Again, being a relative MMO noob, I've been doing some research. I see now that the 'grind' seems to be endemic to MMO's, and in fact has been people's most oft-cited complaint about them. The problem I see in TOR is that there isn't much else to do besides the grind, whereas in the STO 'sandbox' you do have a few other options. I don't know, maybe I would like EVE.
Can I ask what level you are on STO?
If your at endgame then you might also be using the word Grind on STO even more so then TOR.
Also if your not wanting to spend any money on STO, then welcome to the "Grind"...
MMO's currently are all about grinding. You can deny it all you want while you do your dailies or play with your inventory, or kill 20 Whatevers for a bonus-objective.
I feel like the odd man out for not preferring TOR. I don't know, just seems like Bioware's style of storytelling is getting old to me. It may be story driven, but I have yet to see a story I haven't played a dozen times before for less than $15 a month. Companions are really bland, too. Maybe I've been spoiled by games like New Vegas which have companions that have things other than "I have a semi-dark past but not dark enough to make me morally ambiguous and if you give me a lot of gifts I will tell you about it and maybe after that we can have sex."
Graphics glitches abound, space combat is a joke, I have a 4 trays full of abilities all of which just become a mush of my jamming on buttons for damage. PVP is a mess. Constantly having to re-equip companions is a chore. Server population is overly sparse. And all of this is just from levels 1-30.
Also, I feel like little effort has been put into the little details. Yes, its cute that there are people everywhere frozen in carbonite, but it was made pretty clear that it was not at all a common practice in Empire and was ridiculously dangerous. And I don't get why a bleed ability is called 'Cauterize'. I don't think that word means what they think it means.
STO isn't a great MMO, but it is unique, its different from everything else out there, and when you look past the money-grubbing its clear that a lot of love was put into this game. I don't get that feeling from TOR, just seems like a homogenized star wars mush put into a WoW mold.
you may want to look it up then because it dose fit whit some one ummm idk using a lightsaber
You may want to look it up because to cauterize a wound is to burn it so it does not bleed. So to have it apply to a bleed attack makes no sense.
Edit: Ironically, it is also the name of a defensive move in WoW, in which a lethal attack can potentially restore your health. So kudos to blizzard for using a dictionary.
You may want to look it up because to cauterize a wound is to burn it so it does not bleed. So to have it apply to a bleed attack makes no sense.
Edit: Ironically, it is also the name of a defensive move in WoW, in which a lethal attack can potentially restore your health. So kudos to blizzard for using a dictionary.
funny just me but I thot a lightsaber could do that dumb me for thinking a lightsaber is just a laser
funny just me but I thot a lightsaber could do that dumb me for thinking a lightsaber is just a laser
It can, which is why, with the exclusion of Ponda Baba in the cantina, nobody who has been stabbed with a lightsaber has bled from it. Hence why Luke and Anakin were able to survive horrific injuries without the use of a tourniquet.
I am not disputing that a lightsaber can cauterize, it always does. What I am disputing is why cauterization would cause someone to 'bleed' damage. The ability is fine, but to call it Cauterize struck me as odd. Seems like it would do more good than harm to cauterize something.
I feel as though you are either missing or deliberately ignoring the point of my statement.
It can, which is why, with the exclusion of Ponda Baba in the cantina, nobody who has been stabbed with a lightsaber has bled from it. Hence why Luke and Anakin were able to survive horrific injuries without the use of a tourniquet.
I am not disputing that a lightsaber can cauterize, it always does. What I am disputing is why cauterization would cause someone to 'bleed' damage. The ability is fine, but to call it Cauterize struck me as odd. Seems like it would do more good than harm to cauterize something.
I feel as though you are either missing or deliberately ignoring the point of my statement.
They're bleeding midichlorians. That hurts. A lot. Over time. You'll understand if you ever get stabbed by a lightsaber and start bleeding your own midichlorians.
They're bleeding midichlorians. That hurts. A lot. Over time. You'll understand if you ever get stabbed by a lightsaber and start bleeding your own midichlorians.
STO isn't a great MMO, but it is unique, its different from everything else out there, and when you look past the money-grubbing its clear that a lot of love was put into this game. I don't get that feeling from TOR, just seems like a homogenized star wars mush put into a WoW mold.
