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Fleet Ships not in Ship Yards?
f8explorer
Member Posts: 1,328 Arc User
Special standard starships and fleet starships become unlocked as you progress through the main Spire track. These must be purchased using Fleet Credits, Fleet Modules and Military Personal Requisition Provisioning from your Starbase. Below are the starships that can be earned and at which Tier they become available:
Spire Tier 1
Spire Tier 2
Fleet Peghqu' Heavy Destroyer - KDF Only*
Fleet Chimera Heavy Destroyer - Starfleet Only*
Fleet Daeinos Heavy Destroyer - Romulan Republic Only*
*NOTE: The above Fleet Ships require that the player owns the existing non-fleet version of the Veteran Ships (1000 day veteran) to be able to purchase them.
Spire Tier 3
Fleet Kar'fi Battle Carrier - KDF Only
Fleet Caitian Atrox Carrier - Starfleet Only
Fleet Ar'Kif Tactical Warbird Retrofit - Romulan Republic Only
This gating of fleet ships into other holdings worries me and others I know as it hurts / impacts small fleets.
Anyone else feel concerned about these ships via holdings and not shipyards?
It feels like a bad precedence.
Small fleets have the grind on the shoulders of a few. They work hard to unlock things like shipyard tiers. And now we have fleet ships elsewhere?
Its like they are trying to force people to the new holding.
Toss in that KDF has been waiting for those fleet ships for a year and ROMs have few choices.
And then ... The newest FED ship went directly to the ship yard.
Thoughts and feelings?
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I don't see feds needing to even get T3 spire if there is nothing else added to it.
Oh come now, there's at least three people who want a fleet Atrox.
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It does seem odd that these new fleet shipa aren't in the shipyard, and I would much rather if they wanted to have the new fleet holding unlock something brand new (say give us a lockbox style ship for fleet modules rather than random chance or 800 lobi) but it doesn't bother me too much.
They do still need to look at fleet progression. Small fleets have trouble growing and large fleets actually have a bit of the oposite problem: I have had a hard time getting fleet credits because projects always seem to fill before I can get to them, and I am not the only one. I would totally donate to another fleet for credits if I could do it without leaving my current fleet.
It's hardly irrelevant. The majority of fleet ships still come from there.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
Up until now you might have thought, that once you finally reach T5 Military, you'll have access to all fleet ships, current and upcoming ones. But you won't be done - new ships are instead now gated behind another holding, forcing you in another grind to keep/gain the same level of access.
Same applies to equipment: The new cores are not added to the mine you just grinded up, instead you'll have to grind another holding for more of the same stuff you thought you'd have already build the mine development-track for.
Cryptic is shattering any thoughts of small -any- fleets to be done with something once they unlocked the highest tier. Instead they have to realize, that the grind to retain full access to any category of items will continue.
But maybe it's exactly this thought how cryptic wants to help small fleets with: If we can't ever be done, if we'll always be running behind progression - why bother at all?
If nothing else, its how we fear they see us.
U.S.S. Maelstrom, NCC-71417 (Constitution III-class/flagship) --- Fleet Admiral Hauk' --|-- Dahar Master Hauk --- I.K.S. qu'In 'an bortaS (D7-class / flagship)
If you want to put the vet ships in the spire that's alright, you wont be affecting as many people, and those should be harder to obtain anyway. But mainline ships should be mainline projects. Putting them behind an additional wall ... its like living with an alcoholic, what arbitrary kind of crazy do we get today?
Your statement is only true if small fleets just started very very recently.
It is a hit to small fleets, sure T3 spire is easier than T5 shipyard, but they have been working like crazy on T5 shipyard since season 6. Most are probably closer to T5 shipyard than T3 spire and then with season 9 a new set of ships get put out behind a new grind. They would be done with a yard by then certainly.
Member since December 2009
AW COME ON!
You want to link them to the Spire? Fine. Make those fleet ships require T1 Spire and T5 shipyard, and WE STILL BUY IT FROM THE SHIPYARD.
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Meanwhile, the fleet battlecruiser feds just got doesn't even require a t5 shipyard.
It only takes 2-3 months to finish an embassy, dilithium mine, or spire. Compare that to the Tier V shipyard, which can take 6 months to 2+ years.
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This plainly states the most obvious lack of fairness in the whole situation for non-feds, and folks like telbasta that are punished for flying the ships being released in S8.
You realized though that the shipyard work has been ongoing season 6. This means that instead of getting it done once for the ships it holds now you ahve to do it AND the future holdings because a small fleet probably has a good portion that wants the existing ships.
Like a previous poster your comment is only valid to fleets that started recently/now or after and only want access to 2 ships/their faction as opposed to the bulk of the fleet variants.
