We've seen the pressure thread come and go, and i felt like we are not getting our point across.
After the UGC interview this feeling has been intensified.
Systems here is my proposal.
After the last boot camp session, join us for some 3v3 fun. One match with 3 Graduates (all well above 14) and 3 systems guys. Preferably Gecko with NI, Insulators in a beamboat.
Bring any ship you like, but here are the rules: Dev team: One of each class, and career. Sci ship and Cruisers must bring beams.
Boot Camp team. All DHC ships, you may leave the eng at home (Breen and two bugs, vesta and 2x Kumari...)
If you want to go fancy and gather more data have a 2v2 afterwards. Devs bring a fed cruiser and a tac/scort and go against a tac and a sci in escorts.
Finally if you still want more see what you can achieve with your eng/healboat monster against a tac/glass cannon. Or maybe try a 5 eng recluse CSE run (no DHCs)
DOffs Rep passive, Elite Shields bring whatever you like. WE'll cut the matches short if need be. Just some
boot camp graduates, no coaches, or Uber builds.
Now I have a very clear idea on how i expect this 3v3 match to go, maybe I'm wrong. If after the 3v3 match Geckos still things all is WAD, we all know better what to expect for the future of STO PvP, and be more constructive in working with each other.
You guys are taking Geko's quote out of context and it's clearly not what he meant if you listen to the whole convo and not one sentence (which no one has even posted verbatim). Think anyone is going to take you up on your offer when you continue to do that in every post you make? I think not. Posts that do that will most likely be ignored, so I suggest considering how you make proposals if you'd like any attention at all from anyone on the dev team.
You guys are taking Geko's quote out of context and it's clearly not what he meant if you listen to the whole convo and not one sentence (which no one has even posted verbatim). Think anyone is going to take you up on your offer when you continue to do that in every post you make? I think not. Posts that do that will most likely be ignored, so I suggest considering how you make proposals if you'd like any attention at all from anyone on the dev team.
Cheers,
Brandon =/\=
I think a transcript somewhere of the entire recording would help.
I've been slowly working my way through the entire thing on my ride back and forth to work, but even listening to it like this it's hard to keep track of what was said and where.
I know this is an outside podcast, so it really has nothing to do with your end but it's also good PR and posts directing us to the podcast are found here on the forums (I believe from you Bran).
If there is any possibility of a transcript, I think that would be a great way to have a clearer discussion on what was actually said and in what context.
You guys are taking Geko's quote out of context and it's clearly not what he meant if you listen to the whole convo and not one sentence. Think anyone is going to take you up on your offer when you continue to do that in every post you make? I think not. Posts that do that will most likely be ignored, so I suggest considering how you make proposals if you'd like any attention at all from anyone on the dev team.
Cheers,
Brandon =/\=
Once again, I listened to the whole conversation, no need to continuously imply otherwise. Others , after listening to the interview, apparently had the same impression about the comment in question. But what has been said as opposed to what has been meant is not the purpose of this. If you know what he meant, why not just tell us?
We have had multiple threads on the lack of pressure damage, resists and healing during the past months, and based on the interview I don't think our point came across. So this could be an opportunity for both sides to make their points.
This has happened before with Voldi bug, it took months to get our point across. Unitl J-man finally managed to demonstrate it to Gecko. PvP feedback being ignored has been the default for three years straight. Sorry the PvP community in STO is not what the Devs would like it to be or that our feedback isn't all roses. Thanks for the help though.
We've seen the pressure thread come and go, and i felt like we are not getting our point across.
If that point was "We're not really sure how this works." trust me, it came across.
Then came "there are always counters" 2.0 aka 14 year old min-maxers and i can't help but feel that the game we are seeing on holodeck is very different from the game that runs on geckos desk at 1/4 speed.
Right. Okay so you don't like the counters? They are there. Or do you just not like 14 year olds?
Systems here is my proposal.
After the last boot camp session, join us for some 3v3 fun. One match with 3 Graduates (no 14year old pros) and 3 systems guys. Preferably Gecko with NI, Insulators in a beamboat.
Bring any ship you like, but here are the rules: Dev team: One of each class, and career. Sci ship and Cruisers must bring beams.
