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DPS question on Bortas'qu
twam
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
So ehm, seeing as we have a ship sale, I wanted to get some more KDF ships.
Guramba I'm getting, for sure, but it turns out the only other T5 C-store ship I didn't have yet was the Bortas'qu. Now, I was wondering which would end up pulling more DPS in a eSTF/PvP context, the Tactical variant (with 5 tac consoles) or the Command version (with Sensor Analysis)?
Anyone got any decent figures/thought on that?
I dug up the dps-sheet from this thread: http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=6453001#post6453001
According to that spreadsheet the 5th tac console adds roughly 7% dps. Sensor Analysis makes for a damage resistance debuff of up to 33%, building up over either 60 or 90 seconds of unbroken engagement within 10km range (wiki is wrong btw, most certainly not over 10 minutes).
Sensor Analysis might also contribute to non-weapon damage (sci skills/EWP?)?
Does the debuff apply to team members too?
Turns out I have no idea how SA works, despite flying lots of sci ships...
Which do you guys think contributes more in an avarage engagement? And, consequently, which would be the better buy?
ps: I know, they also have different consoles, but I might well end up not using them anyway b/c of the long cooldowns, so might as well ignore those. Also not particularly interested in 3-pack, for same reason.
pps: I also know the turn rate on these things is terrible, but they are flexible-ish in layout and, frankly, I figure buying KDF ships is the only way to support further KDF development. I can always run it as a tank/healing beamboat/single cannon ship.
Guramba I'm getting, for sure, but it turns out the only other T5 C-store ship I didn't have yet was the Bortas'qu. Now, I was wondering which would end up pulling more DPS in a eSTF/PvP context, the Tactical variant (with 5 tac consoles) or the Command version (with Sensor Analysis)?
Anyone got any decent figures/thought on that?
I dug up the dps-sheet from this thread: http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=6453001#post6453001
According to that spreadsheet the 5th tac console adds roughly 7% dps. Sensor Analysis makes for a damage resistance debuff of up to 33%, building up over either 60 or 90 seconds of unbroken engagement within 10km range (wiki is wrong btw, most certainly not over 10 minutes).
Sensor Analysis might also contribute to non-weapon damage (sci skills/EWP?)?
Does the debuff apply to team members too?
Turns out I have no idea how SA works, despite flying lots of sci ships...
Which do you guys think contributes more in an avarage engagement? And, consequently, which would be the better buy?
ps: I know, they also have different consoles, but I might well end up not using them anyway b/c of the long cooldowns, so might as well ignore those. Also not particularly interested in 3-pack, for same reason.
pps: I also know the turn rate on these things is terrible, but they are flexible-ish in layout and, frankly, I figure buying KDF ships is the only way to support further KDF development. I can always run it as a tank/healing beamboat/single cannon ship.
Post edited by twam on
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Now, as to what would be better? My instincts point to the 5 tactical consoles. The reason I think this is because Sensor Analysis will likely clear once you switch targets. In PvE, how long does it really take you to kill something, especially if you're throwing an Attack Pattern Beta debuff onto it regularly as well? In STFs the gates usually don't take more than 2-3 minutes at most to kill with a competent team, and Donatra keeps cloaking.
So, you don't really get a lot of time to stack the debuff up to 33%, even if it only takes 5 minutes instead of 10. Whereas the boost from that 5th tactical console is there all the time, it doesn't go away. You can AoE DPS with it, something the Sensor Analysis won't do.
So, my conclusion is to go with the Tactical Bortas'qu if you're looking for DPS. The biggest reasons to switch between the Bortas'qu variants are the boff seatings and console layouts, imo. Also, against PvE the Tactical Bortas'qu Disruptor Autocannon would be rather effective, since PvE enemies are easier to hit/line up.
