Title says it all. The change is a serious nerf to all end game ships and totally game changing. I can't even get close to the spec I run on my ships, I lose points in everything, hull, shields, power levels, damage. It's never a good idea to alienate your existing playerbase to bring in "new" players. Seriously, place a few calls to SOE and ask them how well it worked for them. But you better call them before December 15th.
Agreed, the skill revamp reeks with fail.
Plus to make it worse, they are "forcing" us to buy respecs from the C-Store, wasting either C-Points or Dilithium in the process, instead of the perfectly fine merit/honor system that did not need to be removed.
Title says it all. The change is a serious nerf to all end game ships and totally game changing. I can't even get close to the spec I run on my ships, I lose points in everything, hull, shields, power levels, damage. It's never a good idea to alienate your existing playerbase to bring in "new" players. Seriously, place a few calls to SOE and ask them how well it worked for them. But you better call before before December 15th.
Can you please explain what you mean by "nerf all end game ships?" Also, clarify what makes it game changing. It would also help to know what spec exactly you are running.
Based on what you've said, I don't understand how this is alienating the existing player base. This is just a much simpler skill tree. It's closer to what WoW did about 6 months in to its run than SW's NGE. The change should help negate the need for a respec, which is what the player base has asked been asking for.
To the OP,
I do not agree.
As a tactical I have little problems recreating my old build concept in part.
The only area I have lost in is CC based defenses.
It was the sacrifice to give my build durabilty and DPS potential.
I dislike the new skill systems, but I'm not going to call it the STO NGE. It doesn't fundamentally change the way the game is played, nor changes the game in any fundamental way period.
But then that's my problem with it. It hasn't actually fixed many of the problems they were claiming to fix, and in fact have exasperated some of the problems from the old system. But its certainly not the NGE. I dislike the system as its set up, especially with the new skill point cost increase, but its not all that.
NGE. No. It doesn't remotely resemble the massive game scrambling that was NGE. Thus the OP's point has failed.
Now if you were to compare it to the City of Heroes Global Defense Nerfs (GDN), or even Enhancement Diversification (ED), I might take the point a bit more seriously.
NGE. No. It doesn't remotely resemble the massive game scrambling that was NGE. Thus the OP's point has failed.
Now if you were to compare it to the City of Heroes Global Defense Nerfs (GDN), or even Enhancement Diversification (ED), I might take the point a bit more seriously.
I dislike the new skill systems, but I'm not going to call it the STO NGE. It doesn't fundamentally change the way the game is played, nor changes the game in any fundamental way period.
But then that's my problem with it. It hasn't actually fixed many of the problems they were claiming to fix, and in fact have exasperated some of the problems from the old system. But its certainly not the NGE. I dislike the system as its set up, especially with the new skill point cost increase, but its not all that.
What do you mean? Everything about the game is changing. And sorry the new skill system is not just bad, but terrible.
What do you mean? Everything about the game is changing. And sorry the new skill system is not just bad, but terrible.
It is? Space ships now fly like fighters and you need a joystick/throttle to play them like flight sims? Ground combat is now true FPS like Modern Combat/Battlefield/whatever?
Or, do you mean the skill system has been changed like other games change their Talent systems occasionally (which, really, is what this skill system is). Hardly as game breaking as one would think.
Plus, *everybody* is in the same boat (ship?). So, its not as if you, personally, were the only one who needs to figure out the skill system.
And, I'm glad that we know the system is *terrible* after only half a day or so of testing.
To the OP,
I do not agree.
As a tactical I have little problems recreating my old build concept in part.
The only area I have lost in is CC based defenses.
It was the sacrifice to give my build durabilty and DPS potential.
My escort was always surviveable before, loss of CC based defense is the worst thing that could happen to an escort....or anybody really with all these sci ships and sci captains flying round....
As far as this being similar to the NGE...Im going to have to agree with that. Total change of the skill system, to the point where you cannot even get close to your old build....well seems damn familiar to me.
It is? Space ships now fly like fighters and you need a joystick/throttle to play them like flight sims? Ground combat is now true FPS like Modern Combat/Battlefield/whatever?
Or, do you mean the skill system has been changed like other games change their Talent systems occasionally (which, really, is what this skill system is). Hardly as game breaking as one would think.