Why force someone to run a silly build. I mean c'mon, by now everyone should know that beam arrays on anything but a sci ship is just above TRIBBLE, why are you still clinging to this? It has never been otherwise, and to pretend that there was such a time, or that there ever was such an intent, is foolish.
Boot Camp team. All DHC ships, you may leave the eng at home (Breen and two bugs, vesta and 2x Kumari...)
If you want to go fancy and gather more data have a 2v2 afterwards. Devs bring a fed cruiser and a tac/scort and go against a tac and a sci in escorts.
Finally if you still want more see what you can achieve with your eng/healboat monster against a tac/glass cannon. Or maybe try a 5 eng recluse CSE run (no DHCs)
DOffs Rep passive, Elite Shields bring whatever you like. WE'll cut the matches short if need be. No pros, just some Boot Camp graduates vs Devs. No 14 year olds either.
Now I have a very clear idea on how i expect this 3v3 match to go, maybe I'm wrong. If after the 3v3 match Geckos still things all is WAD, we all know better what to expect for the future of STO PvP, and be more constructive in working with each other. No more need for name calling either.
Just put pressure damage to rest. It might be different if you had some clearly stated outcomes for pressure damage. You don't. And even then that's just a might.
Don't even bother saying that anyone has clearly stated outcomes for this. No one has. Saying that pressure damage is no longer useful isn't very clear or well...useful.
Since launch there's been a profound lack of understanding and dislike for the designed role of cruisers and science ships in relation to escorts. And really it is in relation to. If you don't understand that you don't understand the design intent. If you just don't LIKE it, well that's different. One of the changes implemented to change that has put the game where it is today. Exactly ONE.
And it wasn't any change to "pressure damage". Hell, all damage output has gone UP.
You guys are taking Geko's quote out of context and it's clearly not what he meant if you listen to the whole convo and not one sentence
star trek fans taking nothing out of context! The above quote means that branflakes believes that all Star Trek fans don't have the patience to listen!
Probably because of an auditory impairment caused by listening to too much Judas Priest!
I never listen to judas priest!
:rolleyes:
Betcha you are going to enjoy your vacation next week
Just put pressure damage to rest. It might be different if you had some clearly stated outcomes for pressure damage. You don't.
If you had read the pressure damage thread, you'd know the problem: The ability to heal at this point in the game is too great. Pressure damage is no longer enough to cause healers to stop healing their teammates because passive healing is more then enough to overcome pressure damage. The only way something dies is a coordinated SNB Alpha Strike combo. There is literaly no reason to fly a cruiser or play an Engineer in Space PvP because neither of them have the skills or guns necessary to kill something (or even to disrupt the opponents cross healing).
When 1/3 of the game can't be used in PvP, something is wrong.
You guys are taking Geko's quote out of context and it's clearly not what he meant if you listen to the whole convo and not one sentence (which no one has even posted verbatim). Think anyone is going to take you up on your offer when you continue to do that in every post you make? I think not. Posts that do that will most likely be ignored, so I suggest considering how you make proposals if you'd like any attention at all from anyone on the dev team.
Cheers,
Brandon =/\=
Maybe I'm just a dumb European who does not understand English language very well. So enlighten me please.
What did he mean by the "power insulator" quote then ? Because power insulator has 0 (as in ZERO) impact on weapon drain. Does he not know his own systems well ?Or was it, how do they say it on your continent? Brain TRIBBLE ?
What did he mean by the "14 years old" insult to the pvp community ? Or was he talking about something/someone else ?
What did he mean by the "beams are working as intended" quote when this game is pretty much Escort online ? Last time I saw you in game, even you were playing a JEM BUG with DHC
"Cryptic Studio’s Jack Emmert (2010): Microtransactions are the biggest bunch of nonsense. I like paying one fee and not worrying about it – like my cellphone. The world’s biggest MMO isn’t item based, even though the black market item GDP is bigger than Russia … microtransactions make me want to die.”
star trek fans taking nothing out of context! The above quote means that branflakes believes that all Star Trek fans don't have the patience to listen!
Probably because of an auditory impairment caused by listening to too much Judas Priest!
I never listen to judas priest!
:rolleyes:
Betcha you are going to enjoy your vacation next week
The Priest ?
Na they think we are all Beiber fans... that is what 14 year old's are into these days isn't it ?
