Not a super fan of the console, just found out today that it basically does nothing if you don't use photon torpedos. Wish it would work with other torps, I mean the skill system is moving away from locking you into a certain weapon type, but this console is moving towards it. It is not a super big deal I guess, but it does make me rethink buying this refit on holodeck.
The ships appearance though is fantastic to say the least, probably one of my favorite ships I have seen. Really like where you guys are going with the star fleet models I must say.
Not a super fan of the console, just found out today that it basically does nothing if you don't use photon torpedos. Wish it would work with other torps, I mean the skill system is moving away from locking you into a certain weapon type, but this console is moving towards it. It is not a super big deal I guess, but it does make me rethink buying this refit on holodeck.
This. The console doesn't seem terribly useful when it only works with photon torpedoes.
The ship is beautiful. Appreciation to Captain Logan for the care put into her.
Having said that:
1) The ship has no dorsal phaser strips. When it fires beams, they just come from the hull and the effect does not look polished at all.
2) The ship has no running lights.
3) The ventral side of the main saucer looks pretty much like the current Intrepid, which is already a source of frustration in the community. Any updates to this area would likely be welcomed.
4) I realize this has to do with the tier of ship and not the Bellerophon ship costume itself, but any port in a storm: the Retrofit Long Range Science Vessel is still using the default Constituion-class ship icon inside the shield ring in the UI. An Intrepid or Bellerophon-shaped icon would be welcome.
5) Registry number along the aft section of the nacelles like other Starfleet vessels have would probably look nice.
Not a super fan of the console, just found out today that it basically does nothing if you don't use photon torpedos. Wish it would work with other torps, I mean the skill system is moving away from locking you into a certain weapon type, but this console is moving towards it. It is not a super big deal I guess, but it does make me rethink buying this refit on holodeck.
The ships appearance though is fantastic to say the least, probably one of my favorite ships I have seen. Really like where you guys are going with the star fleet models I must say.
I agree with all of the above. The console should function with -any- torpedo type, not just photons. Same goes for the "Constitution Refit +1" ship (forget its class name). Really shouldn't be tied to only functioning with a specific damage type.
The ship is beautiful. Appreciation to Captain Logan for the care put into her.
Having said that:
1) The ship has no dorsal phaser strips. When it fires beams, they just come from the hull and the effect does not look polished at all.
2) The ship has no running lights. 3) The ventral side of the main saucer looks pretty much like the current Intrepid, which is already a source of frustration in the community. Any updates to this area would likely be welcomed.
4) I realize this has to do with the tier of ship and not the Bellerophon ship costume itself, but any port in a storm: the Retrofit Long Range Science Vessel is still using the default Constituion-class ship icon inside the shield ring in the UI. An Intrepid or Bellerophon-shaped icon would be welcome.
5) Registry number along the aft section of the nacelles like other Starfleet vessels have would probably look nice.
I agree with the above statements, and hope some of it gets addressed before going to Holodeck (thou as usual, this sort of feedback will probably fall on deaf ears). Bolded the important part for emphasis and would like to see the same fixing done to the default Intrepid look as well.
From my other thread regarding the console (with some edits)
I was all thrilled about a Torp upgrade, since my main flies a torpedo boat (which also happens to be a science vessel). So I bought the Bellerophon with a vast majority of my test points and slotted the console. Went into 1v1 combat to try it out. Nothing.
I was super bummed that my first attempt to use the console didn't work because I had transphasics equipped. I didn't see anything in the flavor text where it required me to use photons (which I don't have, don't feel like spending the dilithium to craft replacements for the transphasics I do have, and am not specced into presently).
This console (not surprisingly) also activated the cooldowns on HYT and Torp Spread. I thought a 2 minute cool down was a little steep.
I also noticed a buff icon (like Attack Pattern Alpha) above my ship icon that stayed in place, but it appeared to only buff one shot. Weird.
