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KDF Science Cruiser Build Help

gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
I think I may have found the closest KDF cruiser to the Science Odyssey. The Fleet Corsair Flight-Deck Cruiser Retrofit. I have made a build for it and wanted feedback on it. The goal is for it to be a sci support tank with moderate dps. more PvE geared than PvP. I only have tier 2 dyson rep as of right now. all the fleet gear I do not have yet but want since it would match the Aegis Set I do have. It would be preferable if I could keep the Aegis set since it was a 9 mil EC investment AND its being upgraded in season 9.5 :). Feel free to give me any feedback. thanks guys!

BUILD HERE: http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=kdfsciencecruiser_7030
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Post edited by gameverseman on
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Comments

  • dahminusdahminus Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I would highly recommend the bort command as a sci vessel

    http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=scicruiserkdf_0

    Let me know which ship you'd like a build for
    Chive on and prosper, eh?

    My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
  • tororosso11tororosso11 Member Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    dahminus wrote: »
    I would highly recommend the bort command as a sci vessel

    http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=scicruiserkdf_0

    Let me know which ship you'd like a build for



    how should the skills be spent using that ship? thanks much.

    More so with Gravimetric torp and Grav well combo build ive been seeing alot here, just idk yet how skills should be spent.
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    dahminus wrote: »
    I would highly recommend the bort command as a sci vessel

    http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=scicruiserkdf_0

    Let me know which ship you'd like a build for

    The Bortas Command Is nowhere close to the Science Odyssey if you look at the consoles. I want the fleet corsair because it has 4 science consoles and its still a cruiser plus it has a higher shield modifier. So a build with the Fleet corsair would be much appreciated :) thanks
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  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    how should the skills be spent using that ship? thanks much.

    More so with Gravimetric torp and Grav well combo build ive been seeing alot here, just idk yet how skills should be spent.

    You are better off having the corsair due to its 4 sci consoles for grav torp like I have with my build. Aegis deflector ( or any graviton deflector) will really help boost the grav torp. in terms of skill points, Im not entirely sure skill points buff it beyond torp tac skill points. I would say graviton generators would be your best bet.
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  • tororosso11tororosso11 Member Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    You are better off having the corsair due to its 4 sci consoles for grav torp like I have with my build. Aegis deflector ( or any graviton deflector) will really help boost the grav torp. in terms of skill points, Im not entirely sure skill points buff it beyond torp tac skill points. I would say graviton generators would be your best bet.

    can share your build now what you said above?
    im such a noob and idk how to spend my skills points as i level up this science character. but yes you are right, im aiming for one of the generic builds i commonly noticed being shared on forums which is the graviton generator/Tach Rift/Gravity Well as my base.

    thanks
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    can share your build now what you said above?
    im such a noob and idk how to spend my skills points as i level up this science character. but yes you are right, im aiming for one of the generic builds i commonly noticed being shared on forums which is the graviton generator/Tach Rift/Gravity Well as my base.

    thanks

    I already did.... the first initial post. 0.o

    BUILD: http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=kdfsciencecruiser_7030

    Although this thread was meant help my build.....
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    The point of the Command BortasQu' is it has Sensor Analysis and a far greater tac potential.

    The downsides are poor manoeuvrability and lower shield mod than Fleet cruisers (one of the things cryptic kinda screwed about the BortasQu' imo).


    Now to your posted build:

    I suppose you're going for a sort of healboat, possibly attracting enemy fire?

    If so, you should really ditch BO and get FAW. Tac team would also be useful.

    MES is sorta useless in such a build and Tachyon beam isn't all that great even on dedicaced sci ships (in this case, on a relatively slow ship, it's useless).

    Otherwise I suppose you'll use Damage Control Engineer doffs to cycle EPtW and EPtS.

    When it comes to consoles, the Dyson ones aren't all that great and if I got your desired role well, you shouldn't really need ani sci consoles at all (though anything boosting your heals and shields could help).

    I'd recommend ditching the mine and getting the Kinetic Cutting beam and Assimilated console from the Omega rep.