Plus, *everybody* is in the same boat (ship?). So, its not as if you, personally, were the only one who needs to figure out the skill system.
And, I'm glad that we know the system is *terrible* after only half a day or so of testing.
Edit because I read your post wrong i guess. I cant figure out if your being serious or have no clue.
After looking at the NGE AKA Skill revamp, I've found the following:
VA = RA 5 again. You can only get, if you put 8 points in most skills (Which appears to be the absolute max you really need to get the most Bonus for your Points) You can get 2 Tier 5 Skills at 8 and 1 Skill at 6. Here's an Example on my Engineer on Fed side in his Defiant:
Starship Weapons training 9, Starship Energy Weapon 8, Starship Maneuevers 8, Starship Attack Pattern 8, Starship Energy Weapon Specialization 8
Starship Weapon Targeting 8
Starship Flow Capacitors 9, Starship Power Insulators 8
Starship Shield emitters 9, Starship Shield Systems 8
With this build I'm losing the Resist to Holds, Disables and Knockbacks, Resistance to Subsystem Defenses (Have they gotten this to work since it didn't work on Live?), Sensors Bonuses, and Stealth Bonuses to my Cloak (Does that even work yet?).
Now What does that mean I have to do? I HAVE To specialize in Energy weapons. I have to basically use nothing but Cannons and Beams. Is it eaiser to do it? Sure, but I could have done it eaiser already.
But then while I'm looking at my Engi and how it doesn't seem so bad.. I then remember my favorite character on the Klingon side... My Tac in a Bird of Prey..
The Bird of Prey Typically in PVP is the Tactical/Sci Combo. Where you use Tac skills for your kills, and Sci skills to help soften the enemy. Usual Set up I've seen revolves around Photonic Shockwave and maybe even Charged Particle Burst. How ever in the current system that I'm seeing.. It will be near impossible to get a build with the skills you could use before with any thing that resembles ease. Not to mention there's the requirement to Spec into Stealth (more then likely) And worse is the Sci Captians that Fly BoPS and having to also add in Sensors. You litterally have to spread your self so thin that you won't get anything what you could in the current live system.
Also, they are trying to promote that you'll be able to go back and forth between ships eaisly. The only ships I could see you going back and forth between are either A: Ships in the same class (Escort with another Escort) or B: Escort to Cruiser or Sci Ship to Carrier or Sci Ship to Sci Specilized BoP (But why?)
Seriously, with the way this is looking.. I'll demand dinner from Cryptic before I allow any further fraternization on my part.. :mad:
Edit:
What I feel they really should do, is not exactly throw this iteration out, but at least give us more skill points to that we have close to the amount of ability to get builds we could get before. Either what or perhaps introduce another Skill Bump, OR just introduce the suggested No Skill Cap back in Beta. Because while I'm sure they could get away with not removing the Skill Cap by using the Level Caps as ways to do it, It's not fun having to wait for the Skill cap to raise again.
NGE. No. It doesn't remotely resemble the massive game scrambling that was NGE. Thus the OP's point has failed.
Now if you were to compare it to the City of Heroes Global Defense Nerfs (GDN), or even Enhancement Diversification (ED), I might take the point a bit more seriously.
No? It's not? Really? Have you even looked at the Skill system.. And not only that but the way Consoles and Deflectors are working now? It's not a NGE? Why not? Because it hasn't hit Ground skills yet? Guess what. That's also coming to a planet near you soon..
The comparison to the NGE is not fair. NGE would mean the game was basically unrecognizable compared to how it was before. I don't like all of the changes, but for the most part they probably can be gotten used to, and they aren't game breaking.
No? It's not? Really? Have you even looked at the Skill system.. And not only that but the way Consoles and Deflectors are working now? It's not a NGE? Why not? Because it hasn't hit Ground skills yet? Guess what. That's also coming to a planet near you soon..
If the changes also meant that Science and Engineer characters went away and that combat was now FPS, I might be more inclined to compare the new system to NGE. Comparing the skill changes to NGE is just pointless histrionics.
