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Ship sale, but...
dongemaharu
Member Posts: 544 Arc User
So now there's a ship sale and I've been wanting the Vesta pack for a while. Great. But I hear there are plans to buff or tweak the them. Can anyone guess whether that would automatically be applied to the Vesta I bought, or if they would make new Vestas to buy? Just wondering.
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My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
All tweaks & upgrades are applied to all ships & powers .
There are no "two kinds" of the same ship or power in the game .
In some instances you had to dismiss & reclaim an item for the upgrade to be applied .
However DON'T DO THIS unless you're specifically told to do this by a Dev blog .
Any upgrade to the Vesta (i.e. Secondary Deflectors) will be applied retroactively. So like Warp Cores, the slot for Deflectors will be added to the Vesta automatically whether you buy it now or later.
On the Vesta, I highly advise it. It's a great multi-purpose ship.
Case in point: the recent buff to KDF raiders. All player who already owned the ships received the buff to hull and flanking feature.
AWESOME-SAUCE!!!!
I can't wait to buy my Ody bundle and avenger!!!!
Has anyone seen if this sale is affecting ship modules? Last I checked ship modules were under the ship tab.
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Based on previous experiences, these buffs should be applied retroactivelly on every commisioned Vesta that the players own.
While past precedent has been established with warp cores that were added to older ships, Cryptic is under no obligation to provide secondary deflectors to all existing science vessels.
On the same token if they do buff the Nebula it might be similar to the Galaxy buff and apply to existing ships. Alternately they could instead release the Nebula re-refit, retire the existing Nebula, and make you repurchase the ship.
If you do not like the ship as it is at this exact moment, do not buy it. If you do and want to fly it, then go ahead and pick it up.
Ok. Yeah, I do know about the secondary deflector, but the possible hull buff, or whatever else they do to it, is what I was particularly curious about. I'll definitely pick up the Vestas then. Thanks.
They generally call it a sci ship if it has analysis and subsystem targeting. If they're consistent, then, yes, the Orb Weaver counts.
Will they be consistent?
I know the pallisade is for sure... it has "science vessel" in the name after all. i think the Orb Weaver is considered sci as well.
along with the Temporal Science vessels, and the mirror sci ships, i dont htink those needed explaining.
Generally, a good way to tell what's a "true" science ship is if it has Sensor Analysis and the inherent Beam: Target ___ powers.
This is correct. If the Tempest-class becomes a financial success for Cryptic, anticipate more top-of-the-line ships to be 'retired' and buffed with new versions you'll have to re-buy.
The precedent has been set with the Patrol Escort. The only thing that will determine whether it happens some more is how many people will choose not to care if ships are being 'retired'.
I'm not saying that they won't retroactively buff the Vesta (or any other ship) -- I'm saying that the precedent has been set where they aren't obligated to do so, and might 'retire' it because not enough people care whether they do or not.
Their foot is already in the door on the matter. What is the Patrol Escort today might be the Star Cruiser tomorrow, the DSSV a month from now, the Odyssey a few more, the Bortasqu', the Vesta, the Andorian ships. If they see nobody cares that they 'retire' enough ships, then there is literally nothing stopping them from doing it with every ship we have already.
'Retiring' ships are only going to stop with the Patrol Escort if the point is pressed that we want them to stop. Just because it's happening to the Patrol Escort that you don't even fly, don't think it won't happen to whatever your favorite fleet-quality ship happens to be further on down the line.
The Wells is most definitely a Sci ship, but I was wondering that about the Orb Weaver myself. It has all the hallmarks of a Sci ship, but has more hull HP, more crew, and the horrible turn rate of a Cruiser.
http://sto.gamepedia.com/Playable_starship
[SIGPIC]Click here to visit my STO YouTube channel[/SIGPIC]
They will likely just give you a white MK X sec deflector like when warp cores were added. Or when you buy a new ship and it comes with white gear.
The Fleet Patrol Escort and its non-fleet version were never C-Store ships. So they retired the one avail in game that you could get when you leveled up or bought with 4 fleet modules. I wish that they just gave you the new fleet version fi you had the old Fleet Patrol Escort. Cuz you spent real money on it if you used Zen.
Also: Vesta Class starships just need a hull hitpoint increase... not a beefier shield mod.
Erm it is not enough the high shield modifyer?? or i am missing something? do you want hull boost as well? or is not the Vesta the ship with high shield modifyier?? in STO, the most important thing is the shield system, then hullpoints. So i think the Vesta is perfect as it is.
Defending The Galaxy By Breaking One Starfleet Regulation After The Next.
But should we want them to stop?
Look at this another way. The new Patrol Escort is a drastic change to the old version. An overall improvement, yes, but you're still in a situation where you have to make large sweeping changes to things people paid money for. New console layout, new BOff layout, new fixed gun gimmick... it's a lot to change.
This sort of thing is unprecedented. Cryptic was likely operating under the assumption that changing something that drastically would start a flame war the likes of which the forums haven't seen since they took dil from STFs. Obviously they'd want to avoid that. But they also want to chance the Patrol Escort to something new. How do you satisfy both desires? Simply let people keep the old ones they've got, and add the new ones to purchase if they want to.
