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Refused to fight

shanksboyshanksboy Member Posts: 42 Arc User
edited January 2013 in PvP Gameplay
Hi all,

With all the goings on about how to make PVP more accessible for the new ppl who would like to venture into it, i.e the boot camp, the upcoming tournament, more ppl in Opvp channel I was happy to see that it looked like pvp was heading in the right direction..then came today.

Thought about getting in a few matches before the Shard came down for maintainence in the FvK ques..Trouble is i have to PUG my matches as the fleet im in on klink side 95% of them dont PVP. Entered a match on Arena FvK, looked at the names on my team and then looked at the opposition. 4 Tsi on fed side..ok no problem, especially as i see 1 of the ppl on my team i have played with before and thought hes a good player, should be fun..We lost 15-6 i believe..customary gg at end and this person on my team says u will never beat TSI in pvp. I replied no i havent either and the same goes with the pandas but you have to at least try.

Qued again in Arena, the que pops quick..Checks again this person is on my side again. Check the opposition, TSI again.. "Lol not again" i put in zone chat, then this person who is on my team decides to cloak and hide for the entire match, totally gimping me and the other 2 players who are willing to fight with with pride and honour. This person actually said in chat that he refuses to fight against TSI and decided to watch..expecting this game to be over in seconds. My other team mates also said to him to get in and fight. Yet he totally refused.

We lost 15-4 and considering there was only 3 of us i was happy with the result as we gave them a dam good fight. This person also commented in zone chat when it was 9-3 i believe "WOW i thought this match would of been finished a long time ago".

Even the opposition commented on this person refusal to fight and like i said at the start i had fought along side this person in FvK ques a few times and i thought he was a strong player. Well i was wrong big time and TBH this is one of the 1st ppl i have ever seen on klingon side to refuse to fight or go AFK for the match.

I dont have the luxury of being in a premade and like i said i PUG all the time.Yet in all my time of Pugging i have never refused to fight a premade team. Hell if anything i believe it has made me a stronger player. Now i must emphasise it wasnt a full 5 man premade of TSI it was like 4 or 3 of them. I really hope this was a one off incident as i said before i have never seen a klink go AFK in a game.


On a side note im hoping to enter this tournament at the end of this month and was wondering how would i go about entering it if all i do is PUG. Would i be teamed with other ppl in my situation or would i be unable to enter. As i know a lot of my fleet wont PVP.


Morganna
7th KDF Battle Group
Post edited by shanksboy on
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Comments

  • maicake716maicake716 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    sadly this isnt the case, there have been more and more incidents of people warping out/refusing to fight against "known" fleets.

    i was in a match where there me was me and a second tsi member, and 3 people from the organizedpvp chat channel.... we ran into a premade team. they said something about tsi and they refuse to fight them and warped out.

    i actually have that match recorded.

    and posted to youtube.

    there are also incidents where a single tsi member will be on the team and a player will refuse to fight even though hes on the same team because hes under the impression that tsi "cheats".


    ah well.....
    mancom wrote: »
    Frankly, I think the only sound advice that one can give new players at this time is to stay away from PVP in STO.
    Science pvp at its best-http://www.youtube.com/user/matteo716
    Do you even Science Bro?
  • elandarkskyelandarksky Member Posts: 1,013 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    I'll hold my hand up, i will refuse to fight whole heatedly in pugVpremade

    Simply because its not worth trying.

    If i pvp, its to see what im like compared to other players, not to be ganged up on by pvp focused players :), dont get me wrong ill still try, but wont give it my all.

    Im ashamed to admit on the odd occasion i get so irritated i just take my shields+deflector off and just fly into their focusfiring spam :p
    [Combat (Self)] Your Bite deals 2378 (1475) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother.
  • snoge00fsnoge00f Member Posts: 1,812 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Yeah, I know of the loser who refused to fight. He was mentioned in OPvP before it went down. He's a sore winner and loser. If he's on your team, expect a total nub and a useless wanker.

    It's not like it's easy enough to get queues to pop and yet you have people who want to deliberately sabotage the game.