Power Insulators boost the Engy captain skill Nadion Inversion.
So was he implying that beams are fine, because ONE out of THREE career choices can use ONE of their abilities, every THREE minutes ?
"Cryptic Studio’s Jack Emmert (2010): Microtransactions are the biggest bunch of nonsense. I like paying one fee and not worrying about it – like my cellphone. The world’s biggest MMO isn’t item based, even though the black market item GDP is bigger than Russia … microtransactions make me want to die.”
So was he implying that beams are fine, because ONE out of THREE career choices can use ONE of their abilities, every THREE minutes ?
16% up time... and frankly beams still suck even with nadion and 9 points in insulators.
The reason we laugh at the comment he made... which I know was off the cuff in a 4 hour interview... so I am willing to cut the guy a little bit of slack. Anyway the reason we laugh is because if you just listen to that 1min out of the 4hrs... he really does sound like someone who started playing the game a few days ago.
Actually the real pvp issue is that heals, and consequently cruisers, since they are the best healers, are too powerful. If that's what you want, then be it, nerf heals and it'll be fine/fixed for pvp. But really, a ship class having amazing healing abilities and dps just look plainly silly.
You're not fighting for balance, but for your very own play-style, which is sad.
BTW I'm almost sure Gecko had some sort of brainfart and meant warp core potential or something like that, which makes a lot more sense.
Actually the real pvp issue is that heals, and consequently cruisers, since they are the best healers, are too powerful. If that's what you want, then be it, nerf heals and it'll be fine/fixed for pvp. But really, a ship class having amazing healing abilities and dps just look plainly silly.
You're not fighting for balance, but for your very own play-style, which is sad.
Not sure, but the best healer is the Recluse, and the last time I checked it is not a cruiser...
Also a ship class having amazing tanking potential and dps is just plainly silly...oh what it is ? I give you a hint...it is not a cruiser.
"Cryptic Studio’s Jack Emmert (2010): Microtransactions are the biggest bunch of nonsense. I like paying one fee and not worrying about it – like my cellphone. The world’s biggest MMO isn’t item based, even though the black market item GDP is bigger than Russia … microtransactions make me want to die.”
Actually the real pvp issue is that heals, and consequently cruisers, since they are the best healers, are too powerful. If that's what you want, then be it, nerf heals and it'll be fine/fixed for pvp. But really, a ship class having amazing healing abilities and dps just look plainly silly.
You're not fighting for balance, but for your very own play-style, which is sad.
BTW I'm almost sure Gecko had some sort of brainfart and meant warp core potential or something like that, which makes a lot more sense.
Not sure, but the best healer is the Recluse, and the last time I checked it is not a cruiser...
Also a ship class having amazing tanking potential and dps is just plainly silly...oh what it is ? I give you a hint...it is not a cruiser.
The recluse can be turned into some sort of weird cruiser if you use an eng BO in the universal slot.
Lockbox ships have always been an exception anyway. And if you want it to be a healboat then you can do that. Call it a cruiser or a carrier, it won't make any difference. Semantics are also silly you know?
It won't change this simple fact: cruisers are healboats. Their tanking and healing abilities can keep anyone with some gaming skills alive for more time that it takes to get bored in a pvp match. Cruisers don't do dps but they do two things:
- indirect damage if they keep escorts alive
- keep the kill count as low as possible.
Which is great from a pvp perspective. Even in pve i find my eng/cruisers very enjoyable. It's just a support role. You don't do anything by yourself, you support your team. What's the problem? Cruisers can already do that perfectly. If you add dps it just looks stupid and too much in favour of one play-style. Since this game is supposed to make "teamwork OP" then forcing people to cooperate seems the best way to achieve that.
It's definitely not perfect, but ship balances is fine. Powers could use some tweaking, but threads like this don't look serious at all because it's too much one-sided.
Actually I do it, but i'm not the kind of person who likes complaining because my playstyle isn't favoured. I'm able to adapt. And yes I love flying my galor in pvp occasionally.
If you like ad hominem, then you should take a look at yourself instead of following the crowds on the forums and see that it's not that terrible.