In City of Heroes, the Global Defense Nerfs (GDN) significantly changed the resistance and defense values of every power that provided defense and resistance. This wrecked many many builds that existed at the time, causing players to have to figure out the new powers and use respecs, adapting to the much different defensive values. My own Invulnerability Tanker, for instance, lost most of her damage protection and had to be restructured from the ground up to be survivable. So, overall, I'd be more willing to compare the GDN changes to the new skill changes in this game.
keeping in mind the system is not finished or even fully balanced, im not seeing a huge problem. skills are doing slightly different numbers than before. this affects everybody. how is it in anyway like NGE thats numbers are slightly different. so space combat might be fractionally tougher here and there. thats probably a good thing.
yes its easier to go between ships of the same type, from escort to escort but there should still be a big difference between going from an escort to a cruiser. you can get away with it but if you want to max out you need to respec. that should never change. respecs should be much easier to get than they are with an in game way coming back.
now you have to choose do you decide between doing dps, if your healing and or reducing effects happening to you, or triggering said effects. Very little in between. So that means escorts seem to have become sitting ducks even more so then they already are. Yes they can focus on dps which is their role, but then ou decide do i take tanky skills? Oh wait but then i can't take skills that reduce effects of hold etc etc which essentially negate tanky skills. And your left deciding essentially between all the time buffs or buffs that only trigger when you use X skill.
In my mind a buff that is ALWAYS going to effect things, and usually multiple things at that, they are a better purchase then things that only effect one thing and only when you use a particular boff skill.
I think all skill should have some all the time passive bonus and then has an effect on one more more skills. Instead of all skills either being an all the time flat bonus or a buffs x skill
Just to quote a line:
"now you have to choose do you decide between doing dps, if your healing and or reducing effects happening to you, or triggering said effects."
Isn't that the point of the changes? You shouldn't be able to do everything, that is the current problem with the game. I can roll up in my escort, with fully buffed healing abilities while popping off as much dmg as possible. THAT is what is ridiculous.
In the new system you will have to specialize a bit more, decide what is most important to you and everything else is secondary. This games PvE and PvP are pretty much idiot proof. I can fly Elite space, half asleep and STILL not even remotely worry about not winning the fight. I don't call that "elite"
Hell, I can run advanced and only use half my abilities to gain victory every time...and that isn't even including captain skills which I don't even think about most of the time. That isn't very "advanced."
I know people are going to be ****ed that they are losing their god mode here but really, its for the best. Now you actually have to play the game without uber buffs across the board in DPS, healing AND CC. Heaven forbid you have an opportunity cost involved, thank goodness F2P is getting that right.
Neutral voice here -- not promoting any pro or con...
But has anyone looked at this from the different perspective of ship balance in that the skill tree revamp may have a secondary purpose to rebalance long-standing issues of ship balance, rather than rebalancing the ships themselves?
Admittedly I am late to the party -- I transferred over two of my Klingon charactors just this week -- but when I respecced my Engineer, who is flying a Negh'Var, I actuallly gained some resists, and slightly better manueverability (turn radius and inertia). My hull and shields strengths remain unchanged. Although I lost 1.4% on my overal defense rating (on Holodeck, I am at 60%, on Tribble, 58.6%), I went from around 10% resists across the board to 11.5% resists across the board.
Bottom line is that if there is a hidden nerf...then it is something that will effect every player across the entire spectrum of ships-- which doesn't equal a nerf per se -- it evens the playing field, but specific ships are not buffed or nerfed because every player is subject to the same "rebalancing" which in turn nullifies/neutralizes any perceived advantage or nerf involved.
Having said all that...this is just the first shot at the skill revamp system - it is still in draft form -- so finding problems out now is to our benefit.
Agreed, the skill revamp reeks with fail.
Plus to make it worse, they are "forcing" us to buy respecs from the C-Store, wasting either C-Points or Dilithium in the process, instead of the perfectly fine merit/honor system that did not need to be removed.
The skill revamp isn't even close to being done yet...
Title says it all. The change is a serious nerf to all end game ships and totally game changing. I can't even get close to the spec I run on my ships, I lose points in everything, hull, shields, power levels, damage. It's never a good idea to alienate your existing playerbase to bring in "new" players. Seriously, place a few calls to SOE and ask them how well it worked for them. But you better call them before December 15th.
NGE... get over yourself will you, I'm sick and tired of people banging on and on and on about the NGE.
This is Star Trek, not Star Wars. You didn't login to find a COMPLETELY different game to what is was 3 weeks ago. You found a slightly new system for skills, that IS NOT FINISHED YET as is mentioned in Dev Blog 18.