    All in all, the Command BortasQu' would fare better.
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Everybody is missing the point here. Its suppose to be a Science Odyssey but KDF side. True the Command Bortas (and Science Odyssey) have sensor analysis but If I wanted that I would have stuck with my Voth Palisade science vessel or I would fly the Tal Shiar Adapted Battlecruiser. I don't really need it. It's a nice ship ability and all, but its not what I'm looking for. What I am looking for, however, is pretty much a sci support cruiser with a respectable amount of versatility geared toward tanking. I currently fly the Fleet Kar'fi Battle Carrier and it's great for DPS and overwhelming the enemy but it tanks terribly compared to other cruisers and carriers. Hence why I am changing ships. The base turn rate for the Fleet Kar'fi and the Fleet Corsair are the same and I like how my Kar'fi turns. I couldn't really see myself flying anything with any less of a turn rate since previous to this ship I was flying the Voth Bastion Flight Deck Cruiser and that ship did not turn well enough for me. I love my mines and spent money for the hot pursuit trait so I'm not ditching my mines. I'm only using BO because of a doff I am using that increases shield penetration when used. Im keeping the Dyson consoles because of the proton proc on tachyon beam.
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    If I recall well, Antimatter spread doesn't really play well with tanking at all.

    For the shield penetration on BO, using a well-timed High Yield might be better than TS. However that's not gonna draw anywhere near the amount of aggro as FAW would nor the same amount of damage.

    Sorry, but overall, I don't really see the point of this build. Given the Fleet Corsair has a Lt.Comm Sci, it'd be a great tanking/healing platform for GW and FAW...

    In broad strokes, this: http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=tankybasicfleetcorsair_0

    However the lack of tac team might be a problem.

    EDIT: Of course, DCE doffs, for more threat some Fleet particle gens.
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    toiva wrote: »
    If I recall well, Antimatter spread doesn't really play well with tanking at all.

    For the shield penetration on BO, using a well-timed High Yield might be better than TS. However that's not gonna draw anywhere near the amount of aggro as FAW would nor the same amount of damage.

    Sorry, but overall, I don't really see the point of this build. Given the Fleet Corsair has a Lt.Comm Sci, it'd be a great tanking/healing platform for GW and FAW...

    In broad strokes, this: http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=tankybasicfleetcorsair_0

    However the lack of tac team might be a problem.

    EDIT: Of course, DCE doffs, for more threat some Fleet particle gens.

    I agree FAW would pull more aggro but the main objective of the ship is to support more than tank. I have antimatter spread because I like having a confuse/placate ability that doesnt consume a bridge officer slot. I very much like the addition of the experimental proton weapon as an added set bonus however the tac station cannot accommodate cannon ability unfortunately. Having the 4 set bonuses is an interesting idea but I dont think the bonuses are worth it some cases. The obelisk warp core forces me to do a aux2bat with my engineer and the omni AP is really weak compared to a fleet AP. Since Proton Dmg is undefined as to what it does for effect, the experimental protonic weapon might not be worth it. I would want the borg tech set however I want mines too and 3 Beam arrays in the back. I guess I could get use to having 2. GW is only good for crowd control, how does that play into the support role?
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I agree FAW would pull more aggro but the main objective of the ship is to support more than tank. I have antimatter spread because I like having a confuse/placate ability that doesnt consume a bridge officer slot. I very much like the addition of the experimental proton weapon as an added set bonus however the tac station cannot accommodate cannon ability unfortunately. Having the 4 set bonuses is an interesting idea but I dont think the bonuses are worth it some cases. The obelisk warp core forces me to do a aux2bat with my engineer and the omni AP is really weak compared to a fleet AP. Since Proton Dmg is undefined as to what it does for effect, the experimental protonic weapon might not be worth it. I would want the borg tech set however I want mines too and 3 Beam arrays in the back. I guess I could get use to having 2. GW is only good for crowd control, how does that play into the support role?

    Exp proton weapon works with FAW (and very well) as a two piece proton weaponry bonus (with gravimetric torp and/or console). And it leads to nice crit bonuses as well.

    The Obelisk core + Omni beam give you final +10% AP damage. Not sure why it'd force you to Aux2Batt. :confused:

    GW does nice damage and plays well with the Grav torp. Both are supporting the team with crowd control and additional damage. Both are supported with particle gen consoles.
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    toiva wrote: »
    Exp proton weapon works with FAW (and very well) as a two piece proton weaponry bonus (with gravimetric torp and/or console). And it leads to nice crit bonuses as well.

