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Time to turn better

alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
edited October 2012 in Federation Discussion
Now that we have cruiser/escort ships like the Chimira Class that have base turn rate at 14, now its time to adjust the turn rate of the ships like the Galaxy brand to higher than 6. After adding my skill tree, my turn rate in the Chimira was 28.6. Thats extrordinary for a ship the size of a ship the size of an assault cruiser minus the engine length. With the same skill tree and a Jem'Hadar engine added to my Galaxy Dreadnought, my turn rate was only boosted 3.8 points to 9.8. Why can't I get the same doubled turn rate boost in my Galaxy brands? I should at least get boosted to 12 for my Galaxy brands.
Post edited by alexindcobra on
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Comments

  • shookyangshookyang Member Posts: 1,122
    edited October 2012
    Now that we have cruiser/escort ships like the Chimira Class that have base turn rate at 14, now its time to adjust the turn rate of the ships like the Galaxy brand to higher than 6. After adding my skill tree, my turn rate in the Chimira was 28.6. Thats extrordinary for a ship the size of a ship the size of an assault cruiser minus the engine length. With the same skill tree and a Jem'Hadar engine added to my Galaxy Dreadnought, my turn rate was only boosted 3.8 points to 9.8. Why can't I get the same doubled turn rate boost in my Galaxy brands? I should at least get boosted to 12 for my Galaxy brands.
    Because the increase is in %. A 50% increase on a turn rate of 6 is going to give you a total of 9. But, a 50% increase on a turn rate of 16 is going to give you a total of 24.

    If you're proposing that the Cruiser have the same turn rate as an Escort, it's never going to happen.

    If you're proposing that the Cruiser have the same turn rate as a Klingon cruiser, it's probably still not going to happen.
  • adamkafeiadamkafei Member Posts: 6,539 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    I'm sorry but firstly there is no rule against reverse gear, heck I use that in my excelsior with base turn of 8, secondly I get 14 out of my cruiser, anything higher makes it hard to keep a broadside going
    ZiOfChe.png?1
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    Base turn rate is 14 on the Chimira, look at it in the ship requisition. Its time for you to check your math.

    50%=.50

    .5 x 14=7

    7+14=21

    My Chimira final turn rate was not a half boost. It was doubled and a .8 added with out any special engine added.

    2x14=28

    End result is 28.8

    My Galaxy Dreadnought base turn rate is 6. and only got a 50% boost from my skill tree and Jem engine. End result, 9.8. Why can't I also get the doubled boost that the Chimira enjoys? My new turnrate for my Galaxy Dreadnought should be 12.8 This is where I'm saying to the Devs, it is time to adjust the Galaxy brand's turn rate and not artificially cripple them after stats not matching. If every ship I get in gets a x2 boost because of the skill tree, then that should also go for my Galaxy brands.
  • bitemepwebitemepwe Member Posts: 6,760 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    shookyang wrote: »
    Because the increase is in %. A 50% increase on a turn rate of 6 is going to give you a total of 9. But, a 50% increase on a turn rate of 16 is going to give you a total of 24.

    If you're proposing that the Cruiser have the same turn rate as an Escort, it's never going to happen.

    If you're proposing that the Cruiser have the same turn rate as a Klingon cruiser, it's probably still not going to happen.

    I would not be against this change to Cruisers and Battle Cruisers;

    Cruiser 9 (10-11)
    Cruiser Refit 9 (10-11)
    Advanced Heavy Cruiser 8 (9-10)
    Heavy Cruiser 8 (9-10)
    Exploration Cruiser Refit 6 (7-8)
    Exploration Cruiser 6 (7-8)
    Advanced Heavy Cruiser Retrofit 8 (9-10)
    Mirror Universe Assault Cruiser 7 (8-9)
    Star Cruiser 7 (8-9)
    Mirror Universe Star Cruiser 7 (8-9)
    Assault Cruiser 7 (8-9)
    Dreadnought Cruiser 6 (7-8)
    Heavy Cruiser Retrofit 8 (9-10)
    Fleet Heavy Cruiser Retrofit 8 (9-10)
    Odyssey Science Cruiser 6 (7-8)
    Fleet Exploration Cruiser Retrofit 6 (7-8)
    Odyssey Operations Cruiser 6 (7-8)
    Exploration Cruiser Retrofit 6 (7-8)
    Fleet Star Cruiser 7 (8-9)
    Odyssey Star Cruiser 6 (7-8)
    Assault Cruiser Refit 7 (8-9)
    Odyssey Tactical Cruiser 6 (7-8)


