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Speculation about Tier 6 ships and the raising of the level cap.

fulleatherjacketfulleatherjacket Member Posts: 980 Arc User
I predict they will be brand new 25th century hull designs. I also predict they will be on par with Fleet ships with ten consoles, however they will have slightly weaker HP than the Fleet ships in order to keep players from complaining that their Fleet ships are suddenly obsolete. I also predict that they will be tied to new reputation systems for the Federation and KDF respectively and they will be Tier 5 requisition rewards.

And there will be great praise heaped upon Cryptic from some players and great rage and gnashing of teeth from others.
Post edited by fulleatherjacket on
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Comments

  • maicake716maicake716 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    i have a feeling when it happens, fleet ships will recieve a free "bump" up to tier 6 instead of tier 5.5.


    otherwise theyd be more then double dipping us, thatd be like.. tripple dipping or somthing.
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  • stirling191stirling191 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    maicake716 wrote: »
    i have a feeling when it happens, fleet ships will recieve a free "bump" up to tier 6 instead of tier 5.5.


    otherwise theyd be more then double dipping us, thatd be like.. tripple dipping or somthing.

    I can see it being subsidized (ala c-store ships having a reduced module cost for their fleet variant), but no way in hell will it be free. Cryptic and PWE can't keep their hands off another revenue stream.
  • duaths1duaths1 Member Posts: 1,232 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    it could be that they let us upgrade our fleet ships for one fleet module.

    this would also open a possibility - you could add a console of your choice, other stats would be given
  • johngazmanjohngazman Member Posts: 2,826 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    I predict they will be brand new 25th century hull designs. I also predict they will be on par with Fleet ships with ten consoles, however they will have slightly weaker HP than the Fleet ships in order to keep players from complaining that their Fleet ships are suddenly obsolete. I also predict that they will be tied to new reputation systems for the Federation and KDF respectively and they will be Tier 5 requisition rewards.

    And there will be great praise heaped upon Cryptic from some players and great rage and gnashing of teeth from others.

    More reputation projects? Ugh.

    Only if they reduce the cost of stuff. For individual projects, some stuff asks way too much.
    You're just a machine. And machines can be broken.
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  • stirling191stirling191 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    johngazman wrote: »
    More reputation projects? Ugh.

    Only if they reduce the cost of stuff. For individual projects, some stuff asks way too much.

    Don't worry, I'm sure they'll show us some metrics talking about how the average player doesnt complete enough reputation projects, and use that as a rationale to decrease all reputation related mark and commodity income.
  • anazondaanazonda Member Posts: 8,399 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    I can't speak to what they will be...

    I do know this: It's gonna be shooting themselves (Cryptic) in their foot, because of all the T5 ships people have already purchased.

    Launching T6 ships, without a possibility to (for free) upgrade your current ship to T6, will simply be THE most stupid idea Cryptic could possibly get.
    Don't look silly... Don't call it the "Z-Store/Zen Store"...
    Let me put the rumors to rest: it's definitely still the C-Store (Cryptic Store) It just takes ZEN.
    Like Duty Officers? Support effords to gather ideas
  • zerobangzerobang Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    call it my theory:

    There will be no Tier 6.
    There will be no Level Cap increase.

    dStahl keeps saying in every Ask Cryptic that it will happen because he keeps getting asked about it, but then he keeps talking about KDF, Exploration and PvP content for 3 years now and nothing ever happens. Pure PR BLAH if you ask me.

    Geko already said multiple times that there are good reasons for NOT doing it.

    a) higher level cap requires new Endgame Content that is scaled to the new cap -> requires either complete new content or new versions of all existing content, they do not have the manpower to pull off a complete new endgame just after working 2 Seasons now completely dedicated to what they call Endgame (Fleetbase+Rep Systems).

    b) he said they would INSTEAD introduce alternate ways of progression while keeping it all on the same level, the Reputation System IS that way, and you can be sure there will be a lot more Reputation Tabs with every Season from now on.




    also
    making all C-Store and Fleet Ships obsolete that Cryptic has introduced over the past 3 Years, and ALL gear would only TRIBBLE Players off that have invested a lot of money into their Ship collection.
    If that ever happens i predict a LOT of rage quitting over it.

    And to be honest i'm baffled that the per character Fleet Ships with their ridiculous Zen Pricetag for so little gain (and an UGLY Hull texture) have been so well received without any flames on the Forum.


