He had that running for a looong time on this forum and was updating it then as he is now. He may be banned now, but that has nothing to do with this info provided and all of the linked posts backing up everything in it. Its very much a valued history and well worth reading....the author being banned or not is irrelevant.
Very very sad that teh Empire is in the state its in as far as storyline goes.....
Originally Posted by CapTrott
The KDF is a functioning faction. Given the levels and the content, it isnt hard to be entertained. There is no more grinding with the level increase for the starting level as it was when the game first came out..
Fedcentric opinions like the one above do not help as it glosses over the truth that while we have been given a lot of new content to enjoy, its all fluff compared to a working from level 1 to level cap amount of storyline content that is needed to finish the faction and move on.
Honestly thats all teh KDF needs, outside of some more costume options, to give it a level of entertaining gameplay that will draw in new players and old alike and tell the Story of why the Empire is in the state it is in and at war with the Feds.
KDF was origionally supposed to be a PvP only faction I believe. However since PvP didnt have much to offer it seemed easier to shoehorn content into the faction and give it a seperate story arc. Again wasnt much to offer there so it again got shoehorned into the Federation story arc (see devidion/breen/romulan FE) Now it seems there is no real direction atm and is considered STO purgatory
Make the Romulans our peons, fill in the low-level ship gaps with Romulan designs. One problem solved! There's far more of a history of interchange between the Romulans and the Klingons than there is with Starfleet.
That should also draw some population, and give Starfleet a few more defection headaches! And BoPs/Battle Cloak will still be ours alone.
KDF was origionally supposed to be a PvP only faction I believe. However since PvP didnt have much to offer it seemed easier to shoehorn content into the faction and give it a seperate story arc. Again wasnt much to offer there so it again got shoehorned into the Federation story arc (see devidion/breen/romulan FE) Now it seems there is no real direction atm and is considered STO purgatory
KDF was origionally supposed to be a PvP only faction I believe. However since PvP didnt have much to offer it seemed easier to shoehorn content into the faction and give it a seperate story arc. Again wasnt much to offer there so it again got shoehorned into the Federation story arc (see devidion/breen/romulan FE) Now it seems there is no real direction atm and is considered STO purgatory
It was never actually revealed that the KDF were 'intended' to be PvP only until just two months prior to release, in fact prior to that they talked about things like "Competitive PvE" and other things that lead us to believe that the KDF was originally intended to be a full faction, until that announcement. By that point it was pretty clear that the PvP only faction statement was a cover for the faction being incomplete and the rushed state of the game as a whole. STO was rushed to launch, which explains why the KDF was incomplete at launch, however the excuses for an incomplete faction really end there. There was no viable reason for then to not then flesh out the faction, since I can't think of a single decent Multi-Faction MMO that doesn't have two complete factions.
I finally got around playing Klingon, and i can say that i personally like it.
Also it gave me a bit of perspective on why some things are the way they are and while these may not be consistent with ST Lore/Ethos, these are needed for the chosen mechanics of the game.
For instance the higher turn rates of Klingon ships are required because most of their ships are forward firing ones, and it is not easy to keep an enemy in your frontal Angle during heated battles.
Even on PvE it is more challenging, you have to do passes and fly byes you cannot just circle around with continuous fire like in the Fed Ships.
I still do not like the (what I call) "magical" aspects of the mechanics of the game as a whole but that of course cannot be blamed on Klingons or Feds, it is a decision the devs made when making this game, and I still wish that at one point it is revamped and addressed...I know it will probably nver be changed..but one can always hope right?
And I'll keep making suggestions about it, even if I know these may drive some to see me as annoying. It is just the way I express myself when frustrated with the game, but mean no ill feelings towards anyone personally nevertheless.
Anyways not wanting to detract from the topic, I am enjoying playing Klingon thus far.
To tell the truth I very much enjoy Klingon PvE play because as abovesaid, the combat mechanics are very different .
