I'm an explorational gamer in general. I don't pay attention to numbers, care what powers I have, or how effective my build is.
That works really well for levels 1 to 49.
The things I care about, are what ship I'm flying (I love my Nova, but I outleveled it ),
You can get a fleet Nova and get back to that someday. I, however, can't get a fleet Exeter.
how effective I FEEL like I am. i.e. do I die a ton?
Well, I mean, playing on normal difficulty, I think you would have to walk away from the keyboard for about 20 minutes to either be logged off or maybe, just maybe, die?
But mostly, I care about exploring the space the devs of a game have made.
Exploration could use a revamp to get that exploration feel really going.
the system guys, that work on balance, really need to be pvping more.
The problem with that is the same problem facing KDF development. Not enough people PVP to justify the resource allocation, just like not enough people play the KDF.
For the first two seasons, those problems were linked together.
All Dev accounts probably have the silliest ship names you'll see ingame. :P
And tacofangs, same playstyle as me. Unless I have one of my hardcore periods and are determined to achieve some goal, then I'll start Crunch numbers and stuff.. (haven't done that since..)
the system guys, that work on balance, really need to be pvping more.
Are you seriously suggesting that Borticus... the guy who Mathed us in STOked... the one currently engaged in fixing problems that PvP players are bringing up... doesn't play the game? Doesn't PvP?
And didn't they have a Play with the Devs event awhile back? Were any of the systems guys in on that?
Dunno about Geko and not gonna argue with you there. I get the impression he's a PvE kind of guy... but then so am I.
I don't believe cruisers and beams are 'fine' either, and I'm not entirely sure I'd believe it even if Bort came in here and said they were 'fine'.
But I am willing to believe that they know more about the game's innards than I do and that they have a pretty good idea what the current direction is for STO and they're marching to that tune.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
I'm an explorational gamer in general. I don't pay attention to numbers, care what powers I have, or how effective my build is.
That works really well for levels 1 to 49.
Honestly? It's not all that bad for 50 either. There's basically nothing that isn't passable for STFs, even Elites, so long as you care juuust enough to stick to one energy type and acquire Mk XI blue gear. I personally don't pay any mind to effectively cycling powers for maximum tank or how to stack buffs for offensive oomph. My main is a beam 'scort, just to drive my point home. And the only reason I've even got purple Mk XII stuff is incidentally through STFs pre-Rep and having the excess Fleet Credits lying around to spring for the occasional Advanced weapon. The exception being my Mk XI MACO space and Mk XII ground sets - that I actually worked for.
Of course you'd get utterly destroyed in PvP if you tried to do it that way, but for Taco's style, which is quite similar to mine, that's kind of unimportant.
Are you seriously suggesting that Borticus... the guy who Mathed us in STOked... the one currently engaged in fixing problems that PvP players are bringing up... doesn't play the game? Doesn't PvP?
yes. theres no evidence that any of them pvp, and if they do, arent any good at it. ive seen bran flakes pvping fairly well, thats it. borticus knows the system very well, hes shown that over and over. but hes never going to know how to balance unless he gets a feel for it by actually pvping. it should basically be a job requirement to know the state of balance from the inside and out.
my guide, and others, on how to pvp well could easily be the first step for any of them to get the hang of pvping, its really not that hard once you learn the very basics. the channel opvp would LOVE to work with devs and teach them everything they need to know too.
if they were pvp'ers, and were aware of everything i went into detail about in my post, well, it wouldn't be as bad as it is now, things would have been done differently, pressure wouldn't have been so marginalized.
Not really. When it comes time for me to replay a mission I don't look at it with my 'player goggles' like I do for the first run through. Instead I put on my 'dev artist nit picky goggles' and find bugs, art that needs updating and what have you. Or maybe a second play through will spark a new idea or mechanic I could bring up with fellows devs for later projects down the road.
Very good, I must add I just play 1 KDF char it's handmade cardassian, just love that guy it exactly has a name and a BIO and thanks to my luck I bought a lock box with the Cardassian cruiser and updated it all against the Borg.
You gut to like that guy and anyone who played with me respected me with STF.
Ship had a good deal off power.
Recently I scored a dominion ship for him well also very good ship.
And sometimes I just not doing ST F's but pick one off the missions in the cryptic list so to speak and play them.
We have a small house of 25 members enjoying the game every step off the way.
Recently I do some missions on new Romulus I know this is very new but it's to typical grind build I must add, Could you say to make improvements on this world also to make it less grind and more fun ?
Well most players do love the game otherwise they wouldn't get angry if Dev's build another grind or make a story that doesn't add up with anything star trek.