You NGE freaks have over used the term so much it has no meaning now, it's useless, pointless, obsolete and would be forgotten if you stopped behaving like every minor tweak is the forthcoming Armageddon.
I really wish Stormshade would just delete any thread or post with a reference to the NGE in it and make use of the ban button he has.
This is the wrong place, wrong time and wrong game.
NGE... get over yourself will you, I'm sick and tired of people banging on and on and on about the NGE.
This is Star Trek, not Star Wars. You didn't login to find a COMPLETELY different game to what is was 3 weeks ago. You found a slightly new system for skills, that IS NOT FINISHED YET as is mentioned in Dev Blog 18.
You NGE freaks have over used the term so much it has no meaning now, it's useless, pointless, obsolete and would be forgotten if you stopped behaving like every minor tweak is the forthcoming Armageddon.
I really wish Stormshade would just delete any thread or post with a reference to the NGE in it and make use of the ban button he has.
This is the wrong place, wrong time and wrong game.
My escort was always surviveable before, loss of CC based defense is the worst thing that could happen to an escort....or anybody really with all these sci ships and sci captains flying round....
As far as this being similar to the NGE...Im going to have to agree with that. Total change of the skill system, to the point where you cannot even get close to your old build....well seems damn familiar to me.
The CC defenses are not lost. One merely has to make choices now in the building of one's vessel.
Secondly those Science guys have it just as "new" as everybody else. They too will have to make choices and sacrifices in thier builds.
I could have shaved points and put them into the skills that gave defenses against CC but I chose not to in the course of testing how easy/hard it may be to spend Skill points.
These changes in F2P Aren't a New Game Experience? Hmm.. Let's see...
New Economy.. Check..
New Ship aquireing prices from the C-Store and new Ships? Check
New Skill System .. Check
Changes to Equipment because of the Skill system Change ... Check
New STF PVE system .. Check
New Eposide Chain ENFORCEMENT ... Check
Changes in how a facion's starting level is earned and started? Check.
Respecs now cost C-points only? Check....
Game is going F2P? Check...
How are we supposed to think that there is anything else but a new Game Experience going on here?
Are the changes for the best? I don't even know any more. At first I thought things were going to get better, more fun. But so far all I'm seeing is More Grind fest, our Exp being Penalized Maybe not by taking it away, but by making skills cost more. I feel like I'm back to playing the game when it first came out in Beta all over again. Only I'm at RA5 and not VA 1. That is how bad the Skill changes are. It feels like steps backwards. And it's either their way of trying to improve the game.. OR they are throwing out the old Skill system for a Skill system that they will be able to work around because the old skill system was invted by the original game creation team, and not who's working there now.
Now while I'm sure the Development team is a group of cool people. As a life time subscriber, I'm starting to wonder if I wasted my money on that subscription. Especially since I've been a Life time Subscriber since Open Beta. Even the 400 Point Stipind no longer feels like it's going to be as much as originally it looked. I understand they are trying to set the game up so that they can make the most money from the C-store, I just hope that doesn't cost them some of the more loyal customers. Especially when other games come out.. Like TOR..
Title says it all. The change is a serious nerf to all end game ships and totally game changing. I can't even get close to the spec I run on my ships, I lose points in everything, hull, shields, power levels, damage. It's never a good idea to alienate your existing playerbase to bring in "new" players. Seriously, place a few calls to SOE and ask them how well it worked for them. But you better call them before December 15th.
This rang with so much truth that my pants are now sticky.
Neutral voice here -- not promoting any pro or con...
But has anyone looked at this from the different perspective of ship balance in that the skill tree revamp may have a secondary purpose to rebalance long-standing issues of ship balance, rather than rebalancing the ships themselves?
Admittedly I am late to the party -- I transferred over two of my Klingon charactors just this week -- but when I respecced my Engineer, who is flying a Negh'Var, I actuallly gained some resists, and slightly better manueverability (turn radius and inertia). My hull and shields strengths remain unchanged. Although I lost 1.4% on my overal defense rating (on Holodeck, I am at 60%, on Tribble, 58.6%), I went from around 10% resists across the board to 11.5% resists across the board.
Bottom line is that if there is a hidden nerf...then it is something that will effect every player across the entire spectrum of ships-- which doesn't equal a nerf per se -- it evens the playing field, but specific ships are not buffed or nerfed because every player is subject to the same "rebalancing" which in turn nullifies/neutralizes any perceived advantage or nerf involved.
