I really did. Then the folks who came back to the game via LoR who used to pvp have decided to stop pvp'ing because its nothing more than a massive bad joke.
Just had TEN arena matches in a row... TEN. The pugs i was in faced off against teams with healers, teams with bug ships, teams with healers AND bug ships. All the way through those ten matches about half of the folks said that was their last pvp match, as far as they are concerned cryptic can remove pvp entirely.
...and now im one of them. There is no point to joining those arena queues anymore. No point at all. The fresh blood which came in with LoR has mostly been scared away with premades, instawin lockbox ships and spam.
Ohhhhh...and please spare me the rhetoric of "well folks should make their own premades with friends!" or "folks should join the opvp channel"
Most of the folks in those pug matches i came across was fleetless casual players which is this games LIFE BLOOD. Scare of that type of gamer from PVP and you'll kill off any chance of new folks getting into the arenas.
As for the OPVP channel... yeah join it, ya get good build tips there at least.
Well done premades, p2w console and lockbox kiddies, way to go to start the process of driving that final big effing nail into the coffin on PVP. I played my last arena/cnh match today, im never going back in.
Cryptic, just remove pvp and get it over with.
"You know when that shark bites, with its teeth dear... scarlet billows start to spread..."
Understandable reaction on your part, and hopefully people like you come back IF things ever get better.
For some odd reason, and all this is subjective observation on my part, the number of fleetmades/premades/pugmades in FvF, at least, has shot up immensely since LoR came out. Now, while this may be a good thing in that there is more organisation going on, it also means that casual players are getting squeezed out.
I'm not saying that PvP should cater to the casual player as a whole. I'm just saying that there should be some method by which casual players can have some fun away from more competitive players. Yes, I know teamwork is great to have and is something people should work towards, but there should be some space for those who just want to jump in for 15 minutes, no-fuss, and just indulge in mindless ship combat mayhem.
I show up fairly regularly in OPvP, and it's a great place to chat, speculate and theorycraft. However, I find myself being less-and-less inclined to actually PvP. If I do, it's usually because I have PvP dailies to complete, or just popping into Kerrat.
Actually, I would think that Kerrat-style warzones would be the perfect environment for the casual player, if it wasn't so bugged and unevenly distributed. Anyone can just jump in or jump out at a moment's notice, and dive into a huge furball.
if they ever make proper pvp camps like we did dynaverse you will be back. was fun times old frind hope u stay in opvp and consider joining an odd big 10v10 or other event. good luck in game and out, u will be missed
Just had TEN arena matches in a row... TEN. The pugs i was in faced off against teams with healers, teams with bug ships, teams with healers AND bug ships. All the way through those ten matches about half of the folks said that was their last pvp match, as far as they are concerned cryptic can remove pvp entirely.
So you're complaining that teams you played against had healers? Maybe people should only run Tacs? Bug ships are good escorts, but they are not necessarily the best any more with the Rommies. If you are tired of getting rolled by teams with healers, maybe you should make a healer and help keep your teammates alive or come up with a strategy that can negate the effects of healers (they do exist).
PvP is not some brainless monotonous grind like PvE. Teammates heal each other. They coordinate attacks. Strategies are constantly evolving. New teams are forming. And if you don't want to get rolled by premades you should consider teaming up with friends-- that is, afterall, how premades are formed (the shame).
I'm not a fan of the "blame the players, not the game-makers" mentality.
PvP has been driving players away for a long time. If it isn't premades, it's some new piece of equipment that is too powerful, or a new duty officer that changes everything, etc etc.
Most premade teams are pugmade (associated players who are playing together, but not in any formal sense of team makeup or strategy), but against a pug, are still very effective. People form these pugmade groups in the hopes of facing another pugmade group. Killing random pug groups isn't fun at all, provides no challenge, and holds no interest. Most pugmades want it over as quickly as possible as not to waste the puggers time, or their time (though more often than not, the pug team will go into "hide and seek" mode and drag the match out).
But the truth is, one of these skilled premade and pugmade players will completely dominate even a pug vs pug match, and people will still complain about the game not being fun so long as they're around.
Being good at PvP recently comes with loathing from casual PvP players who feel that they shouldn't have to face the good players in the first place. What makes it worse is that the rage is directed towards the better PvP players, instead of the company who has done nothing to remedy the problem.