Quick nitpicky things. The flavor text has some misspellings. Should be Nadion, not Nadeon. And it's the USS Voyager not Voyger
This should be a tier 4 ship not tier 3. The console is completely lacking in power and for that matter usablity. It only works with photon torpedoes. It only does shockwave damage when it should do both torpedo damage and shockwave damage. Otherwise looks great.
The ship is beautiful. Appreciation to Captain Logan for the care put into her.
Having said that:
1) The ship has no dorsal phaser strips. When it fires beams, they just come from the hull and the effect does not look polished at all.
2) The ship has no running lights.
3) The ventral side of the main saucer looks pretty much like the current Intrepid, which is already a source of frustration in the community. Any updates to this area would likely be welcomed.
4) I realize this has to do with the tier of ship and not the Bellerophon ship costume itself, but any port in a storm: the Retrofit Long Range Science Vessel is still using the default Constituion-class ship icon inside the shield ring in the UI. An Intrepid or Bellerophon-shaped icon would be welcome.
5) Registry number along the aft section of the nacelles like other Starfleet vessels have would probably look nice.
6) The aft windows of the saucer module seem a lot smaller/denser than everywhere else on the ship.
7) Kitbash: Using the Bellerophon saucer on the VA model causes the windows to break and get stuck on type 1 for the saucer (the rest of the hull will use what you pick)
8) Kitbash: Using the Bellerophon pylons on any non-Bellerophon hull causes some extremely strange alignment issues with the starboard nacelle. The reverse also applies to useing Bellerophon's hull with any other pylons causes the reverse of the alignment problem.
9) The aft torpedo launcher on the neck seems impossibly thin.
I have been very tempted by this ship has it looks awesome, however the Blue Bussard Collectors are quite odd for a Federation ship and they share the exact same texture as the deflector which looks a bit lazy.
Also after forking out 18k Dilithium to craft a fleet mate a Aegis shield to see if it would make the Bussards on his one the same Orange/Red that it does on all ship I was disappointed that the Bussards and Deflector don't change at all
Can anyone tell me if using a Different hull texture changes the colour of the Bussards at all?
8) Kitbash: Using the Bellerophon pylons on any non-Bellerophon hull causes some extremely strange alignment issues with the starboard nacelle. The reverse also applies to useing Bellerophon's hull with any other pylons causes the reverse of the alignment problem.
It has something to do with the hinging mechanic being put in backwards, I think; Whoever put the model together put the hinge in wrong, but made sure /that model/ worked correctly, without testing it with other components. Either way, it's a serious issue.
I'll also chime in with the extreme disappointment that the console requires Photon Torpedoes; It may make sense from an in-universe technology reason (Photonic effect from Photon torpedoes), but considering it's tied to real money, it's far too limited in it's gameplay applications.
I really like the Bellerophon. The only real beef I have with it visually is that I would have liked very much for the warp nacelles to be folded in different position than presently.
The sublight/impulse setup is okay enough, but when you go to warp they flip up much further and end up being too vertical. I would've liked it very much if one of the setting included the nacelle angle matching the downward angle of the pylon's base.
Also, the torpedo launchers are a bit... slit-like.
I actually think that integrating the forward torpedo launchers into the Starfleet delta insignia and stripe going down the length of the vessel is, visually, a brilliant design aspect.
As for the aft torpedo launchers, the small slit seems to be part of the new STO ship design philosophy that CapnLogan is introducing. The launchers are pretty small in the neck of the Exeter-class as well. Admittedly I haven't played the mirror event, so I haven't seen the Odyssey-class in game to notice if they'll be similar on the Enterprise-F as well. Having said that, I wouldn't be opposed to making the aft launcher slit larger.
As a huge Voyager fan (I know, I know; I should be examined, right? Well, my second favorite Trek is Enterprise, so, hmm, maybe I do need to be checked, heh), I was looking forward to this ship/costume the most out of the new Fed batch (not counting the Odyssey class, of course). I must say, I love the ship, and look forward to having it on the Live server. I think CapnLogan did an excellent job of the overall design of the ship.