    K't'inga Battle Cruiser Refit 11 12
    K't'inga Battle Cruiser 11 12
    Vor'cha Battle Cruiser 7 8-9
    Vor'cha Battle Cruiser Refit 10 11
    Negh'Var Heavy Battle Cruiser 9 10
    Vor'cha Battle Cruiser Retrofit 10 11
    Mirror Universe Vor'cha Battle Cruiser 10 11
    K't'inga Battle Cruiser Retrofit 11 12
    Bortas Battle Cruiser 5.5 6.5-7.5
    K't'inga Battle Cruiser Retrofit 11 12
    Bortasqu' Command Cruiser 5.5 6.5-7.5
    Fleet Tor'Kaht Battle Cruiser Retrofit 10 11
    Bortasqu' Tactical Cruiser 5.5 6.5-7.5
    Fleet Negh'Var Heavy Battle Cruiser 9 10
    Bortasqu' War Cruiser 5.5 6.5-7.5

    I think this colored changes seem fair. They give the fed Cruisers a 1-2 point turnrate boost and keep the KDF from being infringed by giving them 1 point boost on average with 2 point on just 1 or 2 vessels to keep them from being to slow.
    Leonard Nimoy, Spock.....:(

    R.I.P
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    12.8 would be a great turn rate for my cruiser. Nobody is asking for the turn rate of a cruiser to be in the 20's. If the base turn rate is 6 and it get doubled when added to a player's skill tree, then its in no danger of getting close to 20. My other ships get a x2 boost, my Galaxy should get a x2 boost, also.
  • jacenjacen24jacenjacen24 Member Posts: 159 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    My only guesswould be that the modifiers get added in a different order. And the 50% bonus from skilltree is last.

    Like base plus the jem engine plus consoles then skill tre? This is a guess
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    bitemepwe wrote: »
    I would not be against this change to Cruisers and Battle Cruisers;

    Cruiser 9 (10-11)
    Cruiser Refit 9 (10-11)
    Advanced Heavy Cruiser 8 (9-10)
    Heavy Cruiser 8 (9-10)
    Exploration Cruiser Refit 6 (7-8)
    Exploration Cruiser 6 (7-8)
    Advanced Heavy Cruiser Retrofit 8 (9-10)
    Mirror Universe Assault Cruiser 7 (8-9)
    Star Cruiser 7 (8-9)
    Mirror Universe Star Cruiser 7 (8-9)
    Assault Cruiser 7 (8-9)
    Dreadnought Cruiser 6 (7-8)
    Heavy Cruiser Retrofit 8 (9-10)
    Fleet Heavy Cruiser Retrofit 8 (9-10)
    Odyssey Science Cruiser 6 (7-8)
    Fleet Exploration Cruiser Retrofit 6 (7-8)
    Odyssey Operations Cruiser 6 (7-8)
    Exploration Cruiser Retrofit 6 (7-8)
    Fleet Star Cruiser 7 (8-9)
    Odyssey Star Cruiser 6 (7-8)
    Assault Cruiser Refit 7 (8-9)
    Odyssey Tactical Cruiser 6 (7-8)