How can I say this, for me simply put, SWTOR does STAR WARS better than STO does STAR TREK. Personally were I to play a game for it's combat/progression mechanics alone, I'd stick with Champions Online or go back to CoH/V.
They're bleeding midichlorians. That hurts. A lot. Over time. You'll understand if you ever get stabbed by a lightsaber and start bleeding your own midichlorians.
I feel like the odd man out for not preferring TOR. I don't know, just seems like Bioware's style of storytelling is getting old to me. It may be story driven, but I have yet to see a story I haven't played a dozen times before for less than $15 a month. Companions are really bland, too. Maybe I've been spoiled by games like New Vegas which have companions that have things other than "I have a semi-dark past but not dark enough to make me morally ambiguous and if you give me a lot of gifts I will tell you about it and maybe after that we can have sex."
Graphics glitches abound, space combat is a joke, I have a 4 trays full of abilities all of which just become a mush of my jamming on buttons for damage. PVP is a mess. Constantly having to re-equip companions is a chore. Server population is overly sparse. And all of this is just from levels 1-30.
Also, I feel like little effort has been put into the little details. Yes, its cute that there are people everywhere frozen in carbonite, but it was made pretty clear that it was not at all a common practice in Empire and was ridiculously dangerous. And I don't get why a bleed ability is called 'Cauterize'. I don't think that word means what they think it means.
STO isn't a great MMO, but it is unique, its different from everything else out there, and when you look past the money-grubbing its clear that a lot of love was put into this game. I don't get that feeling from TOR, just seems like a homogenized star wars mush put into a WoW mold.
Actually, its WoW in space, with lightsabers but single player mode with a co-op twist.
Actually, its WoW in space, with lightsabers but single player mode with a co-op twist.
i love how you keep saying its wow over and over and over wow is no innovator it took from all the best mmos and just made it a bit better if you ask me every mmo ive played are like wow why ??? because it was my first mmo but now after playing other's knowing ppl that have played mmos like ultima online everquest you soon find out wow is no innovator mmos are not going to chang much really there are other mmos that do space combat way better then sto just no as yall say star trek sink
i love how you keep saying its wow over and over and over wow is no innovator it took from all the best mmos and just made it a bit better if you ask me every mmo ive played are like wow why ??? because it was my first mmo but now after playing other's knowing ppl that have played mmos like ultima online everquest you soon find out wow is no innovator mmos are not going to chang much really there are other mmos that do space combat way better then sto just no as yall say star trek sink
Woa, dude. Try and put some punctuation. Is kinda hard to follow you there.
Anyways, i never said wow was an "innovator" as you put it. I said that this kind of MMO is done in the same way of many others and people often don´t like "more of the same".
Lol we all know there are MMOs out there that do space combat better than STO. But STO has the Star Trek fans, lore, movies, etc. Just like TOR.
I didn´t quite understand the last part of your post, about "star trek sink", but i´ll tell you this: when all is said and done, people will always play what they most like. If you like TOR, go play it, if you like STO, play it.
I don´t know why people always make a fuss out of this...
Actually, its WoW in space, with lightsabers but single player mode with a co-op twist.
You could say the same about Star Trek Online. The only difference is, Star Trek Online has less lightsabers and more lock boxes.
Fundamentally as MMOs WoW, TOR and STO follow the same basic formula. TOR and WoW use the same basic mechanics, as does Rift.
WoW has gone in the direction of solo leveling experience with less need for grouping to complete quests, a greater level of convenience with the LFD and LFR systems.
Though both systems come at a heavy price in terms of community and social interaction. The LFR system was essentially a death warrant for larger 25 man raiding guilds. Why put up with the rules and confines of a guild when you can just queue with some random strangers, faceroll the boss and take the easy ride on the epic express.
It was uncommon for players using the LFD system to say anything more than, "Go go go!". Unless they were Brazilian, Portuguese or some other non-English speaking nationality. In which case they were equal parts annoying and worthless.
The wost part of all of this, WoW has removed all accountability on the part of the player. Gone are the days of people acting in a respectable manor due to the likelihood of being blacklisted by every good guild or group of players hoping to run a dungeon. Now it's every man for themselves and the slate can be wiped clean with a name change.
Conveniences for the masses is what WoW provides. With little to no social interaction or communication required. People don't make friends anymore, they just use each other to further their own goals.
So, how is TOR different?
Star Wars the Old Republic is in many ways much like the early years of World of Warcraft. Back before convince was King. People are required to maintain a reputation for themselves on their respective servers, no matter how well populated those servers are.
Social interaction is rewarded not only with social points but with friendships. Many missions on many of the worlds require social interaction in order to be completed.
People have to talk to each other, people have to work for the benefit of the group. The word convenience has very little place in SWTOR.
What WoW and TOR have in common are PvP and raiding. Many of the features currently in WoW are cloned from features of other MMOs or other games. Poke'mon battle anyone?
Nothing is original in the MMO market, that is the absolute truth.
Well you do kind of provoke people with blanket statements like.
You could say the same about Star Trek Online. The only difference is, Star Trek Online has less lightsabers and more lock boxes.
Fundamentally as MMOs WoW, TOR and STO follow the same basic formula. TOR and WoW use the same basic mechanics, as does Rift.
WoW has gone in the direction of solo leveling experience with less need for grouping to complete quests, a greater level of convenience with the LFD and LFR systems.
Though both systems come at a heavy price in terms of community and social interaction. The LFR system was essentially a death warrant for larger 25 man raiding guilds. Why put up with the rules and confines of a guild when you can just queue with some random strangers, faceroll the boss and take the easy ride on the epic express.
It was uncommon for players using the LFD system to say anything more than, "Go go go!". Unless they were Brazilian, Portuguese or some other non-English speaking nationality. In which case they were equal parts annoying and worthless.
The wost part of all of this, WoW has removed all accountability on the part of the player. Gone are the days of people acting in a respectable manor due to the likelihood of being blacklisted by every good guild or group of players hoping to run a dungeon. Now it's every man for themselves and the slate can be wiped clean with a name change.
Conveniences for the masses is what WoW provides. With little to no social interaction or communication required. People don't make friends anymore, they just use each other to further their own goals.
So, how is TOR different?
Star Wars the Old Republic is in many ways much like the early years of World of Warcraft. Back before convince was King. People are required to maintain a reputation for themselves on their respective servers, no matter how well populated those servers are.
Social interaction is rewarded not only with social points but with friendships. Many missions on many of the worlds require social interaction in order to be completed.
People have to talk to each other, people have to work for the benefit of the group. The word convenience has very little place in SWTOR.
What WoW and TOR have in common are PvP and raiding. Many of the features currently in WoW are cloned from features of other MMOs or other games. Poke'mon battle anyone?
Nothing is original in the MMO market, that is the absolute truth.
While i agree with you in all that (i played wow for quite some time myself), you absolutely can´t compare TOR and WoW at their respective launch dates.
Just ignore the bugs on both games. WoW did many things so right, that TOR absolutely ignored, like world pvp, for instance.
When i said that TOR is wow with lightsabers, i meant merely that TOR was based on the same, old MMO model. Click this, use your skills, loot that, bring it to that guy, get paid, move on to the next one.
Nothing wrong with that, but some players, like me are too tired of the same pattern. Now, some games have at least tried to come up with something new.
Rift is heavily wow based, point and click, bla, bla, bla. BUT they came up with that rift system thats so interesting. Also the class system is unique, i never seen anything like that in any game. And guess what, world pvp is also good.
STO has ships, Star Trek franchise and all. Ground combat was the same tab / point and click system. Kudos for Cryptic for listening its players and critics and changing it.
I could name other games that have inovated and brought something new to the table, like Savage 2 and a few others. Those are the MMOs i tend to play.
I played TOR for a while, leveled 2 toons to 50, geared them, really tried to enjoy the game, and even as a Star Wars fan, i´m having more fun playing STO then i had playing TOR and watching the story, voice overs and all that.
For me, one of the big errors by BW, was to put so many instances in the same place, thus denying the players the effort to travel and the risk of being attacked by the enemy faction, meaning the world pvp became so weak. For me, warzones are a joke, as it is.
I´m not trying to say STO is better than TOR, or the other way around. I´m just saying that TOR failed to deliver the amount of entertainment i was expecting from the game.
I´m not trying to say STO is better than TOR, or the other way around. I´m just saying that TOR failed to deliver the amount of entertainment i was expecting from the game.
Fair enough.
Anyone had a chance to try out the Lost Island? I haven't had that much fun figuring out boss mechanics in quite a while. I fully expect to see the encounters nerfed because they'd be too challenging for your average pug.
When i said that TOR is wow with lightsabers, i meant merely that TOR was based on the same, old MMO model. Click this, use your skills, loot that, bring it to that guy, get paid, move on to the next one.
You just described every MMO including STO. Only thing is none of the others went 18 months without story content added so that's all STO did originally. So STO is WoW without the development.
Well TOR literally redid all of their website...a tad bad for the eyes though...but it's pretty organized now...well structure wise...they still need better mods to organize posts haha.
Actually, its WoW in space, with lightsabers but single player mode with a co-op twist.
Considering there are other classes to play then just lightsaber users, and that the majority of the game takes place on planets and WoW released about a year after KoTOR, I'd say it's an MMO version of KoTOR that borrows heavily from WoW's gameplay and in-game mechanics but remains focused on story-telling and roleplay. A pretty good deal if you ask me.
Comments
Seconded.
55 was the pits, 59 killed me.
Not even talking about death penalty at 59
Can I ask what level you are on STO?
If your at endgame then you might also be using the word Grind on STO even more so then TOR.
Also if your not wanting to spend any money on STO, then welcome to the "Grind"...
Graphics glitches abound, space combat is a joke, I have a 4 trays full of abilities all of which just become a mush of my jamming on buttons for damage. PVP is a mess. Constantly having to re-equip companions is a chore. Server population is overly sparse. And all of this is just from levels 1-30.
Also, I feel like little effort has been put into the little details. Yes, its cute that there are people everywhere frozen in carbonite, but it was made pretty clear that it was not at all a common practice in Empire and was ridiculously dangerous. And I don't get why a bleed ability is called 'Cauterize'. I don't think that word means what they think it means.
STO isn't a great MMO, but it is unique, its different from everything else out there, and when you look past the money-grubbing its clear that a lot of love was put into this game. I don't get that feeling from TOR, just seems like a homogenized star wars mush put into a WoW mold.
you may want to look it up then because it dose fit whit some one ummm idk using a lightsaber
You may want to look it up because to cauterize a wound is to burn it so it does not bleed. So to have it apply to a bleed attack makes no sense.
Edit: Ironically, it is also the name of a defensive move in WoW, in which a lethal attack can potentially restore your health. So kudos to blizzard for using a dictionary.
funny just me but I thot a lightsaber could do that dumb me for thinking a lightsaber is just a laser
It can, which is why, with the exclusion of Ponda Baba in the cantina, nobody who has been stabbed with a lightsaber has bled from it. Hence why Luke and Anakin were able to survive horrific injuries without the use of a tourniquet.
I am not disputing that a lightsaber can cauterize, it always does. What I am disputing is why cauterization would cause someone to 'bleed' damage. The ability is fine, but to call it Cauterize struck me as odd. Seems like it would do more good than harm to cauterize something.
I feel as though you are either missing or deliberately ignoring the point of my statement.
They're bleeding midichlorians. That hurts. A lot. Over time. You'll understand if you ever get stabbed by a lightsaber and start bleeding your own midichlorians.
New daily came out this morning too ! I'd kill to have events as good as these in STO.
this^^^^^^^^^^^
this^^^^^^^^^^^^^
http://www.cinemablend.com/games/EA-Viral-Marketing-Exposed-Big-Buyout-Horizon-40885.html
swtor don good why you ask 1 no CSTORE 2 NO LOCK BOX'S and in the end why swtor is going to be better so nuff said
There's no need to worry. If Daniel Erickson announces the game is going to go free to play and then leaves Bioware for Zynga, THEN I'd worry.
Until then ... it's doing better than STO.
this ball park hit right here
Well played, sir.
Actually, its WoW in space, with lightsabers but single player mode with a co-op twist.
i love how you keep saying its wow over and over and over wow is no innovator it took from all the best mmos and just made it a bit better if you ask me every mmo ive played are like wow why ??? because it was my first mmo but now after playing other's knowing ppl that have played mmos like ultima online everquest you soon find out wow is no innovator mmos are not going to chang much really there are other mmos that do space combat way better then sto just no as yall say star trek sink
Woa, dude. Try and put some punctuation. Is kinda hard to follow you there.
Anyways, i never said wow was an "innovator" as you put it. I said that this kind of MMO is done in the same way of many others and people often don´t like "more of the same".
Lol we all know there are MMOs out there that do space combat better than STO. But STO has the Star Trek fans, lore, movies, etc. Just like TOR.
I didn´t quite understand the last part of your post, about "star trek sink", but i´ll tell you this: when all is said and done, people will always play what they most like. If you like TOR, go play it, if you like STO, play it.
I don´t know why people always make a fuss out of this...
Well you do kind of provoke people with blanket statements like.
You could say the same about Star Trek Online. The only difference is, Star Trek Online has less lightsabers and more lock boxes.
Fundamentally as MMOs WoW, TOR and STO follow the same basic formula. TOR and WoW use the same basic mechanics, as does Rift.
WoW has gone in the direction of solo leveling experience with less need for grouping to complete quests, a greater level of convenience with the LFD and LFR systems.
Though both systems come at a heavy price in terms of community and social interaction. The LFR system was essentially a death warrant for larger 25 man raiding guilds. Why put up with the rules and confines of a guild when you can just queue with some random strangers, faceroll the boss and take the easy ride on the epic express.
It was uncommon for players using the LFD system to say anything more than, "Go go go!". Unless they were Brazilian, Portuguese or some other non-English speaking nationality. In which case they were equal parts annoying and worthless.
The wost part of all of this, WoW has removed all accountability on the part of the player. Gone are the days of people acting in a respectable manor due to the likelihood of being blacklisted by every good guild or group of players hoping to run a dungeon. Now it's every man for themselves and the slate can be wiped clean with a name change.
Conveniences for the masses is what WoW provides. With little to no social interaction or communication required. People don't make friends anymore, they just use each other to further their own goals.
So, how is TOR different?
Star Wars the Old Republic is in many ways much like the early years of World of Warcraft. Back before convince was King. People are required to maintain a reputation for themselves on their respective servers, no matter how well populated those servers are.
Social interaction is rewarded not only with social points but with friendships. Many missions on many of the worlds require social interaction in order to be completed.
People have to talk to each other, people have to work for the benefit of the group. The word convenience has very little place in SWTOR.
What WoW and TOR have in common are PvP and raiding. Many of the features currently in WoW are cloned from features of other MMOs or other games. Poke'mon battle anyone?
Nothing is original in the MMO market, that is the absolute truth.
While i agree with you in all that (i played wow for quite some time myself), you absolutely can´t compare TOR and WoW at their respective launch dates.
Just ignore the bugs on both games. WoW did many things so right, that TOR absolutely ignored, like world pvp, for instance.
When i said that TOR is wow with lightsabers, i meant merely that TOR was based on the same, old MMO model. Click this, use your skills, loot that, bring it to that guy, get paid, move on to the next one.
Nothing wrong with that, but some players, like me are too tired of the same pattern. Now, some games have at least tried to come up with something new.
Rift is heavily wow based, point and click, bla, bla, bla. BUT they came up with that rift system thats so interesting. Also the class system is unique, i never seen anything like that in any game. And guess what, world pvp is also good.
STO has ships, Star Trek franchise and all. Ground combat was the same tab / point and click system. Kudos for Cryptic for listening its players and critics and changing it.
I could name other games that have inovated and brought something new to the table, like Savage 2 and a few others. Those are the MMOs i tend to play.
I played TOR for a while, leveled 2 toons to 50, geared them, really tried to enjoy the game, and even as a Star Wars fan, i´m having more fun playing STO then i had playing TOR and watching the story, voice overs and all that.
For me, one of the big errors by BW, was to put so many instances in the same place, thus denying the players the effort to travel and the risk of being attacked by the enemy faction, meaning the world pvp became so weak. For me, warzones are a joke, as it is.
I´m not trying to say STO is better than TOR, or the other way around. I´m just saying that TOR failed to deliver the amount of entertainment i was expecting from the game.
Fair enough.
Anyone had a chance to try out the Lost Island? I haven't had that much fun figuring out boss mechanics in quite a while. I fully expect to see the encounters nerfed because they'd be too challenging for your average pug.
You just described every MMO including STO. Only thing is none of the others went 18 months without story content added so that's all STO did originally. So STO is WoW without the development.