    The Obelisk core + Omni beam give you final +10% AP damage. Not sure why it'd force you to Aux2Batt. :confused:

    GW does nice damage and plays well with the Grav torp. Both are supporting the team with crowd control and additional damage. Both are supported with particle gen consoles.

    I would have to use aux2bat because I wont be using the majority of the Aux power provided by the Obelisk core. But the +10% AP dmg isnt worth it when the core and omni beam are useless to me. I will consider the experimental proton weapon. Is it really worth it if its GW1?
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I would have to use aux2bat because I wont be using the majority of the Aux power provided by the Obelisk core. But the +10% AP dmg isnt worth it when the core and omni beam are useless to me. I will consider the experimental proton weapon. Is it really worth it if its GW1?

    I gotta say I don't follow you very well. The aux power will be used for all the sci abilities bar Sci team. If you feel you'll have too much of Aux power most of the time, just push it to 15 at default.

    And while the Omni beam does somewhat less damage than a fleet Beam, the 10% bonus to all AP weapons easily outdoes that (the Omni beam does same damage as a regular beam array, not that of a turret). What fleet core exactly do you want to use that you don't wanna lose?

    And GW in any form is definitely way more useful than MES or Tachyon beam. Buff it properly and even GW1 willl do serious damage (added to the control aspect). It's the hands down second most useful sci ability in PvE behind HE if fighting Borg.
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • eradicator84eradicator84 Member Posts: 1,116 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I have to say, I'm a little confused about what the OP is asking for. Yes a build for Fleet Corsair, but I'm struggling to understand the tanky "support" role he wants.

    Tanky is easy, but what does "support" even mean?
    - Healer
    - Aggro grabber
    - DPS "support"
    - Control (snares/slows)
    - Enemy neutralizer (drains/debuffs/anti sensors)
    - Any/all of the above?

    gameverseman - Would be nice if you can pin point for us what kind of game play you're trying to achieve to "support" others.



    I've a few builds for my corsair, for PvE anyway this is my go to DPS focused Fleet Corsair build - Aggro grabbing tank, that specialises in exotic damage, 24k DPS capable with an engineer captain.


    Now, you say you want tanky, but primarily "support".

    Rule #1, aux2batt won't work on this build. Sacrifice too much engy slots (running 2) and dumping aux nerfs half your boff abilities. Forget about it.

    Rule #2, you said you wont be using aux much. Seriously consider speccing into aux power buffing abilities and gear, science is >40% this ships make up, turn it to your advantage as sci skills are buffed by aux. After your boffs, your flight deck relaunch cool down directly feeds of aux too.
    After weapons, aux should be on equal pegging with shields.


    Tip: This ship has to have one of the best boff layout for healing or control in this game. If you want to run primarily "support" focus, consider focusing on those two options. Straight up aggro grabbing and tanking works too, but can be boring.

    For some suggestions on what you can try, here's some of my "support" role specific builds:
    Control build
    Shield drain build - Works well in that task
    Power drain build
    Healer build
    Lots of high end gear on 'em, but if you can tell us what you're aiming for specifically we can guide you on the cheaper path to obtaining near same results.
    These all tank reasonably well too. Being an engineer specced into aggro, they kinda have to, or I die, and I hate dying lol
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  • warmaker001bwarmaker001b Member Posts: 9,205 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    OP, your build lacks focus. There's nothing wrong in making a ship build do multiple functions decently, but you're way all over the place.

    Judging by your consoles and Aegis Set, your ship will shield heal quite well.

    The rest though lacks focus and dilutes the other things the ship could be doing well.

    You want the Dyson Grav Torp but you put no consoles or space equipment to make it or the rifts function better. Aegis Set does absolutely nothing to enhance Dyson Grav Torp performance, whether it be the torp itself or the rifts that it can cause. Outside the 2 Proton Arsenal items, you put no TAC Consoles to increase torp / photon damage, nothing to boost Particle or Graviton Generators, which directly impact the performance of the rifts. Points from Skillboxes aren't enough. Science ships that truly rely on the performance of the Dyson Grav Torp are very strong in Particle & Graviton Generators.