You guys are taking Geko's quote out of context and it's clearly not what he meant if you listen to the whole convo and not one sentence (which no one has even posted verbatim). Think anyone is going to take you up on your offer when you continue to do that in every post you make? I think not. Posts that do that will most likely be ignored, so I suggest considering how you make proposals if you'd like any attention at all from anyone on the dev team.
The recluse can be turned into some sort of weird cruiser if you use an eng BO in the universal slot.
Lockbox ships have always been an exception anyway. And if you want it to be a healboat then you can do that. Call it a cruiser or a carrier, it won't make any difference. Semantics are also silly you know?
It won't change this simple fact: cruisers are healboats. Their tanking and healing abilities can keep anyone with some gaming skills alive for more time that it takes to get bored in a pvp match. Cruisers don't do dps but they do two things:
- indirect damage if they keep escorts alive
- keep the kill count as low as possible.
Which is great from a pvp perspective. Even in pve i find my eng/cruisers very enjoyable. It's just a support role. You don't do anything by yourself, you support your team. What's the problem? Cruisers can already do that perfectly. If you add dps it just looks stupid and too much in favour of one play-style. Since this game is supposed to make "teamwork OP" then forcing people to cooperate seems the best way to achieve that.
It's definitely not perfect, but ship balances is fine. Powers could use some tweaking, but threads like this don't look serious at all because it's too much one-sided.
Actually I do it, but i'm not the kind of person who likes complaining because my playstyle isn't favoured. I'm able to adapt. And yes I love flying my galor in pvp occasionally.
If you like ad hominem, then you should take a look at yourself instead of following the crowds on the forums and see that it's not that terrible.
You do realize that we are trying to help the Cruisers right?
You do realize that we are trying to help the Cruisers right?
Blah. Cruisers don't need help, really.
If pressure damage is an issue, nerfing heals should really be the way to go, since it's always easier to lower the ceiling instead of raising the floor for everyone. And the result will be the same.
I know alot of you (players) get angry when you take the time to test something and post about it and go in game and talk to people about it, AND THEN NOTHING HAPPENS ABOUT IT
happens all the time in politics
but lets not forget that this is just a video game
and I would like to point out again that its moments like this were nerd rage gets out of hand and pushes away the very people at the company that can really make change for us for pvp
just like how the pvp supported tournament imploded (great job all)
or how about so much crying about a boff ability, console, and or weapon that cryptic's final solution is to nerf it to the point that it is useless afterwards (just because its not worth the grief of working with a community that is so petty, childish, vindictive, and dishonest TO FIX IT PROPERLY SO IT IS EFFECTIVE AND BALANCED
To be honest, day back or so when I was reading all of you getting you feathers ruffled over the "14 year old pvp" comment,
I laughed out loud and thought, sounds about right
and LOOK AT YOU GO! still harping on about some backhanded comment made in some pod cast making a mountain out of a mole hill,
(I especially liked the one poster couple down talking about astronaut and scientists in his fleet that pvp that are NOT 14 for sure, LOL like dude you missed the point of the comment),
and still trying to get cryptic to pvp you grilling on about, "come challenge us, no really, jump in your game and fight us and you will see our point, comon now, get in here with us, listen to us! LISTEN TO US!! ! rage.rage.rage.rage.etc"
I mean really, (if you worked for cryptic) would you? WHAT if your plate was full every day with TRIBBLE to do with either code or thinking up how to put in new content for the game DEAL with a handful of petty, small, voices on the forums that act like they speak for us all in PVP?
lets just get this strait- none of you on the forums here speak for "all of us" and I hope the guys at cryptic get that
If pressure damage is an issue, nerfing heals should really be the way to go, since it's always easier to lower the ceiling instead of raising the floor for everyone. And the result will be the same.
That would be a lovely idea.
Nerf heals.
We are realists at this point. Cryptic WILL NOT nerf healing ever. The PvE kids are far to important to them... and they are simply NOT willing to fix every NPC in every mission to make them ok with any nerf to heals.
They did nerf the Shield doffs not to long ago... and they adjusted the Borg set bonuses... and then at the same time, Threw everyone multiple healing passives... and healing items. It was one step forward 4 steps back.
So if they won't bring healing down to a point where things work... we ask them to continue doing what they have been doing the entire time Power Creeping the game to death. We are simply saying Hey next power creep the pressure weapons.