    K't'inga Battle Cruiser Refit 11 12
    K't'inga Battle Cruiser 11 12
    Vor'cha Battle Cruiser 7 8-9
    Vor'cha Battle Cruiser Refit 10 11
    Negh'Var Heavy Battle Cruiser 9 10
    Vor'cha Battle Cruiser Retrofit 10 11
    Mirror Universe Vor'cha Battle Cruiser 10 11
    K't'inga Battle Cruiser Retrofit 11 12
    Bortas Battle Cruiser 5.5 6.5-7.5
    K't'inga Battle Cruiser Retrofit 11 12
    Bortasqu' Command Cruiser 5.5 6.5-7.5
    Fleet Tor'Kaht Battle Cruiser Retrofit 10 11
    Bortasqu' Tactical Cruiser 5.5 6.5-7.5
    Fleet Negh'Var Heavy Battle Cruiser 9 10
    Bortasqu' War Cruiser 5.5 6.5-7.5

    I think this colored changes seem fair. They give the fed Cruisers a 1-2 point turnrate boost and keep the KDF from being infringed by giving them 1 point boost on average with 2 point on just 1 or 2 vessels to keep them from being to slow.

    I don't know why you guys arguing about Fed and KDF, because this is for all ships that suffer the crippled turn rate. Even if they don't want to change the base turn rates, at least they should share the bonuses that skill trees provide. Thats the whole point of having a skill tree to add bonuses to the ship's base stats. If there is a x2 bonus added to other ships rom skill tree, then the Galaxy brands or any ship using the "6" turn rate should also enjoy that x2 bonus.
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    If we got this x2 for our Galaxy brands, then we would shut up about turn rate in a long time.
  • shookyangshookyang Member Posts: 1,122
    edited October 2012
    Base turn rate is 14 on the Chimira, look at it in the ship requisition. Its time for you to check your math.

    50%=.50

    .5 x 14=7

    7+14=21

    My Chimira final turn rate was not a half boost. It was doubled and a .8 added with out any special engine added.

    2x14=28

    End result is 28.8

    My Galaxy Dreadnought base turn rate is 6. and only got a 50% boost from my skill tree and Jem engine. End result, 9.8. Why can't I also get the doubled boost that the Chimira enjoys? My new turnrate for my Galaxy Dreadnought should be 12.8 This is where I'm saying to the Devs, it is time to adjust the Galaxy brand's turn rate and not artificially cripple them after stats not matching. If every ship I get in gets a x2 boost because of the skill tree, then that should also go for my Galaxy brands.
    And, of course you realize that impulse speed also affects your turn rate, right?

    Are you flying your Galaxy at the same impulse speed as your Chimera? How about inertia? Are they the same?
  • hereticknight085hereticknight085 Member Posts: 3,783 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Enough. Enough with these kinds of threads. The Chimera is a HEAVY DESTROYER. It's supposed to be able to turn better than your Gal-X. It still is outstripped by escorts of course, but seriously. You gotta get off your high horse already. The Chimera probably also gets a better passive boost because you need to pay $300 (or 200 if you got the discount) for it. OF COURSE IT'S GOING TO BE BETTER THAN YOUR DREADNAUGHT. Why don't you stop trying to play a cruiser like an escort, and either A) Play your cruiser like a cruiser, or B) Get a bloody escort and stop complaining.
    It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once. B)
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    shookyang wrote: »
    And, of course you realize that impulse speed also affects your turn rate, right?

    Are you flying your Galaxy at the same impulse speed as your Chimera? How about inertia? Are they the same?

    I did the test while both ships are at full speed. This is the same character, mind you.
  • adamkafeiadamkafei Member Posts: 6,539 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Heretick is right, you're comparing a cruiser (perhaps the tankiest in the game) to what is effectively an escort... that doesn't work mate.

    As for a turn rate boost to all cruisers, Excelsiors really don't need it and frankly I don't want it for mine, I do however support it for every other cruiser below 8 base
    ZiOfChe.png?1
  • shookyangshookyang Member Posts: 1,122
    edited October 2012
    I did the test while both ships are at full speed. This is the same character, mind you.
    Full speed isn't the same as having the same impulse speed.

    Turn rate is affected by your ships inertia (lower means lower turn and impulse speed) and your ship's impulse speed.

    Those are additional modifiers to your turn rate.