    Also, Gravity Well in conjunction with a Torp Spread of the Dyson Grav Torp is what REALLY makes the bread and butter for the Grav Torp.

    You're sacrificing a BOFF skill for Mask Energy Signature, which has very limited use and I do believe some other more valuable Science skill can go there.

    You put in Tachyon Beam 2, but outside skillboxes, you have no equipment that reinforces the drain ability... no extra "Flow Capacitors" outside your skillboxes. As someone who's done Drain Builds, I can tell you now that to make it really effective, you need way, way, way, way more Flow Caps. Skillboxes aren't enough. With no real dedication for Flow Capacitors, your Tachyon Bm 2 performance will be weak.

    Weapons:
    - Energy Weapons: You put in a Dual Beam up front while most of your other energy weapons are single Beam Arrays. Beam Arrays shine for broadsiding. But a DBB up front will be useless. If you want to use the Beam Overload for the DBB, then you have to face forward and all your aft BAs will be useless. You need to decide if you want to be a broadsider or a truly forward focused ship, then build around that.

    - Mine: You install a mine but have no Dispersal Patterns to enhance its performance, no consoles to give it more damage. Generic Mine damage consoles or better yet, Quantum Projectile boosts will help your Mine also (Specific "Projectile" boosts count both the Torp & Mine of the same type). I know you said you spent $$$ to get that mine, but it's not really doing anything useful if you're not dedicating anything for it.

    You installed the Antimatter Spread Console, but literally have nothing in skillboxes or equipment to increase its performance.

    You installed the Nadeon Detonator, which means you want the utility of Photonic Shockwave at range. Fine, but you did not have enough Particle Generator Skill dedication to really make it useful. It suffers from the same problem of your Dyson Grav Torp... not enough dedication to make it shine.

    My recommendation... your build has too many gimmick consoles and lacks focus. You need to decide on a few things that your ship will be good at. Because it really looks like you want a strong shield healing ship, but you have various abilities, consoles that go against that. Not only that, these gimmicks weaken the performance of your capability outside your high shield heals.

    Lastly, if you REALLY want to have damaging capability with science, you NEED high Particle Generators. The Dyson Grav Torp rifts also need both high Particle & Graviton Generators. If you really want to make use of of Drains, you need VERY high Flow Capacitors. If all you want is good Plasmonic Leech performance, then your skillboxes are just fine for it. But your Tachyon Beam will still be weak without considerable boosts.
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I have to say, I'm a little confused about what the OP is asking for. Yes a build for Fleet Corsair, but I'm struggling to understand the tanky "support" role he wants.

    Tanky is easy, but what does "support" even mean?
    - Healer
    - Aggro grabber
    - DPS "support"
    - Control (snares/slows)
    - Enemy neutralizer (drains/debuffs/anti sensors)
    - Any/all of the above?

    gameverseman - Would be nice if you can pin point for us what kind of game play you're trying to achieve to "support" others.

    Yeah, same. I supposed he meant a healer/tank combo which seems well suited to the ship but by his answers, that just started making no real sense.

    I'd just mention that trying to be 'jack of all trades' with sci is gonna lead to being 'master of none'. If you insist on Tachyon beam, gameverseman, you should really support that choice heavily with Flow caps consoles and other shield drains. Same with any other drain or debuff build.