Having said all that...this is just the first shot at the skill revamp system - it is still in draft form -- so finding problems out now is to our benefit.
Hey! Logic has absolutely no place in this thread.
Hey! Logic has absolutely no place in this thread.
I call foul!
If that was the intent bud, it would make more sense still to simply abolish the ENTIRE skill system.
Nerf EVERYTHING for EVERYONE so that they're all on the same playing field.
After all, customization means players can find things that WORK. Things developers OBVIOUSLY never intended, because the average idiot cries themselves to sleep when faced with a smarter/stronger opponent.
The excuses of idiots who die in Ker'rat complaining they want to get the PvE objective complete when an opposing player, in a PvP zone, decides they have a tactical advantage and uses it.
While we're at it, let's remove Carriers from the game altogether. Oh, and all cloaking devices. Oh, and anything in the game that has the potential to buff damage at all. Oh, and the ability to choose your own skills.
Too much open opportunity to "customize", which means an obvious advantage or as PvE'ers argue, "exploit", will be found and used. We can NEVER ALLOW THAT!
NGE... get over yourself will you, I'm sick and tired of people banging on and on and on about the NGE.
This is Star Trek, not Star Wars. You didn't login to find a COMPLETELY different game to what is was 3 weeks ago. You found a slightly new system for skills, that IS NOT FINISHED YET as is mentioned in Dev Blog 18.
You NGE freaks have over used the term so much it has no meaning now, it's useless, pointless, obsolete and would be forgotten if you stopped behaving like every minor tweak is the forthcoming Armageddon.
I really wish Stormshade would just delete any thread or post with a reference to the NGE in it and make use of the ban button he has.
This is the wrong place, wrong time and wrong game.
You people are so... so... NGE!!! :eek:
Sorry but the skill change is not "slightly" different, it's a complete change. The whole damn game is changing, EVERYTHING ABOUT THE GAME. I'd say that's goes even a little farther than the NGE in Galaxies did, it didn't change the whole game, just the skills and classes. Oh but thats right, you are such a genius that you knew that right........
And by the way I was a Master Brawler/Teras Kasi Master/Master Swordsman, and later on a Rebel Jedi and a Imp Bounty Hunter.
So far I haven't seen any changes I have a big problem with. I have always wanted it to be easier to switch between ships. If I have to adjust the abilties and tactics I use to make that happen, I'm ok with that. I'm pretty luke warm on the whole economy change so far. I love the DOFF system. I do hope they make respeccing more in-game accessible. That's my 2 cents.
So far I haven't seen any changes I have a big problem with. I have always wanted it to be easier to switch between ships. If I have to adjust the abilties and tactics I use to make that happen, I'm ok with that. I'm pretty luke warm on the whole economy change so far. I love the DOFF system. I do hope they make respeccing more in-game accessible. That's my 2 cents.
It's not easier though. To effectively fly a class of ship you still have to spec for it. A escort spec will NOT work in a sci ship or a cruiser or vice versa. You will have to spend 780 c-points to respec STILL. The only ships you'll be able to switch between without losing effectiveness will be ships within their existing classes like going from a Prommy to Defiant, and that won't always work either depending on ship/spec/boffs/abilities, you'll still have to respec at some point for 780 c-points. Respecs are ONLY gonna be on the C-store, you can't respec any other way.
I do like the DOFF system too bad it wasnt around a year ago. That's what makes me so mad, I like this game and cryptic is just trashing it to make a quick buck for their new bosses.
Comments
Plus to make it worse, they are "forcing" us to buy respecs from the C-Store, wasting either C-Points or Dilithium in the process, instead of the perfectly fine merit/honor system that did not need to be removed.
Can you please explain what you mean by "nerf all end game ships?" Also, clarify what makes it game changing. It would also help to know what spec exactly you are running.
Based on what you've said, I don't understand how this is alienating the existing player base. This is just a much simpler skill tree. It's closer to what WoW did about 6 months in to its run than SW's NGE. The change should help negate the need for a respec, which is what the player base has asked been asking for.
I do not agree.
As a tactical I have little problems recreating my old build concept in part.
The only area I have lost in is CC based defenses.