I know alot of you (players) get angry when you take the time to test something and post about it and go in game and talk to people about it, AND THEN NOTHING HAPPENS ABOUT IT
happens all the time in politics
but lets not forget that this is just a video game
and I would like to point out again that its moments like this were nerd rage gets out of hand and pushes away the very people at the company that can really make change for us for pvp
just like how the pvp supported tournament imploded (great job all)
or how about so much crying about a boff ability, console, and or weapon that cryptic's final solution is to nerf it to the point that it is useless afterwards (just because its not worth the grief of working with a community that is so petty, childish, vindictive, and dishonest TO FIX IT PROPERLY SO IT IS EFFECTIVE AND BALANCED
To be honest, day back or so when I was reading all of you getting you feathers ruffled over the "14 year old pvp" comment,
I laughed out loud and thought, sounds about right
and LOOK AT YOU GO! still harping on about some backhanded comment made in some pod cast making a mountain out of a mole hill,
(I especially liked the one poster couple down talking about astronaut and scientists in his fleet that pvp that are NOT 14 for sure, LOL like dude you missed the point of the comment),
and still trying to get cryptic to pvp you grilling on about, "come challenge us, no really, jump in your game and fight us and you will see our point, comon now, get in here with us, listen to us! LISTEN TO US!! ! rage.rage.rage.rage.etc"
I mean really, (if you worked for cryptic) would you? WHAT if your plate was full every day with TRIBBLE to do with either code or thinking up how to put in new content for the game DEAL with a handful of petty, small, voices on the forums that act like they speak for us all in PVP?
lets just get this strait- none of you on the forums here speak for "all of us" and I hope the guys at cryptic get that
I actually took some of your post seriously until that,,,,your complaining about others complaining that they feel insulted or ignored then you proceed to tell them they are " petty, small, voices" And you made this situation better how?
We are realists at this point. Cryptic WILL NOT nerf healing ever. The PvE kids are far to important to them... and they are simply NOT willing to fix every NPC in every mission to make them ok with any nerf to heals.
They did nerf the Shield doffs not to long ago... and they adjusted the Borg set bonuses... and then at the same time, Threw everyone multiple healing passives... and healing items. It was one step forward 4 steps back.
So if they won't bring healing down to a point where things work... we ask them to continue doing what they have been doing the entire time Power Creeping the game to death. We are simply saying Hey next power creep the pressure weapons.
Borticus recently ran an idea that they could implent zone wide variable magnitude modifiers; They could do that by cutting heals by X% in a space PvP zone.
Just put pressure damage to rest. It might be different if you had some clearly stated outcomes for pressure damage. You don't. And even then that's just a might.
Don't even bother saying that anyone has clearly stated outcomes for this. No one has. Saying that pressure damage is no longer useful isn't very clear or well...useful.
Since launch there's been a profound lack of understanding and dislike for the designed role of cruisers and science ships in relation to escorts. And really it is in relation to. If you don't understand that you don't understand the design intent. If you just don't LIKE it, well that's different. One of the changes implemented to change that has put the game where it is today. Exactly ONE.
And it wasn't any change to "pressure damage". Hell, all damage output has gone UP.
you have been cloaked to long! for months there have been threads saying pressure damage is dead, and elaborating on it. this has nothing to do with how many of us wish cruisers were like, and has everything to do with the nature of cruiser damage, wile shooting at a target with 5 or 6 added passive buffs to resistance, regeneration, and proc heals. thanks to the nature of cruiser damage, they no longer do any.
regeneration happens to every shield facing, with resistance levels and just balancing shields with basic EPtS cycling, you can quite nearly out pace all presure damage. the damage of my completely over the top, 2AtB death cruisers, dealing the most possible fed cruiser damage possible, are even rendered useless.
this wasn't a change to pressure damage, this was a change to the average resistence and regeneration rate of shields, with 3 of 4 different proc heals thrown in as well. it directly cancels out pressure in a way that does not cancel out spike. be it BO, DHC CRF, what ever energy weapon spike you can get. that can remove a shield facing, there isnt a 4 second period were any other weapon would gradually deal the same damage, wile distributing shields would simply keep up with it.
