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Warp Core Plasma Exploit Question

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
Since I cannot find it anywhere in the forums anymore, I need clarification so that all can see.

Before it was mentioned that using the Plasma along with Impulse / Evasive to lock a person down was a known bug / exploit.

I need a DEV to clarify is that is still the case or can we use these tactics in PVP again?

Also the DOFF that disables ships stuck in plasma is EXTREMELY overpowered.

30 seconds not being able to turn or move is death in PVP.

Meanwhile you sit there while the plasma kills you.

I don't see any reason for anyone to use anything BUT plasma and these new DOFF to disable ships.

SO clarification from the devs would be very much appreciated here.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Have you tried to use Hazzard Emitters, to remove it?

    Warp Plasma is a serious matter with a ship's manifolds, these intakes help to keep the Engines cool, during flight. Any foreign matter that enters those intakes will cause serious problems for the engines that has to be kept at certain (opertional) temperatures. When that occurs, the next action is to flush out the intakes, and restore the system to normal parameters.

    The Doff in question offers a base percentage chance to *to add possible addtional time to* immoblize the affected ship, and it is not an high percentage number at that. *But can be stacked with an addtional Doff with the same ability*

    And the whole trick is not to be close when that happens, but other hand, yes...a fly by dump is hard to avoid when not expecting it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    As far as I know the stopping of players with Warp Plasma is the whole IDEA behind Warp Plasma. Strafing them with it is one of the best ways to get them stuck in it. The DOFF ability only lasts for a measly 4 seconds... By the time you read that last sentence it has probably come and gone. The DOFF for Warp Plasma is actually USELESS and redundant.

    Now if you really want to get OUT of Warp Plasma get Attack Pattern Omega. That will let you fly right out with no problem whatsoever.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Someone in the PvP thread is asking the same near question, when wil it get fixed. Seriously...hasn't anyone not realize the act of Eject Warp Plasma, is the same with a Jetliner getting hit by a flight of birds, or a on take off, the engines suck loose debris on the runaway (The Concorde as an exmple).

    Those engines don't do well against flying objects, one hit on one Turbine blade does a domino effect of epic fail.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Most crusier don't have a Tact 4 slot methinks...unless using a certain retrofit escort.
    As far as I know the stopping of players with Warp Plasma is the whole IDEA behind Warp Plasma. Strafing them with it is one of the best ways to get them stuck in it. The DOFF ability only lasts for a measly 4 seconds... By the time you read that last sentence it has probably come and gone. The DOFF for Warp Plasma is actually USELESS and redundant.

    Now if you really want to get OUT of Warp Plasma get Attack Pattern Omega. That will let you fly right out with no problem whatsoever.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Evasives with Warp Plasma is not an exploit, it's a perfectly legitimate tactic.

    I don't know where people are getting this ridiculous idea that it's somehow an exploit. Why would that not be permissible? It's just like combining any other two abilities in the game. You don't see people calling cheat when people use RSF and TacTeam, Gravity Well and EWP, or Beam Overload and HYT.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Using EWP and EVM is not an exploit.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    mvs5191 wrote: »
    Evasives with Warp Plasma is not an exploit, it's a perfectly legitimate tactic.

    I don't know where people are getting this ridiculous idea that it's somehow an exploit. Why would that not be permissible? It's just like combining any other two abilities in the game. You don't see people calling cheat when people use RSF and TacTeam, Gravity Well and EWP, or Beam Overload and HYT.

    you mean me mashing the spacebar wont win me the game against human targets!? NERF!
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Ok we get the point, no need to get nasty about it.

    Before this was a real problem in the astreroid pvp scenario.

    One dev / mod said before it was not meant to be used with speed boost.

    I didn't know you could still use it on impulse, it does make a massive line when going that fast, not to mention you can cover a very large area that way. Before they you were not supposed to use skills with that.

    As far as evasion, well if it's tolerated fine, people will just have to pony up for cruisers with 3 tact slots.
    BTW hazzard emitters do not work when stuck in the cloud, I've tried. Quite likely a bug.

    I've heard it mentioned before by a dev they were modifying plasma eject, but they keep purging old posts.

    Anyway, still no official word.

    Extremely powerful manuver and it will destroy any ship stuck in it who doesn't have omega.

    Also another well known exploit is that if you use plasma weapons, plasma mines, and use the warp eject then you can essentially lock a person down with debuffs, especially with the DOFF because it triggers off ANY plasma effect currently.

    You get one dot from each and even hazard only removes one at a time. So if someone is using all three you're literally screwed with no way to clear it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Ok we get the point, no need to get nasty about it.

    Before this was a real problem in the astreroid pvp scenario.

    One dev / mod said before it was not meant to be used with speed boost.

    I didn't know you could still use it on impulse, it does make a massive line when going that fast, not to mention you can cover a very large area that way. Before they you were not supposed to use skills with that.