    Only useful Sci skills you don't necessarily need to heavily invest in would be GW and heals. If then you go for as much damage as possible, you will be useful in PvE (you may even occasionally be thanked for a heal :P ).
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Thank you for all your feedback, it is much appreciated. Now to answer some of your questions... What I meant by support is that I would tank enough to not die, and "support" with hangar pet DPS, ship DPS, and healing with a trick or two up my sleeve.. that being Antimatter Spread. I realize now that, that, is not the best option since I have nothing to buff it (Particle generators etc...). To answer the Aux2bat concern,(I only will be using Aux2bat if I use the obelisk core) The Fleet Corsair is still a cruiser in the end, not a science vessel. So there is less access to science abilities and, therefore, less demand for Aux power. True, the science abilities use Aux power, but I doubt I would need that much. I could be wrong but that is what I have experienced/noticed when playing with my 8 other characters. I have reconsidered the oblesik set and am willing to try it. It never occurred to me that the +10% AP dmg would apply so effectively to the omni beam. The core I would ideally want would be Fleet Elite Reinforced Warp Core [EPS]/[Eff] (depending on power levels since I do not own the ship yet) [S->W]/[W->S] [Wcap] [EWS]. Now the mine issue, I spent $$$ on both the mine AND the hot pursuit trait, thats why I am keeping the mine. The DBB concern, I will be using BO in PvP and FAW for PvE so I am going to keep the bank because I like to have 1 bank on my cruisers. I am getting rid of MES. Finally, although I know how effective GW is, I will have to pass on that too since I do not have the equipment to really support and buff it. I will keep the nadeon detonator because I believe I have enough skill points to buff it enough. Thanks again for your time :)
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Thank you for all your feedback, it is much appreciated. Now to answer some of your questions... What I meant by support is that I would tank enough to not die, and "support" with hangar pet DPS, ship DPS, and healing with a trick or two up my sleeve.. that being Antimatter Spread. I realize now that, that, is not the best option since I have nothing to buff it (Particle generators etc...). To answer the Aux2bat concern,(I only will be using Aux2bat if I use the obelisk core) The Fleet Corsair is still a cruiser in the end, not a science vessel. So there is less access to science abilities and, therefore, less demand for Aux power. True, the science abilities use Aux power, but I doubt I would need that much. I could be wrong but that is what I have experienced/noticed when playing with my 8 other characters. I have reconsidered the oblesik set and am willing to try it. It never occurred to me that the +10% AP dmg would apply so effectively to the omni beam. The core I would ideally want would be Fleet Elite Reinforced Warp Core [EPS]/[Eff] (depending on power levels since I do not own the ship yet) [S->W]/[W->S] [Wcap] [EWS]. Now the mine issue, I spent $$$ on both the mine AND the hot pursuit trait, thats why I am keeping the mine. The DBB concern, I will be using BO in PvP and FAW for PvE so I am going to keep the bank because I like to have 1 bank on my cruisers. I am getting rid of MES. Finally, although I know how effective GW is, I will have to pass on that too since I do not have the equipment to really support and buff it. I will keep the nadeon detonator because I believe I have enough skill points to buff it enough. Thanks again for your time :)

    I see you're about as stubborn as I am :D , so only a few points:

    - Don't use Aux2Batt. With or without the Obelisk core, there's no need for it. (Honestly I still don't understand what makes you think 'Obelisk -> Let's use Aux2Batt'. Aux2Batt is used with Technician doffs to reduce all Boff ability CDs, that's the main point of it.)

    - The +10% AP damage applies to all Antiproton weapons as a final modifier. That's why it's very good. And you won't lose much if anything from the mentioned Fleet Warp core with the Obelisk core (plus it's free).

    - Your call with GW, I'd still use it and get a couple Particle gen consoles (would also buff the nadeon detonator you want to keep).

    - Good call with FAW for PvE.
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • eradicator84eradicator84 Member Posts: 1,116 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Please learn to paragraph. lol wall of text!

    What I meant by support is that I would tank enough to not die, and "support" with hangar pet DPS, ship DPS, and healing with a trick or two up my sleeve.. that being Antimatter Spread.
    Ok so tanky DPS essentially.

    Try THIS build I made for you. A tweaked version of yours.

    AMS can be good to break you away when you're getting desperate with low hull, so thats fine.

    DPS on this ship means exotic damage, ie particle generators. So work your way towards some of those.
    I realize now that, that, is not the best option since I have nothing to buff it (Particle generators etc...).
    Don't worry about buffing AMS. Buff your damage abilities. You will still need particle generators but they can be bought off the exchange for very little EC. Like just get Mk X Uncommon (green) particle consoles (very cheap) just to get you started, that'll get you some 2/3 as effective as MKXII stuff.
    To answer the Aux2bat concern,(I only will be using Aux2bat if I use the obelisk core)
    I see no reason for this thinking.

