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Let's be honest about the realistic state of PvP.

captainluke85captainluke85 Member Posts: 8 Arc User
edited September 2012 in PvP Gameplay
PvP is dead. No matter how are you guys want to hope, pray, wish, think, etc. it is and it will NEVER change. The best thing they really need to do is just get rid of PvP all together and make this game a PvM based.

Besides right now the C-Store is mainly designed for the PvEr. That's where your money is going to, where the main player base is and is how they barely keeping the game afloat. After all, we were not even a 0.1% of the game population to make any incentive for them to fix it. Simple reason is because there is no money in it.

I love PvP more than anything and I hate PvE but I've come to terms that it will never be fixed. Once you realize that the better off you all are.

It's been since beta which is 3 years now. Let's be honest here. 3 years? Why keep complaining when they do not hear you. Let it go and find PvP in another game. I already have.

Hopefully by 2015 this game will be ready when it is what I predicted back in the 2009 because I warned the developers about this. Naturally they didn't listen and look what the game has taken for form. History repeats itself.
Post edited by captainluke85 on

Comments

  • esquire1980esquire1980 Member Posts: 152 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    They could "fix" it, the 64 dollar ? is, will they?

    Possibly if they can figure a way to monitize PVP gameplay. The new Starbases got monitized via large dil sinks and 20 bucks for all the new little pixel toys, each. I believe I like this idea about as well as you do, but it's the way of the STO world as F2P. At the end of it all, they are a business and there simply has to be a return for investment. In the mean time, we get 1 developer, who asked for the job, and then he beats feet.

    Maybe......, if they can figure a way to monitize PVP.

    I'm also looking at other games now for my PVP fix but haven't found it as yet. The open world PVP with the new Rift expansion seems at the least, interesting.
  • dontdrunkimshootdontdrunkimshoot Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    dead huh? i played a ton of good matches today. some were boring pub stomps, others were with skilled groups of guys. pvp is not dead, L2P. if more then about 5% of sto's player base would just L2P, pvp would be a huge part of the game, even as imperfect as it is.
  • razellisrazellis Member Posts: 176 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    dead huh? i played a ton of good matches today. some were boring pub stomps, others were with skilled groups of guys. .

    There's the problem right there. The PVP matches are so uneven due to the lack of a ranking system and the advantages of pre-made teams that new people in PUGs are curb stomped till they don't enjoy it anymore. They never "learn to play" because it's not fun for them to play. I've pvp'd for a while now but the proliferation of the SUB NUK doff and the unbalanced nature of some ships(patrol escort=tough kill that will whoop your TRIBBLE, non c-store sci ship=points on the score board) has really hurt my interest.

    For the record, I've never flown a sci ship into PVP, I've seen too many get absolutely flattened and have farmed them in PVP matches so many times I now feel bad about it. Same for most RA cruisers.
  • janetza#4790 janetza Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    PvP is not that bad as people say. It lacks content, and rewards to make others interested in it. I personally like PvP and I play when I see people in queue.
    razellis wrote: »
    For the record, I've never flown a sci ship into PVP, I've seen too many get absolutely flattened and have farmed them in PVP matches so many times I now feel bad about it. Same for most RA cruisers.
    Don't underestimate sci. ships. Any ship is useless in hands of someone who can not use it. I can show good example, 2 sci ships on enemy team: Nebula, Recluse carrier, and Tactical escort. When you attack one of sci ships its getting healed by another, if you attack escort, they both heal him. It was long match, and we lost because we did not have such teamwork.
    __________________
    [Combat (Self)] You lose 6549 (7572) Cold from the torment of the underworld.

    In-game handle @Janetza
  • baudlbaudl Member Posts: 4,060 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    taut0u wrote: »
    PvP is not that bad as people say. It lacks content, and rewards to make others interested in it. I personally like PvP and I play when I see people in queue.

    Don't underestimate sci. ships. Any ship is useless in hands of someone who can not use it. I can show good example, 2 sci ships on enemy team: Nebula, Recluse carrier, and Tactical escort. When you attack one of sci ships its getting healed by another, if you attack escort, they both heal him. It was long match, and we lost because we did not have such teamwork.

    yeah it is not specifically the sci ship that is bad, it is 90% the captain and his setup. There are some really good sci ship captains, just very few. And you must consider, that most of the really good players will most likely have an escort or a heal cruiser.
    Go pro or go home
  • aquitaine985aquitaine985 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    I'd say PVP is alive and well as long as we get another repetitive "Oh nao we're d00med!!111" PVP thread every few days.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    @Aquitaine985
    Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
    A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
    2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
  • jknamejkname Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    My impression from all this reading is that PvP is about who can put together and use the most broken combination of magic spells and powers to be invulnerable or instantly kill their opponent, rather than any kind of deep Starfleet Command-like tactical action. To be honest, when I first signed on, I expected more out of it.