Maybe they did. Or maybe they simply haven't progressed very far. Why are you discounting them?
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
Not sure where you are going with this, but the argument implies the spire is cheaper than the shipyard so it is a benefit to small fleets. Valid only if the spire gave what the shipyard gives or the spire only offered what the fleet members want. Currently the spire is only a cheaper option IF you only want the ships the spire offers. If you have a split fleet you have to get both anyways on top of every future holding released will present a new fleet ship gate.
Well yeah of coarse. But they have to have some real reason for fleets to build each new holding. This is a good way to do that. I really don't see why people are getting all worked up about it.
If you want the new ships, put the work in. Don't act so entitled. And if you aren't interested in them why are you complaining?
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
Yes, im in a smal fleet, 190k on shipyard, in 60 days we will be finished (then the upgrade). I'm not happy with the new trent of Cryptic, what will be next ?
Lots of time cryptic give us what we want, and when they tell us how to get it it feels like a kick in the balls..
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Agreed .... vet ships and even fleet or special versions of some of the lockbox ships in the spire tiers would be great.
But standard fleet ships? ... ship yards.
U.S.S. Maelstrom, NCC-71417 (Constitution III-class/flagship) --- Fleet Admiral Hauk' --|-- Dahar Master Hauk --- I.K.S. qu'In 'an bortaS (D7-class / flagship)
Because instead of all the players of a fleet working to advance the same projects ... like shipyards ... Now they will be split among holdings trying to advance them in smaller groups just to unlock the ships they want because they are NOT all in the same place.
At least with the shipyards, we knew that we could advance through those tiers and it benefited all.
This divides the efforts and wants of the players.
U.S.S. Maelstrom, NCC-71417 (Constitution III-class/flagship) --- Fleet Admiral Hauk' --|-- Dahar Master Hauk --- I.K.S. qu'In 'an bortaS (D7-class / flagship)
So you're gonna have to wait a bit longer. Oh well.
And if the leader of the fleet feels strongly enough about it, they could just not slot one of them until the other is completed.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
So the only reason to build fleet holdings are ships? Interesting thought.
There's the problem: These are not new ships. These are tiny upgrades for existing ships that have been demanded for ages and were now put behind a huge paywall without any reason. Unless you can explain to my why you need ancient relics of an advanced civilization to build Romulan, Federation, Klingon, Caitian and Fek'lhr ships that are as powerful as what a normal starbase shipyard can put out. And people who are not interested in them are complaining because of the precedent it sets. Because maybe the ship they want will be attached to something even stupider. Maybe you will be able to build a fleet D'kyr in a conquered Borg node. Or a fleet Galaxy-X in a Megas-Turian embassy. If Cryptic wants to attach ships to the Dyson sphere holding they should be related to the Dyson Sphere. Meaning new ship designs either by the ancient civilization who built it, or augmented with their tech.
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
Don't think I did say that actually.
That's all a matter of opinion.
And no I don't know why you would need a dyson sphere to make those "Upgrades,"
but then I haven't played any of this content yet.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
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Not acting entitled. 12th fleet has a couple hundred and will be through it fast enough. However I know horse TRIBBLE when I see it. The game can go this direction if it likes, that is not for debate, its not our game. Its just that it shouldn't go this way so that smaller tight knit groups aren't sacraficed. Sometimes I wish I had our old fleet of 20-30, but the fleet advancement system caused us to disband. I enjoy the economy of scale to meet the grind fest, but I log in less and play shorter periods because of the growing boredom.
Personally the trade off is to avoid the new stuff and be less competitive in PvP, then I will be done with STO. Now if the traits and gear for PvE grinds could not be used in PvP that would be one thing. But this is getting sillier and sillier and it is hurting the small groups that contribute to the PvP population. More gutting and more slimming down of the interested community.
We have to take care of each other, the bigs need to stop crapping on the smalls and fight for their existence. I figure there are far more players in small fleets than in large fleets, and if we can't sustain those groups we stand to lose significant players and that will hurt us all.
Be a team player and fight for all types of play, not just yours.
For me i would struggle because I like to complete things and be self sufficient. A lot of people are like that, they want to do it for themselves. The tipping point is when those people find what they want somewhere else. STO is not in a vacuum and all this "Deal with it attitude" works in life, but not in games, games is where we come to escape and recreate. It is a place of enjoyment. Not saying it should be a hand out either, but it needs to be obtainable for all in teh timeframe between releases. If small fleets are falling farther behind then something needs an adjustment.
I am a star trek fan. I am here for Star Trek. I have no other MMOs, but I hve other games I play. As STO gets more and more grindy (imagine how this would look to a new player) it will lose appeal and it will collapse in its own weight.
I believe what is best for the small fleets, new players, and altoholics (love that term by the way) is best for the longevity of the game.