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Critical chance needs to be capped URGENTLY (closed, necro)
darramouss1
Member Posts: 1,811 Arc User
Hello all.
I've written about Sensor Targeting Assault in the past and how I believe it's a severely broken mechanic. The new vulnerability locater consoles are about to make everything worse.
Let's look at a JHAS with 4 DHCs and 3 turrets on the rear. DHCs fire 2 volleys every 4 seconds, including recharge time. Turrets fire 4 every 4 seconds. This means in any 4 seconds period there are 20 volleys that have a chance to critically hit. 20 in 4 seconds = 5 volleys per second. If an escort is firing on a cruiser or science ship and it's set up properly it's going to be hitting at least 90% of the time. Let's say that that results in 4.5 volleys landing per second.
On our JHAS, let's see what our critical chance can be pumped up to.
2.50% - Base chance
4.00% - 2 Superior Romulan Operatives
0.76% - Tachyokinetic console
0.92% - Borg console
1.80% - Romulan zero point
8.00% - 5 vulnerability locater consoles
3.00% - Romulan reputation - Precision
5.00% - Attack Pattern Alpha with points in Attack Pattern skill
2.00% - [CrtH] weapon
Our total critical hit chance is 27.98%!!
4.5 shots in a second, multiplied by the critical chance of 27.98% means that you'll be landing 1.26 critical hits per second.
Sensor Targeting Assault provides that a crit has a 20% chance of placating the target. That's 1 in 5 crits placating the target. That means that, on average, 5 crits should result in a placate. If you're landing 1.26 crits per second then it will take 3.96 seconds to land a placating critical hit. In other words, every 4 seconds you will placate your target for 2 seconds.
I'm sorry, but this is just not right.
We all know that Sensor targeting Assault won't be changed. This means that we need to cap that maximum critical chance a ship can achieve to avoid this scenario from ever occurring. More importantly, it needs to be capped BEFORE any fleet can unlock the vulnerability exploiting consoles. If the consoles are unlocked and then the cap is introduced you'll have people crying that something has been taken away from them.
Cryptic, we all know that you favour escorts, but this could seriously break the game for sci ships and cruisers. Fighting an opponent you can't see for 50% of a fight is just unfair no matter which way you look at it. Please introduce a cap before these consoles are unlocked.
tl;dr - The new vulnerability console will allow escorts to placate their enemies for 50% of any given battle. The crit chance needs to be capped to prevent this from happening.
I've written about Sensor Targeting Assault in the past and how I believe it's a severely broken mechanic. The new vulnerability locater consoles are about to make everything worse.
Let's look at a JHAS with 4 DHCs and 3 turrets on the rear. DHCs fire 2 volleys every 4 seconds, including recharge time. Turrets fire 4 every 4 seconds. This means in any 4 seconds period there are 20 volleys that have a chance to critically hit. 20 in 4 seconds = 5 volleys per second. If an escort is firing on a cruiser or science ship and it's set up properly it's going to be hitting at least 90% of the time. Let's say that that results in 4.5 volleys landing per second.
On our JHAS, let's see what our critical chance can be pumped up to.
2.50% - Base chance
4.00% - 2 Superior Romulan Operatives
0.76% - Tachyokinetic console
0.92% - Borg console
1.80% - Romulan zero point
8.00% - 5 vulnerability locater consoles
3.00% - Romulan reputation - Precision
5.00% - Attack Pattern Alpha with points in Attack Pattern skill
2.00% - [CrtH] weapon
Our total critical hit chance is 27.98%!!
4.5 shots in a second, multiplied by the critical chance of 27.98% means that you'll be landing 1.26 critical hits per second.
Sensor Targeting Assault provides that a crit has a 20% chance of placating the target. That's 1 in 5 crits placating the target. That means that, on average, 5 crits should result in a placate. If you're landing 1.26 crits per second then it will take 3.96 seconds to land a placating critical hit. In other words, every 4 seconds you will placate your target for 2 seconds.
I'm sorry, but this is just not right.
We all know that Sensor targeting Assault won't be changed. This means that we need to cap that maximum critical chance a ship can achieve to avoid this scenario from ever occurring. More importantly, it needs to be capped BEFORE any fleet can unlock the vulnerability exploiting consoles. If the consoles are unlocked and then the cap is introduced you'll have people crying that something has been taken away from them.
Cryptic, we all know that you favour escorts, but this could seriously break the game for sci ships and cruisers. Fighting an opponent you can't see for 50% of a fight is just unfair no matter which way you look at it. Please introduce a cap before these consoles are unlocked.
tl;dr - The new vulnerability console will allow escorts to placate their enemies for 50% of any given battle. The crit chance needs to be capped to prevent this from happening.