Don't shun the premade teams, thank them. They've done more to try and keep PvP alive than Cryptic or anyone else ever has.
I really did. Then the folks who came back to the game via LoR who used to pvp have decided to stop pvp'ing because its nothing more than a massive bad joke.
Just had TEN arena matches in a row... TEN. The pugs i was in faced off against teams with healers, teams with bug ships, teams with healers AND bug ships. All the way through those ten matches about half of the folks said that was their last pvp match, as far as they are concerned cryptic can remove pvp entirely.
...and now im one of them. There is no point to joining those arena queues anymore. No point at all. The fresh blood which came in with LoR has mostly been scared away with premades, instawin lockbox ships and spam.
Ohhhhh...and please spare me the rhetoric of "well folks should make their own premades with friends!" or "folks should join the opvp channel"
Most of the folks in those pug matches i came across was fleetless casual players which is this games LIFE BLOOD. Scare of that type of gamer from PVP and you'll kill off any chance of new folks getting into the arenas.
As for the OPVP channel... yeah join it, ya get good build tips there at least.
Well done premades, p2w console and lockbox kiddies, way to go to start the process of driving that final big effing nail into the coffin on PVP. I played my last arena/cnh match today, im never going back in.
Cryptic, just remove pvp and get it over with.
so after the.... well say third match.
why didnt you create your own team? i mean... yeah sure. one or 2 i could understand. but ten matches where you didnt make youre own team?
you cant complain about it then.
youre part of the problem, not the premade.
cryptic has killed pvp a long time ago, the community and "evil premades" are all thats left that keep it going.
so how dare those other evil people play with their friends. how dare they!
Casual player posts complaining about elitists ruining his PvP game play experience as it is unlikely for a player who stands absolutely no chance of winning a competitive game option to actually enjoy it.
Elitists flame him with L2P responses then wonder why PvP gets low player participation which leads to low dev prioritization.
The correct answer is they need a better matchmaking system, this actually applies to the PvE potion of the queues as well to an extent. But at the end of the day a PvP game will either thrive or strangle itself depending upon the quality of the matchmaking.
I know this might be an insane idea, but how about implementing PvP queues that don't allow teams to go in already pre formed. It'd be a situation where you'd never know who you're teaming up with. This doesn't mean getting rid of the old maps though.
I know this might be an insane idea, but how about implementing PvP queues that don't allow teams to go in already pre formed. It'd be a situation where you'd never know who you're teaming up with. This doesn't mean getting rid of the old maps though.
Seconded.
When I've been into the queues with fleetmates recently, it's just been a slaughter. Which is (or should be) no fun for either side. PUGs, I've been lolstomped by premades but also had some decent battles.
This is a simple option which gives the casual player somewhere to go without having to face the most elite aspects of PVP. That can only help PVP, and therefore the game, as a whole.
I also did a Arena run a few days ago and when I got in a group with a leader or someone calling out targets, things went real good. We lost some but they were real close. Some rounds were just stupid. 3 Sci captians spamming Photonic fleet and Elite Danubes. throwing Perma-TSS on 2 Bugs. Some of the team just warped out. When I attempted F vs K 2 times, in both instances they immediately went to the spawn and began camping. One round I did not respawn because the second I did I had 5 ships shooting at me.
When the rest of the team did the same the Klingons talked smack in chat then warped out because the match would never end because we would not respawn. (That was kind of funny)
When I was able to get in a match with 2 teams with a good mix of Sci, Cruisers and Escorts it was fun and evenly matched with kills on both sides and close to the end. When I got in a match with a premade its was pointless to even stay in the match.
Seems like the answer is to have seperate queues. One for people that are teamed up and one for Solo.
But I know the way around that is to get 5 people on teamspeak and all queue up at the same time. That way they could roll pugs and pound thier chests and think themselves awesome. Prob because they are afraid to take on the other premades. Seems like there are certian combinations of Ships and consoles and spam that just ruin PVP when used. like when you have immortal escourts that can kill within seconds and can withstand the focus fire of an entire team and never have shields below %99. I understand the OP's frustration. If we had a "PUG ONLY" arena then I think many more people would do it. Might be as popular as STF's
Teams should be allowed to que in the public ques... but no more then 3 on a team should be able to que....