    On top of that, it has no...purpose. PvP, except maybe Kerrat, advances no agenda or goal besides senseless violence. Except apparently they killed Kerrat and the place is mostly dead now, so I missed the heyday of that, too. Go figure. Entropy always increases, and this is why we can't have nice things.
  • travelingmastertravelingmaster Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    razellis wrote: »
    There's the problem right there. The PVP matches are so uneven due to the lack of a ranking system and the advantages of pre-made teams that new people in PUGs are curb stomped till they don't enjoy it anymore. They never "learn to play" because it's not fun for them to play. I've pvp'd for a while now but the proliferation of the SUB NUK doff and the unbalanced nature of some ships(patrol escort=tough kill that will whoop your TRIBBLE, non c-store sci ship=points on the score board) has really hurt my interest.

    For the record, I've never flown a sci ship into PVP, I've seen too many get absolutely flattened and have farmed them in PVP matches so many times I now feel bad about it. Same for most RA cruisers.

    Well, if they get a reputation system going for the lvl 50 players, and have a separate one for PvP (based off number of players you've defeated, perhaps?), and tie 'em into the queues. . .things might even out a bit.

    I'm staying. STO costs me nothing to play right now, as I'm using ex-gold fringe benefits on two of my toons, with a 3rd new one on plain silver access, and I don't see the need to create new toons anytime soon. I'll just plague the wretched wasteland of Ker'rat and the PvP queues, seeking what entertainment I can find there.
    My PvP toon is Krov, of The House of Snoo. Beware of my Hegh'ta of doom.
  • baudlbaudl Member Posts: 4,060 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    jkname wrote: »
    My impression from all this reading is that PvP is about who can put together and use the most broken combination of magic spells and powers to be invulnerable or instantly kill their opponent, rather than any kind of deep Starfleet Command-like tactical action. To be honest, when I first signed on, I expected more out of it.

    On top of that, it has no...purpose. PvP, except maybe Kerrat, advances no agenda or goal besides senseless violence. Except apparently they killed Kerrat and the place is mostly dead now, so I missed the heyday of that, too. Go figure. Entropy always increases, and this is why we can't have nice things.

    haha, thats only valid if you cherish order...i embrace CHAOS!!:P
    Go pro or go home
  • jknamejkname Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    No, you don't. You definitely don't want chaos happening to you. You want to cause chaos to others. This is entirely reasonable and consistent: While net entropy must always increase, local entropy, I.E., yours, can be decreased...by causing net entropy, the parts belonging to someone ELSE, to increase even MORE.

    This, of course, brings us to the golden rules:
    1. Do unto others before they do unto you.
    2. Always pillage BEFORE you burn.
  • bitemepwebitemepwe Member Posts: 6,760 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    I have always found Ker'rat full of players willing to fight my non-gimmick Somraw, regardless of what time I logged on to play.
    Leonard Nimoy, Spock.....:(

    R.I.P
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  • srspellssrspells Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    I played PVP and it was fun and I love the people I faced, but lets face it tell they give this type of reward most wont play it.

    Rewards.
    decent amount of dil(I think 4000 if its a 15 match)-I can farm more dil on stfs even then.
    sell-able rewards.
    or just ec ingenral

    PVP just needs to be better with a leaderboard and a matchmaking system.
    ps sorrry for spelling got work pretty soon and just catching up.
    -Spells
    || Open Door Policy ||
    | Dues Ex Mechina |
    Fleet Leader
  • travelingmastertravelingmaster Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    srspells wrote: »
    I played PVP and it was fun and I love the people I faced, but lets face it tell they give this type of reward most wont play it.

    Rewards.
    decent amount of dil(I think 4000 if its a 15 match)-I can farm more dil on stfs even then.
    sell-able rewards.
    or just ec ingenral

    PVP just needs to be better with a leaderboard and a matchmaking system.
    ps sorrry for spelling got work pretty soon and just catching up.
    -Spells

    Well, we get those kinds of rewards to a limited extent, but they could certainly expand on 'em. There's missions in the KDF to 'kill Federation playerships/Fed captains on ground', 'kill KDF playerships/KDF captains on ground', a Ker'rat completion mission, and a 'kill Borg ships' mission that can also be completed in Ker'rat. The problem is, they're dailies. I usually do the Fed playership, Ker'rat completion, and Borg ships one, so that nets me 1.5k dil. I can make more than that in an hour by doing two elite STFs.