It was the sacrifice to give my build durabilty and DPS potential.
But then that's my problem with it. It hasn't actually fixed many of the problems they were claiming to fix, and in fact have exasperated some of the problems from the old system. But its certainly not the NGE. I dislike the system as its set up, especially with the new skill point cost increase, but its not all that.
Now if you were to compare it to the City of Heroes Global Defense Nerfs (GDN), or even Enhancement Diversification (ED), I might take the point a bit more seriously.
Agreed. Nowhere close to an 'NGE' change.
What do you mean? Everything about the game is changing. And sorry the new skill system is not just bad, but terrible.
It is? Space ships now fly like fighters and you need a joystick/throttle to play them like flight sims? Ground combat is now true FPS like Modern Combat/Battlefield/whatever?
Or, do you mean the skill system has been changed like other games change their Talent systems occasionally (which, really, is what this skill system is). Hardly as game breaking as one would think.
Plus, *everybody* is in the same boat (ship?). So, its not as if you, personally, were the only one who needs to figure out the skill system.
And, I'm glad that we know the system is *terrible* after only half a day or so of testing.
My escort was always surviveable before, loss of CC based defense is the worst thing that could happen to an escort....or anybody really with all these sci ships and sci captains flying round....
As far as this being similar to the NGE...Im going to have to agree with that. Total change of the skill system, to the point where you cannot even get close to your old build....well seems damn familiar to me.
Edit because I read your post wrong i guess. I cant figure out if your being serious or have no clue.
VA = RA 5 again. You can only get, if you put 8 points in most skills (Which appears to be the absolute max you really need to get the most Bonus for your Points) You can get 2 Tier 5 Skills at 8 and 1 Skill at 6. Here's an Example on my Engineer on Fed side in his Defiant:
Starship Weapons training 9, Starship Energy Weapon 8, Starship Maneuevers 8, Starship Attack Pattern 8, Starship Energy Weapon Specialization 8
Starship Weapon Targeting 8
Starship Batteries 9, Structural Intergerity 9, Starship Electro-Plasma Systems 8, Starship Engine Performance 8
Starship Hull Repair 9, Starship Impulse Thrusters 8, Starship Hull Plating 8, Starship Aux Performance 8
Starship Warpcore efficiency 8, Starship Warpcore Potential (Does this even work?) 8, Starship Shield performance 8, Starship Weapon Performance 6
Starship Flow Capacitors 9, Starship Power Insulators 8
Starship Shield emitters 9, Starship Shield Systems 8
With this build I'm losing the Resist to Holds, Disables and Knockbacks, Resistance to Subsystem Defenses (Have they gotten this to work since it didn't work on Live?), Sensors Bonuses, and Stealth Bonuses to my Cloak (Does that even work yet?).
Now What does that mean I have to do? I HAVE To specialize in Energy weapons. I have to basically use nothing but Cannons and Beams. Is it eaiser to do it? Sure, but I could have done it eaiser already.
But then while I'm looking at my Engi and how it doesn't seem so bad.. I then remember my favorite character on the Klingon side... My Tac in a Bird of Prey..
The Bird of Prey Typically in PVP is the Tactical/Sci Combo. Where you use Tac skills for your kills, and Sci skills to help soften the enemy. Usual Set up I've seen revolves around Photonic Shockwave and maybe even Charged Particle Burst. How ever in the current system that I'm seeing.. It will be near impossible to get a build with the skills you could use before with any thing that resembles ease. Not to mention there's the requirement to Spec into Stealth (more then likely) And worse is the Sci Captians that Fly BoPS and having to also add in Sensors. You litterally have to spread your self so thin that you won't get anything what you could in the current live system.
Also, they are trying to promote that you'll be able to go back and forth between ships eaisly. The only ships I could see you going back and forth between are either A: Ships in the same class (Escort with another Escort) or B: Escort to Cruiser or Sci Ship to Carrier or Sci Ship to Sci Specilized BoP (But why?)
Seriously, with the way this is looking.. I'll demand dinner from Cryptic before I allow any further fraternization on my part.. :mad:
Edit:
What I feel they really should do, is not exactly throw this iteration out, but at least give us more skill points to that we have close to the amount of ability to get builds we could get before. Either what or perhaps introduce another Skill Bump, OR just introduce the suggested No Skill Cap back in Beta. Because while I'm sure they could get away with not removing the Skill Cap by using the Level Caps as ways to do it, It's not fun having to wait for the Skill cap to raise again.
