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Cure Space no longer fun
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Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
Just ran thru Cure Space and what was a fun repeatable grind mission yesterday is no longer fun. I have a couple of questions that if someone can answer I'd appreciate.
1.) Borg Shield Nutruelizer (sp?) - Why do we even have a counter to this (HE) if the cubes can fire it more often than we can fire off standard torpedoes? Get hit with it twice in rapid succession, clear it, and hey...get hit twice more. Death by cube. repeat same pointless counter to the borg shield drain three more times before one of the three cubes die. Fun.
2.) Why are STFs seemingly designed to be PUG unfriendly? Just because casuals like me don't want to bother with fleets/teamspeak doesn't mean we don't appreciate fun endgame. Cure Space was fun and completely PUG accessable yesterday.
I was arguing with heezdedjim that the loot drops were fine. That was before I played it today. That STF gear just became a lot more scarce because players like me who only play in PUGs won't have the patience to keep getting continually mauled in PUGs just to get a Mk X gear set.
Every patch so far on Tribble just seems to make me like the game less. Other than DOFFs, this has just been a terrible testing experience for me.
1.) Borg Shield Nutruelizer (sp?) - Why do we even have a counter to this (HE) if the cubes can fire it more often than we can fire off standard torpedoes? Get hit with it twice in rapid succession, clear it, and hey...get hit twice more. Death by cube. repeat same pointless counter to the borg shield drain three more times before one of the three cubes die. Fun.
2.) Why are STFs seemingly designed to be PUG unfriendly? Just because casuals like me don't want to bother with fleets/teamspeak doesn't mean we don't appreciate fun endgame. Cure Space was fun and completely PUG accessable yesterday.
I was arguing with heezdedjim that the loot drops were fine. That was before I played it today. That STF gear just became a lot more scarce because players like me who only play in PUGs won't have the patience to keep getting continually mauled in PUGs just to get a Mk X gear set.
Every patch so far on Tribble just seems to make me like the game less. Other than DOFFs, this has just been a terrible testing experience for me.
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BTW.. the Optional Objective Loot bag never dropped Set Pieces... If that's what you think has changed. it only dropped random BOE stuff, Rare Salvage, and the occasional EDC (common salvage).
No, the loot is fine. I knew that is how it worked.
Issue #1 has been a bother of mine for a while. Just got to the point today where I really got tired of it. Why have a counter that doesn't actually end up countering anything if every NPC ship (Maybe not the Borg BoP's, but everything else) just spams shield nuetrilizer to the point that the counter is useless?
And if I am not mstaken, you strengthened up the probes. At least the bottom set of three seem much more difficult to kill then they were. The upper set seem the same as they always have. The addition of the optional secondary failure (Kang hull drops below 75% = fail) just means no PUG will ever complete the optional. Why is this considered a good thing from a design perspective?
And issue #2 is valid no matter if it was yesterday or today. It seems to be the opinion of some that I have seen posting that the STFs are not supposed to be fun for PUGs. Seems born out to me when I play them. The additional failure state on the optional objective makes the STF optional all but impossible for a PUG. Why is this considered a good thing? Casual players would like to achieve an optional goal just as much as fleeted-up teamspeaking players.
Why should something be more difficult by design for the casual player than for someone with the time to find a cool fleet and get set up on voice chat and all of that?
It may just be that STFs aren't worth the frustration for me. Either way, thanks for responding. I do like the format of them now much more than I did before if that counts for anything.
People are not going to do these if there is no rewards. And not the borg gear tokens either. Unless I get blazingly lucky I still need to come up with 105 more "Encrypted Data Chip" to get the rest of the Kelrun Mk XI ground set on my KDF SCI captain.. and all of a sudden that starting to look like 105 STF runs.. If drop rate has ben edjusted down then the chances of extra data chips has also drop significantly.
Or, in other words, ya'll overdid it AGAIN! Have any of ya ever considered making a SMALL change?
16 Nanite repair probes, 3 cubes, 6 guard raptors, 12-16 BOP, 6-10 Raptors and usually at least 4 Neg'var that need to be taken out and of course that assimilated Carrier at the end and 2 loot drops off of kills during the mission split between 5 players...
I'll keep plugging at this but my impression is that ya'll shot the goose!
Thanks, really thanks alot....
(18 nanite probes, isn't it?)
I didn't notice much difference in loot drops on my test runs, to be honest. I only had the patience to run two runs before I decided it wan't fun anymore so maybe I was just loot lucky.
