One of the root problems with STO is that the game's map of the galaxy is just too small. This drives many of the other big problems in STO, such as the lack of faction-controlled space with diplomacy and combat between the factions, which drives the absence of *tension* in the game, or sector space too small which must be overcome for sufficient territory control PVP, and so on, even things like unbalanced travel times are a result of this. Its a Problem Zero that must be resolved before the rest of it can be addressed.
Cryptic really really needs to find a way to integrate STO with
the map of the explored galaxy. From
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/File:The_Explored_Galaxy.jpg and especially the discussion there:
The Federation star chart of "The Explored Galaxy" was first seen in 2293, in Captain Kirk's quarters aboard the USS Enterprise-A. (Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country)
The chart was also seen frequently in the 24th century in various locations. In 2364, the chart was displayed at Starfleet Headquarters in the room where Dexter Remmick, possessed by neural parasites, was killed after sending a homing beacon. (TNG: "Conspiracy") In 2365, the chart was seen in the court room on Starbase 173 (TNG: "The Measure Of A Man") and the tactical room aboard the Enterprise-D, close to another map that depicted the whole Milky Way Galaxy. (TNG: "The Emissary") In 2367, the chart was seen in the tactical laboratory of Enterprise-D. (TNG: "The Mind's Eye") In 2368, in the ship's engineering laboratory. (TNG: "The Game") In 2369 and 2370, the chart was seen in the classroom aboard Deep Space 9, featuring the heading "The Explored Galaxy". (DS9: "In the Hands of the Prophets", "Cardassians")
I'm not saying the artwork should be used for the galaxy map, rather that the layout of the galaxy should be used as a starting point for determing scale, travel time and mechanics (warp vs transwarp vs gateways), faction-controlled space, and so forth, using the canon map as the cornerstone referene which everything else is built upon.
Comments
Here is a map of the Milky Way that I made for an STO Exploration proposal a few years ago. And the area we play STO in is within that tiny, tiny circle around Earth (50 Light Years across). While the Blue Area is the area the Federation explored in the TNG era.
So in means of the entire Galaxy, it's really been untouched. And tons of potential that Cryptic isn't capitalizing on.
Should travel times be made slower as well?
IMO, this is all rather arbitrary...
You make it out to be a Catch-22, when it's just Cryptic needing to be true to Star Trek than making new rules as they go.
From what I gather what Ursus's saying, it's that we are a small fish in a big pond, and we don't have the means to stretch our legs and make the most of Transwarp and Slipstream tech. Sector Space and the speeds its fine, just that we need to get out of the box that Cryptic put us in.
Travel times can be dealt with via multiple modes of travel. EG, warp travel within a sector can be (relatively) slow if you have transwarp drives that let you (instantly) go to any system within the sector and transwarp hubs that let you (instantly) travel to any other sector. The assets are already here, but the map doesnt support it.
In that respect, I agree. But I also disagree that if Cryptic handles the story correctly with a new race, they can pull it off.
For instance, the Fen Domar. They were mentioned by Future Janeway as a powerful enemy that lies somewhere between Earth and the Beta/Delta border. If we expanded STO into that area, Cryptic could ramp up the danger season by season until a climax where we face off with their main fleet. And they can do the same with any fictional race they create. It's a matter of conveying that danger storywise and gameplaywise. As long as they stay true to Star Trek ideals.
Anyway your assertions are irrelevant. I'm saying that its not really possible to have any kind of PVP area control with the current map restrictions. The current state of the KDF-Federation relations within the single-player story arc is something for you to work through, it has no relation to anything that may happen between any number of factions in the future, except that the galaxy map we have now wont support it.
So please, no more derailing on sidebar topics
My assertion is that Territory Control PvP is irrelevant at this point in time. The only wars going on are with NPCs rather then Factions. We do not need larger or smaller maps, nor do we need more tensions from map size when the Factions are no longer involved in conflict.
PvP might get a full revamp at some point, but I do not believe we are going to see it before next year - and certainly not before the game takes us to the Delta Quadrant for new end-game play - as a Level Cap increase seems to be the most talked about purpose of the new EP.
I was specifically addressing the points you brought up in your Original Post. Maybe you need to reread what you wrote?
I'll put this in perspective for you, would you want this level of spacial realism in the game, it would take you about a month and a half to reach DS9. Though I'm sure they could implement a travel while logged out system, so you can set course and then log in several weeks later when you get there.