    Adding levels 50 - 60 for FED+KDF would make the KDF mob even more angry, one year after removing the lower level ranks there is still no lvl1-25 content in sight.


    Adding levels 50 - 60 would make it that much harder to EVER introduce another full lvl1-60 Faction, be that Romulans or another one after that, and we are talking copy&paste cookie cutter Factions in STO anyway, it's not like they would invent new skills, professions, abilities or kits for the Romulans, they will just add pointed ears, a green Starbase a green UI a few Romulan Ships and Uniforms 10 or 20 levels of Romulan Mission gameplay (i'd expect no more than 10 missions anyway, that is more than the KDF ever got.) ...and dStahl even said in Interviews that he does not believe that people want a Romulan DOff pack or a Romulan Starbase but utilize the resources we already have.
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  • jumpingjsjumpingjs Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    If we have an Odyssey for teir 5, what the hell would be a tier 6? Maybe a ship with 5 5 weapon slots
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    I hope STO get's better ...
  • kurtzroykurtzroy Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Been thinking about this for awhile now, my speculation is that tier 6 ships will be more powerful then current fleet and tier 5 ships (after all that is kind of the idea of forward progression in a MMO).

    I can see 10 console being ships being the low end of tier 6, 11 being the standard and 12 being the advance/new fleet ships/special ships. I can also see them having better hull and shields. I can also see Cryptic making their own unique design's as well as making a few tier 6 versions of already existing ships or at least offer some sort of payed upgrade option for existing ships.
  • centersolacecentersolace Member Posts: 11,178 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    No! No! NO! T6 ships should not happen, cannot happen, and if it did happen, would result in a mass uprising led by myself using POWER CREEP PAY TO WIN! As a banner of great justice!

    And you want to know what? We would be right.

    NO T6 SHIPS.
  • puttenhamputtenham Member Posts: 1,052 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    ok i think there is gona be a level cap, but i dont think they will raise the tier of the ships.. they would never out date any of the ships they sell in the c store.. also, there is limits to how much they can add and still hold balance and playability.

    ie, im gonna randomly pick say the defient class as a test seubject.. right now, the fleet version has 10 conoles, 4 fore, 3 aft weapons, and 2 device slots.. it also has its boff layout.. i would say the only thing you could add to it would be device slots.. that would not really effect its overall power all that much.. to add a weapon slot would be insane, first off, power drains would be effected, secondly, it would make the ship retardedly op and cause all sorts of balance issues (and we all know how good cryptic is at mainting balance lol). not to mention, all the ships in the game are designed and mathmatically calculated to have the modifiers, power, and dmg output that they currently have.. that means adding another weapons slot potentially adds more accuracy, or crit chance or dmg, or over all dmg.. the nightmare that would insue is not worth the aggravation..

    now imagine having more boff slots.. i find myself with my hands full right now with all the boff slots i have. i feel it is a good balance, and a good i have a steady rotation of "powers" to maintain while still letting me immerse myself in the game play.. i think more boff slots would also be a mistake.. i know there is talk about department head skills and what not, but i still think it would be a mistake..

    also, we are not leaving the admiral rank yet, we are simply becoming "fleet admirals" i would assume that they would reserve an increase to t6 for a rank that actually changes out of the admiral rank system.. (which i know doesnt really make sense, but hey, this is cryptic were talking about lol... 3/4 of starfleet is already admirals lol...

    however, to play the other side of the fence, i felt that their was no way they would ever make t6 ships, that was until the fleet system hit.. now it is possible for them to make t6 ships, and upgrade the existing t5 ships to t6, and make a few bucks doing it.. i could get on bored with a t6 upgrade, if it is done fairly, and makes sense, however, cryptic has not really given me much faith to work on here.. so for now, i would vote no to a t6 ship system. not to mention, it is another thing that needs to be developed, taking devs away from more important things, like story line, bug fixes, and other content that is more worthy of their time...
  • flash525flash525 Member Posts: 5,441 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    I don't think this will happen personally. There are too many running issues that they'll have to overcome before hand. Firstly you've got the ships; Unless they update the fleet ships to tier 6 (which would be the cheap and lazy option) they're going to have to provide us with a bunch of new ones, that'll be what, nine ships or more?