But now that I think about it, making it impossible for PUGs to achieve the optional will make the whole process a lot more grindie than it was. Its just one less chance I have of snagging an extra common or rare, making the odds of having to do a full 30 runs for one piece of gear more likely.
Oh, and halving the dilithium payout kinda sucked, too. If there isn't going to be a change to dilithium being tied to crafting, I was hoping Cryptic wasn't going to be stingy with dilithium rewards. Now we have less rewards, more costs, and a silly 8k refining cap.
Enthusiasm waning the more I think about it.
Edit: to be a little more constructive, I will toss out a suggestion. Remove the optional failure state on normal. That keeps the normal difficulty PUG-friendly, and makes the elite challenge that much more elite by comparison. It also doesn't diminish the accomplishment of the elite players, since those of us on normal difficulty teaming in PUGs are never going to earn the Mk XII gear as it stands, anyway.
However the bug of someone not getting put in to auto team happened, so 1 guy who was just sitting doing nothing for the first 5mins got away with our bonus loot bag :mad: please fix the auto teaming in STFs as this is very very annoying.
That all said. I agree with the OP that the borg can fire that damned neutralizer way too often. I gave up clearing it long ago because when I healed the set of 7 that was on me, another 9 got fired at me while the buff was running and I still got neutralized. Now it seems if im not running a full healing build I just have to resolve myself to having no shields ever and that I'm going to die a lot.
Yeah, as an Eng in a Defiant, I expect to go boom quite a bit, but its a little redonkulous now. I had 7 or 8 neutrilizers on me, hit HE, cleared those, got 4 or 5 more, couldn't clear them. I have HE, Eng team II, rotate shields, emergency to shields, tac team, miracle worker, brace for inpact all going off when cooldowns allow just to try to last long enough to use HE again to reclear and try to get some shields up again.
It might be ok if you get an exceptional group in your PUG. Otherwise, kiss that optional loot bag bye-bye, auto-team camper or no.
This evening after the patch the drops of salvage, err, encrypted things are much less during the run of the stf.
Then, someone didnt get put into auto team and we who did all the work got nothing for saving the Kang.
And finally, yesterday on MANY times I ran it the final reward was often 3 items, one salvage and 2 of something else. Tonight, one salvage and one item.
So something has changed and as mentioned it has made doing this grind a hassle. This is a test server, give us a bit of a break on it to test out the new equipment...
And make the ground (new) sets up before the weekend so those of us grinding for the sets can use them during our fleet nights for the weekend.
:-)
My point exactly. before todays patch the STF's were fun and doable by all. now their doable but it's no longer fun. and that gring for 30 is going to take a lot longer. I see this as a turn off for people who just whnt to go do a quick stf run. leave this challenge for elite. and you have both ways still. one for casual players and one for the hardcore players.
I understand in doing it since there is no end-game content, but it's just too much. We need new grounds to play in.
I didn't mind the grind when it was fun and could be somewhat accomplished. Wouldn't mind new grounds to play in either.
Something just doesn't seem right. Gozer is saying the only change is the change to the Kang optional goal. If so, why does it seem so much harder today than yesterday?
i agree, well said.
if u want us to gind for sets thats fine, but this is making me not want to play them any more:(
I for one am getting really tired of all this ENDLESS grinding. So let me add my voice to the growing chorus.
This is becoming one HUGE grindfest. For damned little rewards. And it's NOT FUN.
I'm all for working to get what I want, but this is starting to get ridiculous, I don't have all day and, or tons of hours to run missions over and over and over again. ENDLESSLY -
I'f I'm lucky I have an hour a day.
Today for example, now's the time, I try to log on, the server is down for maintenance.
I'm done for the day -
If I can't make reasonable progress in the short time I have, I'm gonna loose interest FAST.
And I'm loosing interest FAST........
I'll be honest, I don't know. I honestly didn't play the Cure Space today to notice any differences, except the headache I got for testing Elite mode.
If there is, I think people will mention it.
Number one and first off.
Either the NPC's are hitting harder or the Kang got a lot more fragile. I just did my third mission today where everyone did what the usually do, and I was with players I've seen time and again over the last several days. They all know the mission.
The Kang was destryed before we could finish off the first cube by 4 BOP's which previous to todays patch would "maybe" have knocked the shields down before we could get to it.
In the last mission we had a Fed SCI VA in a sci ship, a Fed ENG in a Dreadnaught Cruiser, and three KDF in Carriers.. all of us pack reman fighters and BOP..
