Kit swapping is getting fixed!

buccaneerdtb

First double cloak, now kit swapping. Thanks Cryptic for improving ground PvP. We are not being ignored.

webdeath

I was kinda wondering when they would put the kaibosh on kit swapping for Engineers on the ground. I guess that means an Engineer will have to find a new way to PVP instead of swaping their Kits for all pets.

adamkafei

this removes for me any point in having more than 1 kit, I have 3 for my engineer such that I can adapt in mid mission to suit my situation for example I run a bunker fab kit and an enemy neutralisation kit as well although my primary use for the enemy neutralisation kit is it's chroniton minefield so I walk up to a doorway swap to enemy neut, lay down the minefield and then swap back to do my turrets and gens.

If they take away my ability to change mid mission then not only will my engineer suffer, my sci will suffer and as a result any team I work with will suffer

delta

adamkafei wrote: »

this removes for me any point in having more than 1 kit, I have 3 for my engineer such that I can adapt in mid mission to suit my situation for example I run a bunker fab kit and an enemy neutralisation kit as well although my primary use for the enemy neutralisation kit is it's chroniton minefield so I walk up to a doorway swap to enemy neut, lay down the minefield and then swap back to do my turrets and gens.

If they take away my ability to change mid mission then not only will my engineer suffer, my sci will suffer and as a result any team I work with will suffer

The issue here is the ability to swap and accrue an army of pets which was not intended in the first place. Choose your kits wisely. Facerolling is no fun for anyone.

aquitaine985

Shame. This was mighty useful in KAGE.

tehjonel

sabrefyre wrote: »

The issue here is the ability to swap and accrue an army of pets which was not intended in the first place. Choose your kits wisely. Facerolling is no fun for anyone.

who was to say that wasn't an intended mechanic? i have not been able to find anything from the devs that state that swapping out a kit was a bug or cheat.

the only people having a problem with this are ground pvp players.

i like pvp alot. i like pve alot as well. but i don't see how inconveniencing the majority of the playerbase to accommodate a minority for what seems like a mild tactical advantage is going to help balance anything.

boglejam73

tehjonel wrote: »

who was to say that wasn't an intended mechanic? i have not been able to find anything from the devs that state that swapping out a kit was a bug or cheat.

Don't you kinda think the fact that they decided to remove the ability to kit swap and keep all the pets implies that it wasn't an intended mechanic?

Sure, say what you will about Cryptic, but I don't think they sit in the cube-farm and say "I really like being able to spam drones, mines, shields, and turrets practically simultaneously....but lets f**k that all up, even thou we intend for it to be that way"

adamkafei

sabrefyre wrote: »

The issue here is the ability to swap and accrue an army of pets which was not intended in the first place. Choose your kits wisely. Facerolling is no fun for anyone.

I don't use kit swapping for either of those purposes, I agree an army of pets can be unfair and no, facerolling isn't fun but as I said in my post i use it to ADAPT to my situation, how would you like it if you were an engineer using the bunker fabrication kit and you were doing well and then you come across a group of enemies who destroy you using your own stuff (Manus/Beccy in IGE for example), you'd want to change to a kit more suited to your situation right? but somebody came along and stopped you doing that because it didn't suit THEM that you were able to adapt to your situation...

Yes I sympathise with you, to a degree, as it is if I'm under fire i can't change and that can mean the difference between life or death for both me AND my team so I'm sorry but if it's a matter of you beam onto a map and you're no longer allowed to change your kit, that's unfair. I know you've mentioned engineers but nobody has mentioned science, should a science player be limited to a debuff kit because they didn't know the team would need a medic going into the map, I know for a fact the med kit is not useful for most of CGE but at the end it's the best weapon you can have.

In doing this you are penalising good players of 2 classes, I ask you now... Is THAT fair? is THAT right?

boglejam73

adamkafei wrote: »

I don't use kit swapping for either of those purposes, I agree an army of pets can be unfair and no, facerolling isn't fun but as I said in my post i use it to ADAPT to my situation, how would you like it if you were an engineer using the bunker fabrication kit and you were doing well and then you come across a group of enemies who destroy you using your own stuff (Manus/Beccy in IGE for example), you'd want to change to a kit more suited to your situation right? but somebody came along and stopped you doing that because it didn't suit THEM that you were able to adapt to your situation...