To be honest I would agree with lots of the new kids... if you have 5 or even 4 people teamed up ready to fight... use opvp for what its intended for and find a match.
The random nature of pugs can be fun... but ya 4-5 man teams on either side against a team that was 100% random draw... is never going to be any fun for anyone.
PvP is for people with dedication, and it is good.
I played 3 top MMO since 2004, and each of them had same thing; gear, skill and timings.
Study numbers, learn mechanics, perfect your build, get gear. It is about learning and execution.
PvP is fun for people who puts time and effort in perfection to kill another people and it feels good.
IMHO pvp should be like this, its not a fairytale for casuals, it is dark and cruel place where humans kill humans.
PvPers have fun in it, i had a lot of laughts when i havent properly executed my attack or enemy failed to do same or i got locked to death because of my stupidity to stay longer than i had to, when few guys hunt each other and have a good time "smack talking" or when i got a kill and then destroyed but i got"that guy" or wining against all odds or heroic 15-14 win or lose 13-15, that feel is priceless.
It is all not serious, it is all fun but requires dedication.
p.s. if STO had Open PvP where you can ambush in sector space, capital world invasions and sector control... well STO of my dreams. Chaos is a ladder!
I was about to sign on and run a few STFs. Now I'm headed to the cap and splode. Fun times.
__________________________________
STO Forum member since before February 2010. STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
Starfleet Dental runs comedy fits in the queues, pilots those comedy fits on the basis of whoever thought they were signing up for an STF and still manages to give a good account of itself. We also often run the queues with only one or two of us and the rest randomly selected.
I think it sounds like a lot of you are doing it wrong.
I'm not even making this up, when I pug in KvF, my feddie teammates usually just throw their arms in the air when they see HOBO for instance.
I can understand why they'd do that. It's annoying having to chase down folks who think running away is the same thing as being good at PvP.
I understand perfectly where the OP and others are coming from, but I don't think 5 buddies/fleetmates should be prohibited from joining the queues together and the system should definitely not force them to play on different teams.
Public PvP queues, like any other type of public queue, work like this:
Whether it's ground or space, sometimes you just get bad luck and end up in the queues while there's a really good team or a pugmade that gels well there, and they win and pretty conclusively. Sometimes you queue and you get 5 ok players V 5 ok players, sometimes you get 5 ok players V 5 terrible players (or at least a terrible team), sometimes you get 5 decent players V 2 extra good and 3 terrible players. Sometimes you get spam insanity, sometimes no-one is even using mines, sometimes you get 3 afkers and someone has to volunteer to sit out, sometimes you get 2 afkers on the same team and no-one notices for the first 3 or 4 kills. Sometimes you get 10 of the same thing in a row, sometimes it changes from match to match.
Sure, some of those are more annoying or less fun than others, but I have to admit I kinda like the randomness of it all. It's certainly better than knowing that first we hit the tac cube, then there's a popup, I either take the probes or I take out two of these, then a cube appears, then if I pop buff x, y and z with debuff a, and fire this.... (you all know how the story ends). I think it's also generally true to say that 5 very good players will always look like a premade against 5 not very good players, just like 1 or 2 very good players can carry 3 or 4 very bad ones through an stf. So sometimes, it might look like a pre/pugmade, when actually it's just a coincidence - although 10 matches in a row would be pushing 'coincidence' to it's outer limits, I'll give you that.
Not sure if a 'Really-quite-good-actually/Not-so-good-at PvP' type queue system (basically Elite/Normal) would work though, as not only are there are many players who have an unjustified sense of their own awesomeness (that is a general comment and is NOT directed at anyone in particular), but there are also probably going to be groups out there who actually enjoy pug stomping.....
Something could be done, but not sure what. I still enjoy PvP even when my team is roflstomped and if there is good synergy/teamwork on the part of the opposing team, or I have been impressed by a particular player, I say so. I ain't all that anyway and being good at PvP is not an easy thing to accomplish.