You guys are taking Geko's quote out of context and it's clearly not what he meant if you listen to the whole convo and not one sentence (which no one has even posted verbatim). Think anyone is going to take you up on your offer when you continue to do that in every post you make? I think not. Posts that do that will most likely be ignored, so I suggest considering how you make proposals if you'd like any attention at all from anyone on the dev team.
Cheers,
Brandon =/\=
gecko saying he thinks beams (pressure damage) is fine, and if anything cannons or DHC specifically should be nerfed is basically a direct quote. that demonstrates a lack of understanding of the current state of pvp, with all the defensive power creep there currently is. i explained the effect of this power creep above. this has been a simmering topic since the rep system especially, but ive been complaining about it since the borg set was introduced, it started being a problem back then.
then, off offhandedly sure, we hear from one of the highest ups say beams (pressure damage) is just fine! we it makes us a bit exacerbated brandon. you pvp right? you have filled out the rep system by now right? you have rom consoles and stf set shields or elite fleet equipment right? ive seen you in a bug, haven't you noticed how beam arrays and other non DHC weapons are totally harmless to you? unless your burred in sci debuffs held, and no mater whats shot at you you were guaranteed to die.
i would think you pvp enough to see what we are seeing. i understand that Al doesn't pvp, the npcs don't have these defensive passives that have all been added, as far as he knows nothing has changed. you have to go to pvp to see it.
Borticus recently ran an idea that they could implent zone wide variable magnitude modifiers; They could do that by cutting heals by X% in a space PvP zone.
That is true they did mention that and its one possible solution.
I think the issue goes well beyond just pvp and that is the real issue.
The same issues exist in say Space STFs..... have you ever decided to play say one of your engi toons and ended up in a pug with no escorts... how did that go for you. lol
Yes reducing healing in PvP across the board... perhaps it helps... until they do inevitably power creep weapons. Which 100% will happen... I mean I don't think adjusting numbers for some magical optimizer algorithm every single patch/cstore release/lockbox drop is really going to be workable.
I actually took some of your post seriously until that,,,,your complaining about others complaining that they feel insulted or ignored then you proceed to tell them they are " petty, small, voices" And you made this situation better how?
That one is still sore over the Tricobalt mine nerfs, I suppose.
gecko saying he thinks beams (pressure damage) is fine, and if anything cannons or DHC specifically should be nerfed is basically a direct quote. that demonstrates a lack of understanding of the current state of pvp, with all the defensive power creep there currently is. i explained the effect of this power creep above. this has been a simmering topic since the rep system especially, but ive been complaining about it since the borg set was introduced, it started being a problem back then.
then, off offhandedly sure, we hear from one of the highest ups say beams (pressure damage) is just fine! we it makes us a bit exacerbated brandon. you pvp right? you have filled out the rep system by now right? you have rom consoles and stf set shields or elite fleet equipment right? ive seen you in a bug, haven't you noticed how beam arrays and other non DHC weapons are totally harmless to you? unless your burred in sci debuffs held, and no mater whats shot at you you were guaranteed to die.
i would think you pvp enough to see what we are seeing. i understand that Al doesn't pvp, the npcs don't have these defensive passives that have all been added, as far as he knows nothing has changed. you have to go to pvp to see it.
This is not the quote I am talking about; the first post was edited by the OP after I made the post you quoted so I can see how there would be confusion. I'm referring to the fact that some of you actually think he was calling you 14 year olds -- he wasn't. This was riddled all over the OP before it was edited and that's where this came in:
You guys are taking Geko's quote out of context and it's clearly not what he meant if you listen to the whole convo and not one sentence (which no one has even posted verbatim). Think anyone is going to take you up on your offer when you continue to do that in every post you make? I think not. Posts that do that will most likely be ignored, so I suggest considering how you make proposals if you'd like any attention at all from anyone on the dev team.
Comments
Cheers,
Brandon =/\=
I think a transcript somewhere of the entire recording would help.
I've been slowly working my way through the entire thing on my ride back and forth to work, but even listening to it like this it's hard to keep track of what was said and where.
I know this is an outside podcast, so it really has nothing to do with your end but it's also good PR and posts directing us to the podcast are found here on the forums (I believe from you Bran).
If there is any possibility of a transcript, I think that would be a great way to have a clearer discussion on what was actually said and in what context.