Post edited by darramouss1 on
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This discussion has been closed.
Comments
Secondly, if we want to cap cries then what about CrtD? Should that be allowed to reach stupid levels too? Then what about spike damage, should that be capped?
Capping something always opens up a can of worms, besides its unlikely we will see the crit chance rise much further any time soon.
What's that? There's a 2 piece set that gives something like a 10% crit chance to photon torps? Well damn, someone call Cygone up, I think his intrepid build just got a whole lot more interesting.
It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
Has damage got out of control?
This is the last thing I will post.
Vin Naftero@playhard88 - FED Sciencie
K'tan@playhard88 - KDF Tactical
Argento@playhard88 - RRF Tactical (FED)
Now your total CrtH is at 35.48%
You probably also have 1.1% extra bonus defense over any other faction toon.
"Siri, does cryptic want its players to play anything other than a romulan?"
"Sorry, I could not find 'anything other than a romulan' in cryptics dictionary."
Elite Defense Stovokor
Did they remove the 12 second placate immunity?
no but there's a bug where you can get multiple placates when the immunity is not active. I'm not sure how it works, but yeah, one can get placated multiple times in a row without using the KHG shield or the doff.
NEVER!
Most MMos have a bigger critical chance rate for their dps. This is perfectly normal.
Also , PVP trying to break PVE again. I for one say No!
But I'm not worried just use a Feed Back Pulse, since they have put so much of their console space to Crit consoles instead of defenses it is easier to use their own firepower against them.
For the Placate proccing you are talking nonsense as well, the thing almost always placated after the 10 seconds immunity has passed, or the time restriction interval between procs, since every volley you pretty much always crit at least once, taht doesnt require you to have 25% CritH+ believe me.
On the other hand, why take the most depreciated cookie cutter 4x dhc/3x turret build which is so 2011.
Seriously I dont think you know what you are talking about.
Well Good luck anyway with another PvP fail thread, back to Dysing it up! Dont you guys love Dyson?
Hahahaha. I wish there was a Dyson Lover Accolade man oh man. We live to dyse! Best season yet! Moar PvP passive fun! We got content, what are you talking about? LOL.
This game is totally dead when it comes to PvP, there are luckily better PvP games to be played where schkill takes a much larger role rather then what consoles and abilities you spam at once.
Yay!
Does most other MMO also have a "Sensor Targeting Assault " passive which has a chance to placate your target for 2secs on a critical hit?
Elite Defense Stovokor
I bet if cryptic bumped all the NPC crth to 15% there'd be some bawling
PVpers often whine about good pve items to get them nerfed. Remember the Valdore console that used to be good? Pvp did it.
And now the critical chance? Sorry, but that's not happening on my watch!
This makes me laugh. When I level up a new toon I only add common or uncommon consoles to my ships and I don't spend any skill points yet I can complete all of PvE content and compete in STFs without breaking a sweat. If you need OP gear to play then either a) you must like to be able to complete PvE content by using only a single finger or b) you really suck at the game and desperately need it.
Dude... not cool. It's that kind of put down and elitism that shuns me, and I'm sure others away from pvp.
But seriously, I do both PVE and PVP. At the moment I spec out some of my builds for the maximum efficiency I can come up with in STFs.
Now last time I checked, I don't suck at the game, and I know I don't need to maximise certain ships for PVE but I do.
Thing is, I don't always do what Michael Caine does... the whole You're only supposed to blow the bloody doors off shabang
Fair call. I just get tired of people who care about their own little subsection of the game. Capping crit hit won't ruin PvE as PvE can't achieve the crit levels that the new consoles will bring out. Basically it will be business as normal. Capping crit will prevent PvP from being broken. People who care about their build/ship/piece of game to the expense of everyone else irritates me.
The valdore console had a decimal moved so it matched the tool tip which is what they originally intended. It was giving a whole order of magnitude more healing than it should. So instead of giving 200% healing for damage dealt it was giving 2000%. If it was only giving 20% they still would have changed it to 200%. Just because a bug benefits you doesn't mean it should be kept.
Also, that console is still good...
more and more crit chance is not needed
increase the Borgs hit points game wide by 400%
increase there shields by 800%
give the borg Cheese consoles and more abilitys
give them some defense !!!!!!!!! Acc weapons are not even needed to get almost 100% hit rates against them
Too the Dev team
Do a infected elite with your Dev team in a balenced group using all the top cheese and gear you have put in the game and make sure 2 or 3 of your team are Romulans with max crit chance
Increase the borg abilitys until you complete the STF with a few seconds on the clock for the optional
That would be balence
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
LoL... You needed the valdore console? really? in PvE? you must be a really horrible player.
