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All levels PvP free for all

giliongilion Member Posts: 686 Arc User
edited September 2012 in PvP Gameplay
Alright so to quickly explain what my idea is, right now PvP is divided by rank: captains together, commanders together, etc... What if it was a all levels free for all? Now the first thing most of you will spout is "it wouldnt be fair for the lower levels." Obviously if it was using the current system. But how about if instead of having a set number of required player, we have a set amount of "points" required to start a game? What I mean by points is lets say a VA ship is worth 1000 points, and you need 5k points for one team. Lower rank ships will be worth less points so their are more of them to even out their lower performance.

Also instead of needing a set number of kills to win the game we need a set number of (you guessed it) points. Higher rank ships are harder to kill but they give you more points towards winning so you have to decide: do I want to try and go for the big bucks? or do I want to play it safe? If a team decides to go for the small fry then their wide open for attacks from the heavy hitters. Whether or not everyone is automatically leveled up to level 50 is debatable but I think it would be fair considering under level 20 ships can be destroyed buy one Tricobolt device.

Obviously PvP needs a lot more to fix it than just this, but as a small step towards fixing a part of the game that could be so much more, what do you guys think of this?
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Post edited by gilion on

Comments

  • corsair114corsair114 Member Posts: 276
    edited September 2012
    I'm going to enjoy griefing low-level players that have less combined hull and shield healing than my BoP's DHC's able to put out in a single burst.

    Actually, it ought to be plenty easy to just TBR-crash whole waves of ships that won't be able to hit my ship while I rake in the points.


    [EDIT]

    You are aware lower-tier ships also take more damage from, and receive less healing from, higher tier ships, right?
  • amidoinitrightamidoinitright Member Posts: 163 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    This sounds like fun. It would give me a reason to create & level some alts.
    Lower tier ships would have to get some kind of buff though.
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  • zarathos1978zarathos1978 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    No, thank you. Yesterday I ended in 2 Fed vs 3 Klinks arena match. And I was paired with Miranda(!). I could tank those three Klinks without problems (unless I made some stupid error) but all they needed was to wait till Miranda respawn and kill it again and again. I surrendered in the end and ended the match quickly by stripping my shield and waiting untill they score 15 kills.

    Low level ships (and in this case it was cmdr level pvp so not that much difference) dont pack enough firepower to help in killing higher levels and dont have enough health to survive the firepower of enemy from higher levels. Healing them is a waste too cause even if I throw sci team, TSS and extend on that ship it will be still less healing then the damage other side is causing.
  • kinetic78kinetic78 Member Posts: 90 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    I can't see it,, lower tiers would get done over in seconds ,,, and I can't see there weps doing much,, I could prob go take a dump and they would still be shooting when I return
  • darienavandarienavan Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    the Problem ist: even at level 50 the differences between 'good builds' and 'bad builds' is easily at 300%-400% and more.
    Allowing lower tier ships will only improve that Gap.


    But a point system would be a good idea, not for ships, but for players :D
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  • redrickyredricky Member Posts: 1,004 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    As I've brought up before, I have a dream of retrofit queues. For example, players will enter the tier 3 queue while piloting a tier 3 ship. Captains will be scaled accordingly. This way a lvl 50 character can be used to PvP with a lvl 30 ship, giving new PvPers a chance to learn to PvP without jumping in at a max-level ship and being overwhelmed by options. Other players might also enjoy the slower pace of lower tier combat and the chance to fly their favorite lower tier ships which cannot compete at max level.
    _______________
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  • kattarnkattarn Member Posts: 105 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    Lol devs are unable to fix many bugs that everyone knows and are going to do this?, besides pvp is almost about ''go kill the squishy'' this idea brings more unbalanced pvp and the system already favors that so please NO.
  • bitemepwebitemepwe Member Posts: 6,760 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    If the zone could support crowds of 100 versus 100, the event had a countdown timer and the winner was determined by total kills and a point system that acrued each kill a points amount based on ship tier.

    That way several low level ships could gang up on a few high levels and possibly keep the points to win.

    Otherwise it would remind me of fleet versus fleet battles in EVE with all the explosions, weapons fire and other flashy stuff.
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  • syberghostsyberghost Member Posts: 1,712 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    The PvPers want more maps, more balance, rewards when PvPing and also a player ranking...Cryptiiiiiic!!!

    All of that; plus an OpenPvP megasector with its own PvE storyline. So nobody HAS to go in there, but there's a reason PvE players might want to.
    bitemepwe wrote: »
    If the zone could support crowds of 100 versus 100, the event had a countdown timer and the winner was determined by total kills and a point system that acrued each kill a points amount based on ship tier.

    That way several low level ships could gang up on a few high levels and possibly keep the points to win.

    Otherwise it would remind me of fleet versus fleet battles in EVE with all the explosions, weapons fire and other flashy stuff.

    I'm not sure even that would be enough; a premade of 5 good builds could probably take on 100 Lt/LtC randoms without much challenge. With the right buffs and power use, you could wipe half of them out in a single salvo.

    It might work out on Cap and Hold maps, simply because you could never swat all the flies; but that would be imbalanced the OTHER direction.
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  • trueprom3theustrueprom3theus Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    redricky wrote: »
    As I've brought up before, I have a dream of retrofit queues. For example, players will enter the tier 3 queue while piloting a tier 3 ship. Captains will be scaled accordingly. This way a lvl 50 character can be used to PvP with a lvl 30 ship, giving new PvPers a chance to learn to PvP without jumping in at a max-level ship and being overwhelmed by options. Other players might also enjoy the slower pace of lower tier combat and the chance to fly their favorite lower tier ships which cannot compete at max level.