    This would then make the fleet ships redundant. They can't release tier 6 ships with lower stats than current fleet ships, there wouldn't be enough of a difference between tier 5 and tier 6. In addition, if they went about upgrading fleet ships to the tier 6 mark, they've then presented themselves with bridge officer problems.

    From tier 1 through to tier 5, all the ships are equal and mirrored on bridge officer slots (such as the Star Cruiser having two science and one tactical, and the assault cruiser having two tactical and one science). The fleet ship setups are all over the place.


    The next problem is the ranking system. Where is the next logical step above admiral? Sure, there are labels they can use, but really? There is a reason why they are called Starship Captains, and the leveling system should have reflected that from the start. It should have been Cadet (level 0) > Ensign > Lieutenant Junior Grade > Lieutenant 2nd Class > Commander and then Captain to finish it off. Round that off at 50, it's all neat and done.


    As already mentioned too; end game content. They'd have to overhaul this. That's a lot of work right there, unless again they just took the easy route and changed end game content from level 50 players to level 60.


    Then there is the Klingon Faction (which is already missing earlier ranks); you think they'd be willing to add more higher ranks to them when they can't bring back the earlier ones?


    Honestly, I don't really desire a level increase. I think 50 is a nice level to end on, and we've got the top rank (Admiral). I'd rather them focus on completing the Klingons, giving us a 3rd faction and introducing more end-game content than I would about another 10 levels.
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  • puttenhamputtenham Member Posts: 1,052 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    No! No! NO! T6 ships should not happen, cannot happen, and if it did happen, would result in a mass uprising led by myself using POWER CREEP PAY TO WIN! As a banner of great justice!

    And you want to know what? We would be right.

    NO T6 SHIPS.

    while im with you for no t6 ships, this is the type of response that makes people not have sympathy for no t6 ships.. try explaining why, be constructive, and your point will go across much better lol...
  • puttenhamputtenham Member Posts: 1,052 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    flash525 wrote: »
    I don't think this will happen personally. There are too many running issues that they'll have to overcome before hand. Firstly you've got the ships; Unless they update the fleet ships to tier 6 (which would be the cheap and lazy option) they're going to have to provide us with a bunch of new ones, that'll be what, nine ships or more?

    This would then make the fleet ships redundant. They can't release tier 6 ships with lower stats than current fleet ships, there wouldn't be enough of a difference between tier 5 and tier 6. In addition, if they went about upgrading fleet ships to the tier 6 mark, they've then presented themselves with bridge officer problems.


    unfortunatly i think it might happen (not that i want it too) when they increase the level cap of the starbases to t6, they are gonna need new ships to put in there, and that to me screams upgrading the ones we already upgraded via the fleet system lol.. (makes perfect cryptic sense, right) make us pay a third time for ships we already technically baught twice already lol...
  • jumpingjsjumpingjs Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    No! No! NO! T6 ships should not happen, cannot happen, and if it did happen, would result in a mass uprising led by myself using POWER CREEP PAY TO WIN! As a banner of great justice!

    And you want to know what? We would be right.

    NO T6 SHIPS.

    I think your right ... but my way around it is , you can hand pick some of your BOFFs (like 1 -3 or something) and have them fly in their ships

    So tier 5 remains the most powerful . But you get some subordinates too.

    And tie in the reputation system for the BOFF ships and powers
    Hopefully I'll come back from my break; this break is fun; I play intellectual games.

    I hope STO get's better ...
  • centersolacecentersolace Member Posts: 11,178 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    puttenham wrote: »
    while im with you for no t6 ships, this is the type of response that makes people not have sympathy for no t6 ships.. try explaining why, be constructive, and your point will go across much better lol...

    I was simply adding my voice to the chorus. Zerobang, Anazonda, and yourself have all explained it very well. While I certainly could voice my opinion through walls of text to appeal to hardheaded uppity individuals like yourself, and have done so in the past, and likely will do so in the future.

    This time I have chosen to voice my disapproval of the obvious problem rather than the nitty gritty. It was not meant to be intelligent, witty, or clever by any means. It was meant as an obvious argument against and incredibly stupid idea. By that definition, my statement more than suffices.

    And stand it shall.

    A rather nice lesson to take from this, for forums, and even life in general, is to not insult the people who agree with you. Infighting only undermines our goal. That is what makes people have no sympathy for a cause.