    As far as evasion, well if it's tolerated fine, people will just have to pony up for cruisers with 3 tact slots.
    BTW hazzard emitters do not work when stuck in the cloud, I've tried.

    I've heard it mentioned before by a dev they were modifying plasma eject, but they keep purging old posts.

    Anyway, still no official word.

    Extremely powerful manuver and it will destroy any ship stuck in it who doesn't have omega.

    1.)
    Evasive + plasma is used since release.

    2.)
    Hazard + evasive and i'm outa your cloud....

    3.)

    The only "exploit" is the latent bug that makes hazard emitters not remove effects with every pulse but only once a application.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Ok we get the point, no need to get nasty about it.

    Before this was a real problem in the astreroid pvp scenario.

    One dev / mod said before it was not meant to be used with speed boost.

    I didn't know you could still use it on impulse, it does make a massive line when going that fast, not to mention you can cover a very large area that way. Before they you were not supposed to use skills with that.

    As far as evasion, well if it's tolerated fine, people will just have to pony up for cruisers with 3 tact slots.
    BTW hazzard emitters do not work when stuck in the cloud, I've tried.

    I've heard it mentioned before by a dev they were modifying plasma eject, but they keep purging old posts.

    Anyway, still no official word.

    Extremely powerful manuver and it will destroy any ship stuck in it who doesn't have omega.

    Also another well known exploit is that if you use plasma weapons, plasma mines, and use the warp eject then you can essentially lock a person down with debuffs. You get one dot from each and even hazard only removes one at a time. So if someone is using all three you're literally screwed with no way to clear it.

    Which Dev was that?

    Also, Hazards not fully clearing it is a current bug - one we've been trying to get fixed for a while now.

    As far as multiple Plasma stacking... what's wrong with that? The only relatively threatening Plasma DoTs come from the projectiles or EWP (with resistance debuffs or Tac buffs). Plasma weapons are a MASSIVE joke thanks to just about every decent shield now having 20% [Pla] resist.

    Even then, there's nothing wrong with stacking multiple procs... it's just like stacking Sensor Scan, Attack Pattern Beta and Disruptor procs. You'll eat someone through their shields.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    3.)

    The only "exploit" is the latent bug that makes hazard emitters not remove effects with every pulse but only once a application.

    Which is exactly the problem when someone is using the plasma trio. There IS no way to remove all the dots once you're locked down that's it. Especially with that blasted DOFF triggering on everything.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Which is exactly the problem when someone is using the plasma trio. There IS no way to remove all the dots once you're locked down that's it. Especially with that blasted DOFF triggering on everything.

    EWP is the only thing that is problematic when it comes to being cleared via HE. I don't have a problem clearing Plasma DoTs from energy weapons or projectiles.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    30 seconds? the doff only gives you 3 seconds (purple is 5 secs i think).
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    I think the notion that any combination of abilities that seem strong should be removed from the game is... a very boring idea.

    Seriously, there are good tactics and bad ones, in every game, and you have to discover them and find ways to counter the better ones. Isn't that more than half the fun?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    1.)
    Evasive + plasma is used since release.

    2.)
    Hazard + evasive and i'm outa your cloud....

    3.)

    The only "exploit" is the latent bug that makes hazard emitters not remove effects with every pulse but only once a application.

    Yes, I think the last thing is really the only problem. Hazard Emitters used to clear every instance of Warp Plasma while it ran, now it only clears the first apparantly. That is a serious issue IMO.

    I think the only issue with using Evasives + Warp Plasma is really that it looks weird, since the individual clouds are suddenly seperated by empty space. Doesn't look very nice.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    One dev / mod said before it was not meant to be used with speed boost.

    Okay, that makes *no* sense. I'd really like to see the post where the Dev states that.

    There are multiple ways of getting speed boosts, Evasive being only one. What you're basically saying is that you can't use *any* skill that boosts your speed and hit Eject Warp Plasma? What about items that boost your speed?

    I can't believe a Dev actually said something like that.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Similar thread running here...this is just nonsense.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Answerd....
    Ok we get the point, no need to get nasty about it.

    Not nasty...just humanly dismayed at the prospect of this.

    Before this was a real problem in the astreroid pvp scenario.

    That is sincerely doubtful

    One dev / mod said before it was not meant to be used with speed boost.

    Where and when was said.


    I didn't know you could still use it on impulse, it does make a massive line when going that fast, not to mention you can cover a very large area that way. Before they you were not supposed to use skills with that.

    Tested--Go full Impulse one can, but as soon the EWP is activated--Full Impulse is shuted off.


    As far as evasion, well if it's tolerated fine, people will just have to pony up for cruisers with 3 tact slots.
    BTW hazzard emitters do not work when stuck in the cloud, I've tried. Quite likely a bug.

    Someone else has explain the possible chance use to ge out


    I've heard it mentioned before by a dev they were modifying plasma eject, but they keep purging old posts.

    Again when said?

    Anyway, still no official word.

    No one else has heard this, or nor brought by current Devs who are conversing the public

    Extremely powerful manuver and it will destroy any ship stuck in it who doesn't have omega.

    Crippling damage is continous. but destroying a ship outright? Possible chance for that, is when the HP threshold is very low to begin with.

    Also another well known exploit is that if you use plasma weapons, plasma mines, and use the warp eject then you can essentially lock a person down with debuffs, especially with the DOFF because it triggers off ANY plasma effect currently.

    That is not Exploit, plasma in its Raw form is very dangerous to any ship explained here

    You get one dot from each and even hazard only removes one at a time. So if someone is using all three you're literally screwed with no way to clear it.

    Yep, a triple dose of plasma is not a pleasant thing, that is agreed.

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    The other thread in the PvP forum is very likely in homage to this one (I.e. a joke). The only real issue, as stated above, is that they still haven't fixed HE to remove and protect against Warp Plasma and Theta procs after the initial application is cleared.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    How about to help offset this obviuos exploit everybody shoots with thier eyes closed?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    TrueWarper wrote:


    Warp Plasma is a serious matter with a ship's manifolds, these intakes help to keep the Engines cool, during flight. Any foreign matter that enters those intakes will cause serious problems for the engines that has to be kept at certain (opertional) temperatures. When that occurs, the next action is to flush out the intakes, and restore the system to normal parameters.



    There is nothing in space to which the heat from the engines can be transferred with any kind of efficiency. Physics says your argument is invalid.


    Starships should not have intake manifolds anyway, at least not for cooling. Plus, the bussard collectors do the work of picking up what little matter/radiation that there is in space for various uses.

    In addition, the intake manifolds were only ever mentioned in Enterprise, which makes their existence invalid imho.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Actually, the "intakes" could be just a way to increase the amount of space-directed radiation surface of the ship, to radiate the heat away. That would probably be a useful design compromise between long masts with panels over panels of radiators (which cannot be protected by shields and armor) and no cooling enhancement at all.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Then please explain how does any Star Trek Ship remove heat from the Engines...where is it senf?
    Engines create heat and exhaust, it has to go somewhere...

    Second, impulse Engines are Reactors

    Possible Info Link


    Just to pull from that...Impulse Engines create their own plasma, introducing extra from the outside of that process, disrupts the ship's Engines own process--

    Small history on Intake manifold.

    This might be the answer...



    Hanakar wrote:
    There is nothing in space to which the heat from the engines can be transferred with any kind of efficiency. Physics says your argument is invalid.


    Starships should not have intake manifolds anyway, at least not for cooling. Plus, the bussard collectors do the work of picking up what little matter/radiation that there is in space for various uses.

    In addition, the intake manifolds were only ever mentioned in Enterprise, which makes their existence invalid imho.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    An intake manifold implies some sort of convective heat transfer, which is impossible in a vacuum, or near-vacuum like actual space. There is nothing in space to "take in" that would cool the ship. The only way you can get rid of the waste heat in space is through radiation, which you would want to direct outward, away from the ship and thus, no intakes.

    The smarter thing to do would be to reuse that waste heat to power other ship systems. You have a finite amount of fuel to use and you need to find ways to conserve every bit. Any time you use "waste" heat to power something, the engines are using less dilithium, anti-matter, and deuterium.

    So, what happens if you somehow manage to generate more heat than you can use? Convert it to a form you can store, i.e. batteries. If you still have some heat left over, then you might want to consider releasing that heat as some form of radiation through the hull, even though it would use up more heat/energy to just fire the phasers one time at an asteroid.

    Intake manifolds? Tail pipes? Pfft. this is 2409, not 2009.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Hanakar wrote:
    Intake manifolds? Tail pipes? Pfft. this is 2409, not 2009.
    Uhura: "Well the thing has gotta have a tailpipe"
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Roach wrote: »
    How about to help offset this obviuos exploit everybody shoots with thier eyes closed?

    As always Roach, an excellent suggestion.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Don't forget, autofiring is also an exploit. Using the space bar to fire all beam/cannons is an exploit. You should be shooting them all individually. And don't get me started with CTRL-Space.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    rooster75 wrote:
    As always Roach, an excellent suggestion.

    Well, I am a top honor graduate of the Helen Keller school of Sniping, so I may see little difference.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Roach wrote: »
    Well, I am a top honor graduate of the Helen Keller school of Sniping, so I may see little difference.

    A Dev told me that shooting with your eyes closed IS an exploit. Just saying.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    STF65 wrote:
    Uhura: "Well the thing has gotta have a tailpipe"

    My least favorite line in all of Star Trek.

    Would anyone in the 23rd century even know what a tailpipe is given that there hadn't been cars in over a hundred years? If that one person was a "late 20th century buff", the most overused trope in all Trekdom, would anyone else know what they were talking about?

    I love Star Trek, but at times it REALLY infuriates me.
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