    That's a neat idea, I think about it every time I level a tune and wait 1+ hours to pop a queue. The only extra thing I'd add is to disable ant extra upper tier skill tree spec . Maybe don't allow end game sets and gear into lower tiers either.
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  • p2wsucksp2wsucks Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    The game really isn't designed for it. Also, it's here already if you change instances in Kerrat.

    1. It's a power driven game an early ships don't have the boffs to boost there damage output, max sci or eng abilities.

    2. Weapons grades are tied to captains not ships. So, while a high level captain can hop into a lower level ship and use MKXII, stf gear etc and somewhat make up for the lost Boff slots a Low level character would still be stuck w/MKIV gear.

    3. There is no role a low level ship has that a higher level ship can't do better. Unlike a game like EvE there's no distinction of Weapon type to Target size. To elaborate in EvE a frig mounts small weapons which are good at tracking other Frigs. A medium weapon (usable by cruisers and up) can't track frigs as well and so on. Here the defensive to acc ratio is the only thing that matters, it's pretty basic as well.

    That said low level raiders may be decent @ it since they have BC to maintain initiative.
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  • beary666stobeary666sto Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    I'm pretty sure a VA/LG shuttle would wipe the pants off a Tier 1 or even Tier 2 ship
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  • teleon22teleon22 Member Posts: 424
    edited September 2012
    The only way I can see a multi-Tier PVP space battle, that would be successful, is if and only if everyone was set to level 50 automatically my the match player level system already in the game and if and only if restrictions on quantity of Tier ships were in place.

    Such as:
    2 T5
    2 T4
    6 T3
    10 T2 & T1

    This would make for a 20 verse 20 match. Which would be epic and awesome and it won?t happen!

    EDIT: BTW the T2 & T1 can include shuttle craft and fighters.
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  • giliongilion Member Posts: 686 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    A lot of you pointed out that PvP needs a lot more than just this, I agree. I just came up with this idea and dicided to post it before I forget about it in the months (or years most likely) it would take Cryptic to actually start working on PvP.

    Also, yes everyone would be set to lvl 50 so the lower level players would actually stand some sort of chance. Also some people didnt realize that the number of lower level ships would (some what) compensate for their lower performance.

    Let me clarify one other thing: this idea is for a working PvP, I know we dont have that but like I said, I had the idea and felt like sharing it before I forgot.
    _____________________________________________________
    Anyone want to give me a Temporal Heavy Dreadnought pack? I'll be your friend :D
  • drkfrontiersdrkfrontiers Member Posts: 2,477 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    corsair114 wrote: »
    I'm going to enjoy griefing low-level players that have less combined hull and shield healing than my BoP's DHC's able to put out in a single burst.

    Actually, it ought to be plenty easy to just TBR-crash whole waves of ships that won't be able to hit my ship while I rake in the points.


    [EDIT]

    You are aware lower-tier ships also take more damage from, and receive less healing from, higher tier ships, right?

    I was just thinking the same. I tear through a T5 cruiser in less than 3 - 5 secs. :)
  • drkfrontiersdrkfrontiers Member Posts: 2,477 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    gilion wrote: »
    A lot of you pointed out that PvP needs a lot more than just this, I agree. I just came up with this idea and dicided to post it before I forget about it in the months (or years most likely) it would take Cryptic to actually start working on PvP.

    Also, yes everyone would be set to lvl 50 so the lower level players would actually stand some sort of chance. Also some people didnt realize that the number of lower level ships would (some what) compensate for their lower performance.

    Let me clarify one other thing: this idea is for a working PvP, I know we dont have that but like I said, I had the idea and felt like sharing it before I forgot.

    Cool bud, it makes sense to have them at the same level.
  • dalolorndalolorn Member Posts: 3,655 Arc User
    edited September 2012
    I'm pretty sure a VA/LG shuttle would wipe the pants off a Tier 1 or even Tier 2 ship

    QFT ^^

    I blew up my Lt. friend's Shi'Kahr consistently in a VA Danube runabout, and I -think- (my memory's a bit vague, it was about 6 months ago) I could even beat him when fighting without shields. I certainly could beat his Constitution with my Stalker later on, though there I believe I was forced to keep my shields on :P

    Edit: Also, about the Stalker, I was fighting with a Commander, with gear that probably can't even classify as good, against a player who infrequently plays the game and is on his first character. So even with dying about once for every 2 or so kills, it shows how much a VA would have done against the ship.

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  • corsair114corsair114 Member Posts: 276
    edited September 2012
    Even if the levels were normalized so everyone was at level 50, a Tier 1-2-3 ship is just going to be fodder for VA ships on account of the way Tiering affects damage and healing. Not to mention that the lower level players will still not have the BOffs, DOffs (yes, really, they're as important as any other item choice), and skill point-placement to even be of any kind of use.

    If you're not at least Commander you don't even have ranks into accuracy. Think about that, then think about what a VA Escort Carrier / Tac Escort Retro / Adv. Escort / MVAM / Patrol Escort is gonna do to you, and what your realistic chances are of being able to do more than tickle their shields, on the off chance you ever hit.

    You're just throwing newbie/lowbie players to wolves with exactly zero chance of them living long enough to learn anything.
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