    You can look at what your impulse speed by bringing up your character sheet and looking at the movement tab. Or, you can hover your mouse over the impulse slider bar.

    I'm doubtful that your Galaxy Dreadnought has the same impulse as your Chimera.

    It's very easy to test this.

    Go to the Sol System (not sector space). Set your power settings to something like Offensive or Defensive mode. Go at your fastest speed without going into max impulse and check your character sheet (movement tab). It should tell what your max impulse speed and turn rate is (without diverting all power to your engines).

    Switch to Speed mode, which will set your engine power to 100. You'll now see your turn rate and impulse speed increase.
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    Enough. Enough with these kinds of threads. The Chimera is a HEAVY DESTROYER. It's supposed to be able to turn better than your Gal-X. It still is outstripped by escorts of course, but seriously. You gotta get off your high horse already. The Chimera probably also gets a better passive boost because you need to pay $300 (or 200 if you got the discount) for it. OF COURSE IT'S GOING TO BE BETTER THAN YOUR DREADNAUGHT. Why don't you stop trying to play a cruiser like an escort, and either A) Play your cruiser like a cruiser, or B) Get a bloody escort and stop complaining.

    The current turn rate for the Galaxy brand and the likes there of is not a canon turn rate for a cruiser in Star Trek, so you trying to acuse us of trying to play like an escort is baseless. The gap between bonuses added by skill trees should be fair and not artificially crippled to make certain other ships seem more attractive. That destroys the credability of this game being a Star Trek game. Many of us, minus yourself, have put up some numbers and math to debate. Pointing fingers and trying to start a fight between cruiser players and escort players is uncalled for in this thread. It shows that you are one sided and want to stay dominate over other types of ships. I don't want your stinking bloody, escort, so go start an escort enthusiast thread somewhere else.
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    shookyang wrote: »
    Full speed isn't the same as having the same impulse speed.

    Turn rate is affected by your ships inertia (lower means lower turn and impulse speed) and your ship's impulse speed.

    Those are additional modifiers to your turn rate.

    You can look at what your impulse speed by bringing up your character sheet and looking at the movement tab. Or, you can hover your mouse over the impulse slider bar.

    I'm doubtful that your Galaxy Dreadnought has the same impulse as your Chimera.

    Both ships only got max turn rates at max speed. You can got test it yourself instead of sitting here arguing with me.
  • hereticknight085hereticknight085 Member Posts: 3,783 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    The current turn rate for the Galaxy brand and the likes there of is not a canon turn rate for a cruiser in Star Trek, so you trying to acuse us of trying to play like an escort is baseless. The gap between bonuses added by skill trees should be fair and not artificially crippled to make certain other ships seem more attractive. That destroys the credability of this game being a Star Trek game. Many of us, minus yourself, have put up some numbers and math to debate. Pointing fingers and trying to start a fight between cruiser players and escort players is uncalled for in this thread. It shows that you are one sided and want to stay dominate over other types of ships. I don't want your stinking bloody, escort, so go start an escort enthusiast thread somewhere else.

    Wow dude. Just wow. I am an Engineering Captain who flies a fkin Odyssey. That thing is a space whale. I AM A CRUISER PILOT (or did you miss the cruiser thread I started a few weeks ago? Or the fact I have posted in support of cruisers on almost every thread that included them?). I don't fly escorts unless I absolutely have to. And look at it this way. LIFETIME SUBSCRIBERS will always get the best stuff. They had to pay quite a bit to get said heavy destroyers. And those are heavy destroyers. Their name alone implies combat based. And you need to move around to do combat. And the Dreadnaught can CLOAK. It's designed for ambush nuking, not dogfighting. And I have put up numbers. Look at my thread and all the other threads I posted in involving cruisers. I have put up calculations, numbers, suggestions.

    So please, before making a fool of yourself, please at least have proper false information to back it up so you don't seem like an overblown windbag that sees only his own ideas. This is not Burger King, you cannot have it your way.
    It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once. B)
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    adamkafei wrote: »
    Heretick is right, you're comparing a cruiser (perhaps the tankiest in the game) to what is effectively an escort... that doesn't work mate.