I do empathize with the OP though, as being dead before or shortly after you fire off your first buff is not a good learning environment. It's also not very good for those who want something a bit different from the mindnumbing-gameleavingly easy/boring PvE content, but who don't necessarily want to or have the time to 'learn2play' and become PvP experts. That said, there is nothing to stop people from sending a tell after a match and asking for advice. The worst that will happen is that they refuse, and if they're not nice about it, you can always add them to your ignore list.
"So my fun is wrong?"
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
I like pvp how it is, I guess I had my time learning on kdf side when you get stomped in fed side. however I like grinding more than pvp so I don't do that so often, but yeah pvp is fine how it is for me, fight fire with fire.
Say the word, it saves the world. CUUCUUMBEER!"-With slight partigen with it." Proud member or DPS-800"-We kill dem mines with our scitter turrets."
I really did. Then the folks who came back to the game via LoR who used to pvp have decided to stop pvp'ing because its nothing more than a massive bad joke.
Just had TEN arena matches in a row... TEN. The pugs i was in faced off against teams with healers, teams with bug ships, teams with healers AND bug ships. All the way through those ten matches about half of the folks said that was their last pvp match, as far as they are concerned cryptic can remove pvp entirely.
...and now im one of them. There is no point to joining those arena queues anymore. No point at all. The fresh blood which came in with LoR has mostly been scared away with premades, instawin lockbox ships and spam.
Ohhhhh...and please spare me the rhetoric of "well folks should make their own premades with friends!" or "folks should join the opvp channel"
Most of the folks in those pug matches i came across was fleetless casual players which is this games LIFE BLOOD. Scare of that type of gamer from PVP and you'll kill off any chance of new folks getting into the arenas.
As for the OPVP channel... yeah join it, ya get good build tips there at least.
Well done premades, p2w console and lockbox kiddies, way to go to start the process of driving that final big effing nail into the coffin on PVP. I played my last arena/cnh match today, im never going back in.
Cryptic, just remove pvp and get it over with.
IMHO PvP has been a horrible joke for a long time in STO and I am not even talking LOLGround.
I still do it for the Lawls and to enjoy the OPNess of some ships but yeah... I cannot blame anyone for saying NO to our current PvP environment.
I'm rapidly going off PvP right now (and the game for that matter).
The reason is really down to cryptic but partly down to the players.
The old addage goes 'Ignoring a crime is just as bad as committing it'.
Its so bad that even the group I used to join have all but given up now.
That is how bad its getting with cheese, spam and P2W 'I win' consoles.
He with the biggest wallet wins.
Before people start flaming (which has already started anyway), FEDs, take away your p2w consoles, ships and broken doffs then try it, even better, go in as a pug in that format.
There are three basic PVP modes that I see working here
Open Warfare Zones -- These are in-RP combat zones. You should be able to enter from sector space, or select an instance and join in. If you have a team that's awesome, if you are solo that's awesome, its just red vs blue anyway so whatever. Ker'rat is close to this, except it breaks the RP part (Fed and KDF vs Borg), and the PVE loot drops make it a sucker zone. Delete Ker'rat, move the combat to contested starbases in the neutral zones, and turn off loot drops.
Objective-based Zones -- This covers objective-based combat modes like Arena, Capture the Flag, Free-for-All, etc. You join a queue, get assigned to a team randomly (in FFA this is a one-man team), and you fight the opposing team(s) in pursuit of the objective(s). The purpose of these maps is to scratch an immediate-gratification itch or to grind for some kind of points. Objective-based gaming is out-of-roleplay by definition, therefore faction alignment is irrelevant. No NPCs on these maps.
Challenge Matches -- Any of the objective-based zones should also be available for use as private challenge matches. This allows for 1v1 combat, fleet warfare, ladders, and so forth.
There are a lot of balance problems that have to be sorted out too, but this would address most of the basic gameplay problems. The game has the mechanics in place for most of this already, and it really just needs some restructuring and reordering.
Merge the queues (FvF, KvK, FvK -> RvB), split the queues (PUG, Teams).
VD, you're an idiot. You better not report me for calling you an idiot either. I'll know.
Ahem, no - I didn't have a psychotic breakdown - I'm just trying to make myself laugh a little. It didn't work though...meh.
In all seriousness, though - my suggestion there is pretty much fail. It might curb the issue, but it won't prevent the issue. This isn't the first game to face the issue nor will it be the last to face the issue.