Or we can just keep the maps smaller like they are and have things work more like how it's seen in the franchise, rather than littering sectors with trans-warp gates everywhere for no real needed reason other than to encompass a massive grandiose map to implement a system that hardly anyone expresses any interest in.
Most of us play this game because it's star-trek.
...so make sector space larger and give player's incentive and means to avoid it?
the Romulan Neutral Zone is huge, but in STO its literally a line on the galaxy map. If the map were large, it would be possible to exploit systems in the map at some future point. The point is, right now its not possible.
And then transwarps for the people that just want to get to the other side of the map for whatever
And since the game does not have Territory Control PvP, nor has it ever had it, there is no way I could have ever played through such a thing here - and neither could you. So what does your second sentence have to do with anything?
Where you see a "problem zero" I see no problem at all. At best all I really want is seamless zoning giving space the illusion of being vast and open rather then sectored off. None of that would affect travel time or the use of various "go to" abilities.
This always seemed like an argument for stagnation. I mean, if they can't please anyone, why bother?
The Romulan Neutral Zone is probably a bad example, since the Romulan Empire no longer exists, and thus the current status of the Neutral Zone is questionable.
However, the Federation-Klingon neutral zone is just as unclear.
Which brings me back around to my Sector Space pet peeve, which is that IMO "deep space" (read: empty space between systems) should always be considered neutral/uncoloured, since Trek generally shows all species having pretty free travel until they arrive at an occupied system. Instead, I think it makes more sense to have a colour-coded "island" around each occupied/controlled system on the sector map. Neutral zones are denoted by being uncoloured.
Regarding transwarp...the STO depiction always struck me as funny, considering its portrayal in the series has always been closer to what we have with Quantum Slipstream drive - travel time is still required.
Travel time is a waste of time... you do not fight in sector space... sure you may go to a location via your ship... but if they implemented instant access to locations in your sector by a drop down menu or you can travel via ship like now... what do you think would happen?
Fun and games does not equal spending a few minutes going from place A to place B.
Heck they do that now with mission quests that has "transwarp" but it costs EC. Make it free and I would NEVER travel in my ship from my current location to next mission location.
What I am purposing, is much like oblivion/Fallout3/NewVegas/Skyrim, where you preload all surronding sectors while you mode.
Imagine a board of 9 cells... 3x3. You are in cell #5 wich obviously is loaded and ready.
Now cells 1-4 and 6-9 are pre-loaded, meaning nothing, or very little is really loaded, it's just prepared. Players are obviously loaded into these cells, as well as certain stellar objects (such as nebula).
As you move from cell #5 to cell #2,Cell #2 is fully loaded when you cross the cell-border, cells 7,8 and 9 unload fully, cell #5 is unloaded and altered into a preloaded cell instead and cell -1, -2 and -3 preload.
This would make the impression that you don't use load times, would allow for almost endless maps (obviously this is to some degree limited by the engine and the client PC).
Now if you move outside the established map, you would be overpowered by a huge, never ending squadron of raiders.
This would actively discourage you from leaving into pure emptyness, and all it would take is to set a variable on the two outer cells to border map, so that the game knows that if you move past the established mission sectors.
Considering that it hasn't happened yet, I wouldn't count on it ever happening.
I also think it's not such a big deal. Seamless would certanly be nice, but size is irrelevant as long as there is nothing happening in there. Blowing up the maps doesn't automatically generate more content to do in it.
I think for that we'd need an Exploration Revamp or Genesis II ...
Alien: To your planet, welcome.
McCoy: I think that's *my* line, stranger.
Alien: Oh, forgive. I here am new. But you are known, being McCoy from Enterprise.
McCoy: You have me at a disadvantage, sir.
Alien: Oh, I name not important. You seek I. Message received. Available ship stands by.
McCoy: How much and how soon?
Alien: How soon is now. How much is, where?
McCoy: Somewhere in the Mutara sector.
Alien: Oh, Mutara restricted! Take permits many; money more.
McCoy: There aren't gonna be any damned permits! How can you get a permit to do a damned illegal thing? Look, price you name, money I got.
Alien: Place *you* name, money *I* name, otherwise bargain, no.
McCoy: Alright, damn it! It's Genesis! The name of the place we're going is GENESIS!
Alien: Genesis?
McCoy: Yes, Genesis! How can you be deaf with ears like that?
Alien: Genesis allowed is not! Is planet forbidden!