    As for a turn rate boost to all cruisers, Excelsiors really don't need it and frankly I don't want it for mine, I do however support it for every other cruiser below 8 base

    He is not right because he didn't read the whole thread where I mentioned testing with other ships, and he didn't put any debatable numbers but just yell out his point of view.
  • adamkafeiadamkafei Member Posts: 6,539 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Look man, if you wanna fly a cruiser AND keep up with most things, get an Excelsior and everyone is happy.

    Otherwise I'm afraid you get what you're given...
    ZiOfChe.png?1
  • hereticknight085hereticknight085 Member Posts: 3,783 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    He is not right because he didn't read the whole thread where I mentioned testing with other ships, and he didn't put any debatable numbers but just yell out his point of view.

    Yes, please, disregard my post about being a cruiser pilot. Contrary to common belief, I actually read ENTIRE threads before posting. Not doing so would be an insult if I responded. I looked at the numbers. I looked at what you were asking, and at your testing. And I say again, the Chimera is a LTS ship ONLY. You pay an arm and a leg for it (300 dollars? really? Or 1000 days worth of monthly subscription. Really?) and as such, you get a ship that can perform at that level.

    You are asking for other ships that not only do not have that level of commitment into the game to be able to perform that well, but that a ship that required that level of commitment be nerfed to match a regular ship. That isn't right bro.
    It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once. B)
  • shookyangshookyang Member Posts: 1,122
    edited October 2012
    Both ships only got max turn rates at max speed. You can got test it yourself instead of sitting here arguing with me.
    I understand that. However, what you are failing to understand is that turn rate is dictated by several factors (engines, ship's inherit turn rate, inertia, impulse speed, consoles, etc). Cruisers have a lower inertia (lower impulse speed) and a lower turn rate. Since the modifiers provided by equipment (and probably inertia and impulse speed) are from percentages, a lower numerical value with have a lower gain from the modifiers with percentages.

    It is not a straight 2x turn rate. Your Chimera has a higher turn rate value and higher inertia (probably), the latter case means that your Chimera's impulse speed is higher.

    It's very easy to test this.

    Go to the Sol System (not sector space). Set your power settings to something like Offensive or Defensive mode. Go at your fastest speed without going into max impulse and check your character sheet (movement tab). It should tell what your max impulse speed and turn rate is (without diverting all power to your engines).

    Switch to Speed mode, which will set your engine power to 100. You'll now see your turn rate and impulse speed increase.

    For instance, my Tactical Escort Retrofit, at 52/30 engine power, has an impulse speed of 28.10 and a turn rate of 42.6. If I switch to an engine power of 100, my impulse speed goes 32 and turn rate of greater than 45 (can't remember off the top of my head).

    Inertia affect your turn rate and your speed, and they are additional modifiers. Period. Lower inertia has a lower speed and turn rate. Higher inertia has a higher speed and turn rate. Unfortunately, I have yet to find any information on what the percentage is exactly.

    But my example of 50% is assuming you have consoles to help you increase your turn rate. In that case, the math is correct. 6 + 50% = 9. 14 + 50% = 21. But, because of your ships inertia and impulse speed, the actual turn rate will be different.
  • bitemepwebitemepwe Member Posts: 6,760 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    How are you getting x2 modifiers?
    The charts and graphs that have been made of the skills effects bring a 9 point spending in Thrusters as only providing a 19% increas to turn and 26% increase to speed.

    Where is the missing 31% coming from?
    Leonard Nimoy, Spock.....:(

    R.I.P
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    Wow dude. Just wow. I am an Engineering Captain who flies a fkin Odyssey. That thing is a space whale. I AM A CRUISER PILOT (or did you miss the cruiser thread I started a few weeks ago? Or the fact I have posted in support of cruisers on almost every thread that included them?). I don't fly escorts unless I absolutely have to. And look at it this way. LIFETIME SUBSCRIBERS will always get the best stuff. They had to pay quite a bit to get said heavy destroyers. And those are heavy destroyers. Their name alone implies combat based. And you need to move around to do combat. And the Dreadnaught can CLOAK. It's designed for ambush nuking, not dogfighting. And I have put up numbers. Look at my thread and all the other threads I posted in involving cruisers. I have put up calculations, numbers, suggestions.

