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Fleet Ship Rework Ideas

kiloacekiloace Member Posts: 488 Arc User
edited December 2012 in Federation Discussion
Yes, I know I have another thread, but this is really important to me, so I'm gonna keep making threads. They've gotta see one of them eventually right?

ALL FLEET SCIENCE VESSELS NOW HAVE THE SHIELD MODIFIER OF 1.43 (10% less is 1.3)!

ALL FLEET CRUISERS NOW HAVE THE SHIELD MODIFIER OF 1.1 (10% less is 1.0)!

ALL FLEET ESCORTS NOW HAVE THE SHIELD MODIFIER OF 0.99 (10% less is 0.9)!



Fleet Cruiser Retrofit

Just....IMPLEMENT IT! Please, Cryptic. Please, Perfect World. PLEASE, CBS. WE WANT A FLEET CRUISER!

Fleet Science Vessel Retrofit

Hull: 28,500 (10% less is 25,650)

Weapons: 3 Fore, 3 Aft

BOFF Stations:


Commander Science
Lieutenant Cmdr. Science


Lieutenant Eng

Lieutenant Tac

Ensign Universal

Consoles:
3 Engineer

4 Science

3 Tactical

Fleet Escort Retrofit

Hull: 33,000

Weapons: 4 Fore, 3 Aft

BOFF Stations:

Commander Tac
Lieutenant Cmdr. Tac


Lieutenant Eng

Lieutenant Sci

Ensign Universal

Consoles:
3 Engineer

4 Tactical

3 Science

Fleet Heavy Cruiser

Hull: 41,200 (10% less: 37,080)

Weapons: 4 Fore, 4 Aft

BOFF Stations:

Commander Eng
Lieutenant Eng


Lieutenant Cmdr. Tac

Lieutenant Sci

Ensign Universal

Consoles:
3 Tactical

5 Engineer

2 Science

Heavy Escort Carrier

Hull: 34,250

Weapons: 4 Fore, 3 Aft

BOFF Stations:

Commander Tac
Lieutenant Tac


Lieutenant Cmdr. Eng

Lieutenant Sci

Ensign Universal

Consoles:
4 Engineer

4 Tactical

2 Science

Fleet Research Science Vessel

Hull: 29,100

Weapons: 3 Fore, 3 Aft

BOFF Stations:

Commander Sci
Lieutenant Sci


Lieutenant Cmdr. Tac

Lieutenant Eng

Ensign Universal

Consoles:
3 Tactical

5 Science

2 Engineer

Fleet Exploration Cruiser Retrofit

Hull: 44,000

Weapons: 4 Fore, 4 Aft

BOFF Stations:

Commander Eng
Lieutenant Cmdr. Eng


Lieutenant Sci

Lieutenant Tac

Ensign Universal

Consoles:

3 Science

5 Engineer

2 Tactical

Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit

Hull: 33,000

Weapons: 4 Fore, 3 Aft

BOFF Stations:

Commander Tac
Lieutenant Cmdr. Tac


Lieutenant Eng

Lieutenant Sci

Ensign Universal

Consoles:

3 Engineer

5 Tactical

2 Science


Fleet Assault Cruiser

Hull: 42,900

Weapons: 4 Fore, 4 Aft

BOFF Stations:

Commander Eng
Lieutenant Eng
Ensign Eng


Lieutenant Sci

Lieutenant Cmdr. Tac

Consoles:

4 Tactical

4 Engineer

2 Science

Fleet Star Cruiser

Hull: 42,900

Weapons: 4 Fore, 4 Aft

BOFF Stations:

Commander Eng
Lieutenant Eng
Ensign Eng


Lieutenant Cmdr. Sci

Lieutenant Tac

Consoles:

4 Science

4 Engineer

2 Tactical

Fleet Advanced Escort

Hull: 34,100

Weapons: 4 Fore, 3 Aft

BOFF Stations:

Commander Tac
Lieutenant Tac
Ensign Tac


Lieutenant Cmdr. Sci

Lieutenant Eng

Consoles:

3 Science

5 Tactical

2 Engineer

Fleet Patrol Escort

Hull: 34,100

Weapons: 4 Fore, 3 Aft

BOFF Slots:

Commander Tac
Lieutenant Tac
Ensign Tac


Lieutenant Cmdr. Eng

Lieutenant Sci

Consoles:

4 Engineer

4 Tactical

2 Science

I will periodically add and edit this board based on my feelings, your feedback, and other ideas. Check back frequently!
Post edited by kiloace on

Comments

  • hereticknight085hereticknight085 Member Posts: 3,783 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Just gonna say it right now. Your fleet connie ain't happening. Sry bro.
    It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once. B)
  • kiloacekiloace Member Posts: 488 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Just gonna say it right now. Your fleet connie ain't happening. Sry bro.

    At the very least we still have the Exeter/Excalibur/Vesper available.
  • adamkafeiadamkafei Member Posts: 6,539 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Your fleet Nova suggestion... No.

    I quite like the ability to lock a ship down AND destroy it myself while tanking well...

    Do what you want with the others
    ZiOfChe.png?1
  • travelingmastertravelingmaster Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    I have to say no on the shield modifier for fleet sci ships and cruisers. Competent PvPers have an ungodly ability to shield tank as it is. Last thing this game needs is stronger shields.
    My PvP toon is Krov, of The House of Snoo. Beware of my Hegh'ta of doom.
  • kiloacekiloace Member Posts: 488 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    adamkafei wrote: »
    Your fleet Nova suggestion... No.

    I quite like the ability to lock a ship down AND destroy it myself while tanking well...