I also enjoy roleplaying from the KDF perspective because there is less content... so I tend to make them myself (plots, fanfics, unconventional ops etc). As my signature implies, I'm documenting virtual military and interstellar operations, not sitting around telling tall tales over bloodwine
Tomorrow morning EST time I will be doing an engineering review of the Kar'Fi Battle Carrier and the Guramba Siege Destroyer in drydock followed by a gala reception hosted by the Mistress of said vessels..
The way I run the events they involve millions of EC expenditure to fund player / participation rewards and for abovesaid ships' mistress, C points expenditure. Yes, I am that serious running my own events xD
Like I said, I leveled my first Klingon before season 2 was out, and it was fun...just a lot less to do back then. The KDF is very fun IMO..anmd , as ive said in other threads, its really a matter of making the most of whats there..meaning the "fun" aspect often comes down to the person.....having said that..the KDF still has what many, including myself, consider to be a huge content desparity compared to the Federation. I dont know why but its as if Cryptic thought no one wanted to try Klingons. To me that was a cooler prospect than playing a good guy Fed..lol.
The link in the OP shows why soem of the things are what the are today. Having said that im really glad newer ppl are trying and liking the KDF side.
I have pushed and supported the kdf for years. I can't anymore. Cryptic won't fix it. And unless they fix it in a way that the kdf and Feds can team up, the kdf will always be a second rate faction.
They will spend 6 months on combat revamp but not anytime on the kdf.
But please put down 40$ on the bortas
I have pushed and supported the kdf for years. I can't anymore. Cryptic won't fix it. And unless they fix it in a way that the kdf and Feds can team up, the kdf will always be a second rate faction.
They will spend 6 months on combat revamp but not anytime on the kdf.
But please put down 40$ on the bortas
I liked so far what I have seen about the KDF, it is interesting and any time I can have Worf cheer me on is a plus! we shall see how it works long term.
A very interesting read, and thank you for posting it. It sure explains a lot about the current state of affairs in the Klingon Empire.
Can only start KDF at level 25 fed char - annoying.
You start at level 21 - very upsetting.
Pile of PVE repeatable missions for dilithium - unequaled on Fed side.
PVP centric - no. At least, not anymore.
Even though the KDF faction is based on diplomatic alliances with Orion, Gorn and Nausicaans, they don't actually have diplomacy.
KDF mirror universe: copy pasted from the Feds. There are no klingons in the mirror universe?
It is great until you ask: why can I group up with the Feds for some things and not others?
Why can't I get a defari group?
Why am I fighting the mirror universe people?
And not get a canned response, sure.
You see, It not really "Cryptic" meaning the company as a whole, who are the bad folks. They just made some promises they could not live up to.
The problem stems from all the "promises" made and not lived up to that has given them such a bad reputation. They have shown that they can indeed fix many things, look at the effort they put in making the game F2P. A literal revamp of the entire game. It shows that if they wanted to they could fix many things.
Problem is they built their house on sand where it came to the KDF. They have said too much one thing, and completely done the other. This destroys the reputation you try to build.
Dev's fault? Nah, the Dev's are good. They are just programmers who work hard to give us what we want, as they are allowed to do. This is more a management issue, and no I am not stating Executive Producer issue. It is higher then that.
That is where the quirkiness is. It is a leadership thing, to the higher ups, While I may want to do X, my boss or the Board say no, we need Y money and that is gathered by doing Z thing. So like it or not I have to ensure that I can produce Y by doing Z with the same enthusiasm that i would have doing X. Its called their job.
Personally myself, I stopped worrying over it. They do as good of a job as they are allowed to do. (meaning the devs) they are just human folks, and not perfect. Am I defending them? nah, no need to, they are just human like we are.
Does the upper leadership need to get more consistant in what they do and what they promise? oh yeah, but I think the team learned that lesson, his enthusiasm for the game the first time and what he wanted to do, vs what he could do, vs what the technology allowed them to do.
If you think you can do better, by all means, go start your own game. Otherwise, lets give the benefit of a doubt in some things and realize, while I would love to do Y, my boss says A, B, C come first...
You see, It not really "Cryptic" meaning the company as a whole, who are the bad folks. They just made some promises they could not live up to.