    So please, before making a fool of yourself, please at least have proper false information to back it up so you don't seem like an overblown windbag that sees only his own ideas. This is not Burger King, you cannot have it your way.

    "The Chimera probably also gets a better passive boost because you need to pay $300 (or 200 if you got the discount) for it. OF COURSE IT'S GOING TO BE BETTER THAN YOUR DREADNAUGHT. Why don't you stop trying to play a cruiser like an escort, and either A) Play your cruiser like a cruiser, or B) Get a bloody escort and stop complaining."

    Well from those words it appeared otherwise. You said "bloody", I said "stinking,"
    one is not more rude than the other. Bloody doesn't make it sound less rude just because it came out of your mouth.

    Its like you are bent on starting a fight, period. You thought i was going to crawl uder a rock with my tail between my legs because you spoke rude first? Since I am so much of a "windbag" on my own thread, even when I did the test and put up numbers and you didn't put up TRIBBLE, I will ignore anything you have to say, because you are irrellvant.


    Note the Odyssey is one cruiser that got revamped because of the mass outrage over the ship's low power rating and squishingness and turn rate. Now they have 3 C-store versions that can be combined into one with added power for engines, shields, weapons, and healing over all the other cruisers. I flew all the cruisers and looked at the varius differences. The Galaxy Brands are the most crippled out of all the cruisers. Flying the STO's favored cruiser by Devs don't really speak to the shortfalls of the cruiser group as a whole.
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    bitemepwe wrote: »
    How are you getting x2 modifiers?
    The charts and graphs that have been made of the skills effects bring a 9 point spending in Thrusters as only providing a 19% increas to turn and 26% increase to speed.

    Where is the missing 31% coming from?

    Dude, I don't know why i'm getting x2 on my Chimira. I don't even have a special engine on it. I did say the stats are not really matching up when comparing to my Dreadnought's bonus.
  • adamkafeiadamkafei Member Posts: 6,539 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Ok, I don't care who started this, IT ENDS HERE!

    This is (meant to be) about how CRUISERS move not anything else... P2W in irrelevant... that and unbalanced... sure up the turn-rates of cruisers below base 8 (anything 8 or higher really doesn't need it), we have to pay for a tankability one way or another (I know we paid 2 ways and I think that should change) and I for 1 am happy to pay with speed and turn rate.

    But in a DISCUSSION thread we don't need a bashing session (deciding who's best is the job of direct 1 on 1 pvp, as opposed to the wider pvp picture)
    ZiOfChe.png?1
  • hereticknight085hereticknight085 Member Posts: 3,783 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Its like you are bent on starting a fight, period. You thought i was going to crawl uder a rock with my tail between my legs because you spoke rude first? Since I am so much of a "windbag" on my own thread, even when I did the test and put up numbers and you didn't put up TRIBBLE, I will ignore anything you have to say, because you are irrellvant.


    Note the Odyssey is one cruiser that got revamped because of the mass outrage over the ship's low power rating and squishingness and turn rate. Now they have 3 C-store versions that can be combined into one with added power for engines, shields, weapons, and healing over all the other cruisers. I flew all the cruisers and looked at the varius differences. The Galaxy Brands are the most crippled out of all the cruisers. Flying the STO's favored cruiser by Devs don't really speak to the shortfalls of the cruiser group as a whole.

    Not really bent on starting a fight. More like confused as to why you refuse to see reason. It's like you say anyone who doesn't agree with you doesn't know what they are talking about. I am trying to see your point of view, really I am. But when you don't seem to be even open to the possibility of something you said being wrong, I find it hard to put any validity to any arguments you make. If you only see one side, you'll never be able to look at the whole.