If i had it all to do over again, I'd skip the Bort and just go for the vorcha and negvar and..well...all the other cruisers. Love em all. Fleet Neg is my next purchase. K'tinga is great too. Really there's no "make or break" dps mark for these guys. STO isn't as cutthroat as some MMO's pve dps checks.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAAgaD-zbotq2By_2-8qqIg
I'll just put that there so that you can see I've played these critters. And actually have some neat vids up of them. Multiple ones of the Bortas.
If the bortas pet didn't die (even focus healing doesn't always do the trick, and shouldn't be needed in PVE), if the cooldown on the cannon was a bit shorter, or the "teleport" was actually useful, this would be a great set. As is, not so much. Vorcha and Neg and Ktinga are WELL worth the layout.
Also it helps in pvp as I want to front load all my damage rather then wait for SA.
My eng uses the command Bortasqu though, as it will take a little longer to kill targets anyway, so more time for SA to stack. Also it helps at taking out structures like gates and transformers since I usually have enough time for it to stack all the way up to 10. In pvp my eng can tank a lot so likes long drawn out fights, and can gradually wear the targets down after it stacks if they aren't dead already.
Overall either Tac or Command Bortasqu's are some of the best DPS ships in game due to its firepower and survivability if you are able to handle using DHC on them. The War Bortasqu is not far behind, but no reason to use it over the other 2 really.
Other cruisers Thissler mentioned are good overall and manuver better but don't pack the same punch the Bortasqu has or have the versatile boff layout it has. The Bortasqu is the only cruiser I can use and get into the super high DPS private matches where everyone is doing at least close to 10k and some doing way more, and feel welcome and invited quickly. I doubt you will get in to those kind of matches in other cruisers.
Excellent point, good one to keep in mind. Didn't consider that.
So you're basically saying "stick to the battlecruisers (and BoPs) you've got and wait for the C-store Neghvar? Because I did in fact forget about that one being mentioned. Might be awesome... And I'm nothing if not patient.
That's part of what I was thinking about too. I've got KDF captains in all 3 classes and fly them all frequently - though I suppose my sci's will stick to the B'rel and Ning'tao BoPs.
I should really see whether I can in fact manage that first, I guess. I only tend to fly ships with turn rates above 9, though I am perfectly comfy using DHC's on my Neghvars. I might dust off my Dreadnought to get a feeling for turn rate 5 ships using DHC's... *braces self* That's going to be brutal. Been flying my B'rel mostly, past weeks.
Hmm. Thanks so far guys, good stuff, much to think about before the ship sale ends. It wouldn't be such a tricky position if my Zen reserves hadn't built up so much and/or I would've turned out to prefer Romulans over pure KDF. Harshly confronted with the fact that the KDF needs new C-store ships :P
The only things you'll fight that will let sensor analysis catch up with an extra tac console are Gateways, Unimatrix ships, and the Crystalline Entity.
The Disruptor Autocannon rocks out loud. Nevermind how long it takes to cool down - when that sucker goes off you'll look and feel heroic, and your target will feel pain. Especially if you've buffed with attack pattern and DEM.
It's not a "science" ship. It's the Tyrannosaurus rex of battlecruisers. Treat it as such.
...Oh, baby, you know, I've really got to leave you / Oh, I can hear it callin 'me / I said don't you hear it callin' me the way it used to do?...
- Anne Bredon
It isn't too hard for me to manage with 2 RCS with the improvements to those consoles and impulse thrusters skill, also I have helmsman trait and run omega and tractor beam. I cant fit the 3 piece set in when I run 2 RCS, but I have tried removing them and using DHC with the 3 piece set and I can manage that too in STF since its mostly killing cubes and structures. I have also seen some people do high dps using some type of beam FAW build but am not really sure exactly how to do it with bortas if they are running aux2bat or not, but maybe you could try that or single cannons and turrets if DHC isn't for you.
Unlike marc8219 who I think runs DHCs, I run an A2B beamboat with mine. I don't think I could deal with the piloting to line up cannons. And if you're going for high pve dps, the autocannon is unfortunately garbage due to the long cooldown. I could see it possibly be more useful in pvp when you want all the spike you can get.