    So, I agree. . .rewards need major expansion, in order to give people an incentive to spend more time PvPing, and to get better at it.
    My PvP toon is Krov, of The House of Snoo. Beware of my Hegh'ta of doom.
  • srspellssrspells Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    thats what I mean theres no real reward besides beating people in pvp, they need new rewards and new maps, also a leaderboard and matchmaking system would be nice.

    but ya if u farm CSE u can do so much dil farming also contraband helps that, I want big rewards for pvp.(as it can take longer and also is more imersive)
    -Spells
    || Open Door Policy ||
    | Dues Ex Mechina |
    Fleet Leader
  • jknamejkname Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    There are out there very strong players who play PvP for over two years, they've found the perfect combination of build, ship, components, weapons, abilities, doffs, keybinds, teamplay.
    They are really umbeatable and the average player can not do anything but kneel and instead try to improve himself as quickly as possible.
    Ayup. I saw a guy who had apparently gone to great lengths to optimize his build for the level 30s, he was murdering everything in Kerrat and no one could touch him. Mostly, I was impressed that someone would go to such lengths for an ephemeral level that you leave behind in a matter of a few hours.

    The other thing is that the people you mentioned exist. What this tells the rest of us is that it's purposeless to bother until you've finished gathering all those items. I don't see this as wrong, but I'm essentially part of the PvP lurker population until I've acquired the stuff it takes to actually win it. Don't get me wrong: I love PvP, but knowing what the entry barrier is in stuff, I know it's going to be a long, long time before I'll have the equipment needed to participate. I'm okay with that. Things come to those who wait.
  • skurfskurf Member Posts: 1,071 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    I don't think it's dead. It's just not as popular as PvE. And honestly, the extremely casual-friendly design of PvE is what hurts PvP. I am fairly new to STO and even newer to PvP, but when I first started PvP I got my TRIBBLE handed to me, very quickly, over and over. At this point, I was pretty much a PvE master (I know, tough, right?) using an atrocious build. PvE doesn't dissuade you from using horrible builds for the entirety of the game, even for STFs. I am a fairly competitive RTS player, so instead of throwing my hands up in frustration and calling people that killed me in 2 seconds a cheater, I made it my goal to learn how to play this game properly. Unfortunately, the majority of people do not have the desire to do this. They'd rather think they have everything figured out since they can get the Optional on a STF.

    Nowadays, I love playing PvP more than anything else in STO, although it does suck when it's a one-sided stomp-fest. The only thing that could fix this would be a ladder/match-making system like they have in RTS games, but the problem is that not enough people queue up at any given time. Essentially, this is not a viable option until the queues are constantly populated. I will tell you this though, a good, balanced PvP match is the by far the best aspect of this game. It is actually quite reminiscent of a good RTS PvP in that you have to execute perfectly and be able to out-think and out-predict your opponent.
  • captainluke85captainluke85 Member Posts: 8 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    dead huh? i played a ton of good matches today. some were boring pub stomps, others were with skilled groups of guys. pvp is not dead, L2P. if more then about 5% of sto's player base would just L2P, pvp would be a huge part of the game, even as imperfect as it is.

    In denial much? Your statements are littered with it like pollution.
  • brandonflbrandonfl Member Posts: 892
    edited September 2012
    Well, it might not be dead, but it is certainly on life support right now. Only those of us who keep getting strung along by promises of improvement (which I seriously doubt will happen soon) are keeping it barely alive.
    LOLSTO
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  • zarathos1978zarathos1978 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    PvP is like guy with now untreatable cancer. Unless new treatment will be applied that can help it - he (PvP) will die. And as Cryptic is not investing much into such treatment (if anything at all) then the outcome is known.

    I do PvP, but mostly because there is no other MMO ST-based game or even good space MMO with good space combat. Had someone made Starfleet Command MMO with PvP I would've gone away from STO in a minute and never looked back.
  • dontdrunkimshootdontdrunkimshoot Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    In denial much? Your statements are littered with it like pollution.

    LOL! i suppose im actually not having any fun, even though im having fun enough of the time to keep me coming back. what would improve my fun is more people being at a higher skill level. there is absolutely nothing untrue about that last statement, if you ONLY get rolled, the problem is you.
  • bitemepwebitemepwe Member Posts: 6,760 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    And the evil Klinguns due to the characteristics of their ships instil fear to the Feds.

    Its the three fuzzy moQ that we hang below our nacelles, isn't it? :P
    Leonard Nimoy, Spock.....:(

    R.I.P
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  • aldo1rainealdo1raine Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    sophlogimo wrote: »
    Actually, I do PvP and am not bored or disappointed by it in itself. But I accept the whole game as something I do for fun, without taking it too seriously. Maybe that's the key.


    That is because you are a drunken monkey with a keyboard.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Nerf Klinks, Buff Rommies
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