The problem stems from all the "promises" made and not lived up to that has given them such a bad reputation. They have shown that they can indeed fix many things, look at the effort they put in making the game F2P. A literal revamp of the entire game. It shows that if they wanted to they could fix many things.
Problem is they built their house on sand where it came to the KDF. They have said too much one thing, and completely done the other. This destroys the reputation you try to build.
Dev's fault? Nah, the Dev's are good. They are just programmers who work hard to give us what we want, as they are allowed to do. This is more a management issue, and no I am not stating Executive Producer issue. It is higher then that.
That is where the quirkiness is. It is a leadership thing, to the higher ups, While I may want to do X, my boss or the Board say no, we need Y money and that is gathered by doing Z thing. So like it or not I have to ensure that I can produce Y by doing Z with the same enthusiasm that i would have doing X. Its called their job.
Personally myself, I stopped worrying over it. They do as good of a job as they are allowed to do. (meaning the devs) they are just human folks, and not perfect. Am I defending them? nah, no need to, they are just human like we are.
Does the upper leadership need to get more consistant in what they do and what they promise? oh yeah, but I think the team learned that lesson, his enthusiasm for the game the first time and what he wanted to do, vs what he could do, vs what the technology allowed them to do.
If you think you can do better, by all means, go start your own game. Otherwise, lets give the benefit of a doubt in some things and realize, while I would love to do Y, my boss says A, B, C come first...
This is likely the most sensible thing i ever seen in a MMO forum.
If you think you can do better, by all means, go start your own game. Otherwise, lets give the benefit of a doubt in some things and realize, while I would love to do Y, my boss says A, B, C come first...
I am actually doing just that...making my own game that is But it will take a few years to see the light of day yet.
For the rest of your post I agree, the problem often stems from up high where our feedback and concerns are never even discussed and the only thing that is important is Stock Share value, profitability and numbers that Look Good on a quarterly statement.
It is also why I am very hesitant about partnering up with Publishers, I will not want my game's path to be altered due to management/Financial concerns, it should be altered only for Gameplay concerns. So it will be done as an independent or probably through some Publishing Platform that guarantees that decisions remain at the Development level, I am looking at Sony's publishing platform at the moment, same as the one used by POTBS.
Anyways..I am wandering off the scope of this discussion...
For KDF, there are many things that could be done to enrich its gameplay, and there are really no other constraints not even ST Lore and Ethos or Cannon, than the ones you mentioned.
But the game play is already good in my opinion. It is different from Fed play in some respects and while some may say it is not as developed I see it as more Free. And that freedom is important within the context of Klingon way of doing things. I often felt a bit overwhelmed by the sheer number of things you have to focus on on the Fed Side, I do not have that feeling playing Klingon.
Just to make clear...this was posted because there is a lot of emotion still about the KDF, and much of it , as well and much of what the old player base has dealt with is, on large part, unknown to the new F2P players.
This history is very clear and accurate (because Ive been here and seen it all along), and I just wanted the new ppl to have some perspective. And make no mistake, there is blame to be had here. Over promising and under delivering is an issue, and thats what has happened for a very long time with the KDF. Some want to blame the player base, but thats insane. Players just wanted what was promised. Many will want to absolve the Devs or Cryptic management and that their right. However, many wont forget that cash was squandered and we were strung along.
Now the KDF has more content then ever, even if its way behind. The new players who are having fun are good to see and I hope they stay on and continue to enjoy the game. Just remember that there is some fun on the KDF side thx to many old players, many now banned, who fought to get to where we are now. The history here is key to understanding just about everything with the KDF faction and why it works and well as how many players react to things.
, many now banned, who fought to get to where we are now. The history here is key to understanding just about everything with the KDF faction and why it works and well as how many playreactaact to things.
"Those Who Were Banned" shall be honoured as True Warriors!
Very very sad that teh Empire is in the state its in as far as storyline goes.....
Fedcentric opinions like the one above do not help as it glosses over the truth that while we have been given a lot of new content to enjoy, its all fluff compared to a working from level 1 to level cap amount of storyline content that is needed to finish the faction and move on.