Most players care for the game as much as the Dev's that build it.
What I love most is the build off the game but it certainly need improvement not only the maps and the environment but also weapons, tactics, builds like star bases, embassy's etc etc.
But I really like it when I hear Dev's come into the game testing various things with or without players to test stuff out. And make notes to come next day to office with a clear head and a book full with notes on what must be done in game.
Well who knows we see each other some time in game if you play KDF that is because I do not play PVP sorry ....
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"Coffee: the finest organic suspension ever devised. It's got me through the worst of the last three years. I beat the Borg with it."
There isn't much exploration to be done when you've built the world in the first place.
You guys are not the only ones building.
I know we may not be artistes and official devs, but we are building new worlds and environments to explore, often using the cryptic made props in unconventional ways. We are repurposing a lot of those props to make entirely new things.
Play my "Trojan Horse," for example.
On a different note:
If you explored that content, I predict the following would happen. You would say to yourself, "Wow, these folks are desperate for a flat primitive textured as a carpet... I can make that in 3 minutes and tell Zero how to find it in the library."
All Dev accounts probably have the silliest ship names you'll see ingame. :P
And tacofangs, same playstyle as me. Unless I have one of my hardcore periods and are determined to achieve some goal, then I'll start Crunch numbers and stuff.. (haven't done that since..)
I've been experimenting with Dragon builds just for the fun of doing something other than facerolling the keyboard.
its nice to see devs say they play the game and what not,
but to be honest you devs should play the game undercover
from scratch and grind all your stuff with out spending a single dime.
better off playing the game from a point of view of a free player.
i am not the type of person that saids anything about balance, but
its easy to not really see balance for those who are all tricked out
in gear that has no need to grind and has all the dev commands to cheat.
so thats why its better to just go undercover and play as a free user who
grinds like mad and doesnt play on alienware computer.
--
Merely giving my opinion
--
took a break from the game for the last 2 months but thought i give my opinion
on this. that is all.
I play a lot of STFs and fleet actions. I've been known to drop into PVP on rare occasions.
Lately I've been playing an alt with my S.O. and we've been taking notes about things that need polish in missions, then when I have spare time I sneak in and fix them.
I also grind all of my own dilithium and use the dilithium exchange to get Zen. I recently acquired the Vesta bundle using Zen that I purchased with dilithium (plus the lifetime member monthly stipend). This has gotten a bit easier since I reached T5 in both reputations!
I play a lot of STFs and fleet actions. I've been known to drop into PVP on rare occasions.
Lately I've been playing an alt with my S.O. and we've been taking notes about things that need polish in missions, then when I have spare time I sneak in and fix them.
I also grind all of my own dilithium and use the dilithium exchange to get Zen. I recently acquired the Vesta bundle using Zen that I purchased with dilithium (plus the lifetime member monthly stipend). This has gotten a bit easier since I reached T5 in both reputations!
on how many? I ihave both to, will have both on 2nd toon,and shortly after that 2 kdf will have 5. plus been doing tripple duty
I will have second toon omega done saturday Romulan 5 next week
however I would moving faster if xp was not drained
hmm i could get the vest to that way but i want to gear on all toon then i will get it
I also grind all of my own dilithium and use the dilithium exchange to get Zen. I recently acquired the Vesta bundle using Zen that I purchased with dilithium (plus the lifetime member monthly stipend). This has gotten a bit easier since I reached T5 in both reputations!
Shhh, don't let the devs know we get ships without paying a dime!
I play a lot of STFs and fleet actions. I've been known to drop into PVP on rare occasions.
Lately I've been playing an alt with my S.O. and we've been taking notes about things that need polish in missions, then when I have spare time I sneak in and fix them.
I also grind all of my own dilithium and use the dilithium exchange to get Zen. I recently acquired the Vesta bundle using Zen that I purchased with dilithium (plus the lifetime member monthly stipend). This has gotten a bit easier since I reached T5 in both reputations!
Sounds cool. I think point some people are trying to find in the dark without a flashlight is lots of messages state "see you in-game". The thing is they don't understand is yes you do play but are they going to know its a dev. The answer would be know because I am assuming when you do get onto play you wanna enjoy what you work on without someone asking you when xyz is going to be fixed, done, etc.
its nice to see devs say they play the game and what not,
but to be honest you devs should play the game undercover
from scratch and grind all your stuff with out spending a single dime.
better off playing the game from a point of view of a free player.
i am not the type of person that saids anything about balance, but
its easy to not really see balance for those who are all tricked out
in gear that has no need to grind and has all the dev commands to cheat.
so thats why its better to just go undercover and play as a free user who
grinds like mad and doesnt play on alienware computer.