Say they merge the queues and split the queues...fixed, right? Like I said, nope.
...on teamspeak/whatever voice server...
"Okay, guys...3...2...1...queue!"
That tends to be the foil of most split queue systems...synchronized queuing.
The smaller the pool of players, the easier it is to game that system. STO doesn't have that large a pool of PvP players.
Otherwise, they could attempt to overqueue the system - taking 20-30+ folks in, randomizing it, and then dropping out the teams. STO just doesn't have that many folks participating.
So a merge/split would be rather pointless...
...and speaking of pointless, I'm not sure any of it matters with the ARC garbage that's coming.
I just hate how the queues work. If I want to pug with a healing cruiser...somehow the queue sets me up with an all healing team..and if I'm on my tacscort, the queue sets me up with an all tacscort team. It does that all the freaking time.
Comments
For some odd reason, and all this is subjective observation on my part, the number of fleetmades/premades/pugmades in FvF, at least, has shot up immensely since LoR came out. Now, while this may be a good thing in that there is more organisation going on, it also means that casual players are getting squeezed out.
I'm not saying that PvP should cater to the casual player as a whole. I'm just saying that there should be some method by which casual players can have some fun away from more competitive players. Yes, I know teamwork is great to have and is something people should work towards, but there should be some space for those who just want to jump in for 15 minutes, no-fuss, and just indulge in mindless ship combat mayhem.
I show up fairly regularly in OPvP, and it's a great place to chat, speculate and theorycraft. However, I find myself being less-and-less inclined to actually PvP. If I do, it's usually because I have PvP dailies to complete, or just popping into Kerrat.
Actually, I would think that Kerrat-style warzones would be the perfect environment for the casual player, if it wasn't so bugged and unevenly distributed. Anyone can just jump in or jump out at a moment's notice, and dive into a huge furball.
ggs
So you're complaining that teams you played against had healers? Maybe people should only run Tacs? Bug ships are good escorts, but they are not necessarily the best any more with the Rommies. If you are tired of getting rolled by teams with healers, maybe you should make a healer and help keep your teammates alive or come up with a strategy that can negate the effects of healers (they do exist).
PvP is not some brainless monotonous grind like PvE. Teammates heal each other. They coordinate attacks. Strategies are constantly evolving. New teams are forming. And if you don't want to get rolled by premades you should consider teaming up with friends-- that is, afterall, how premades are formed (the shame).
@DevolvedOne
PvP has been driving players away for a long time. If it isn't premades, it's some new piece of equipment that is too powerful, or a new duty officer that changes everything, etc etc.
Most premade teams are pugmade (associated players who are playing together, but not in any formal sense of team makeup or strategy), but against a pug, are still very effective. People form these pugmade groups in the hopes of facing another pugmade group. Killing random pug groups isn't fun at all, provides no challenge, and holds no interest. Most pugmades want it over as quickly as possible as not to waste the puggers time, or their time (though more often than not, the pug team will go into "hide and seek" mode and drag the match out).
But the truth is, one of these skilled premade and pugmade players will completely dominate even a pug vs pug match, and people will still complain about the game not being fun so long as they're around.
Being good at PvP recently comes with loathing from casual PvP players who feel that they shouldn't have to face the good players in the first place. What makes it worse is that the rage is directed towards the better PvP players, instead of the company who has done nothing to remedy the problem.
Don't shun the premade teams, thank them. They've done more to try and keep PvP alive than Cryptic or anyone else ever has.
Lag Industries STO/TOR Guild
so after the.... well say third match.
why didnt you create your own team? i mean... yeah sure. one or 2 i could understand. but ten matches where you didnt make youre own team?
you cant complain about it then.
youre part of the problem, not the premade.
cryptic has killed pvp a long time ago, the community and "evil premades" are all thats left that keep it going.
so how dare those other evil people play with their friends. how dare they!
Do you even Science Bro?
http://www.infochachkie.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/obiwan.gif
Elitists flame him with L2P responses then wonder why PvP gets low player participation which leads to low dev prioritization.
The correct answer is they need a better matchmaking system, this actually applies to the PvE potion of the queues as well to an extent. But at the end of the day a PvP game will either thrive or strangle itself depending upon the quality of the matchmaking.
when was the last pvp update?
yes "implementing" is not possible.