Honestly thats all teh KDF needs, outside of some more costume options, to give it a level of entertaining gameplay that will draw in new players and old alike and tell the Story of why the Empire is in the state it is in and at war with the Feds.
I actually don't miss levels 1 - 25 for my KDF characters (and I play them more often than my Fed).
What I do miss are sci ships, they are all c-points. Be nicer to see the Raptors as c-point ships, though I imagine it's too late to change now. As it is, a sci player working up from the ground pretty much has to use bops to use sci powers, or buy ships. And as a F2P player, I don't mind buying ships and stuff, like the MVAE and the Guramba I purchased, or the other items I've bought, but I'm a little reluctant to buy one of the mid-tier ships that I'm only going to use for five or ten levels - since levelling is so swift.
A lot of the conversation from the Devs, up to and including the recent podcast interview, hints at SFB/SFC type content, and the Dynaverse-style that Taldren did. There's a history there and it seems like they're trying to get to it, but.. other stuff pops up.
I actually don't miss levels 1 - 25 for my KDF characters (and I play them more often than my Fed).
What I do miss are sci ships, they are all c-points. Be nicer to see the Raptors as c-point ships, though I imagine it's too late to change now. As it is, a sci player working up from the ground pretty much has to use bops to use sci powers, or buy ships. And as a F2P player, I don't mind buying ships and stuff, like the MVAE and the Guramba I purchased, or the other items I've bought, but I'm a little reluctant to buy one of the mid-tier ships that I'm only going to use for five or ten levels - since levelling is so swift.
A lot of the conversation from the Devs, up to and including the recent podcast interview, hints at SFB/SFC type content, and the Dynaverse-style that Taldren did. There's a history there and it seems like they're trying to get to it, but.. other stuff pops up.
I agree that 30 kdf missions, although needed, isn't what the kdf needs at this point. Now at top level, you can't do defari. That sucks. I have only done it once. Reason? Grouping like in an stf requires you to enter te zone grouped for it to work cross factionaly. Fine. But please fix it.
Further to the point, why are the kdf grouping up with the Feds? To combat a common threat.
But aren't all threats "common"? So let the kdf do the fed content. That way, cryptic can go ahead and make other "mini factions" and add them to the same mix.
Will it happen? I can already hear the chimes of "too hard".
August 25th, 2008 - ASK CRYPTIC - Zinc: "The universe of Star Trek Online is shaped and changed by the actions of the players. The Federation and the Klingon Empire will be competing for influence and resources throughout the galaxy and players can influence the results through PvP battles and a system we're calling Competitive PvE."
this really would have been awesome. Like for reals. Pity i've never seen anything like it and as such wont likely see anything from cryptek.
but seriosuly it would have been epic to be able to compete with other live players for ground (planets, resources, zones)
We'd get to see notices like "Klingons have invaded Regulus sector block at **** click here to join the fight"
or "Federation Starships spotted near the Trealus system (damned satellite farmers) click here to join the fight and kick those cowards out of our sector space"
invader wins, gets to push the fight onwards to the next system (could be reset weekly or something)
Comments
But the 'progress' is good to know. Thanks very much for posting the above links.
Fedcentric opinions like the one above do not help as it glosses over the truth that while we have been given a lot of new content to enjoy, its all fluff compared to a working from level 1 to level cap amount of storyline content that is needed to finish the faction and move on.
Honestly thats all teh KDF needs, outside of some more costume options, to give it a level of entertaining gameplay that will draw in new players and old alike and tell the Story of why the Empire is in the state it is in and at war with the Feds.
That should also draw some population, and give Starfleet a few more defection headaches! And BoPs/Battle Cloak will still be ours alone.
Please define "originally".
It was never actually revealed that the KDF were 'intended' to be PvP only until just two months prior to release, in fact prior to that they talked about things like "Competitive PvE" and other things that lead us to believe that the KDF was originally intended to be a full faction, until that announcement. By that point it was pretty clear that the PvP only faction statement was a cover for the faction being incomplete and the rushed state of the game as a whole. STO was rushed to launch, which explains why the KDF was incomplete at launch, however the excuses for an incomplete faction really end there. There was no viable reason for then to not then flesh out the faction, since I can't think of a single decent Multi-Faction MMO that doesn't have two complete factions.