--
Merely giving my opinion
--
took a break from the game for the last 2 months but thought i give my opinion
on this. that is all.
You don't need an alienware computer to play a several years old MMO. If you play STO in mdedium quality, or even high, you don't need as much.
And devs do the grind part from scratch. They have a dev account with everything on it, including super power you will never have, but it's only for special event and testing. While they have the same account than you or me, just with a LTS. They can't use dev power to increase whatever, or unlock ships.
The same is true for every MMO. Remember the big drama around eve when a GM used his "power" to add some stuff for his fleet ? He was fired. And it was relatively minor, some blueprint for ammos.
to even remotely attempting to reconcile what STO is with what Star Trek itself is?
I will insert canned response:
"But it's a MMO!"
Personally, if I were in the position, I'm not really sure how I would justify the difference, other than pointing to certain dev and Foundry missions which feel like Star Trek.
I Recall a time when there was a Dev who actively PVPed. The name unfortunately escapes me. But I recall when we would usually go on tribble in Ker'rat and actually show him how things worked, and he even got really good. But then left.
I am wondering if Zero still desires PVP. I know there was a point when she did.
Other then that.. who knows? I will say I am most curious about DStahl himself when it comes to the PVP part of the game. Because I'm sure that Developers do play the game. But PVP.. well that's a different matter..
You think that your beta test was bad?
Think about this: American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
It's not really a case of whether they play or not. They could play, but still be too close to the situation to see things that people that are not as close are able to see. How many folks go through that when working on anything - need to step back - have somebody else look at it, etc, etc, etc...
You say that like you think an MMO could survive in any meaningful capacity on nothing but morality tales and dialog with the occasional pew pew.
STO already has more non-combat or incidental combat missions than any MMO I've ever heard of. While I don't disagree with the idea they could try to write them to be more compelling, it's downright foolish to think a story-heavy MMO written exclusively into Trek-like scenarios would be anything other than a colossal waste of money for the folks developing it.
In other words, "It's an MMO" is a wholly valid response. What you and a lot of other Foundry authors seem to want is a heavily moddable single player game ala TES or NWN. STO can certainly begin to approach that via the efforts and you and your ilk in the Foundry, but you simply have to accept that by its very nature, it will never live up to your standards as a vehicle for great storytelling.
yes. theres no evidence that any of them pvp, and if they do, arent any good at it. ive seen bran flakes pvping fairly well, thats it. borticus knows the system very well, hes shown that over and over. but hes never going to know how to balance unless he gets a feel for it by actually pvping. it should basically be a job requirement to know the state of balance from the inside and out.
my guide, and others, on how to pvp well could easily be the first step for any of them to get the hang of pvping, its really not that hard once you learn the very basics. the channel opvp would LOVE to work with devs and teach them everything they need to know too.
if they were pvp'ers, and were aware of everything i went into detail about in my post, well, it wouldn't be as bad as it is now, things would have been done differently, pressure wouldn't have been so marginalized.
Sorry mate they don't need to PvP to understand balance. I've been complaining about the inbalance with beams long before the PvP crowd ever began too and guess what. Offensive power was increased with this season by more than defensive power was. I mostly had the PvP crowd arguing with me over it.
Majority of the PvP issues are simple extensions of the same issues PvE faces aside from a handful of truly broken skills/items.
Then Balence the powers for both until you have a fun and blaenced game on both sides
To try and balence both at the same time I say is impossible, because people ( PvP ) play much differnty over a programed AI ( PvE )
I agree with all of the above , and would vastly prefer this to any other solution .
The question is :
- Would the Devs find such an approach 'cost effective' ?
Meaning that they would essentially need to create different stats for each new ship *twice* .
- Would the PVP community want this or fear that a more cookie cutter stats would be implemented in PVP ?
the only real class that actually matters right now is Tac, mainly because enough firepower makes de-buffs useless against enemies.
Tac's and development are in a seemingly vicious circle .
Most ppl choose to play Tac as their first toon in game , thus Cryptic's metrics show that to be their most 'popular' class thus they get more Dev attention .
(mind you some Devs could be biased for all I know toward Tacs )
Maybe the current question is: "Have the developers some statistics to ponderate?"
If I am right the player base of STO, Federation side, is fairly broad.
Ideally there should be 33.3% of cruisers, 33.3% of science ships, 33.3% of escorts.
If the % of one of the vessels is too low/high (let's say 36% or more, 30% or less) there is something gone wrong, somewhere.
Or not?
Comments
That works really well for levels 1 to 49.
You can get a fleet Nova and get back to that someday. I, however, can't get a fleet Exeter.