Once again, I listened to the whole conversation, no need to continuously imply otherwise. Others , after listening to the interview, apparently had the same impression about the comment in question. But what has been said as opposed to what has been meant is not the purpose of this. If you know what he meant, why not just tell us?
We have had multiple threads on the lack of pressure damage, resists and healing during the past months, and based on the interview I don't think our point came across. So this could be an opportunity for both sides to make their points.
This has happened before with Voldi bug, it took months to get our point across. Unitl J-man finally managed to demonstrate it to Gecko. PvP feedback being ignored has been the default for three years straight. Sorry the PvP community in STO is not what the Devs would like it to be or that our feedback isn't all roses. Thanks for the help though.
a history of sto pvp: 2010 - 2011
a history of sto pvp: 2012 - 2013
Just put pressure damage to rest. It might be different if you had some clearly stated outcomes for pressure damage. You don't. And even then that's just a might.
Don't even bother saying that anyone has clearly stated outcomes for this. No one has. Saying that pressure damage is no longer useful isn't very clear or well...useful.
Since launch there's been a profound lack of understanding and dislike for the designed role of cruisers and science ships in relation to escorts. And really it is in relation to. If you don't understand that you don't understand the design intent. If you just don't LIKE it, well that's different. One of the changes implemented to change that has put the game where it is today. Exactly ONE.
And it wasn't any change to "pressure damage". Hell, all damage output has gone UP.
star trek fans taking nothing out of context! The above quote means that branflakes believes that all Star Trek fans don't have the patience to listen!
Probably because of an auditory impairment caused by listening to too much Judas Priest!
I never listen to judas priest!
:rolleyes:
Betcha you are going to enjoy your vacation next week
When 1/3 of the game can't be used in PvP, something is wrong.
Maybe I'm just a dumb European who does not understand English language very well. So enlighten me please.
What did he mean by the "power insulator" quote then ? Because power insulator has 0 (as in ZERO) impact on weapon drain. Does he not know his own systems well ?Or was it, how do they say it on your continent? Brain TRIBBLE ?
What did he mean by the "14 years old" insult to the pvp community ? Or was he talking about something/someone else ?
What did he mean by the "beams are working as intended" quote when this game is pretty much Escort online ? Last time I saw you in game, even you were playing a JEM BUG with DHC
The Priest ?
Na they think we are all Beiber fans... that is what 14 year old's are into these days isn't it ?
So was he implying that beams are fine, because ONE out of THREE career choices can use ONE of their abilities, every THREE minutes ?
16% up time... and frankly beams still suck even with nadion and 9 points in insulators.
The reason we laugh at the comment he made... which I know was off the cuff in a 4 hour interview... so I am willing to cut the guy a little bit of slack. Anyway the reason we laugh is because if you just listen to that 1min out of the 4hrs... he really does sound like someone who started playing the game a few days ago.
You're not fighting for balance, but for your very own play-style, which is sad.
BTW I'm almost sure Gecko had some sort of brainfart and meant warp core potential or something like that, which makes a lot more sense.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
Not sure, but the best healer is the Recluse, and the last time I checked it is not a cruiser...
Also a ship class having amazing tanking potential and dps is just plainly silly...oh what it is ? I give you a hint...it is not a cruiser.
Nice post, you should come pvp sometime.
The recluse can be turned into some sort of weird cruiser if you use an eng BO in the universal slot.
Lockbox ships have always been an exception anyway. And if you want it to be a healboat then you can do that. Call it a cruiser or a carrier, it won't make any difference. Semantics are also silly you know?
It won't change this simple fact: cruisers are healboats. Their tanking and healing abilities can keep anyone with some gaming skills alive for more time that it takes to get bored in a pvp match. Cruisers don't do dps but they do two things:
- indirect damage if they keep escorts alive
- keep the kill count as low as possible.
Which is great from a pvp perspective. Even in pve i find my eng/cruisers very enjoyable. It's just a support role. You don't do anything by yourself, you support your team. What's the problem? Cruisers can already do that perfectly. If you add dps it just looks stupid and too much in favour of one play-style. Since this game is supposed to make "teamwork OP" then forcing people to cooperate seems the best way to achieve that.
It's definitely not perfect, but ship balances is fine. Powers could use some tweaking, but threads like this don't look serious at all because it's too much one-sided.