    Edit:

    General note to people who warp out on premades or hate premades:

    FFS, if you hate being wtfpwned in queues, make a damn pugmade in OPvP, that's what it is there for. If you queue solo expect anything, so don't complain.

    I can easily find one guy or two most of the time that I can queue with. If you have no one on, then just make a request in the chat channel.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • corbinwolf#9797 corbinwolf Member Posts: 565 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Geez, that sounds like douch bag behaviour to just sit there and watch you guys fight to the death...

    I found myself yesterday ambushed almost immediately at the (re)spawn point in my brand new Steamrunner ship... felt sad as really there wasn't a chance in hell of escaping the constant barrage of hits. Regardless though, I fought as best I could.

    I wish non PVPer's in general would accept challenges in space sector as sometimes I really just wanna go one to one. If ever interested PM me, it would be a great way to test my builds and meet someone new.
    "The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It's a very mean and nasty place and I don't care how tough you are it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain't about how hard ya hit. It's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward." - Rocky Balboa (2006)
  • maicake716maicake716 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    I'll hold my hand up, i will refuse to fight whole heatedly in pugVpremade

    Simply because its not worth trying.

    If i pvp, its to see what im like compared to other players, not to be ganged up on by pvp focused players :), dont get me wrong ill still try, but wont give it my all.

    Im ashamed to admit on the odd occasion i get so irritated i just take my shields+deflector off and just fly into their focusfiring spam :p

    before you flat out "give up" do you try to organize your pug team by saying "focus fire and stick together"? its amazing how effective a little communication can go in this game, even against "premades". not all 5 man teams from the same fleet are a premade. sometimes theyre just grouped together.


    Geez, that sounds like douch bag behaviour to just sit there and watch you guys fight to the death...

    I found myself yesterday ambushed almost immediately at the (re)spawn point in my brand new Steamrunner ship... felt sad as really there wasn't a chance in hell of escaping the constant barrage of hits. Regardless though, I fought as best I could.

    I wish non PVPer's in general would accept challenges in space sector as sometimes I really just wanna go one to one. If ever interested PM me, it would be a great way to test my builds and meet someone new.

    sadly non-pvprs have no interest in pvp. however feel free to join the organizedpvp chat channel in game, theres always plenty of people of all skill levels on there and i'm sure you could easily get a 1v1, if theres even any special requests on rules mention them too and i'm sure you'll still find people to duel.
    mancom wrote: »
    Frankly, I think the only sound advice that one can give new players at this time is to stay away from PVP in STO.
    Science pvp at its best-http://www.youtube.com/user/matteo716
    Do you even Science Bro?
  • dontdrunkimshootdontdrunkimshoot Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    play to win, always. pre and pug mades arent invincible, a little bit of battle instinct can make pugs that know how to play cohesive enough to challenge them. at least more kdf pugs
  • webdeathwebdeath Member Posts: 1,570 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    What bothers me is when a Premade will go into the Ques with the seeming goal to dry up the Ques and run everyone out of them. Not to give a challenge to them selves or the other pugs and premades they run into, but to make everyone's lives miserable just for that sake alone.

    Using tactics like: Tric Bomb + Warp Pee + Danube Pets + Theta + AMS + Grav Pulse + Tachyon Mines

    Those are obviously not in balance, and cause nothing but grief, yet they get used more and more by those said fleets with their premades. As if that is the only way they know how to win. This is especially worse on in the FvK ques, as the KDF players seem more interested in using said tactics then other wise.

    I haven't seen TSI doing those things lately. But then again I haven't seen much of TSI at all in the Ques. Maybe the ques just don't like to put me up against them. lol :D
    You think that your beta test was bad?
    Think about this:
    American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • snoge00fsnoge00f Member Posts: 1,812 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Yeah it's tragic really. QEW were a model for how to play the game on the Klingon side. With them gone and most of the other really good Klingon fleets disbanded, the Klingons have no one to follow but cheeseball nub fleets. So it's no surprise that most of the them follow their lead and abuse the most annoying garbage.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • sollvaxsollvax Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    No one should be able to display fleet names in the queue

    but that said
    TSI and pandas are both Known for being "unusually tough"
    and frankly if theres an exploit going they know about it
    Live long and Prosper
  • elandarkskyelandarksky Member Posts: 1,013 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    maicake716 wrote: »
    before you flat out "give up" do you try to organize your pug team by saying "focus fire and stick together"? its amazing how effective a little communication can go in this game, even against "premades". not all 5 man teams from the same fleet are a premade. sometimes theyre just grouped together.