Seconded.
When I've been into the queues with fleetmates recently, it's just been a slaughter. Which is (or should be) no fun for either side. PUGs, I've been lolstomped by premades but also had some decent battles.
This is a simple option which gives the casual player somewhere to go without having to face the most elite aspects of PVP. That can only help PVP, and therefore the game, as a whole.
if you want to fight as a group, find another group to fight. roflstomping groups of random newbies just pisses people off.
When the rest of the team did the same the Klingons talked smack in chat then warped out because the match would never end because we would not respawn. (That was kind of funny)
When I was able to get in a match with 2 teams with a good mix of Sci, Cruisers and Escorts it was fun and evenly matched with kills on both sides and close to the end. When I got in a match with a premade its was pointless to even stay in the match.
Seems like the answer is to have seperate queues. One for people that are teamed up and one for Solo.
But I know the way around that is to get 5 people on teamspeak and all queue up at the same time. That way they could roll pugs and pound thier chests and think themselves awesome. Prob because they are afraid to take on the other premades. Seems like there are certian combinations of Ships and consoles and spam that just ruin PVP when used. like when you have immortal escourts that can kill within seconds and can withstand the focus fire of an entire team and never have shields below %99. I understand the OP's frustration. If we had a "PUG ONLY" arena then I think many more people would do it. Might be as popular as STF's
Teams should be allowed to que in the public ques... but no more then 3 on a team should be able to que....
To be honest I would agree with lots of the new kids... if you have 5 or even 4 people teamed up ready to fight... use opvp for what its intended for and find a match.
The random nature of pugs can be fun... but ya 4-5 man teams on either side against a team that was 100% random draw... is never going to be any fun for anyone.
I played 3 top MMO since 2004, and each of them had same thing; gear, skill and timings.
Study numbers, learn mechanics, perfect your build, get gear. It is about learning and execution.
PvP is fun for people who puts time and effort in perfection to kill another people and it feels good.
IMHO pvp should be like this, its not a fairytale for casuals, it is dark and cruel place where humans kill humans.
PvPers have fun in it, i had a lot of laughts when i havent properly executed my attack or enemy failed to do same or i got locked to death because of my stupidity to stay longer than i had to, when few guys hunt each other and have a good time "smack talking" or when i got a kill and then destroyed but i got"that guy" or wining against all odds or heroic 15-14 win or lose 13-15, that feel is priceless.
It is all not serious, it is all fun but requires dedication.
p.s. if STO had Open PvP where you can ambush in sector space, capital world invasions and sector control... well STO of my dreams. Chaos is a ladder!
STO Forum member since before February 2010.
STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link
I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
I think it sounds like a lot of you are doing it wrong.
I can understand why they'd do that. It's annoying having to chase down folks who think running away is the same thing as being good at PvP.
Though even running away doesn't always save them.
EDIT: Hey, just re-watched the first video; as a fun game, count the number of times certain people disconnect when they're in low hull.
Public PvP queues, like any other type of public queue, work like this:
Whether it's ground or space, sometimes you just get bad luck and end up in the queues while there's a really good team or a pugmade that gels well there, and they win and pretty conclusively. Sometimes you queue and you get 5 ok players V 5 ok players, sometimes you get 5 ok players V 5 terrible players (or at least a terrible team), sometimes you get 5 decent players V 2 extra good and 3 terrible players. Sometimes you get spam insanity, sometimes no-one is even using mines, sometimes you get 3 afkers and someone has to volunteer to sit out, sometimes you get 2 afkers on the same team and no-one notices for the first 3 or 4 kills. Sometimes you get 10 of the same thing in a row, sometimes it changes from match to match.
Sure, some of those are more annoying or less fun than others, but I have to admit I kinda like the randomness of it all. It's certainly better than knowing that first we hit the tac cube, then there's a popup, I either take the probes or I take out two of these, then a cube appears, then if I pop buff x, y and z with debuff a, and fire this.... (you all know how the story ends). I think it's also generally true to say that 5 very good players will always look like a premade against 5 not very good players, just like 1 or 2 very good players can carry 3 or 4 very bad ones through an stf. So sometimes, it might look like a pre/pugmade, when actually it's just a coincidence - although 10 matches in a row would be pushing 'coincidence' to it's outer limits, I'll give you that.
