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Forums > Home› Feedback› Builds, Powers, and Game Mechanics

Cannons ... outdated ?

shinzonisbackshinzonisback Member Posts: 330
edited March 2014 in Builds, Powers, and Game Mechanics
Hi guys ...

about a month ago, I saw a BEAM scimitar kill a gateway in less than a minute.

I, with my Fleet Ha'Feh, with Elite Fleet Weapons, Vulnerability Locators etc ... I need at least 2 minutes to kill a gateway.

so the point is: are cannons (turrets, DHCs) outdated ?
why are beams so OP ?

=====================================

I think this game was build with this logic:


Escorts: DHCs + Turrets -> DPS

Cruisers: Beams -> Survivability

Science Vessels: Beams -> Survivability and Damage with Sci Skills


now beams are so OP that cruisers can have both: survivability and best DPS.
do we need the devs to release something to boost cannons ?
Italian Player - Forgive my bad English

[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Post edited by shinzonisback on

Comments

  • ursusmorologusursusmorologus Member Posts: 5,328 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    On a normal setup, IE same captain same ship using regular gear (no DOFFs or special stuff), beams start out weak compared to cannons. But when you put a lot of resources into optimization (special ship, special DOFFs and abilities, etc), then beams can far surpass cannons.

    Its really up to you if you want to pursue that kind of setup. If DPS at all costs is important to you. I will say it doesnt matter for any mainline aspect of the game, but if you want to build a STF killer its pretty well documented by now.

    The game mechanics are really screwball. Weapons should scale together, equally effective at low end and high end with equal investment, which is not at all how things work here. Its not even a question of equal investment, the upper end of beams far surpass the upper end of cannons. A lot of people depend on it for certain aspects of gameplay so its not going away, but I dont think its correct design.
    [img]http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x57/UrsusMorologus/MechWarrior Online/Catapult_K2 sig.jpg[/img]
  • corbinwolf#9797 corbinwolf
    corbinwolf#9797
         Member Posts: 565 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    Hi,

    Since starting this game Cannons have been called OP. Beams have only recently been given an edge with certain and very expensive builds like A2B. I am actually kinda happy because though I like the way cannons make things disappear faster, its nice using canon weapons like beams and have similar results. Feels more trek like. Now if only torpedoes behaved the way they should ... ;-)
    "The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It's a very mean and nasty place and I don't care how tough you are it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain't about how hard ya hit. It's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward." - Rocky Balboa (2006)
  • thegalaxy31thegalaxy31 Member Posts: 1,211 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    Cannons are still nearly OP. So no, they're not outdated.
    I would love to visit this star in-game...or maybe this one!
    shurato2099 wrote:
    Won't SOMEONE please think of the CHILDREN?!
  • killdozer9211killdozer9211 Member Posts: 920 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    Beams aren't OP. For the first time in the game's history thanks to a stupid cookie cutter build that developed in the blind spot of some QA tester, they are now out dpsing cannons, which already did stupid amounts of dps.

    It's more a supporting mechanics issue, not beams themselves.
  • nobletnoblet Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    killdozer9211 wrote: »
    Beams aren't OP. For the first time in the game's history thanks to a stupid cookie cutter build that developed in the blind spot of some QA tester, they are now out dpsing cannons, which already did stupid amounts of dps.

    It's more a supporting mechanics issue, not beams themselves.

    Agreed - cruiser tank should be removed.:D

    Seriously, do you losers honestly think having it all (best dps plus best tank) is balanced?:rolleyes:
    Critical Hit Calculator
  • killdozer9211killdozer9211 Member Posts: 920 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    noblet wrote: »
    Agreed - cruiser tank should be removed.:D

    Seriously, do you losers honestly think having it all (best dps plus best tank) is balanced?:rolleyes:

    No one said it was balanced.

    Either way, escorts did it fine up until now. Cruisers used to be pointless to fly. As soon as cryptic figure out a way to nerf a2b faw, it'll be something else.
  • ddesjardinsddesjardins Member Posts: 3,056 Media Corps
    edited March 2014
    Do you remember Tricobalts taking down a Ninite generator befor the cube?

    The, there was a time not too long ago when people complained this was escorts online.

    AP DHC was the way to go....

    Now people are complaining that 'beams' are OP.

    BFAW FTW! Scmidars are too awesome!

    meh.

    Funny thing is I've gotten so tired of BFAW, I've slowly started to move my toons back to cannons. And it's (STO) fun again...
  • killdozer9211killdozer9211 Member Posts: 920 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    ddesjardins wrote: »
    Do you remember Tricobalts taking down a Ninite generator befor the cube?

    The, there was a time not too long ago when people complained this was escorts online.

    AP DHC was the way to go....

    Now people are complaining that 'beams' are OP.

    BFAW FTW! Scmidars are too awesome!

    meh.

    Funny thing is I've gotten so tired of BFAW, I've slowly started to move my toons back to cannons. And it's (STO) fun again...