    Again, speaking honestly and from my own experiences, after a point i gave in on communication, its either ignored fully or ridiculed (e.g. i have been in elite STFS and been told off for "talking too much"..), or ultimately not enough, ill not deny im not the strongest, and even if i can get 2/3 people to focus fire with me, the damage is glanced off and patched up all too quickly, (while getting pugs to cross heal can be like taking blood from a stone :p)

    While true, i find it hard that coincidence would give 5 people from the same fleet,.. so many times :p, i guess i can agree there

    And there is always the true statement 'fight premade with premade' but quick answer, i dont want to. its such a hassle, i would much rather see specific pvp instances for fleets/premades and pugs
    though i know that can never happen, seeing how hard it is to get a match going sometimes can be..
    [Combat (Self)] Your Bite deals 2378 (1475) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother.
  • cryox1cryox1 Member Posts: 33 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Shanksboy ,come join the House of Beautiful Orions.You will never feel intimidated by anyone;)


    On a sidenote: Isnt it ironic that the ONE player that is most FAMOUS and well known for warping out in Arenas when he had to face TSI or other premade,openly accusing them of cheating and exploiting is the very one that is organizing the new "clean " pvp tournament?

    Well,i guess after 3 years in this game,some of us knows just the "who is who" of STO pvp.
  • snoge00fsnoge00f Member Posts: 1,812 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    And there is always the true statement 'fight premade with premade' but quick answer, i dont want to. its such a hassle, i would much rather see specific pvp instances for fleets/premades and pugs
    though i know that can never happen, seeing how hard it is to get a match going sometimes can be..

    Dude, just ask in OPvP for a team. There's plenty of folks that will fly with you. They are in the same boat and looking for a team to fly with.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • stevehalestevehale Member Posts: 437
    edited January 2013
    Loggers, afkers, and warpers are worthless. I have no interest in these people or their fragile egos. By the by, doing any of these things is more harmful to the enjoyment of fellow players than a super griefing mega evil premade. Don't think your refusal to play makes you any less awful than whatever evil you think you face.

    Rationalize it however you want.
    __________________________________________
    Foundry: Yet Another Borg Mission
    It's terrible but easy, and these Borg are way cooler than the mess STO and Voyager left us.
    May not actually be "way" cooler or even "slightly" cooler.
  • paarethpaareth Member Posts: 91 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    It's a bit silly if you want the match over quicker to hide, better just to get in there and die. I am hopeless as an engineer + dreadnought in pvp - if any of the other team are in an escort anyway, but I die as good as anyone :), and have fun doing it.

    Gotta just be able to accept that you'll die in pvp, that's always part of it in any game, unless you're in a super escort with focused fire teammates. I prefer the control matches for this reason myself, as people waste their time shooting at me :), and the deaths don't add to the score.
  • thishorizonthishorizon Member Posts: 1,158
    edited January 2013
    To explore another side of this:

    Being part of several well performing premade teams on a couple well known fleets in the past... I can actually say I love both pugging and premade matches, as well as being part of a pug against a premade.

    Unfortunately, the downside is... As soon as someone sees "Damian" on the other side, I tend to be one of the first targets. I enjoy that too. I feel respected and feared. But, it does get old quick if its a pug v pug match being the ONLY guy being targeted....

    I mean, puggers will absolutely ignore everyone on my team! And save all of their nukes and grav pulses and thetas and ams just for me.

    And ain't that special.

    I guess what I'm trying to say is..... It's a game. Win or lose, swallow your pride once in a while.... Die a few times. It's all part of the game. Have fun, and be okay having fun being blown up..... I do.

    Have fun kill bad guys

    -thrusters on full-
  • shookyangshookyang Member Posts: 1,122
    edited January 2013
    Unfortunately, the downside is... As soon as someone sees "Damian" on the other side, I tend to be one of the first targets. I enjoy that too. I feel respected and feared. But, it does get old quick if its a pug v pug match being the ONLY guy being targeted....
    That's what my fleet does when we go into a pug match. Go after the people from established fleets first, or people we know who are pretty good.