Also it gave me a bit of perspective on why some things are the way they are and while these may not be consistent with ST Lore/Ethos, these are needed for the chosen mechanics of the game.
For instance the higher turn rates of Klingon ships are required because most of their ships are forward firing ones, and it is not easy to keep an enemy in your frontal Angle during heated battles.
Even on PvE it is more challenging, you have to do passes and fly byes you cannot just circle around with continuous fire like in the Fed Ships.
I still do not like the (what I call) "magical" aspects of the mechanics of the game as a whole but that of course cannot be blamed on Klingons or Feds, it is a decision the devs made when making this game, and I still wish that at one point it is revamped and addressed...I know it will probably nver be changed..but one can always hope right?
And I'll keep making suggestions about it, even if I know these may drive some to see me as annoying. It is just the way I express myself when frustrated with the game, but mean no ill feelings towards anyone personally nevertheless.
Anyways not wanting to detract from the topic, I am enjoying playing Klingon thus far.
I also enjoy roleplaying from the KDF perspective because there is less content... so I tend to make them myself (plots, fanfics, unconventional ops etc). As my signature implies, I'm documenting virtual military and interstellar operations, not sitting around telling tall tales over bloodwine
Tomorrow morning EST time I will be doing an engineering review of the Kar'Fi Battle Carrier and the Guramba Siege Destroyer in drydock followed by a gala reception hosted by the Mistress of said vessels..
The way I run the events they involve millions of EC expenditure to fund player / participation rewards and for abovesaid ships' mistress, C points expenditure. Yes, I am that serious running my own events xD
The link in the OP shows why soem of the things are what the are today. Having said that im really glad newer ppl are trying and liking the KDF side.
Having half a faction (and some promises on the website for future development) is better than having no Klingon faction at all.
good i'll put it in and ty
They will spend 6 months on combat revamp but not anytime on the kdf.
But please put down 40$ on the bortas
I liked so far what I have seen about the KDF, it is interesting and any time I can have Worf cheer me on is a plus! we shall see how it works long term.
Can only start KDF at level 25 fed char - annoying.
You start at level 21 - very upsetting.
Pile of PVE repeatable missions for dilithium - unequaled on Fed side.
PVP centric - no. At least, not anymore.
Even though the KDF faction is based on diplomatic alliances with Orion, Gorn and Nausicaans, they don't actually have diplomacy.
KDF mirror universe: copy pasted from the Feds. There are no klingons in the mirror universe?
Ehh... overall, still more fun to play than feds.
Why can't I get a defari group?
Why am I fighting the mirror universe people?
And not get a canned response, sure.
You see, It not really "Cryptic" meaning the company as a whole, who are the bad folks. They just made some promises they could not live up to.
The problem stems from all the "promises" made and not lived up to that has given them such a bad reputation. They have shown that they can indeed fix many things, look at the effort they put in making the game F2P. A literal revamp of the entire game. It shows that if they wanted to they could fix many things.
Problem is they built their house on sand where it came to the KDF. They have said too much one thing, and completely done the other. This destroys the reputation you try to build.
Dev's fault? Nah, the Dev's are good. They are just programmers who work hard to give us what we want, as they are allowed to do. This is more a management issue, and no I am not stating Executive Producer issue. It is higher then that.
That is where the quirkiness is. It is a leadership thing, to the higher ups, While I may want to do X, my boss or the Board say no, we need Y money and that is gathered by doing Z thing. So like it or not I have to ensure that I can produce Y by doing Z with the same enthusiasm that i would have doing X. Its called their job.
Personally myself, I stopped worrying over it. They do as good of a job as they are allowed to do. (meaning the devs) they are just human folks, and not perfect. Am I defending them? nah, no need to, they are just human like we are.
Does the upper leadership need to get more consistant in what they do and what they promise? oh yeah, but I think the team learned that lesson, his enthusiasm for the game the first time and what he wanted to do, vs what he could do, vs what the technology allowed them to do.