    Put the core in, forget about A2B.
    The Fleet Corsair is still a cruiser in the end, not a science vessel. So there is less access to science abilities and, therefore, less demand for Aux power.
    This ship is about as hybrid as you can get. Much like destroyers, KDF battle cruisers and Avenger etc that are half cruiser half escort. Or Dyson sci ships that are half sci half escorts/destroyers.

    Ignoring half of the Corsairs abilities, will simply nerf half your ship.
    Embrace the Aux, believe me :)
    True, the science abilities use Aux power, but I doubt I would need that much. I could be wrong but that is what I have experienced/noticed when playing with my 8 other characters.
    Aux feeds at least 5/12 of your boff abilities plus hanger. Do not under estimate it. Aux will boost them quite a lot.
    I have reconsidered the oblesik set and am willing to try it. It never occurred to me that the +10% AP dmg would apply so effectively to the omni beam. The core I would ideally want would be Fleet Elite Reinforced Warp Core [EPS]/[Eff] (depending on power levels since I do not own the ship yet) [S->W]/[W->S] [Wcap] [EWS].
    Forget EWS cores, their proc isn't that great. Just look for AMP cores.
    EFF is good
    I would suggest W>A or W>E as the type you get. weapons should be as 100 already. Shields at or above 75. The other two (aux mainly) should be boosted to benefit half the ship abilities and hanger, if you can get it to >74 with the leech then you'll get another AMP boost for even more damage.

    In the mean time, the Obelisk core will serve you well.
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Ok so tanky DPS essentially.

    Try THIS build I made for you. A tweaked version of yours.

    Good build advice, though I'd scale down the control aspect a notch. I'd probably add Polarize Hull and/or Sci team in place of the tractor/s. Would help with the tanking part.
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I just got the ship and ran a very rough test with it. Im still missing a lot of components. I am pleased with my DPS, however, I need to tank A LOT more. By tank i mean I dont want my shields going down in the first place. I know Aegis set is getting a big upgrade in season 9.5 and am now updating tribble and copying over my character for further testing but aside from that, do you guys have any suggestions?
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I just got the ship and ran a very rough test with it. Im still missing a lot of components. I am pleased with my DPS, however, I need to tank A LOT more. By tank i mean I dont want my shields going down in the first place. I know Aegis set is getting a big upgrade in season 9.5 and am now updating tribble and copying over my character for further testing but aside from that, do you guys have any suggestions?
    It's not that big of an upgrade, it just gains new set bonuses and goes from mark X (or XI, not sure) to Mk XII statwise.


    When it comes to shields staying up, depends how you loose them, if by pure damage received:
    I hope you're running EPtS. The higher the rank, the better. You should also cycle it endlessly along with another EPtX power (I believe you were about to use EPtW). Use at least two purple DCE doffs with one copy of each EPtS and EPtX for full uptime.

    Also the higher the Shield power, the higher resists a shield has (that's WHY EPtS is doubly great: gives you more shield power and a bonus shield resist on top of it).

    Another option is to have higher shield capacity to begin with. Field generator consoles help with that, but I'm not sure you've got place for them.

    If you lost shields by drains (Borg shield neutraliser, for instance), invest more in power insulator skill and/or according consoles. Or just use HE accordingly.
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    toiva wrote: »
    It's not that big of an upgrade, it just gains new set bonuses and goes from mark X (or XI, not sure) to Mk XII statwise.


    When it comes to shields staying up, depends how you loose them, if by pure damage received:
    I hope you're running EPtS. The higher the rank, the better. You should also cycle it endlessly along with another EPtX power (I believe you were about to use EPtW). Use at least two purple DCE doffs with one copy of each EPtS and EPtX for full uptime.

    Also the higher the Shield power, the higher resists a shield has (that's WHY EPtS is doubly great: gives you more shield power and a bonus shield resist on top of it).

    Another option is to have higher shield capacity to begin with. Field generator consoles help with that, but I'm not sure you've got place for them.

    If you lost shields by drains (Borg shield neutraliser, for instance), invest more in power insulator skill and/or according consoles. Or just use HE accordingly.