    Do what you want with the others

    You're gonna have to elaborate on that, man. What's the issue?
    I have to say no on the shield modifier for fleet sci ships and cruisers. Competent PvPers have an ungodly ability to shield tank as it is. Last thing this game needs is stronger shields.

    Those shields aren't stronger shields. The Fleet LRSV, Fleet Recon, Fleet Deep Space and Fleet Advanced Research Vessel already have a modifier of 1.43. In Fact, the new timeships have a modifier of 1.45! For whatever reasons, cryptic thinks the fleet ships at the same price and the same level should have an absurd difference in shield modifier. This is especially problematic with Science Vessels, which depend heavily on shield and have weak hulls.

    I suggest (request) that all science vessels have the same shield modifier as the endgame variants. Same with cruisers and Escorts. Here's a chart on STO wiki to see how big the shield difference is:

    http://www.stowiki.org/Federation_Science_Vessel
  • misterde3misterde3 Member Posts: 4,195 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    kiloace wrote: »
    Those shields aren't stronger shields. The Fleet LRSV, Fleet Recon, Fleet Deep Space and Fleet Advanced Research Vessel already have a modifier of 1.43. In Fact, the new timeships have a modifier of 1.45! For whatever reasons, cryptic thinks the fleet ships at the same price and the same level should have an absurd difference in shield modifier. This is especially problematic with Science Vessels, which depend heavily on shield and have weak hulls.

    I suggest (request) that all science vessels have the same shield modifier as the endgame variants. Same with cruisers and Escorts. Here's a chart on STO wiki to see how big the shield difference is:

    http://www.stowiki.org/Federation_Science_Vessel

    I think you're overlooking a few very important details:

    The reason the Fleet Science Vessel (SV) has such low hull and shields is turnrate (14).
    The Fleet DDSV only has one of 11.
    And even though it's not listed on the Wiki's page, I also assume the Fleet SV has the same 0.2 impulse mod as the SV Refit and Retrofit.
    Meaning it basically handles nearly as well as an escort, something that also makes it harder to hit thanks to the superior defense values that come from speed.

    While the Fleet RSV has the same shield mode as the Fleet DSSV, it also has less hull and only slightly more hull than the Fleet SV..
    The reverse is true for the Fleet ARV which has the same shield mod as the Fleet DSSV but more hull.

    Honest question: have you taken these things into consideration?
  • kiloacekiloace Member Posts: 488 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    misterde3 wrote: »
    I think you're overlooking a few very important details:

    The reason the Fleet Science Vessel (SV) has such low hull and shields is turnrate (14).
    The Fleet DDSV only has one of 11.

    The Recon Science Vessel has a turn rate of 13. The Fleet LRSV has one of 12. Those are a 1-2 point difference.

    Now, maybe my scaling is off, because some of the things in this game are hard to perceive (turn rate included) so how big of a difference is there between 1 point of turn rate?
    And even though it's not listed on the Wiki's page, I also assume the Fleet SV has the same 0.2 impulse mod as the SV Refit and Retrofit.

    I thought it was 0.15 last I checked. But if it is 0.2,
    Meaning it basically handles nearly as well as an escort, something that also makes it harder to hit thanks to the superior defense values that come from speed.

    right. And therefore a small ship with high maneuverability doesn't need to be so tanky.
    While the Fleet RSV has the same shield mode as the Fleet DSSV, it also has less hull and only slightly more hull than the Fleet SV..

    Meh..."slightly more" is what I would call my change. But yes, I see what you're saying.
    The reverse is true for the Fleet ARV which has the same shield mod as the Fleet DSSV but more hull.

    -and lower manueverability.
    Honest question: have you taken these things into consideration?

    Honest answer: I can't claim to be 100% unbiased on these tweaks. The Nova is my favorite ship in the entire game. Likewise, I just don't want it to be "worse" than the other options of a same tier.

    Yes, I did take these into consideration, but, again, as some of this is hard to percieve, I may be a bit off in my changes. 1,200 points of hull seems to me like a fair trade of 1-2 points of turn rate, and since shields are big on science vessels (as in important) I think the Nova shouldn't be shortchanged on account of slightly increased maneuverability.

    But, again, it boils down to perception. 1 point of turn rate could be huge, as can increased impulse mod, and I just don't know it right now. Likewise, the shield modifier may not make an enormous difference and I'm mislead. I don't know.
  • cidstormcidstorm Member Posts: 1,220 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    The lower tier fleet ships genuinely need a buff, I reccomend minor innate abilities like excelsiors.
  • bghostbghost Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    about the fleet sci vessel......NO!

    Commander sci
    Ensign sci


    Lieutenant eng
    Lieutenant eng


    LT. Commander tac
  • adamkafeiadamkafei Member Posts: 6,539 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    kiloace wrote: »
    You're gonna have to elaborate on that, man. What's the issue?

    I have a LTC tactical which suits me brilliantly giving me some nasty damage figures (4 beams giving 1k per without EPtW maxing at 1.5k) while the ensign sci gives me a convenient polarise hull for added defence, the only request I have of the ship is an ensign engineer which I can live perfectly well without.

    Taking that away from it would kill that ship
    ZiOfChe.png?1
  • kiloacekiloace Member Posts: 488 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    adamkafei wrote: »
    I have a LTC tactical which suits me brilliantly giving me some nasty damage figures (4 beams giving 1k per without EPtW maxing at 1.5k) while the ensign sci gives me a convenient polarise hull for added defence, the only request I have of the ship is an ensign engineer which I can live perfectly well without.

    Taking that away from it would kill that ship

    Ah, I see.


    I've been toying with the idea of making some of the slots on Fleet ships universal (or something like semi-universal - Tac/Sci only, Eng/Tac only, etc.) but it would take me awhile to get it balanced. How would something like that fit?
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