    Honestly between scimitars and fleet consoles, I'm sure AP DHCs are more potent now than they ever were before this beam fad.

    If I ever bother grinding out the currency, I'll do a build. Should be fun. All hail king crit and whatnot.
  • hereticknight085hereticknight085 Member Posts: 3,783 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    No. Cannons are not out-dated. My DHC Scimitar can take down a gate in under a minute. Easily. It's not that hard. They still burst harder than BAs ever can. And you're using elite fleet weapons. Perhaps you should consider standard mk XII weapons.
    It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once. B)
  • bpharmabpharma Member Posts: 2,022
    edited March 2014
    Pretty sure if you got 5 people focus firing on a transformer with CRF+APO3+FOMM+APA+tactical fleet it would die faster than if you did it with FAW.

    Pretty sure you could BO3+THY3 with all the above buffs and 5 people and the transformer could blow before the gens.

    Damage has crept up and up and up with no diminishing returns. Only thing that has kept it in check PvP wise is the stupid number of passive heals available.
    It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
    A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
    Has damage got out of control?
    This is the last thing I will post.
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited March 2014
    This content has been removed.
  • dcpuserdcpuser Member Posts: 71 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    Eh its all part of being the favorite flavor of the year in the DPS department. Cannons before, Beams today, maybe Torpedoes tomorrow.
  • wolverine595959wolverine595959 Member Posts: 726
    edited March 2014
    dcpuser wrote: »
    Eh its all part of being the favorite flavor of the year in the DPS department. Cannons before, Beams today, maybe Torpedoes tomorrow.

    Cannons were meant to be the max dealer but you traded range for 5km and less damage dealing. YOu had to be somewhat skilled pilot to deliver all the damage goodness in a short window. All FAW does is allows a player to concentrate on other things besides damage and turns a match in BFAW Nascar event.
    Hey I Used to be Captain Data, well I guess I still am in game but the account link really screwed everything up :rolleyes:
  • notrealednanotrealedna Member Posts: 1,028
    edited March 2014
    Why use cannons with a 45 degrees firing arc when you can do twice as more damage with beams with better firing arc.Also awesome in pvp because the firing arc is not only on x and y axys so you can't escape beams no matter what you do.

    again quote Geko "If I nerf cannons people will complain"....here we are with broken beams.
  • wolverine595959wolverine595959 Member Posts: 726
    edited March 2014
    notrealedna wrote: »
    Why use cannons with a 45 degrees firing arc when you can do twice as more damage with beams with better firing arc.Also awesome in pvp because the firing arc is not only on x and y axys so you can't escape beams no matter what you do.

    again quote Geko "If I nerf cannons people will complain"....here we are with broken beams.

    lets not forget the circling up or down to get in cannon blind spots while laying down hull wilting damage.
    Hey I Used to be Captain Data, well I guess I still am in game but the account link really screwed everything up :rolleyes:
  • shinzonisbackshinzonisback Member Posts: 330
    edited March 2014
    Do not misunderstand me: I'm happy that beams have been improved, but this is really much I think.

    Cruisers have to be though not strong.

    I saw an Odyssey in Ker'Rat and I didn't managed to kill it, cause it was too though for me (I think it was too though for anyone :p), but it didn't killed me either.

    And this is the way the game was thought.

    Cruisers have resistance.
    Escorts have damage.
    Science Vessels have ... well they have a lot of things :p

    you can't have anything.

    modern cruisers have resistance and damage ... is really too much, don't you think ?
    Italian Player - Forgive my bad English

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • wolverine595959wolverine595959 Member Posts: 726
    edited March 2014
    shinzonisback wrote: »
    Do not misunderstand me: I'm happy that beams have been improved, but this is really much I think.

    Cruisers have to be though not strong.

    I saw an Odyssey in Ker'Rat and I didn't managed to kill it, cause it was too though for me (I think it was too though for anyone :p), but it didn't killed me either.

    And this is the way the game was thought.

    Cruisers have resistance.
    Escorts have damage.
    Science Vessels have ... well they have a lot of things :p

    you can't have anything.

    modern cruisers have resistance and damage ... is really too much, don't you think ?

    Escorts should have spike, cruisers should have pressure with low spike, sci pressure. What I mean by pressure the damage is steady enough that it causes the receiver to sweat and maybe be spiky enough to score a kill 50-60% of the time. Cruisers are middle road between sci and escorts. Scis do CC and sci spam and escorts do damage and can move cruisers should fit right int he middle, decent damage, decent sci, but good healing resisting. I am not saying that cruisers can't do damage but they should not be doing DPS on par with an escort. In the trinity now cruisers can do escort like damage, sci almost as good as a sci, and have strong hull heals. Scis can do damage but it is less from weapons and more from skills like GW and debuffs do not have the weapon slots of escorts or cruisers. Escorts can do OK eng and sci stuff but no where near the levels of their hybrid peers in the other classes
    Hey I Used to be Captain Data, well I guess I still am in game but the account link really screwed everything up :rolleyes:
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