    In the kindest, simplest, and most eloquent way I can put this; you have my support. If you don't like it.

    Tough Cookies.
  • flash525flash525 Member Posts: 5,441 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    puttenham wrote: »
    unfortunatly i think it might happen (not that i want it too) when they increase the level cap of the starbases to t6, they are gonna need new ships to put in there, and that to me screams upgrading the ones we already upgraded via the fleet system lol.. (makes perfect cryptic sense, right) make us pay a third time for ships we already technically baught twice already lol...
    This being the case, I am in luck. I've not purchased a fleet ship yet. Maybe I'll just wait for season 8, see what that gives us. ;)
    attachment.php?attachmentid=42556&d=1518094222
  • sekritagentsekritagent Member Posts: 510 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    zerobang wrote: »
    <snip>

    YES, someone that gets it. Raising the level cap is a bad, bad, bad idea all around.

    I'm of the opinion that we never should have progressed beyond the original level cap of RA5, which was a perfect rank. It was just north of Captain so you felt like you were making progress but not so high that it was silly to have many of them at this rank. The other thing is you could put all the NPC contacts at RAUH, VA, or Admiral and it would have been fine.

    It was painful upgrading ships, equipment, and BOff gear from Mk X everything to Mk XI or XII, I'm completely unwilling to do it again.

    The only new mechanic we need at Admiral is remote-commanding smaller ships (and I don't mean a fleet of T5 ships) but maybe no more than 1 or 2 T2 ships to command like fighters. I think Photonic Fleet was a mistake for this reason and should be renamed Photonic Support and limited to just 1 holo-ship.
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  • kurtzroykurtzroy Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    It's going to happen, it's been stated more then once. Power creep is already occurring now, so its the perfect opportunity and excuse for cryptic to roll out more powerful ships and make potentially more/extra money. So better sharpen your pitchforks and get your torches ready.
  • radkipradkip Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    johngazman wrote: »
    More reputation projects? Ugh.

    Only if they reduce the cost of stuff. For individual projects, some stuff asks way too much.
    The reputation system isn't that bad, and certainly not as bad as I thought it was going to be when I first saw it. I'm able to get my reputations projects going on a daily basis in reasonable speed.

    I am running out of EC though since I hit the later tiers of the Borg reputation. But at least EC is easy to get.
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  • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,557 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    dstahl mentioned in the latest Ask Cryptic that the Typhoon might be released when we reach Admiral. So if we reach Admiral, then we need new ships since each rank corresponded to new ships. My speculation on Admiral is that we can pilot our current T5 or T5.5 ships or take one of the new T6 ships. We can upgrade our bridge officers to Captain and they can take control of a ship that we are not currently using. We can alter the bridge layout, add equipment, etc. So that STF set that you are currently using now can be transferred now because you are using the next generation of STF gear. These ships can be sent on assignments or help do various missions. So it would work like away teams, but in space. If you solo, then you can have 4 other ships, but if you are in a team of 5, then they don't show up.
  • centersolacecentersolace Member Posts: 11,178 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    starkaos wrote: »
    dstahl mentioned in the latest Ask Cryptic that the Typhoon might be released when we reach Admiral. So if we reach Admiral, then we need new ships since each rank corresponded to new ships. My speculation on Admiral is that we can pilot our current T5 or T5.5 ships or take one of the new T6 ships. We can upgrade our bridge officers to Captain and they can take control of a ship that we are not currently using. We can alter the bridge layout, add equipment, etc. So that STF set that you are currently using now can be transferred now because you are using the next generation of STF gear. These ships can be sent on assignments or help do various missions. So it would work like away teams, but in space. If you solo, then you can have 4 other ships, but if you are in a team of 5, then they don't show up.

    Nooooooooooo.......... I don't want this to turn into Legacy......... :(
  • azurianstarazurianstar Member Posts: 6,985 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    People forget when we went from Rear Admiral to Vice Admiral. I could easily see Cryptic repeating the past by doing the same by merely tweeking the STFs (again) for the new Level 60. And other content already auto-scales people up.

    As for ships, depends on really how the greed bug happens. Given the power creep has made even the Elite STFs really easy, I could see existing T5 ships still being useful, except the NPCs would be a bit tougher to take down. Which could justify one or two players flying Dreadnaughts to act as a real tank.