It should have been a cake walk. It wasn't.. this is the 5th run today where I've seen the Kang killed by what it used to live though easily. to where we could get back and clean the Borg off it, and move to the next cube.
Also, the ships yards were spawning ships faster then previously.
Perhapes ya'll mislabled the ELITE mission as the normal mission perhapes?
Either way Untill I see a posting by staff or Devs that this has been corrected I am done doing STF's I don't need to do this any more to figure out that some changed in the mission.
I'll try it on my engineer toon. But my SCI in her carrier is done with STF's and till what ever code error crept in gets fixed.
This, 110% this. I've never understood it either. For a dev team that has famously declared themselves to be smaller than a starbucks crew, I really do not understand this. I would have thought more energy would be put into other things.
Infected, the tac cube ate us alive at our spawn, then the gate spat us out. every shot from it was 90k torp spreads. somehow, that a tad excessive,,,
This makes me not want to do them on elite. the casual is simple although I wouldnt mind a quick fix to return those to where they were.
*Suggestion*- Do away with torp spread on borg and torps on the gate. and it will be slightly more bearable. and shield neut needs a serious nerf like one every 60 seconds or so with a stack limit of 2. those are my thoughts.
Maybe I was running wit novices or folks off thier game.. but some things still feel different about the mission.. something are simply not dieing as fast to MY character.. please do note that I usually haven't had buffs up from DOFF missions anyway.. They are showing but patch notes said they're not actually there so I'm fine with that.
Ad maybe, just maybe, I'm a little tired and frustrated....
I'm on my Dairet toon on tribble right now..
I am disturbed that that she is NOT wearing the KDF Honor Guard uniform options yet..
She's had her ground set for two weeks now guys, COMONWITHIT!!I
Cure space was fun before yesterday´s patch. Yes even the grind was fun.
After the patch....meeeeh.
Appreciate the fix for the Starfleet Battle Rifle but please bring cure space (normal) back to where it was before the patch.
Oh yeah also tried Infected (Elite) and don´t get me even started on that. Can´t see the fun in it.
Gettin one shotted all the time is not what what I want to do in my spare time.
Haven´t tried the normal version of it after the patch but I liked the version Infected Space (Normal) before the patch. Was fun and a lil challenging.
Oh yes and a small request Gozer. I think you said that when we obtain 3 pieces of a new set we get an accolade. Can you guys link that acclolade with a token that lets us claim the exact set on holodeck when it releases. Seems fair due to having to grind the misisons around 90 times (ok a lil less but you get my point).
i would find having more spawns so someone MUST stay behind to guard kang a nice addition, but ... shield neutralizerz spamming all over, torp spread 3 everywhere and 10x as many spawns, well **************************************
Now it's nothing but SPAM SPAM SPAM!
I protected the Kang from the BoPs, but when the Raptors started coming, wave after wave almost, it became hard to protect to which 2 others had to divert from fighting the cube. And they were fighting the Cube and 2 Raptors too.
Right now, I'm so furious I'm about to say goodbye to STO. If this is the direction they want to call End-Game, then I will won't even bother with this stupid grinding. I'll go spend my time with the competion, than spending my time with 2 year old content.
up until the patch yesterday 4 team members could work on the cubes, while one protected the kang. then when they got a cube they would help the hang, rinse and repeat and mission is completed.
Last night anytime I went to play it we would get one cube down then it would say optional objective failed. Then as we worked on the second cube it would say mission failed, leave map. maybe we'd get like 6 of the 8 spheres on the second before it stopped. I did this with several different groups. The Raptors also did feel a good amount stronger.
Yeah, I'm sure it must be all in my head.
Still, I appreciated his reply. I have to say the only thing that has really impressed me throughout this whole F2P transition testing has been the DOFF system and the level of communication Gozer and Heretic are giving us.
Maybe I'm just not cut out for STFs.
Strangely enough, whle Cure/Space seems harder, I tried the new KA space and it was a cakewalk. Only issue on that one was we were cutting it close on time by the time we killed the second gate.
Are the gates still not taking torpedo damage? If they aren't, then when they get that fixed that STF will be the only one I can do reliably! Ha.
I think the optional objective is a slight bit to hard. After playing through a few times last night we could never keep the Kang's hull above 75%, we could keep it above 50% most of the time. One piece of feedback I would give, would be to lower the hull requirement on the Kang to 50%.