someone didn't think it through.

    Fine with a picture or just a banner same as LoR but this time in announcing ships being obsolete the rules change completely.


    As for developers not posting a lot, I started playing the summer before s. 7.
    Liked it the way it was, not to say they shouldn't try to sell new content and items.

    I actually had nothing to complain about at the time.


    However, for me personally, from that time up until today, it has been a long row of unfortunate decisions - and extra unfortunate a lot of which involved destroying things that were working/people enjoyed.
  • starswordcstarswordc Member Posts: 10,963 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    vestereng wrote: »
    Announcing t6 early only problem I have is people stop spending and I'd say that indicates someone didn't think it through.

    Fine with a picture or just a banner same as LoR but this time in announcing ships being obsolete the rules change completely.

    Yeah, I had somebody on the Star Trek Battles channel ask if he should bother upgrading his gear to fleet yesterday. I told him flat out that I had planned to upgrade the Mk XI Plasma-Disruptor Hybrid guns on my KDF's Tor'Kaht, changing to Elite Fleet disruptors, but until I know more I'm holding onto my money.

    Too late for my Fed's fleet antipro and the Romplas on my Rom, though.
    "Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
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  • doubleohninedoubleohnine Member Posts: 818 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    I LOLd at the former employee jab about quality control and management constantly changing their minds.

    Ive always said Cryptic would run so much smoother if they did in game polling. One vote sheet per account, and you only get to vote if you've spent at least $100 during the lifetime of STO. I imagine much of the course changes are them coming up with asinine ideas, getting player feedback too late, seeing we HATE something, then having to spend additional dev time changing course. This voters club would get the Cryptic ideas first, and we vet which ones we'd like and are most likely to spend money on. If you are a total freeloader here, you dont get a say in the direction of the game. Ive always felt STO could be swimming in Uncle Scrooge money bins if theyd actually listen to REAL Trek fans playing this game. We've flooded them with thousands of good ideas to make money off us and they always go another direction out of left field. If DAngelo wants to keep his job and make his Ferengi masters happy, he'd REALLY tap into the community, instead of taking bad ideas from devs who arent that loyal to the Star Trek universe.
    STO: @AGNT009 Since Dec 2010
    Capt. Will Conquest of the U.S.S. Crusader
  • carlosbflycarlosbfly Member Posts: 682 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    vestereng wrote: »
    Announcing t6 early only problem I have is people stop spending and I'd say that indicates someone didn't think it through.

    Fine with a picture or just a banner same as LoR but this time in announcing ships being obsolete the rules change completely.


    I would absolutely have kept quiet on the T6 part.

    The rest of the Vegas announcement was fine and exciting but dropping the T6 bombshell and offering up nothing since was a big mistake. The shockwaves its created - distrust, anger, confusion, etc - have generated a very unpleasant atmosphere for the community ever since.

    I know the T6 info is of course coming at some point but announcing it with no vital details for the customers was not good planning. I'd rather have not known about it until they had all the most important information regarding it ready to educate me.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    carlosbfly wrote: »
    I would absolutely have kept quiet on the T6 part.

    The rest of the Vegas announcement was fine and exciting but dropping the T6 bombshell and offering up nothing since was a big mistake. The shockwaves its created - distrust, anger, confusion, etc - have generated a very unpleasant atmosphere for the community ever since.

    I know the T6 info is of course coming at some point but announcing it with no vital details for the customers was not good planning. I'd rather have not known about it until they had all the most important information regarding it ready to educate me.
    Truthfully... I see no reason to believe people would have acted differently if he hadn't mentioned T6. Instead people would find a different reason to act angry and confused. Perhaps they would rant about how Cryptic hadn't announced any gear upgrades?

    Honestly the "vital details" thing you mentioned... well, I can think of only one way to interpret that and it comes across as you wanting all the data and wanting it yesterday. they already made a blanket statement about how the current MK12 gear isn't going to be any worse than it is now. The only way they could add more detail is to give us the specs for stuff that won't be released for 2 months, and might get changed before then.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
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  • rinksterrinkster Member Posts: 3,549 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Truthfully... I see no reason to believe people would have acted differently if he hadn't mentioned T6. Instead people would find a different reason to act angry and confused. Perhaps they would rant about how Cryptic hadn't announced any gear upgrades?

    Well, if they'd announced just that we were going to the DQ, I don't see how that would instantly depress T5 ship sales.