I'm currently just using the Intrepid skin on my main character on the live server, but I'll probably go with most (if not all) of the Bellerophon's parts in the future. I've always liked the concept of the Discovery's pylons with the fins ('Computer, delete dynametric tailfins' ), but I've always thought they were a bit big. I like how this ship carries the same concept, but toned down; also, the deflector, saucer, and hull are pretty sweet, too, imo. All in all, thumbs up to CapnLogan (and others, if any, involved )!
As others have said, though, the console seems a bit gimpy with it being restricted to photon torpedoes. Saying that, though, I do run a photon torp (with a chroniton in the rear), heh, and it is a great looking effect, and I really like the overall concept of the console. If you guys would ease up on the torp type a bit, I could see it being much more useful (and cool).
Either way, I'm really looking forward to getting this ship when it comes out, especially if the changes to the skin and console discussed in this thread are implemented.
The torpedo thing makes "sense", as canonically, the photonic shockwave was created by triggering a photon torpedo explosion with a phaser shot or something like that. It's not a transphasic, quantum or tri-cobalt shockwave.
But maybe it would be simpler if the item would simply shoot its own torpedo? No need to have it a torpedo-affecting attack. Instead of sharing cooldowns with torps, it would be better to share a cooldown with Photonic Shockwave.
Also note that giving any ship the ability to use a stun effect is a very powerful effect (in PvP.) Giving Science Vessels the abilty to stun without requiring a science officer power slotted for it is even more powerful. The cooldown may be one balancing factor, but that is actually more a PvE balance factor than a PvP balance factor. In PvP, it matters that your single coordinated attack you make once in a while is highly effective. You can turtle in for minutes in this game, so all you need to be able to do is launch the occassional strike to break through all healing and resistances and other defensive buffs the others have. In PvE, you can deliver constant damage to your enemies without needing to worry about their heals and defensive buffs (much), so it is more attractive to have an attack that you can use often instead of an "overkill" attack you can use only rarely - since the enemy would already be dead before the power is available again..
If you want to make it useful in PvE and not overpowered in PvP, I would suggest upgrading the damage a little, and reducing the stun duration to ~2 seconds.
I love the looks, but I use quantum torpedoes. I bought it on Tribble, but will probably abstain on Holodeck.... unless you make it useful for more than just photon torpedoes. .... and if I decide to play at all.
From the art perspective this ship looks amazing. I only dislike the pylons.
The special ability lacks in practical use. Forcing people to only use Photons is a very bad idea and not good. The other point is that the skill revamp focuses on giving the player a choice of weapon and weapon type use and to make it easier to equip his/her ship individually. The special ability forces the player the opposite. You have to use Photons or be happy only with your skin. This is not good and must be changed so it works with every torpedo type.
Not sure if this was said yet; I skimmed through the thread and don't think I saw it...
When in the ship tailor, I was messing around with the various parts of the Bellerophon & noticed that the right pylon was at an odd angle, causing the nacelle to appear about 25 degrees rotated counter clockwise.
I can't honestly remember the combination I had when it happened. I do know that changing the skin from that point on - no matter what it was set to - the strange pylon/nacelle issue remained the same. I had to exit the tailor and get back in, which resolved it.
I wish I would have taken a screenshot or submitted a bug... I just forgot. Just came across this thread and thought I'd comment before I forgot about it again.
When you view the Bellerophon-class from a distance (at least in the Sol System), parts of it disappear from view. I have noticed the primary hull and at least one of the warp nacelles will not show up if the ship is viewed from far enough away.
Just bought a Bellerophon, but don't like the nobbly pylons so using the Intrepid parts instead - as mentioned by others, the port nacelle is rotated up, the starboard nacelle is level in sector space - port nacelle level and starboard nacelle down in systems.
Also, because they weren't all Bellerophon parts, it wouldn't let me use the new material
I'm not buying any more real C-Store points that I don't need in order to get fake C-Store points on Tribble to test stuff for you guys. Allow me to buy fake points without purchasing real points and I'll go hog wild and test them all.
Until then I'll just test other more important stuff.
:cool:
i think its say all! i dont waste my money for you cryptic guys.
Just taking a wild guess on why it does not work with any others would be that the other torps save Quantums have affects on them and depending on how the code is done the shock wave might trigger the affects as well. Just a guess though.
I agree with all of the above. The console should function with -any- torpedo type, not just photons. Same goes for the "Constitution Refit +1" ship (forget its class name). Really shouldn't be tied to only functioning with a specific damage type.
I agree with the above statements, and hope some of it gets addressed before going to Holodeck (thou as usual, this sort of feedback will probably fall on deaf ears). Bolded the important part for emphasis and would like to see the same fixing done to the default Intrepid look as well.
Thank you, I'm in absolute agreement with you ! (about the underside of the new Bellerophon saucer looking exactly like classic Intrepid model, which needing fixing in the first place)
First of all, I'd like to express my disappointment that these new ships/consoles are being tested on tribble where I have to buy real-world points to test more than one of the ships. While on redshirt I could have tested them all with minimum of fuss.
As it stands I bought the beller-whatever. Interpid refit.
As others have stated, the pylons are crooked. Minor issue, dispite the number of posts in the thred about it.
Console being restricted to photons - Great idea. To sate the cannon seekers amongst you, that point has already been satiffied. Photon SW, not quantum SW.
Cooldown being lengthy - Excellent. This is a free 4 sec stun and a very powerful tool in pvp. Yes, it's next to useless in pve (aside from looking pretty), but stun is a game changer on the other side, and needs appropriate reining back.
Summary: Kudos to the development team, I'm actually pretty happy (in a relative sense (as in: I was expecting worse)) with how this one has turned out. Considering I was expecting this one to be on par with AMS that's a pretty big :eek:
The only suggestion I would make would be to make the tooltip for the console tell users of the console what skills affect the stun duration (for those that don't already know). Though with the skill tree changes upcoming, I suppose that's not really feasable.
Another possibility: Since friendly fire is filtering it's way into the game through the new HY plasma/Tric's... Is there any plans to have this long range indestructible stun hit teammates also? After all, a shockwave would be pretty indescriminate, just like a torpedo explosion.
I absolutely love this ship and I can not wait till it is released on live . I have noticed all of the same issues as previous posters so I wont recant what has already been said but I have a few more thing to add.
I equipped the Photonic Displacer Module on this and wile most of the ship goes dark when used, some parts of the upper saucer do not. Specifically the cutout's which remain the ships hull color. Also ounce this console power is used the ship becomes very sluggish even with evasive maneuvers active which to me kind of defeats the purpose or is that how it's supposed to work?
I don't know, this has been my first experience with that console, the only other thing that stuck out in my mind about this ship is the impulse engine's on the saucer do not seem to show an impulse trail as the pylon impulse engine's do.
Comments
GREAT JOB
The ships appearance though is fantastic to say the least, probably one of my favorite ships I have seen. Really like where you guys are going with the star fleet models I must say.
This. The console doesn't seem terribly useful when it only works with photon torpedoes.
Having said that:
1) The ship has no dorsal phaser strips. When it fires beams, they just come from the hull and the effect does not look polished at all.
2) The ship has no running lights.
3) The ventral side of the main saucer looks pretty much like the current Intrepid, which is already a source of frustration in the community. Any updates to this area would likely be welcomed.
4) I realize this has to do with the tier of ship and not the Bellerophon ship costume itself, but any port in a storm: the Retrofit Long Range Science Vessel is still using the default Constituion-class ship icon inside the shield ring in the UI. An Intrepid or Bellerophon-shaped icon would be welcome.
5) Registry number along the aft section of the nacelles like other Starfleet vessels have would probably look nice.
I agree with all of the above. The console should function with -any- torpedo type, not just photons. Same goes for the "Constitution Refit +1" ship (forget its class name). Really shouldn't be tied to only functioning with a specific damage type.
I agree with the above statements, and hope some of it gets addressed before going to Holodeck (thou as usual, this sort of feedback will probably fall on deaf ears). Bolded the important part for emphasis and would like to see the same fixing done to the default Intrepid look as well.
I was all thrilled about a Torp upgrade, since my main flies a torpedo boat (which also happens to be a science vessel). So I bought the Bellerophon with a vast majority of my test points and slotted the console. Went into 1v1 combat to try it out. Nothing.
I was super bummed that my first attempt to use the console didn't work because I had transphasics equipped. I didn't see anything in the flavor text where it required me to use photons (which I don't have, don't feel like spending the dilithium to craft replacements for the transphasics I do have, and am not specced into presently).
This console (not surprisingly) also activated the cooldowns on HYT and Torp Spread. I thought a 2 minute cool down was a little steep.
I also noticed a buff icon (like Attack Pattern Alpha) above my ship icon that stayed in place, but it appeared to only buff one shot. Weird.
Quick nitpicky things. The flavor text has some misspellings. Should be Nadion, not Nadeon. And it's the USS Voyager not Voyger
6) The aft windows of the saucer module seem a lot smaller/denser than everywhere else on the ship.
7) Kitbash: Using the Bellerophon saucer on the VA model causes the windows to break and get stuck on type 1 for the saucer (the rest of the hull will use what you pick)
8) Kitbash: Using the Bellerophon pylons on any non-Bellerophon hull causes some extremely strange alignment issues with the starboard nacelle. The reverse also applies to useing Bellerophon's hull with any other pylons causes the reverse of the alignment problem.
9) The aft torpedo launcher on the neck seems impossibly thin.
Also after forking out 18k Dilithium to craft a fleet mate a Aegis shield to see if it would make the Bussards on his one the same Orange/Red that it does on all ship I was disappointed that the Bussards and Deflector don't change at all
Can anyone tell me if using a Different hull texture changes the colour of the Bussards at all?
It has something to do with the hinging mechanic being put in backwards, I think; Whoever put the model together put the hinge in wrong, but made sure /that model/ worked correctly, without testing it with other components. Either way, it's a serious issue.
I'll also chime in with the extreme disappointment that the console requires Photon Torpedoes; It may make sense from an in-universe technology reason (Photonic effect from Photon torpedoes), but considering it's tied to real money, it's far too limited in it's gameplay applications.
The sublight/impulse setup is okay enough, but when you go to warp they flip up much further and end up being too vertical. I would've liked it very much if one of the setting included the nacelle angle matching the downward angle of the pylon's base.
Also, the torpedo launchers are a bit... slit-like.
As for the aft torpedo launchers, the small slit seems to be part of the new STO ship design philosophy that CapnLogan is introducing. The launchers are pretty small in the neck of the Exeter-class as well. Admittedly I haven't played the mirror event, so I haven't seen the Odyssey-class in game to notice if they'll be similar on the Enterprise-F as well. Having said that, I wouldn't be opposed to making the aft launcher slit larger.
I'm currently just using the Intrepid skin on my main character on the live server, but I'll probably go with most (if not all) of the Bellerophon's parts in the future. I've always liked the concept of the Discovery's pylons with the fins ('Computer, delete dynametric tailfins'
As others have said, though, the console seems a bit gimpy with it being restricted to photon torpedoes. Saying that, though, I do run a photon torp (with a chroniton in the rear), heh, and it is a great looking effect, and I really like the overall concept of the console. If you guys would ease up on the torp type a bit, I could see it being much more useful (and cool).
Either way, I'm really looking forward to getting this ship when it comes out, especially if the changes to the skin and console discussed in this thread are implemented.
But maybe it would be simpler if the item would simply shoot its own torpedo? No need to have it a torpedo-affecting attack. Instead of sharing cooldowns with torps, it would be better to share a cooldown with Photonic Shockwave.
Also note that giving any ship the ability to use a stun effect is a very powerful effect (in PvP.) Giving Science Vessels the abilty to stun without requiring a science officer power slotted for it is even more powerful. The cooldown may be one balancing factor, but that is actually more a PvE balance factor than a PvP balance factor. In PvP, it matters that your single coordinated attack you make once in a while is highly effective. You can turtle in for minutes in this game, so all you need to be able to do is launch the occassional strike to break through all healing and resistances and other defensive buffs the others have. In PvE, you can deliver constant damage to your enemies without needing to worry about their heals and defensive buffs (much), so it is more attractive to have an attack that you can use often instead of an "overkill" attack you can use only rarely - since the enemy would already be dead before the power is available again..
If you want to make it useful in PvE and not overpowered in PvP, I would suggest upgrading the damage a little, and reducing the stun duration to ~2 seconds.
It doesn't do so well graphicly when combined with the dicovery class pylons.
im also not convinced the power itself is doing a whole heap of damage or disables. it does not even give the stats to tell.
the ship does look awesome though.
The special ability lacks in practical use. Forcing people to only use Photons is a very bad idea and not good. The other point is that the skill revamp focuses on giving the player a choice of weapon and weapon type use and to make it easier to equip his/her ship individually. The special ability forces the player the opposite. You have to use Photons or be happy only with your skin. This is not good and must be changed so it works with every torpedo type.
When in the ship tailor, I was messing around with the various parts of the Bellerophon & noticed that the right pylon was at an odd angle, causing the nacelle to appear about 25 degrees rotated counter clockwise.
I can't honestly remember the combination I had when it happened. I do know that changing the skin from that point on - no matter what it was set to - the strange pylon/nacelle issue remained the same. I had to exit the tailor and get back in, which resolved it.
I wish I would have taken a screenshot or submitted a bug... I just forgot. Just came across this thread and thought I'd comment before I forgot about it again.
Also, because they weren't all Bellerophon parts, it wouldn't let me use the new material
i think its say all! i dont waste my money for you cryptic guys.
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Thank you, I'm in absolute agreement with you ! (about the underside of the new Bellerophon saucer looking exactly like classic Intrepid model, which needing fixing in the first place)
are there any visuals ? I'd love to know how the elite force set looks, especially on the model !
As it stands I bought the beller-whatever. Interpid refit.
As others have stated, the pylons are crooked. Minor issue, dispite the number of posts in the thred about it.
Console being restricted to photons - Great idea. To sate the cannon seekers amongst you, that point has already been satiffied. Photon SW, not quantum SW.
Cooldown being lengthy - Excellent. This is a free 4 sec stun and a very powerful tool in pvp. Yes, it's next to useless in pve (aside from looking pretty), but stun is a game changer on the other side, and needs appropriate reining back.
Summary: Kudos to the development team, I'm actually pretty happy (in a relative sense (as in: I was expecting worse)) with how this one has turned out. Considering I was expecting this one to be on par with AMS that's a pretty big :eek:
The only suggestion I would make would be to make the tooltip for the console tell users of the console what skills affect the stun duration (for those that don't already know). Though with the skill tree changes upcoming, I suppose that's not really feasable.
Another possibility: Since friendly fire is filtering it's way into the game through the new HY plasma/Tric's... Is there any plans to have this long range indestructible stun hit teammates also? After all, a shockwave would be pretty indescriminate, just like a torpedo explosion.
I equipped the Photonic Displacer Module on this and wile most of the ship goes dark when used, some parts of the upper saucer do not. Specifically the cutout's which remain the ships hull color. Also ounce this console power is used the ship becomes very sluggish even with evasive maneuvers active which to me kind of defeats the purpose or is that how it's supposed to work?
I don't know, this has been my first experience with that console, the only other thing that stuck out in my mind about this ship is the impulse engine's on the saucer do not seem to show an impulse trail as the pylon impulse engine's do.