To prove a point, just today, I took my sci ship into the middle of a large mob of Voth NPC's (1 battleship, 2 cruisers and a host of frigates). I activated 2 abilities... just 2, neither from a console. Warp Plamsa 1 and Sensor Scan. Guess what. They all died and I came out unscathed. The PvE in this game is so ridiculously easy that a partially trained monkey could play it w/o needing a crutch like pre-fix Valdore.
I normally try to avoid these types of I'm 'leet and you're not post, but I get really tired of people blaming PvP for "nerfs". If it wasn't breaking PvE it wouldn't have been fixed. 1 console was allowing people to beat No-Win and that's why it was nerfed. Same with Tric's, Double Tap BO, etc... People exploiting mechanics to wreck PvE is the only thing that makes Cryptic sit up and take a second look.
Say 11% CrtH and max 90% CrtD - This would be a step in the right direction for achieving this fun mythical TTK in PvP.
It feels like very soon, the role of a tactical will soon disappear just like the engineer in PvP did for a while if this major power creep continues.
Positives to caps:
Less chance of being 1 shot killed by an opponent.
FaW would be back to a comparatively reasonable level - would be pressure damage instead of constant Beam Overload 1 type damage being generated. FAW working without Crit right now seems to feel bearable but still needs a tone down. (Adrees the weapon power drain mechanic for beams but leave it so for engineers to make them more appealing???)
Less "Nerf this and that" threads would be created.
Negatives of Caps:
Reduced illusion of the "Captain Kirk" syndrome for the average / newcomer player to STO (That in itself would probably blow this thread out of the forum sadly and Devs wouldn't take notice of it)
You forgot to add the all important base damage being a lot lower comparatively as well.......
Makes a MAHOOSIVE difference.
My parrot pecking at the space bar can murder the current squads in game right now.
Joined the DPS 11K channel yet where the Elite PVER's hang out to get a balanced argument or is it because you really needed the broken Valdor console to actually survive against the weak mobs?
The problem with that argument is that these consoles are going to boost Scimitar spam even higher than it already is, and its clearly broken now.
with CRF vs 1 target, that valdor console will proc every 7 seconds, or less. mostly or less, ive never paced a gap longer then 7 seconds wile i was really shooting something. this console proc at the same rate as the cutting beam 2 part, so you can imagine how many procs trip over each other wile FAW or CSV is on. shield power, EPtS, a beam boat warbird basically doesn't need them with the valdor console.
Wasn't aware anyone was double tapping anything in PvE, not when you can APB spam it to death and everything nearby in the same amount of time if not less.
As for tricobalt mines, guess I imagined all the posts crying from PvPers that they were being dropped at spawns instapopping people.
Sure Cryptic only nerfed them when they saw what could be done with a co-ordinate team in PvE but the mines were never the problem, it was the stacking of buffs and debuffs as with anything and everything that gets nerfed in this bloody game.
In fact I seem to remember they started doing some little tweaks on the mines because of the crying in PvP, then they saw the video and got the sledgehammer out and made them quite meh.
It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
Has damage got out of control?
This is the last thing I will post.
Really what's wrong here is your picking on one part of the PVP mechanics and not talking about a reasonable solution.
FOR EXAMPLE
Just maybe we all need to bug Cryptic into breaking PVP out from the PVE rules.
PVP will never be fixed until we get our own skill tree and PVP rules.
99.9% of all players in this game just do PVE and thats their market.
I would love to see a PVP Q where it disables DOFFs and UNI consoles.
It would be like the old days of PVP when we duked it out, and cried when we got hit by JAM Strawberry or Grape.
So for PVP to truly get fixed Cryptic needs to stop trying to balance out PVE with PVP.
Let PVE players have their fun and enable PVP with its own skill tree and rules.
I would love to see a separate skill tree... of course, I also remember that it took almost 18 months to fix some (some still aren't fixed, mainly shield stripping powers) sci abilities after they introduced the last new skill tree. You see, they rebalanced those abilities at the same time, but the guy doing that didn't factor in the new resists and was no longer at Cryptic by the time the whole thing went live. So we ended up with a multitude of completely ineffective (in PvP, NPC's don't have resists) sci skills. In other words, the systems' team makes me nervous.
My name is Jellico
And i endorse this statement
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse