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The New Skill Tree...

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
...seems pretty good.

The differences in tac console boosts make sense to me (I'll explain it if folks don't understand why the specific energy ones are +26% and the beam/cannon ones turned into +18% for all energy).

I'm confused that Gravity Well seems to be affected by 2 different skills when I thought the goal was that each ability is tied to one and only one skill?

There's no skill specifically for fighters and deployables... but it seems that the hull repair skill is tied to them now... what does it do? Boost damage and everything or just the hulls of the fighters?

Thanks / keep up the good work.
Post edited by Unknown User on

Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    sharkball wrote: »
    The differences in tac console boosts make sense to me (I'll explain it if folks don't understand why the specific energy ones are +26% and the beam/cannon ones turned into +18% for all energy).

    What's your theory on this change? I have my own I've posted in other threads.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    so if im reading this correctly

    phaser consoles get +26
    beams get +18

    that makes sense as if you spec in all phaser you would want the phaser console.

    if you however spec in 6 different beam weapons you would need the beam console to affect all of them. problem is with the old way you would get 6 unique abilities all doing different stuff at no cost.

    so its 1 ability and max damage
    or 6 abilities and less damage
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    so if im reading this correctly

    phaser consoles get +26
    beams get +18

    that makes sense as if you spec in all phaser you would want the phaser console.

    if you however spec in 6 different beam weapons you would need the beam console to affect all of them. problem is with the old way you would get 6 unique abilities all doing different stuff at no cost.

    so its 1 ability and max damage
    or 6 abilities and less damage

    that's pretty much my theory on it. If you want a 'rainbow array', you take a hit in total damage, whereas you get more damage by sticking to one weapon type.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    and why should you be penalized for having a rainbow ship? All weapons are very close to balanced as it is so it doesn't make a great deal of sense to penalize someone for wanting various procs to be able to go off.

    Rainbow doesn't give you any real advantages, yes you then have the possiblity of having various procs go off, but because your splitting weapon types you have far less chance of any particular proc going off. So why penalize weapons that are in theory balanced if you want to use more then a single type of weapon?

    It's no skin off my back as i would pick ONE and go with it, but i don't see why people should be beaten with a stick if they WANT to go for rainbow. my 2 cents :)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Well... if you want to do like most people have now... being all phaser beams, or all tetryon cannons, or whatever, you can pick the appropriate skills (beams, or cannons) and the appropriate console (phasers, plasma, whatever) and be all set...

    If you want to mix/match on the same ship, however, you will either do (a) less damage by mixing damage types and using the +18% stuff, or (b) spend more skillpoints by mixing cannons and beams on your ship (as i know that some escorts do with a dual beam bank).

    So I think it's a way to balance the fact that it's skill-point free to mix/match damage flavors, with the fact it's not skill-point-free to mix/match cannons and beams.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    thats just it....the weapons are all BALANCED.....there is no min/maxing period. your simply decideing between proc types which are all different but more or less balanced. So min/maxing has NOTHING to do with this. The only thing i see this doing is preventing people from going rainbow which while i suppose makes sense to some extent its simply catering to some peoples sensibilities.

    there is ZERO game mechanic reason behind this decision. make absolutely no sense at all. Your still going to have people out there with stupid captain names/ship names and talking like tards so i'm sorry to say IMMERSION is NOT an excuse. This is just a baseless decision.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    the way consoles could work AND make sense is they focus on either a weapon system type or they effect a wider assorement of options....well we don't really have many options but basically you choose a console that say effects ONLY cannons so you get a XX bonus. OR you could select a console that effects all BEAMS and get a XX bonus. OR you pick a console that buffs both cannons and beams but at a smaller YY bonus. Or perhaps a console that assists with targetting as a whole and thus effects ALL weapon types so thus provides a wider and yet smaller then YY bonus.

    THAT at least makes sense.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Overall, I do like the new skill tree. Although, it does have issues as some of the skills does not appear to grant anything at this time (I expect that is due to them not being fully done yet).

    It is a step closer to allowing you to fly different ships without respecting, but to really get to that point, each captain should have at least 2 or 3 "builds" they can switch between - depending on what role or ship they want to fly.

    Example: In Rift, you could have up to 4 "builds", and so if you were doing solo PvE, you would use one build, if you were grouping, you may have a couple of builds that you go with, and if you PvP, you would have a 4th - just an example. This would give a lot more freedom with one captain to do multiple roles and fly multiple ships and still have completely different skills for each.

    Note: I do not expect the Devs to put anything like this in right now, but hopefully, this will get some discussion going on with them so it may come in future updates.

    I'm keeping in mind that this is the 1st iteration for testing, and the Dev's stated it will be full of bugs. They dropped this in now so they can get some feedback from all of us, so the more we give good feedback, the better off we will be when it goes live.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    I'm starting to think the skill system should be trashed and in its place esentially each SHIP has its own skill system of a sorts similar to what we have now.

    This would reflect how you equip your ship, when you fly a science ship you'd be picking up abilities to boost your sci boff abilities....assuming that doind so doesn't make your dps and survivability so much a joke that it becomes pointless to be buffing your abilities but this is unclear at present.

    If you fly an escort you spec it more towards dps with maybe some root hold resistance and as much survivability as you can squeez in afterwords.

    NO skill selection is going to work for all ship types so i don't really feel that the new skill system really allows you to fly any ship with out respecing which is supposedly their intended goal with these changes. Although i'm more of the thinking they just want to make everything stupid simple.....yeah i said it.......thats just what i think is really going down. STO is being watered down to the least common denominator and being made into a grind fest.......or you can buy yourself past the grind of course :)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    Destinii wrote:
    that's pretty much my theory on it. If you want a 'rainbow array', you take a hit in total damage, whereas you get more damage by sticking to one weapon type.
    So, why not keep the old cannon/beam split then, and give people the option to make a rainbow cannon or beam only build, or a weapon specific cannon/beam mix?

    The rainbow build is still weak now. Maybe that's good from a canon perspective,but if we want canon, just give all Federation ships +10 % damage strength with phasers, photon torpedoes and quantums, and Klingons +10 % damage strength with disruptors and photon torpedoes (and maybe quantums because we feel generous).
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    I don't mind the new skill tree... mostly I never felt motivated to really bother digging into the old one... It was just something I had to fill up to rank up at some points (like having to use all the points to get to VA) however... I have just spent over an hour trying to figure out how to get it so I've used all my points and it's infuriating constantly ending at 100 points left no matter how I play around with it... It would be really nice if the costs were all hundreds instead of the 50's (ie 100, 300, 400, 600, 700) instead of what there is now... or make a soft skill cap on it where your allowed to go maybe 50 over the top amount.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    or better yet... make the first tier cost 100 points instead of 150
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2011
    So, why not keep the old cannon/beam split then, and give people the option to make a rainbow cannon or beam only build, or a weapon specific cannon/beam mix?

    The rainbow build is still weak now. Maybe that's good from a canon perspective,but if we want canon, just give all Federation ships +10 % damage strength with phasers, photon torpedoes and quantums, and Klingons +10 % damage strength with disruptors and photon torpedoes (and maybe quantums because we feel generous).

    Hey, don't talk to *me* about the changes. I was just stating my assumption as to why they put it in. I might be right as to why they made the change or I might be way off base. Regardless, I think it's a pretty dopey change to the consoles, personally.
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