    Unfortunately, after testing, I get a lower shield capacity with the new Aegis compared to the old. So now Im looking at completely different sets. Solonae and Dyson have really grabbed my attention. Any suggestions?
    BUILD UPDATE!:http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=kdfsciencecruiser_7030
    I have taken all your recommendations and this is now the new build. I do have concerns about the dyson shield however.
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    The Dyson set is another defensive set. Should be fine. However egis loosing capacity from Holodeck to Tribble makes no sense. Are you sure looked at the shield value in system space? Didn't you somehow loose equipment or have skills reset?

    I'm asking because A) Aegis getting lower shield capacity seems like a bug; B) I think Aegis might be a little better at your chosen playstyle.

    Barring that, I'd probably use rather the Solanae set than the Dyson one. The main difference being the Solanae shield is resilient which I generally like better than the very low capacity regenerative ones. (Bonus: the Solanae three piece is a free mission reward.)

    And when talking about shields, I forgot to ask how you fare with shield redistributing. As you lack Tac team, you're very susceptible to lose a shield facing and die while the other three remain at near full. If that is not your case (and you manage redistributing shields manually to the necessary side), disregard this note. Otherwise you may need to switch the TS for Tac team, and probably get corresponding Conn officer doffs to keep it running as often as possible.

    You could try moving your eng abilities around for higher shield resists: Eng team 1, RSP1, EPtS3. Or if you have no engineering friend to train EPtS3: Eng team 1, EPtS2, RSP2.

    Then what's still bugging me would be the Tachyon beam as I'd rather see a GW supported by a couple particle gen consoles, but oh well. You could always try to get some AP tac consoles as well.
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    toiva wrote: »
    The Dyson set is another defensive set. Should be fine. However egis loosing capacity from Holodeck to Tribble makes no sense. Are you sure looked at the shield value in system space? Didn't you somehow loose equipment or have skills reset?

    I'm asking because A) Aegis getting lower shield capacity seems like a bug; B) I think Aegis might be a little better at your chosen playstyle.

    Barring that, I'd probably use rather the Solanae set than the Dyson one. The main difference being the Solanae shield is resilient which I generally like better than the very low capacity regenerative ones. (Bonus: the Solanae three piece is a free mission reward.)

    And when talking about shields, I forgot to ask how you fare with shield redistributing. As you lack Tac team, you're very susceptible to lose a shield facing and die while the other three remain at near full. If that is not your case (and you manage redistributing shields manually to the necessary side), disregard this note. Otherwise you may need to switch the TS for Tac team, and probably get corresponding Conn officer doffs to keep it running as often as possible.

    You could try moving your eng abilities around for higher shield resists: Eng team 1, RSP1, EPtS3. Or if you have no engineering friend to train EPtS3: Eng team 1, EPtS2, RSP2.

    Then what's still bugging me would be the Tachyon beam as I'd rather see a GW supported by a couple particle gen consoles, but oh well. You could always try to get some AP tac consoles as well.

    Yes, I checked and re-checked. The Aegis shield capacity is less from , what I'm guessing is, the added resistance proc. I agree that Aegis would be a better bet but with this hidden nerf I don't think I have a choice. I also agree that the low cap regenerative dyson shield is not all that great for tanking, but, the only reason im doing the 3 part set is for the proton barrage. That, in combination with the experimental proton weapon and the tachyon beam proton proc, would, I think, be really devastating in terms of exotic damage. Thats the reason why I am using the shield re-frequencer consoles as opposed to ordinary consoles. I'm also starting to think that the corsair wouldnt be the best ship for this build. At least the dyson set build. Perhaps prototype Romulan? Dyson seems the most logical but it would be better suited on my palisade than the corsair IMO.
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Yes, I checked and re-checked. The Aegis shield capacity is less from , what I'm guessing is, the added resistance proc. I agree that Aegis would be a better bet but with this hidden nerf I don't think I have a choice. I also agree that the low cap regenerative dyson shield is not all that great for tanking, but, the only reason im doing the 3 part set is for the proton barrage. That, in combination with the experimental proton weapon and the tachyon beam proton proc, would, I think, be really devastating in terms of exotic damage. Thats the reason why I am using the shield re-frequencer consoles as opposed to ordinary consoles. I'm also starting to think that the corsair wouldnt be the best ship for this build. At least the dyson set build. Perhaps prototype Romulan? Dyson seems the most logical but it would be better suited on my palisade than the corsair IMO.