    As for the Odyssey? I only recently got that. Up until then I was flying an Assault Cruiser. The free one. And a shovel out of boredom. Again, one that has identical stats to the Sovereign. So I think I can speak pretty well on how cruisers perform as a whole.

    You need to understand, money talks. You pay a ton of money to get access to the Chimera, and quite a nice chunk of change to get access to the best ships in the game. Look at the Odyssey, arguably the best federation cruiser. It costs $50 to get all 3 so you can design the ship of your choice. And after your apparent bias against the Oddy, I'll instead take the Regent. That's a ship designed for combat, and does it well from what I've seen. It costs $25. Now look at the Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit, arguably the best federation escort. To get everything that particular ship has to offer, you have to pay $35 ($10 for the refit, $20 for the retrofit, $5 for a fleet module, or 5 mil ec on the exchange). And lastly the Science vessels. All the fleet ones cost up to $20, plus however much you may have paid for a c-store ship. Even the Atrox, arguably one of the best science tanks, costs $25.

    Taking all that into account, you now have the Chimera, a $300 dollar ship. It kind of makes sense that a ship that costs that much, with only 9 consoles, would make up for it with huge performance potential/capability.
    It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once. B)
  • lostusthornlostusthorn Member Posts: 844
    edited October 2012
    shookyang wrote: »
    Inertia affect your turn rate and your speed, and they are additional modifiers. Period. Lower inertia has a lower speed and turn rate. Higher inertia has a higher speed and turn rate. Unfortunately, I have yet to find any information on what the percentage is exactly.

    That is simply wrong. Inertia effects how much your ship lags behind changes in movement. The higher the ships inertia score the faster it reacts to changes in speed.
    Impulse speed has nothing to do with it. Thats what the impulse modifier is for.
  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    shookyang wrote: »
    Because the increase is in %. A 50% increase on a turn rate of 6 is going to give you a total of 9. But, a 50% increase on a turn rate of 16 is going to give you a total of 24.

    Zactly. It's a classic rookie mistake to think a RCS console or two will really help you on a natively slow-turning boat; it's working off of percentage of base turn-rate: if that is TRIBBLE, you're never going to get a fast-turning ship (except maybe when using Attack Pattern Omega or something, but I digress).
    3lsZz0w.jpg
  • shookyangshookyang Member Posts: 1,122
    edited October 2012
    That is simply wrong. Inertia effects how much your ship lags behind changes in movement. The higher the ships inertia score the faster it reacts to changes in speed.
    Impulse speed has nothing to do with it. Thats what the impulse modifier is for.
    Ahh, that's right.

    I forgot that ships have their own Impulse modifier as well.

    In any case, impulse speed still plays a role in turning rate. Since ships have different impulse modifiers, the turning rate will be different depending on the ship.

    Comparing "max impulse to max turning rate" isn't going to give you the same ratio. Saying you're getting 2x the turning rate out of the Chimera versus a Galaxy has more to do with ALL of the modifiers in play. Not just what is stated on the ship's description and your engines.

    Essentially, you're looking at an equation that includes the ship's stated turn rate, turn rate of the engines, inertia, impulse modifier, and consoles.
  • hereticknight085hereticknight085 Member Posts: 3,783 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Essentially OP is trying to blow a lot of hot air and complain about something that has been around since launch.
    It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once. B)
  • alexindcobraalexindcobra Member Posts: 608
    edited October 2012
    Essentially OP is trying to blow a lot of hot air and complain about something that has been around since launch.

    Hmm.. and you still didn't bring any stats to debate? Yet, you say I'm blowing a lot of hot air? Better look in the mirrior.


    If you would recall, I did complain about the Galaxy brand and other ships with "6" turn rate. Still I think all ships should be able to enjoy my x2 skill tree boost that only some of my ships enjoy. I am angry at the fact that the ships that need turn rate boost the most aren't getting it. Ships that don't need turn rates boosted are constantly enjoying ridiculous bonuses.
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