If you think you can do better, by all means, go start your own game. Otherwise, lets give the benefit of a doubt in some things and realize, while I would love to do Y, my boss says A, B, C come first...
This is likely the most sensible thing i ever seen in a MMO forum.
I am actually doing just that...making my own game that is
For the rest of your post I agree, the problem often stems from up high where our feedback and concerns are never even discussed and the only thing that is important is Stock Share value, profitability and numbers that Look Good on a quarterly statement.
It is also why I am very hesitant about partnering up with Publishers, I will not want my game's path to be altered due to management/Financial concerns, it should be altered only for Gameplay concerns. So it will be done as an independent or probably through some Publishing Platform that guarantees that decisions remain at the Development level, I am looking at Sony's publishing platform at the moment, same as the one used by POTBS.
Anyways..I am wandering off the scope of this discussion...
For KDF, there are many things that could be done to enrich its gameplay, and there are really no other constraints not even ST Lore and Ethos or Cannon, than the ones you mentioned.
But the game play is already good in my opinion. It is different from Fed play in some respects and while some may say it is not as developed I see it as more Free. And that freedom is important within the context of Klingon way of doing things. I often felt a bit overwhelmed by the sheer number of things you have to focus on on the Fed Side, I do not have that feeling playing Klingon.
This history is very clear and accurate (because Ive been here and seen it all along), and I just wanted the new ppl to have some perspective. And make no mistake, there is blame to be had here. Over promising and under delivering is an issue, and thats what has happened for a very long time with the KDF. Some want to blame the player base, but thats insane. Players just wanted what was promised. Many will want to absolve the Devs or Cryptic management and that their right. However, many wont forget that cash was squandered and we were strung along.
Now the KDF has more content then ever, even if its way behind. The new players who are having fun are good to see and I hope they stay on and continue to enjoy the game. Just remember that there is some fun on the KDF side thx to many old players, many now banned, who fought to get to where we are now. The history here is key to understanding just about everything with the KDF faction and why it works and well as how many players react to things.
It is part of the History of this game anyways, it cannot just be put under the carpet.
"Those Who Were Banned" shall be honoured as True Warriors!
Qa'pla!
/Thumbs up!
I actually don't miss levels 1 - 25 for my KDF characters (and I play them more often than my Fed).
What I do miss are sci ships, they are all c-points. Be nicer to see the Raptors as c-point ships, though I imagine it's too late to change now. As it is, a sci player working up from the ground pretty much has to use bops to use sci powers, or buy ships. And as a F2P player, I don't mind buying ships and stuff, like the MVAE and the Guramba I purchased, or the other items I've bought, but I'm a little reluctant to buy one of the mid-tier ships that I'm only going to use for five or ten levels - since levelling is so swift.
A lot of the conversation from the Devs, up to and including the recent podcast interview, hints at SFB/SFC type content, and the Dynaverse-style that Taldren did. There's a history there and it seems like they're trying to get to it, but.. other stuff pops up.
That would be awesome.
I agree that 30 kdf missions, although needed, isn't what the kdf needs at this point. Now at top level, you can't do defari. That sucks. I have only done it once. Reason? Grouping like in an stf requires you to enter te zone grouped for it to work cross factionaly. Fine. But please fix it.
Further to the point, why are the kdf grouping up with the Feds? To combat a common threat.
But aren't all threats "common"? So let the kdf do the fed content. That way, cryptic can go ahead and make other "mini factions" and add them to the same mix.
Will it happen? I can already hear the chimes of "too hard".
this really would have been awesome. Like for reals. Pity i've never seen anything like it and as such wont likely see anything from cryptek.
but seriosuly it would have been epic to be able to compete with other live players for ground (planets, resources, zones)
We'd get to see notices like "Klingons have invaded Regulus sector block at **** click here to join the fight"
or "Federation Starships spotted near the Trealus system (damned satellite farmers) click here to join the fight and kick those cowards out of our sector space"
invader wins, gets to push the fight onwards to the next system (could be reset weekly or something)
Pity.