No? It's not? Really? Have you even looked at the Skill system.. And not only that but the way Consoles and Deflectors are working now? It's not a NGE? Why not? Because it hasn't hit Ground skills yet? Guess what. That's also coming to a planet near you soon..
If the changes also meant that Science and Engineer characters went away and that combat was now FPS, I might be more inclined to compare the new system to NGE. Comparing the skill changes to NGE is just pointless histrionics.
In City of Heroes, the Global Defense Nerfs (GDN) significantly changed the resistance and defense values of every power that provided defense and resistance. This wrecked many many builds that existed at the time, causing players to have to figure out the new powers and use respecs, adapting to the much different defensive values. My own Invulnerability Tanker, for instance, lost most of her damage protection and had to be restructured from the ground up to be survivable. So, overall, I'd be more willing to compare the GDN changes to the new skill changes in this game.
yes its easier to go between ships of the same type, from escort to escort but there should still be a big difference between going from an escort to a cruiser. you can get away with it but if you want to max out you need to respec. that should never change. respecs should be much easier to get than they are with an in game way coming back.
They are actually giving you MORE flexibility by unbinding specific ships and binding abilities instead. I think it is pure and utter win.
now you have to choose do you decide between doing dps, if your healing and or reducing effects happening to you, or triggering said effects. Very little in between. So that means escorts seem to have become sitting ducks even more so then they already are. Yes they can focus on dps which is their role, but then ou decide do i take tanky skills? Oh wait but then i can't take skills that reduce effects of hold etc etc which essentially negate tanky skills. And your left deciding essentially between all the time buffs or buffs that only trigger when you use X skill.
In my mind a buff that is ALWAYS going to effect things, and usually multiple things at that, they are a better purchase then things that only effect one thing and only when you use a particular boff skill.
I think all skill should have some all the time passive bonus and then has an effect on one more more skills. Instead of all skills either being an all the time flat bonus or a buffs x skill
"now you have to choose do you decide between doing dps, if your healing and or reducing effects happening to you, or triggering said effects."
Isn't that the point of the changes? You shouldn't be able to do everything, that is the current problem with the game. I can roll up in my escort, with fully buffed healing abilities while popping off as much dmg as possible. THAT is what is ridiculous.
In the new system you will have to specialize a bit more, decide what is most important to you and everything else is secondary. This games PvE and PvP are pretty much idiot proof. I can fly Elite space, half asleep and STILL not even remotely worry about not winning the fight. I don't call that "elite"
Hell, I can run advanced and only use half my abilities to gain victory every time...and that isn't even including captain skills which I don't even think about most of the time. That isn't very "advanced."
I know people are going to be ****ed that they are losing their god mode here but really, its for the best. Now you actually have to play the game without uber buffs across the board in DPS, healing AND CC. Heaven forbid you have an opportunity cost involved, thank goodness F2P is getting that right.
But has anyone looked at this from the different perspective of ship balance in that the skill tree revamp may have a secondary purpose to rebalance long-standing issues of ship balance, rather than rebalancing the ships themselves?
Admittedly I am late to the party -- I transferred over two of my Klingon charactors just this week -- but when I respecced my Engineer, who is flying a Negh'Var, I actuallly gained some resists, and slightly better manueverability (turn radius and inertia). My hull and shields strengths remain unchanged. Although I lost 1.4% on my overal defense rating (on Holodeck, I am at 60%, on Tribble, 58.6%), I went from around 10% resists across the board to 11.5% resists across the board.
Bottom line is that if there is a hidden nerf...then it is something that will effect every player across the entire spectrum of ships-- which doesn't equal a nerf per se -- it evens the playing field, but specific ships are not buffed or nerfed because every player is subject to the same "rebalancing" which in turn nullifies/neutralizes any perceived advantage or nerf involved.
Having said all that...this is just the first shot at the skill revamp system - it is still in draft form -- so finding problems out now is to our benefit.
The skill revamp isn't even close to being done yet...
NGE... get over yourself will you, I'm sick and tired of people banging on and on and on about the NGE.
This is Star Trek, not Star Wars. You didn't login to find a COMPLETELY different game to what is was 3 weeks ago. You found a slightly new system for skills, that IS NOT FINISHED YET as is mentioned in Dev Blog 18.