    I'm afraid I can't really say how much the proton barrage is or isn't useful. Either way regenerative shields (and the Dyson set) aren't bad for tanking. It's maybe more of a personal preference of mine to have higher cap shields and rely more on resistances and healing when needed than the natural shield regen rate.

    And I'll check the Aegis stuff myself when I have time. If it's a nerf, it gotta get known.

    That's probably all I can tell you for now. Think about the shield saving tips I've given you earlier and good luck.
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I agree, If Cryptic/Perfect world are covering up a nerf with season 9.5, its gotta be known. I think we can both agree that we are tired of nerfs!
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  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I am still looking for help here guys. I've been testing my build all day (making minor changes here and there) and I'm doing just under the level of damage a want to do. I do not have plasmonic leech yet, I will get that soon. once that is squared away I bet my DPS will be fine.

    However, for a cruiser, I'm not tanking nearly as much as I was with my palisade Sci vessel and that, to me, makes no sense when the science vessel has a much lower hull and crew. Maybe its due to the lack of sci abilities and Voth Consoles. (i.e. reflective immunity matrix and aceton assimilater). I remember that when I DID fly it I had a phenomenal drain/placate build with it that somehow was able to tank like a *insert appropriate word here*, but lacked DPS. So, like I explained before, I moved to cruisers and carriers to get more DPS by compensating with additional weapons or purely by overwhelming the enemy. I was hoping to find an even medium with the Fleet Corsair but lost a lot of my tanking ability. Please help!
    Here is my Palisade Build for reference:http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=kinetica_7030
    That was my build to the best of my memory.
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    The Palisade you're showing has Tac team. And the Palisade has a much higher shield mod/shield regen.

    Also with doing less damage, it must have attracted less aggro --> had to tank less to easily survive.

    And the occasional drain rendered enemy fire less dangerous (aceton worked here as well).


    So, what exactly have you tested? Doffed tac team? Higher rank EPtS (still assuming you got the Damage control engineers to reduce CDs here)?

    EDIT: Heh, the Palisade got actually the BEST shield mod in game. And the Fleet Corsair's relatively low on hull compared to most Fleet level cruisers. Also forget about crew. That statistic has about 0.5% importance as it is now (it actually disadvantages those ships with more crew).

    Damn, forgot to ask if you use the cruiser commands. Fleet Corsair has one to attrack enemy aggro slightly buffing your resistances and another buffing your shields. Try that shield helping one.

    And if it's with hull that you got trouble, add one neutronium console (but with all the HE and Polarize Hull, that shouldn't be a problem).
    TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class.
    Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
    Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.

    Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
  • gameversemangameverseman Member Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    toiva wrote: »
    The Palisade you're showing has Tac team. And the Palisade has a much higher shield mod/shield regen.

    Also with doing less damage, it must have attracted less aggro --> had to tank less to easily survive.

    And the occasional drain rendered enemy fire less dangerous (aceton worked here as well).


    So, what exactly have you tested? Doffed tac team? Higher rank EPtS (still assuming you got the Damage control engineers to reduce CDs here)?

    EDIT: Heh, the Palisade got actually the BEST shield mod in game. And the Fleet Corsair's relatively low on hull compared to most Fleet level cruisers. Also forget about crew. That statistic has about 0.5% importance as it is now (it actually disadvantages those ships with more crew).

    When I said I did less damage I meant with my energy weapons. And, as you can tell from the build, my science abilities were not all offensive. I actually wanted to test how much I tanked in it so I 1v1 PvP'd a fleet mate with an uber powerful escort and it took him 15 minutes to blow me up. So I don't think it's a matter of aggro. Ive changed my hangar pets around a bit for the most part. Had to switch from FAW back to BO because I couldn't take the aggro... hence the tanking issue. even with less aggro, on occasion, I get pummeled bad, but I have yet to blow up out of like 7 PvE's. I cant really afford to give of a torp modifier since its my main "haymaker" so to speak. Also, my corsair has the same base turn rate as my Karfi and its using the same RCS yet it turns worse than the karfi, why?
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