Well, I mean, playing on normal difficulty, I think you would have to walk away from the keyboard for about 20 minutes to either be logged off or maybe, just maybe, die?
Exploration could use a revamp to get that exploration feel really going.
The problem with that is the same problem facing KDF development. Not enough people PVP to justify the resource allocation, just like not enough people play the KDF.
For the first two seasons, those problems were linked together.
And tacofangs, same playstyle as me. Unless I have one of my hardcore periods and are determined to achieve some goal, then I'll start Crunch numbers and stuff.. (haven't done that since..)
Are you seriously suggesting that Borticus... the guy who Mathed us in STOked... the one currently engaged in fixing problems that PvP players are bringing up... doesn't play the game? Doesn't PvP?
And didn't they have a Play with the Devs event awhile back? Were any of the systems guys in on that?
Dunno about Geko and not gonna argue with you there. I get the impression he's a PvE kind of guy... but then so am I.
I don't believe cruisers and beams are 'fine' either, and I'm not entirely sure I'd believe it even if Bort came in here and said they were 'fine'.
But I am willing to believe that they know more about the game's innards than I do and that they have a pretty good idea what the current direction is for STO and they're marching to that tune.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Honestly? It's not all that bad for 50 either. There's basically nothing that isn't passable for STFs, even Elites, so long as you care juuust enough to stick to one energy type and acquire Mk XI blue gear. I personally don't pay any mind to effectively cycling powers for maximum tank or how to stack buffs for offensive oomph. My main is a beam 'scort, just to drive my point home. And the only reason I've even got purple Mk XII stuff is incidentally through STFs pre-Rep and having the excess Fleet Credits lying around to spring for the occasional Advanced weapon. The exception being my Mk XI MACO space and Mk XII ground sets - that I actually worked for.
Of course you'd get utterly destroyed in PvP if you tried to do it that way, but for Taco's style, which is quite similar to mine, that's kind of unimportant.
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
yes. theres no evidence that any of them pvp, and if they do, arent any good at it. ive seen bran flakes pvping fairly well, thats it. borticus knows the system very well, hes shown that over and over. but hes never going to know how to balance unless he gets a feel for it by actually pvping. it should basically be a job requirement to know the state of balance from the inside and out.
my guide, and others, on how to pvp well could easily be the first step for any of them to get the hang of pvping, its really not that hard once you learn the very basics. the channel opvp would LOVE to work with devs and teach them everything they need to know too.
if they were pvp'ers, and were aware of everything i went into detail about in my post, well, it wouldn't be as bad as it is now, things would have been done differently, pressure wouldn't have been so marginalized.
Would be nice to have one once a month or something crazy like that...
Very good, I must add I just play 1 KDF char it's handmade cardassian, just love that guy it exactly has a name and a BIO and thanks to my luck I bought a lock box with the Cardassian cruiser and updated it all against the Borg.
You gut to like that guy and anyone who played with me respected me with STF.
Ship had a good deal off power.
Recently I scored a dominion ship for him well also very good ship.
And sometimes I just not doing ST F's but pick one off the missions in the cryptic list so to speak and play them.
We have a small house of 25 members enjoying the game every step off the way.
Recently I do some missions on new Romulus I know this is very new but it's to typical grind build I must add, Could you say to make improvements on this world also to make it less grind and more fun ?
Well most players do love the game otherwise they wouldn't get angry if Dev's build another grind or make a story that doesn't add up with anything star trek.
Most players care for the game as much as the Dev's that build it.
What I love most is the build off the game but it certainly need improvement not only the maps and the environment but also weapons, tactics, builds like star bases, embassy's etc etc.
But I really like it when I hear Dev's come into the game testing various things with or without players to test stuff out. And make notes to come next day to office with a clear head and a book full with notes on what must be done in game.
Well who knows we see each other some time in game if you play KDF that is because I do not play PVP sorry ....
"Coffee: the finest organic suspension ever devised. It's got me through the worst of the last three years. I beat the Borg with it."
You guys are not the only ones building.
I know we may not be artistes and official devs, but we are building new worlds and environments to explore, often using the cryptic made props in unconventional ways. We are repurposing a lot of those props to make entirely new things.
Play my "Trojan Horse," for example.
On a different note:
If you explored that content, I predict the following would happen. You would say to yourself, "Wow, these folks are desperate for a flat primitive textured as a carpet... I can make that in 3 minutes and tell Zero how to find it in the library."
This is a desperate plea.