I do disagree with outright retiring the old one, but I think they made a good call in how to handle what was either way going to be a bad situation.
That said. We'll see how I feel about it when they change a ship I actually use. I kinda hope my MVAE gets a similar treatment but I don't want a lame fused weapon and I'm not sure I like that BOff layout. Good thing I'll get to keep my old one, inferior though it may be by then...
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
Allow owners of the old version to trade it in to get a discount on the new one. Say 1 FM + FPE = New FPER.
Everyone wins, everyone is happy, and Cryptic just might encourage current owners of a FPE to pony up $5 instead of potentially alienating them from the new purchase with the $25 price tag.
Yes.
If the 'old and busted' FPE was superior to the 'new hotness' FPE, or at least on equal footing -- then there is no point in retiring it to begin with. It should be sold alongside the new one.
But it wasn't. It was retired. This implies that it was inferior to the new one, in execution if not planning.
By offering discounts, trade-ins, or some other form of consideration to show appreciation to those who bought the 'retired' versions, and reduce or eliminate buyer's remorse. Cryptic has the ability to offer discounts, and check your account to see if you own a particular ship. They've done so in the past.
The fact they have not offered any kind of compensation or consideration is part of the problem. Many people (I know this is vague, but it was the #1 concern on the official thread) wanted some form consideration in this manner.
None was given, which tells me either they know this is going to be a new habit they will be undergoing, and they can't afford giving compensation and consideration for every future 'retired' ship they're planning on, or they simply feel the system is fair the way it is.
In either case, I see that as a problem.
It was going to be a bad situation, they knew it was going to be a bad situation. Just like the 'rep trait' execution, they knew it would ruffle feathers beforehand. They could have taken steps to soften the blow and appease at least part of the playerbase for their decision.
But they didn't, despite having the tools and technology to do so (as they have in the past).
That is a problem.
It's not really about being superior or inferior. It's about the very principle of heavily altering something people have already paid for, upgrade or no.
Imagine you buy a car. It's got rear-wheel drive, but heated seats. Nifty, you always wanted heated seats. But you get a recall notice on something. You take it to the shop, they do the fix, but when you get your car back, oh dear. It's got four-wheel drive - that's an improvement - but your heated seats have been taken out in favor of a sun roof. Also they attached a spoiler.
Not the best example since digital media is a different realm entirely, but it should suffice. Things like the Galaxy retouch and adding warp cores to ships are like getting that recall notice and the shop doing exactly what it was supposed to do - fix/add the thing. Switching over entirely from the old patrol escort to the new one would have been like those drastic changes you never asked for along with that fix. I'd be mad.
Here's where we get back to your own points, though. They obviously don't want to just up and change something like that, so they should have offered a trade-in. Simple fix.
I do hope they'll learn from this and try to implement a trade-in for the next time this happens. Cryptic has a history of terrible first iterations that do improve with successive tries. No reason this can't be one of those times.
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
Correct. I do think they can change things. If not the FPE, then future ships they plan to 'retire'. The only way to do that is to ensure there's plenty of clamor, and to encourage them to stop now while they're trying this out.
Otherwise we run into the problem of, "Meh, who cares? I don't even fly [ship type]." Up until their favorite fleet-quality ship is on the chopping block (so to speak). Then it's, "Wait, hold on a second here..."
At which point everyone else will either say, "You didn't care when they did it to [x ship] and [y ship], nor did you care when they did it to the FPE. The ship has already sailed with your blessing."
Which is why I'm making sure Cryptic knows my jimmies are, in fact, rustled.
Al Rivera said that he would be showing some "love" to the Vesta and the Nebula. He did not say anything specific about the Nebula, but said he was looking at buffing the Vesta's hull points and perhaps something more. It was a minor remark in one of the last podcasts.
All "Buffs" in that case would be a back end stats buff and therefore applied to all Vesta's and Nebula's in service.
Since the c-store Nebula is only a 9 console ship(the Vesta is a 10 console) I suppose they could do some new type of refited "fleet" version of the Nebula which would be buffed and replace the old Nebula.
The Vesta is so new it's pretty safe from getting a overhall - like the current patrol escort.
I'm pretty sure people were thinking that when they got their FPE for the first time. "It's a fleet ship, can't get any better than fleet quality! Brand new! Yes, sir. Best help a fed can get."
You think certain ships are safe from being retired and re-sold, up until it happens.
You're right as far as you go, but I do think an FSM discount is in order.
There are two reasons, Imo.
Firstly, cryptic have made way too many polarising decisions recently. This is just another decision that annoys a minority.
That accumulation of minorities is going great to catch up with them one day.
Secondly, how many people will spend one FSM to get it, if they already own one? And how many of them won't pay the five FSM.
If the total of the former is close to five times the latter, they'll not lose anything offering the discount.
When the car manufacturer has a past history of replacing the car you bought with a new model, or offering you a special discount or other compensation, yes.
I can go to a car dealership right now and trade in my car towards the purchase of a new one right now if I wanted to.
Any other ridiculous comparisons you want to make?