    Announcing the existence of T6 ships and not giving any details about any upgrade process from T5 probably would though......
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    rinkster wrote: »
    Well, if they'd announced just that we were going to the DQ, I don't see how that would instantly depress T5 ship sales.

    Announcing the existence of T6 ships and not giving any details about any upgrade process from T5 probably would though......
    Instead they'd be clamoring to find out what new feature could possibly justify this being an expansion and not a season. :P

    Then, when they finally get surprised by the news that there's new T6 stuff, they'd rant about how they wish Cryptic had told them before they bought the Vesta set....
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    My character Tsin'xing
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  • iconiansiconians Member Posts: 6,987 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Instead they'd be clamoring to find out what new feature could possibly justify this being an expansion and not a season. :P

    Then, when they finally get surprised by the news that there's new T6 stuff, they'd rant about how they wish Cryptic had told them before they bought the Vesta set....

    While you may have a point, I'm willing to guess the probability of people not buying ships/equipment/whatever until more information regarding T6 ships is revealed is drastically going to outnumber the amount of buyer's remorse from people who just bought the Vesta 3-pack (or whatever).

    If their sales suffer, they really only have themselves and their publisher to blame.
    ExtxpTp.jpg
  • carlosbflycarlosbfly Member Posts: 682 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Truthfully... I see no reason to believe people would have acted differently if he hadn't mentioned T6. Instead people would find a different reason to act angry and confused. Perhaps they would rant about how Cryptic hadn't announced any gear upgrades?

    Honestly the "vital details" thing you mentioned... well, I can think of only one way to interpret that and it comes across as you wanting all the data and wanting it yesterday. they already made a blanket statement about how the current MK12 gear isn't going to be any worse than it is now. The only way they could add more detail is to give us the specs for stuff that won't be released for 2 months, and might get changed before then.

    You interpret wrong. I do not want all the info 'yesterday'.

    I totally accept there will be a planned deployment of content from the announcement until the launch. This is sound marketing and content strategy.

    The issue of T6 though is very, very sensitive for reasons discussed to death. Rather than brazenly say "T6 is coming!" and then not elaborate at all for over two weeks now is not sensitive in any way and fueling the fire they knew would erupt.

    If they are not prepared to give information on this subject yet, then rather than give us a slither of the controversial news, I'd have held back until I could drop it all and avoid any meltdowns. The lack of info is after all, what is causing the concerns and negative feelings. It would have been a great surprise in a few weeks to unleash a series of back to back blogs with T6 info, images, stats and how older ships can be upgraded. Maximum excitement and maximum disclosure all in one coordinated reveal with no need for speculation or concern. It is all revealed and addressed in a swift publicity move.

    Apart from the T6 ships, I can't see any reason anyone would be annoyed by the Delta Rising announcement. It was all very exciting and sounds great so I don't anyone think would find reason to complain. People are only complaining at the moment because they are concerned their investments into high end purchases are going to be invalidated. Otherwise, the fanbase seems thrilled for everything about DR and I think people will love it.
  • snoggymack22snoggymack22 Member Posts: 7,084 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    carlosbfly wrote: »
    I would absolutely have kept quiet on the T6 part.

    I wouldn't have. I'd have shouted about it while swinging from the proverbial rafters. It's supposed to be one of the key selling points of the expansion.

    Thing is I'd have had some more info ready to go. A blog. With details. Not all of it. But enough of it to get the discussion started.

    I'd have had maybe some graphics or a video with a tease of the stuff to show at Vegas. Something with some WOW (as in gasp/wow, that's cool, not the MMO acronym) factor. Something to get people talking and set some fire to the grass roots word of mouth marketing.

    I mean, apparently this has been in development for quite some time. Rivera's already danced around it multiple times (including a vague statement about how the expansion is going to cure power creep).

    So with all of this potential buzz and marketing juice available, I'd have tried to ... well ... market this product.

    Right now we're halfway through August and it really feels like they don't have enough information to release on some really key elements of their product.

    That's disappointing.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • carlosbflycarlosbfly Member Posts: 682 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Truthfully... I see no reason to believe people would have acted differently if he hadn't mentioned T6. Instead people would find a different reason to act angry and confused. Perhaps they would rant about how Cryptic hadn't announced any gear upgrades?