    Though, if it's an inexperience team, we'll usually break off and just target at will. Or, at least I do anyways.
  • shanksboyshanksboy Member Posts: 42 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Thanks for the comments but i have a feeling this post is running off in the wrong direction of pug v premade...the OP was about some1 not going into battle because of a few members of a well known premade being in arena which i have no problem with...where myself i know wot can and will happen when i pug....i was just shocked thats all as i had never seen it happen before


    Morganna
    7th KDF battle group
  • thishorizonthishorizon Member Posts: 1,158
    edited January 2013
    But the reason this player refused to fight, was because it was a premade or partial premade team. It's the root of what the problem is.

    Nothing is going astray here man. Attack the root of the problem, try to appeal to people who read this thread and may not post. Explore all options, and try to reason.
  • aquitaine985aquitaine985 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    As much as I like moaning about TSI, it's not their fault. The same thing happens when people fly a certain ship. I was roasted in Kerrat yesterday because I was in a Jemmy and thus "unbeatable" it was only when I shared some tips and pointed out I can be easily be beaten but people in "lesser" ships did he fight and take part again.

    People see a well known tag, or a well known player or in my case a well known ship and just assume.

    @TSI - Once you've beaten the Pugs, mention the Bootcamp in chat, or offer your help.

    BRING DOWN BARRIERS MAN!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    @Aquitaine985
    Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
    A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
    2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
  • bobtheyakbobtheyak Member Posts: 374 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    cryox1 wrote: »
    Isnt it ironic that the ONE player that is most FAMOUS and well known for warping out in Arenas when he had to face TSI or other premade,openly accusing them of cheating and exploiting is the very one that is organizing the new "clean " pvp tournament?

    What ever happened to that alternate PvP channel? OrganizedNerdrage, was it?
  • travelingmastertravelingmaster Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    webdeath wrote: »
    What bothers me is when a Premade will go into the Ques with the seeming goal to dry up the Ques and run everyone out of them. Not to give a challenge to them selves or the other pugs and premades they run into, but to make everyone's lives miserable just for that sake alone.

    Using tactics like: Tric Bomb + Warp Pee + Danube Pets + Theta + AMS + Grav Pulse + Tachyon Mines

    Those are obviously not in balance, and cause nothing but grief, yet they get used more and more by those said fleets with their premades. As if that is the only way they know how to win. This is especially worse on in the FvK ques, as the KDF players seem more interested in using said tactics then other wise.

    I haven't seen TSI doing those things lately. But then again I haven't seen much of TSI at all in the Ques. Maybe the ques just don't like to put me up against them. lol :D

    This is pretty much what I dislike about premades. It's bad enough you're entering the pugs with an optimized pre-made team that will likely perform much, much better than the pugmades you'll be coming across. . .but rubbing people's noses in it by using broken/spammable skills and sci-spam? That's just a **** move. The fact that people do that is one of the reasons I don't queue for arenas and C+H, and only do those when it's a private pugmade. I prefer Ker'rat, because that way you can just enter and leave when you want, and the combat is fluid. Nothing better than seeing the tables turned on people who are abusing broken skills.
    My PvP toon is Krov, of The House of Snoo. Beware of my Hegh'ta of doom.
  • snoge00fsnoge00f Member Posts: 1,812 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    @TSI - Once you've beaten the Pugs, mention the Bootcamp in chat, or offer your help.

    BRING DOWN BARRIERS MAN!

    From what I've read they've tried that approach, but get told off in response.

    Someone who just got destroyed is not likely to be too amiable anyway.

    Some don't even say 'gg' at the end of matches because some may take that as an insult. lol.

    I do know that some of their ships advertise the bootcamp or even hilbert's guide.


    Those guys getting rolled over need to get in OPvP and make a pugmade to fight these premades.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • zarathos1978zarathos1978 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    snoge00f wrote: »
    Some don't even say 'gg' at the end of matches because some may take that as an insult. lol.