Actually I do it, but i'm not the kind of person who likes complaining because my playstyle isn't favoured. I'm able to adapt. And yes I love flying my galor in pvp occasionally.
If you like ad hominem, then you should take a look at yourself instead of following the crowds on the forums and see that it's not that terrible.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
i did
Post 54
Even got stutter in ...lol
You do realize that we are trying to help the Cruisers right?
Blah. Cruisers don't need help, really.
If pressure damage is an issue, nerfing heals should really be the way to go, since it's always easier to lower the ceiling instead of raising the floor for everyone. And the result will be the same.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
Well said.
That would be a lovely idea.
Nerf heals.
We are realists at this point. Cryptic WILL NOT nerf healing ever. The PvE kids are far to important to them... and they are simply NOT willing to fix every NPC in every mission to make them ok with any nerf to heals.
They did nerf the Shield doffs not to long ago... and they adjusted the Borg set bonuses... and then at the same time, Threw everyone multiple healing passives... and healing items. It was one step forward 4 steps back.
So if they won't bring healing down to a point where things work... we ask them to continue doing what they have been doing the entire time Power Creeping the game to death. We are simply saying Hey next power creep the pressure weapons.
I actually took some of your post seriously until that,,,,your complaining about others complaining that they feel insulted or ignored then you proceed to tell them they are " petty, small, voices" And you made this situation better how?
you have been cloaked to long! for months there have been threads saying pressure damage is dead, and elaborating on it. this has nothing to do with how many of us wish cruisers were like, and has everything to do with the nature of cruiser damage, wile shooting at a target with 5 or 6 added passive buffs to resistance, regeneration, and proc heals. thanks to the nature of cruiser damage, they no longer do any.
regeneration happens to every shield facing, with resistance levels and just balancing shields with basic EPtS cycling, you can quite nearly out pace all presure damage. the damage of my completely over the top, 2AtB death cruisers, dealing the most possible fed cruiser damage possible, are even rendered useless.
this wasn't a change to pressure damage, this was a change to the average resistence and regeneration rate of shields, with 3 of 4 different proc heals thrown in as well. it directly cancels out pressure in a way that does not cancel out spike. be it BO, DHC CRF, what ever energy weapon spike you can get. that can remove a shield facing, there isnt a 4 second period were any other weapon would gradually deal the same damage, wile distributing shields would simply keep up with it.
gecko saying he thinks beams (pressure damage) is fine, and if anything cannons or DHC specifically should be nerfed is basically a direct quote. that demonstrates a lack of understanding of the current state of pvp, with all the defensive power creep there currently is. i explained the effect of this power creep above. this has been a simmering topic since the rep system especially, but ive been complaining about it since the borg set was introduced, it started being a problem back then.
then, off offhandedly sure, we hear from one of the highest ups say beams (pressure damage) is just fine! we it makes us a bit exacerbated brandon. you pvp right? you have filled out the rep system by now right? you have rom consoles and stf set shields or elite fleet equipment right? ive seen you in a bug, haven't you noticed how beam arrays and other non DHC weapons are totally harmless to you? unless your burred in sci debuffs held, and no mater whats shot at you you were guaranteed to die.
i would think you pvp enough to see what we are seeing. i understand that Al doesn't pvp, the npcs don't have these defensive passives that have all been added, as far as he knows nothing has changed. you have to go to pvp to see it.
That is true they did mention that and its one possible solution.
I think the issue goes well beyond just pvp and that is the real issue.
The same issues exist in say Space STFs..... have you ever decided to play say one of your engi toons and ended up in a pug with no escorts... how did that go for you. lol
Yes reducing healing in PvP across the board... perhaps it helps... until they do inevitably power creep weapons. Which 100% will happen... I mean I don't think adjusting numbers for some magical optimizer algorithm every single patch/cstore release/lockbox drop is really going to be workable.
That one is still sore over the Tricobalt mine nerfs, I suppose.
I like long struggles and hate 10 min games.
This is not the quote I am talking about; the first post was edited by the OP after I made the post you quoted so I can see how there would be confusion. I'm referring to the fact that some of you actually think he was calling you 14 year olds -- he wasn't. This was riddled all over the OP before it was edited and that's where this came in:
Cheers,
Brandon =/\=