    Perhaps they would. Which is unfortunate. But I consider there are different levels are complaints. Validity, if you like. Anything around the issue of spending real world money and having your purchase downgraded/nerfed is absolutely the biggest concert or complaint you could have in a game like STO.

    That is something to be taken seriously and sensitively.

    Thus far, it had been handled with anything but.

    I still stand by what I and others have said. I think Cryptic should have kept quiet on the T6 ships until they had more concrete info so it can roll out very clearly and on a positive delivery. They have plenty more to feed us until then. DR is packed with new content.
  • carlosbflycarlosbfly Member Posts: 682 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    I wouldn't have. I'd have shouted about it while swinging from the proverbial rafters. It's supposed to be one of the key selling points of the expansion.

    Thing is I'd have had some more info ready to go. A blog. With details. Not all of it. But enough of it to get the discussion started.


    Fair point.
  • strorusstrorus Member Posts: 328 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    No Dev Blog today? :(
  • atomictikiatomictiki Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    strorus wrote: »
    No Dev Blog today? :(

    There's only 40 blog posts total. You want them to blow them all away at a rate of 1/week?? 1 every 2 weeks is good enough for you slags!
    Leave nerfing to the professionals.
  • rinksterrinkster Member Posts: 3,549 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    strorus wrote: »
    No Dev Blog today? :(

    They'll release them when they're good and ready.

    Which may not be on a schedule that i think wise, but it's pretty clear they will do things their way, regardless of feedback.
  • bluegeekbluegeek Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    I think the Delta Rising announcement was a timing thing.

    They aren't ready to talk details yet. Clearly. They're not planning to launch this until October-ish.

    But they can't show up at Star Trek Las Vegas and say nothing about the new expansion.

    So they spill it, with the minimum details necessary to hint at what the expansion will be. At that point, they're marketing to Star Trek fans who don't necessarily need to know what a T6 ship is.

    Maybe they would've rather waited to announce anything, but STLV forced their hand a bit. Rushing the expansion to coincide with STLV would have been worse.

    So, like I said. For the last few years, Cryptic routinely goes silent when a) they aren't allowed to talk about it and/or b) they're too busy trying to launch a major update. Dstahl loved to tease us (in a nice way) with small leaks of information but those days are pretty much over. I'm willing to believe the current EP lets marketing decide when the information gets released.
    My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here
    Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
  • snoggymack22snoggymack22 Member Posts: 7,084 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    bluegeek wrote: »
    I think the Delta Rising announcement was a timing thing.

    They aren't ready to talk details yet. Clearly. They're not planning to launch this until October-ish.

    But they can't show up at Star Trek Las Vegas and say nothing about the new expansion.

    So they spill it, with the minimum details necessary to hint at what the expansion will be. At that point, they're marketing to Star Trek fans who don't necessarily need to know what a T6 ship is.


    I could see that. But Rivera has said in a couple of different podcasts that this stuff has been in development for quite some time now. I'm guessing he's not misleading the podcast people there since he's also dropped other teases and hints about this stuff, like his comment about how the expansion will do away with power creep, or how there will be a metric ton of ships coming, stuff like that.

    I don't know. It just seems odd.

    I'm willing to believe the current EP lets marketing decide when the information gets released.

    Most of my criticism is for the marketing department. It begins with ... who are they? And where are they?

    ;)

    LOR seems to have had a much more defined marketing strategy.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • organicmanfredorganicmanfred Member Posts: 3,236 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    Ermahgerd!

    Sterl ner nerw Derv Blerg terder!
  • bluegeekbluegeek Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=18692121&postcount=7
    Hey everyone,

    We have a blog scheduled to go up soon that will explain much of what is coming in X2 regarding T6 ships and Mk XIV gear.

    We wish we could tell you everything now, but we have to wait just a little while longer. I know this is causing a lot of skeptical responses, and I am very sorry to leave you all hanging like this.

    All I can do is ask for your patience and your understanding as the team works to get the systems in place fully operational, with explanations to follow.

    Thanks again everyone!

    ~CaptainSmirk
    My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here
    Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
  • aloishammeraloishammer Member Posts: 3,294 Arc User
    edited August 2014
    bluegeek wrote: »

    Aaaand, more of the same. "No really, we've got some stuff. Trust us. We won't tell you anything about it, but seriously, trust us- have we ever let y'all down before?" :rolleyes:
This discussion has been closed.