    When a premade nuked you till you started to glow, and then shot you in the dark - it was NOT a GG. For you, at least, so no wonder that people don't like GGs from premades.

    I was fleetless (still are), but when the fight was far from even I was never saying GG unless I was on the loosing side. Just thanked for play or if someone from other team left and rest stayed: thanked for staying. GG was a big nope in such cases.
    Those guys getting rolled over need to get in OPvP and make a pugmade to fight these premades.

    Not everyone wants to do any sort of "mades" or join some chat chanells.
  • snoge00fsnoge00f Member Posts: 1,812 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Not everyone wants to do any sort of "mades" or join some chat chanells.

    Their loss. This is a multiplayer game not a solo game. If you solo a queue, you take the good with the bad.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • devorasxdevorasx Member Posts: 693
    edited January 2013

    @TSI - Once you've beaten the Pugs, mention the Bootcamp in chat, or offer your help.

    BRING DOWN BARRIERS MAN!

    We do, or atleast I do!
    Co-founder of The Spanish Inquisition TSI - Cause no one expects it!

    PaxOttomana: gawd mirror event is like fighting a tsi premade, they keep comin and comin!
  • maicake716maicake716 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    As much as I like moaning about TSI, it's not their fault. The same thing happens when people fly a certain ship. I was roasted in Kerrat yesterday because I was in a Jemmy and thus "unbeatable" it was only when I shared some tips and pointed out I can be easily be beaten but people in "lesser" ships did he fight and take part again.

    People see a well known tag, or a well known player or in my case a well known ship and just assume.

    @TSI - Once you've beaten the Pugs, mention the Bootcamp in chat, or offer your help.

    BRING DOWN BARRIERS MAN!

    we do, and we offer advice. but there are so many people who just outright ignore you because they assume you cheat.....

    ive posted many a hilarious one sided convos on the opvp channel.....
    mancom wrote: »
    Frankly, I think the only sound advice that one can give new players at this time is to stay away from PVP in STO.
    Science pvp at its best-http://www.youtube.com/user/matteo716
    Do you even Science Bro?
  • paarethpaareth Member Posts: 91 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Ranked PVP Queue?

    Would experienced PVP'ers in premades like a ranked -optional- pvp queue (just for premades) that is likely to offer a challenge.

    As well as the regular queue? This seems more sensible as it takes away nothing, people can still fight in both queues, while offering something. As a bonus you'll get slightly less premades in the regular queue as some will be in ranked.

    For the ranks, titles, maybe even skins as a reward rather than gear. Perhaps this deserves it's own thread however.
  • maicake716maicake716 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    paareth wrote: »
    Ranked PVP Queue?

    Would experienced PVP'ers in premades like a ranked -optional- pvp queue (just for premades) that is likely to offer a challenge.

    As well as the regular queue? This seems more sensible as it takes away nothing, people can still fight in both queues, while offering something. As a bonus you'll get slightly less premades in the regular queue as some will be in ranked.

    For the ranks, titles, maybe even skins as a reward rather than gear. Perhaps this deserves it's own thread however.

    id be down for that, add the ranked que without changing the current que.
    mancom wrote: »
    Frankly, I think the only sound advice that one can give new players at this time is to stay away from PVP in STO.
    Science pvp at its best-http://www.youtube.com/user/matteo716
    Do you even Science Bro?
  • bitemepwebitemepwe Member Posts: 6,760 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Always Fight! Be not a nuch!
    Leonard Nimoy, Spock.....:(

    R.I.P
  • cryox1cryox1 Member Posts: 33 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    bobtheyak wrote: »
    What ever happened to that alternate PvP channel? OrganizedNerdrage, was it?

    I m not sure if it still exists.As far as i know Mikey isnt playing this game anymore.
    At least beyond his endless QQ and complaints was a spark of decency and coherence.
    In contrast, others that now plays the role of some PvP purists-rejuvenators-cleansers, when only months back were consistently warping out in Arenas when queued against TSI or other high end fleet (of the time) simply stating "I dont fight exploiters and cheaters".
    Apparently all that has been blown away by the wind of new "pvp changes"...and long
    forgotten.
    You guys are all a great big family now.
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