    Another possibility is Cryptic revising their ship system for a Refit system. Given how we already got T2 ships being refitted for T5 with the Fleet system, they just need to find a way to let players upgrade their ships as they level up. So existing T5 ships could be refitted to T6.


    So I find it very doable. Just need them to spend time being creative in making new things to do.
  • centersolacecentersolace Member Posts: 11,178 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    People forget when we went from Rear Admiral to Vice Admiral. I could easily see Cryptic repeating the past by doing the same by merely tweeking the STFs (again) for the new Level 60. And other content already auto-scales people up.

    As for ships, depends on really how the greed bug happens. Given the power creep has made even the Elite STFs really easy, I could see existing T5 ships still being useful, except the NPCs would be a bit tougher to take down. Which could justify one or two players flying Dreadnaughts to act as a real tank.

    Another possibility is Cryptic revising their ship system for a Refit system. Given how we already got T2 ships being refitted for T5 with the Fleet system, they just need to find a way to let players upgrade their ships as they level up. So existing T5 ships could be refitted to T6.


    So I find it very doable. Just need them to spend time being creative in making new things to do.

    I'm not against raising the Level Cap (I miss the Level Up noise :(), in fact I welcome it. There's lots of clever ways that could be done, in order to give us the game we really need.

    I still don't think there is any right way to give us T6 ships. That boat sailed long ago. To get on it now would require crossing turbulent shark and kraken infested waters. Also, the water is lava.
  • neoakiraiineoakiraii Member Posts: 7,468 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    They would need a Fleet of awesome looking Tier 6 ships if they do decide to make them.....They can raise the cap and still keep the Tier 5 ships, and just give us new captain powers.
    GwaoHAD.png
  • jumpingjsjumpingjs Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Sorry to sound a pain

    But as an Star Fleet Admiral , we really ought to be in chairs just barking out orders. Not in Starship chairs ... but STARBASE CHAIRS! :eek:

    I think we need new content. Maybe a few new TIER 5 ships.

    But If we are getting a raise. I propose some of our boffs do some the cool work lie flying a starship while we fight in our own. We dont control them, but we do have power over what ship and abilitys they have. (controlled over the reputation system) But even then .... we would really be doing our job wrong. If we are Admiral we are needed not on our starship but on a base. (Vice admiral people is before an admiral) I am seriosuly against tier 6 ships. Just if there is a rank increase (which pushes STO even further out) just let there be a new game mechanic which does not trouble us like legacy , with new content BUT NO T6 ships
    Hopefully I'll come back from my break; this break is fun; I play intellectual games.

    I hope STO get's better ...
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  • kamiyama317kamiyama317 Member Posts: 1,295 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    I really hope they don't take a World of ******** approach to gear. Because that's exactly how WoW does it - you work your butt off to get the best gear, then they release and expansion that makes it all obsolete. Then you work your butt off to get the best gear again.

    Repeat... Repeat... Repeat...

    I don't want that type of system. I say they keep the Fleet Ships as the "best" ships in the game. Mark XII should be the highest mark of gear in the game.

    They should focus on storyline and bugfixes. Add new ships? New weapons? New Sets? Sure, just don't upset the existing tier and mark system.
  • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,557 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    It all depends on what type of Admiral do we want to be. Its either being stuck behind a desk or piloting a fleet of ships. I am certain that most STO players don't want to play Bureaucracy. The only way I can think of on how our previous equipment and ships would be useful is to promote our Bridge Officers to Captain and have them pilot our old ships. So assignments would include sending ships to do them instead of just crew members. Whether Tier 6 is added to the game, only the devs have a clue. However, the game is set up so each rank means new unlocked ships. Therefore, people would be upset if new ships aren't unlocked when they get to level 60. Besides a Tier 5 ship won't be enough to deal with Iconians. If they raise the level of the endgame opponents, then they need to raise the level of the ship. If level 60 endgame enemy ships can easily deal with the Borg, then how do people expect us to defeat those enemy ships with Tier 5 ships? Better equipment would help, but better ships would make us deal with those threats on a more even playing field.
  • leviathan99#2867 leviathan99 Member Posts: 7,747 Arc User
    edited January 2013
    Instead of T6 ships, why not just have major buffs (10% to all stats), new costumes, and unlocks lie console slots for existing ships?
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