You NGE freaks have over used the term so much it has no meaning now, it's useless, pointless, obsolete and would be forgotten if you stopped behaving like every minor tweak is the forthcoming Armageddon.
I really wish Stormshade would just delete any thread or post with a reference to the NGE in it and make use of the ban button he has.
This is the wrong place, wrong time and wrong game.
You people are so... so... NGE!!! :eek:
Yeah this is no where close to that debacle.
The CC defenses are not lost. One merely has to make choices now in the building of one's vessel.
Secondly those Science guys have it just as "new" as everybody else. They too will have to make choices and sacrifices in thier builds.
I could have shaved points and put them into the skills that gave defenses against CC but I chose not to in the course of testing how easy/hard it may be to spend Skill points.
New Economy.. Check..
New Ship aquireing prices from the C-Store and new Ships? Check
New Skill System .. Check
Changes to Equipment because of the Skill system Change ... Check
New STF PVE system .. Check
New Eposide Chain ENFORCEMENT ... Check
Changes in how a facion's starting level is earned and started? Check.
Respecs now cost C-points only? Check....
Game is going F2P? Check...
How are we supposed to think that there is anything else but a new Game Experience going on here?
Are the changes for the best? I don't even know any more. At first I thought things were going to get better, more fun. But so far all I'm seeing is More Grind fest, our Exp being Penalized Maybe not by taking it away, but by making skills cost more. I feel like I'm back to playing the game when it first came out in Beta all over again. Only I'm at RA5 and not VA 1. That is how bad the Skill changes are. It feels like steps backwards. And it's either their way of trying to improve the game.. OR they are throwing out the old Skill system for a Skill system that they will be able to work around because the old skill system was invted by the original game creation team, and not who's working there now.
Now while I'm sure the Development team is a group of cool people. As a life time subscriber, I'm starting to wonder if I wasted my money on that subscription. Especially since I've been a Life time Subscriber since Open Beta. Even the 400 Point Stipind no longer feels like it's going to be as much as originally it looked. I understand they are trying to set the game up so that they can make the most money from the C-store, I just hope that doesn't cost them some of the more loyal customers. Especially when other games come out.. Like TOR..
This rang with so much truth that my pants are now sticky.
Hey! Logic has absolutely no place in this thread.
I call foul!
If that was the intent bud, it would make more sense still to simply abolish the ENTIRE skill system.
Nerf EVERYTHING for EVERYONE so that they're all on the same playing field.
After all, customization means players can find things that WORK. Things developers OBVIOUSLY never intended, because the average idiot cries themselves to sleep when faced with a smarter/stronger opponent.
The excuses of idiots who die in Ker'rat complaining they want to get the PvE objective complete when an opposing player, in a PvP zone, decides they have a tactical advantage and uses it.
While we're at it, let's remove Carriers from the game altogether. Oh, and all cloaking devices. Oh, and anything in the game that has the potential to buff damage at all. Oh, and the ability to choose your own skills.
Too much open opportunity to "customize", which means an obvious advantage or as PvE'ers argue, "exploit", will be found and used. We can NEVER ALLOW THAT!
NOW we're talking about balance!
Sorry but the skill change is not "slightly" different, it's a complete change. The whole damn game is changing, EVERYTHING ABOUT THE GAME. I'd say that's goes even a little farther than the NGE in Galaxies did, it didn't change the whole game, just the skills and classes. Oh but thats right, you are such a genius that you knew that right........
And by the way I was a Master Brawler/Teras Kasi Master/Master Swordsman, and later on a Rebel Jedi and a Imp Bounty Hunter.
It's not easier though. To effectively fly a class of ship you still have to spec for it. A escort spec will NOT work in a sci ship or a cruiser or vice versa. You will have to spend 780 c-points to respec STILL. The only ships you'll be able to switch between without losing effectiveness will be ships within their existing classes like going from a Prommy to Defiant, and that won't always work either depending on ship/spec/boffs/abilities, you'll still have to respec at some point for 780 c-points. Respecs are ONLY gonna be on the C-store, you can't respec any other way.
I do like the DOFF system too bad it wasnt around a year ago. That's what makes me so mad, I like this game and cryptic is just trashing it to make a quick buck for their new bosses.