Not sure if a 'Really-quite-good-actually/Not-so-good-at PvP' type queue system (basically Elite/Normal) would work though, as not only are there are many players who have an unjustified sense of their own awesomeness (that is a general comment and is NOT directed at anyone in particular), but there are also probably going to be groups out there who actually enjoy pug stomping.....
Something could be done, but not sure what. I still enjoy PvP even when my team is roflstomped and if there is good synergy/teamwork on the part of the opposing team, or I have been impressed by a particular player, I say so. I ain't all that anyway and being good at PvP is not an easy thing to accomplish.
I do empathize with the OP though, as being dead before or shortly after you fire off your first buff is not a good learning environment. It's also not very good for those who want something a bit different from the mindnumbing-gameleavingly easy/boring PvE content, but who don't necessarily want to or have the time to 'learn2play' and become PvP experts. That said, there is nothing to stop people from sending a tell after a match and asking for advice. The worst that will happen is that they refuse, and if they're not nice about it, you can always add them to your ignore list.
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
CUUCUUMBEER! "-With slight partigen with it."
Proud member or DPS-800 "-We kill dem mines with our scitter turrets."
IMHO PvP has been a horrible joke for a long time in STO and I am not even talking LOLGround.
I still do it for the Lawls and to enjoy the OPNess of some ships but yeah... I cannot blame anyone for saying NO to our current PvP environment.
I'm rapidly going off PvP right now (and the game for that matter).
The reason is really down to cryptic but partly down to the players.
The old addage goes 'Ignoring a crime is just as bad as committing it'.
Its so bad that even the group I used to join have all but given up now.
That is how bad its getting with cheese, spam and P2W 'I win' consoles.
He with the biggest wallet wins.
Before people start flaming (which has already started anyway), FEDs, take away your p2w consoles, ships and broken doffs then try it, even better, go in as a pug in that format.
Open Warfare Zones -- These are in-RP combat zones. You should be able to enter from sector space, or select an instance and join in. If you have a team that's awesome, if you are solo that's awesome, its just red vs blue anyway so whatever. Ker'rat is close to this, except it breaks the RP part (Fed and KDF vs Borg), and the PVE loot drops make it a sucker zone. Delete Ker'rat, move the combat to contested starbases in the neutral zones, and turn off loot drops.
Objective-based Zones -- This covers objective-based combat modes like Arena, Capture the Flag, Free-for-All, etc. You join a queue, get assigned to a team randomly (in FFA this is a one-man team), and you fight the opposing team(s) in pursuit of the objective(s). The purpose of these maps is to scratch an immediate-gratification itch or to grind for some kind of points. Objective-based gaming is out-of-roleplay by definition, therefore faction alignment is irrelevant. No NPCs on these maps.
Challenge Matches -- Any of the objective-based zones should also be available for use as private challenge matches. This allows for 1v1 combat, fleet warfare, ladders, and so forth.
There are a lot of balance problems that have to be sorted out too, but this would address most of the basic gameplay problems. The game has the mechanics in place for most of this already, and it really just needs some restructuring and reordering.
VD, you're an idiot. You better not report me for calling you an idiot either. I'll know.
Ahem, no - I didn't have a psychotic breakdown - I'm just trying to make myself laugh a little. It didn't work though...meh.
In all seriousness, though - my suggestion there is pretty much fail. It might curb the issue, but it won't prevent the issue. This isn't the first game to face the issue nor will it be the last to face the issue.
Say they merge the queues and split the queues...fixed, right? Like I said, nope.
...on teamspeak/whatever voice server...
"Okay, guys...3...2...1...queue!"
That tends to be the foil of most split queue systems...synchronized queuing.
The smaller the pool of players, the easier it is to game that system. STO doesn't have that large a pool of PvP players.
Otherwise, they could attempt to overqueue the system - taking 20-30+ folks in, randomizing it, and then dropping out the teams. STO just doesn't have that many folks participating.
So a merge/split would be rather pointless...
...and speaking of pointless, I'm not sure any of it matters with the ARC garbage that's coming.
Hmm... Arc? You mean this? - Link
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
That's one of the threads discussing it, aye...