My character Tsin'xing
its nice to see devs say they play the game and what not,
but to be honest you devs should play the game undercover
from scratch and grind all your stuff with out spending a single dime.
better off playing the game from a point of view of a free player.
i am not the type of person that saids anything about balance, but
its easy to not really see balance for those who are all tricked out
in gear that has no need to grind and has all the dev commands to cheat.
so thats why its better to just go undercover and play as a free user who
grinds like mad and doesnt play on alienware computer.
--
Merely giving my opinion
--
took a break from the game for the last 2 months but thought i give my opinion
on this. that is all.
I can only imagine some of the trolling sent their way if the enter the visage of the damned known as ESD.
"We are smart." - Grebnedlog
Member of Alliance Central Command/boq botlhra'ghom
Lately I've been playing an alt with my S.O. and we've been taking notes about things that need polish in missions, then when I have spare time I sneak in and fix them.
I also grind all of my own dilithium and use the dilithium exchange to get Zen. I recently acquired the Vesta bundle using Zen that I purchased with dilithium (plus the lifetime member monthly stipend). This has gotten a bit easier since I reached T5 in both reputations!
on how many? I ihave both to, will have both on 2nd toon,and shortly after that 2 kdf will have 5. plus been doing tripple duty
I will have second toon omega done saturday Romulan 5 next week
however I would moving faster if xp was not drained
hmm i could get the vest to that way but i want to gear on all toon then i will get it
Shhh, don't let the devs know we get ships without paying a dime!
Oh... Wait.
:P
Daizen - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Sounds cool. I think point some people are trying to find in the dark without a flashlight is lots of messages state "see you in-game". The thing is they don't understand is yes you do play but are they going to know its a dev. The answer would be know because I am assuming when you do get onto play you wanna enjoy what you work on without someone asking you when xyz is going to be fixed, done, etc.
That is just my take on it LOL
Fleet Science Vessel Retrofit, Taco. Fleet. Nova. And it's an awesome ship.
And devs do the grind part from scratch. They have a dev account with everything on it, including super power you will never have, but it's only for special event and testing. While they have the same account than you or me, just with a LTS. They can't use dev power to increase whatever, or unlock ships.
The same is true for every MMO. Remember the big drama around eve when a GM used his "power" to add some stuff for his fleet ? He was fired. And it was relatively minor, some blueprint for ammos.
I will insert canned response:
"But it's a MMO!"
Personally, if I were in the position, I'm not really sure how I would justify the difference, other than pointing to certain dev and Foundry missions which feel like Star Trek.
Shifting back to STO, explosions are cool.
I am wondering if Zero still desires PVP. I know there was a point when she did.
Other then that.. who knows? I will say I am most curious about DStahl himself when it comes to the PVP part of the game. Because I'm sure that Developers do play the game. But PVP.. well that's a different matter..
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
Yes.. Snix.. Thanks!
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
You say that like you think an MMO could survive in any meaningful capacity on nothing but morality tales and dialog with the occasional pew pew.
STO already has more non-combat or incidental combat missions than any MMO I've ever heard of. While I don't disagree with the idea they could try to write them to be more compelling, it's downright foolish to think a story-heavy MMO written exclusively into Trek-like scenarios would be anything other than a colossal waste of money for the folks developing it.
In other words, "It's an MMO" is a wholly valid response. What you and a lot of other Foundry authors seem to want is a heavily moddable single player game ala TES or NWN. STO can certainly begin to approach that via the efforts and you and your ilk in the Foundry, but you simply have to accept that by its very nature, it will never live up to your standards as a vehicle for great storytelling.
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
Sorry mate they don't need to PvP to understand balance. I've been complaining about the inbalance with beams long before the PvP crowd ever began too and guess what. Offensive power was increased with this season by more than defensive power was. I mostly had the PvP crowd arguing with me over it.
Majority of the PvP issues are simple extensions of the same issues PvE faces aside from a handful of truly broken skills/items.
I agree with all of the above , and would vastly prefer this to any other solution .
The question is :
- Would the Devs find such an approach 'cost effective' ?
Meaning that they would essentially need to create different stats for each new ship *twice* .
- Would the PVP community want this or fear that a more cookie cutter stats would be implemented in PVP ?
Tac's and development are in a seemingly vicious circle .
Most ppl choose to play Tac as their first toon in game , thus Cryptic's metrics show that to be their most 'popular' class thus they get more Dev attention .
(mind you some Devs could be biased for all I know toward Tacs )
If I am right the player base of STO, Federation side, is fairly broad.
Ideally there should be 33.3% of cruisers, 33.3% of science ships, 33.3% of escorts.
If the % of one of the vessels is too low/high (let's say 36% or more, 30% or less) there is something gone wrong, somewhere.
Or not?