Yes I sympathise with you, to a degree, as it is if I'm under fire i can't change and that can mean the difference between life or death for both me AND my team so I'm sorry but if it's a matter of you beam onto a map and you're no longer allowed to change your kit, that's unfair. I know you've mentioned engineers but nobody has mentioned science, should a science player be limited to a debuff kit because they didn't know the team would need a medic going into the map, I know for a fact the med kit is not useful for most of CGE but at the end it's the best weapon you can have.

In doing this you are penalising good players of 2 classes, I ask you now... Is THAT fair? is THAT right?

but you can still swap kits. The only difference is the stuff you spawned to deal with the other situation goes away when you unequip the kit that you used to spwan them.

How is that a problem if you are arguing that you've moved on to a new situation and now need to change kits to have the right equipment?

dontdrunkimshoot

kits are stupid, its an anomaly in the current system. in every other case like with your ship and your officers ground and space skills, its all completely customizable.

adamkafei

Ok, Ill give you that, I must admit this was the first i heard of this however if you are playing science and you've just let up say nanite health monitor on someone because they are going into battle but you need your debuff kit to help keep the enemy down to make the per-arranged heals effective, the moment you swap that kit the heals are gone?

Or if you are the only person on a team providing engineering support and you put down a chroniton minefield to stun your enemies so your turrets can help out the team but you are forced t give one of these up thus eliminating the entire strategy that can be make or break in a defensive situation

admittedly these are only 2 examples of a wider aspect of play but what I'm saying is there should be exceptions or perhaps a timer so say you put down the minefield and swap kits, when the kit swap is complete the lifetime of the minefield is cut down to X seconds as the supporting kit is no longer in use as mainly science but all professions are more effective if they can swap between abilities while keeping the others in place if only for a limited time. I say science mainly as they HAVE to be able to hot-swap from one task to another and perhaps on to another again so say from debuff to medic to something else but the team needs those med skills to remain in play while the person plays another role in the team

frtoaster

I'm curious what exactly the exploit was. I play as an engineer, but never used kit swapping as a tactic before. I can think of two possibilities.

1. Use fabrication engineer kit and spawn turrets and mines. Then, swap to bunker fabrication kit and spawn generators. Then, swap to enemy neutralization kit and spawn mines and bombs. I can see that this allows an engineer to construct hardy fortifications, but was this really overpowered?

2. Keep multiple copies of the same kit and litter the field with turrets, mortars, and mines. I can see this being very overpowered. But if this was the case, wouldn't it be better to tie the cooldowns and spawning to the ability itself rather than the particular kit equipped? That way, there is no advantage to keeping multiple copies of the same kit, but swapping to different kits still has advantages.

adamkafei

frtoaster wrote: »

I'm curious what exactly the exploit was. I play as an engineer, but never used kit swapping as a tactic before. I can think of two possibilities.

1. Use fabrication engineer kit and spawn turrets and mines. Then, swap to bunker fabrication kit and spawn generators. Then, swap to enemy neutralization kit and spawn mines and bombs. I can see that this allows an engineer to construct hardy fortifications, but was this really overpowered?

2. Keep multiple copies of the same kit and litter the field with turrets, mortars, and mines. I can see this being very overpowered. But if this was the case, wouldn't it be better to tie the cooldowns and spawning to the ability itself rather than the particular kit equipped? That way, there is no advantage to keeping multiple copies of the same kit, but swapping to different kits still has advantages.

Exactly, I never used multiple copies (I'd never be able to keep track of which is which) but I do keep multiple kits, the game tips say "get multiple kits for your career so that you can quickly change your abilities" perhaps not those exact words but words to that effect at least. Just because it doesn't affect tacticals doesn't mean its ok for the other two, in fact it makes science very ineffective if they've set up medical stuff (vascular regen and nanite health monitor) and then switch to the xenobiologist kit to do some damage themselves but the person who needed the meds dies because they were taken away with the kit change.

Perhaps we should cater to science for a change, they really need ALL the help they can get right now

nicha0

Science doesn't need help on the ground at all, they are diverse and durable, their space captain abilites are ok even if scattered, their ships are a mess.

Tac needs ground help, there is only one way to play with it, I've been trying to get our tacs in the fleet on the ground, but they struggle and for good reason.