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LTC is ok; LT needs major help

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
Once you unlock the Devidian series, the game improves quite a bit. I have to say though, that I think a substantial number of players will have left well before then (even if the T1 powerleveling curve we're enjoying on Tribble goes into production).

LTC starts to be good because you can actually get decent gear just from replay missions, which is really nice; I always liked about STO that you could get everything you need just by playing the game.

LT is really, really bad because there is nothing in that range that you can do to get more than a couple Mk II items. This rank is sorely hurting for its own gear-rich mini featured episode series; basically an LT level Devidian arc that you can access right from LT1 to get green Mk II ship and crew weapons and shields, at least. This is the biggest gap between the crucial first levels and LTC at this point; as it is now, LT is defined by getting gear that is obsolete the minute you pick it up, whereas at LTC you can get Mk IV equipment right from the start. That approach should extend through all the levels, not just from 11 on up.

Also, the Miranda really, really needs some help. It is far too slow and weak, and when you're hobbled with Mk I gear at LT9, it's downright painful. Even full impulse feels like swimming through cheese in this ship. Seriously, this little rowboat is single-handedly going to cull your F2P playerbase by 50% before they even see their first T2 ship. It's that bad.

And you have to do something about the experience of staring at a black screen for 20 minutes. This is intolerable as a defining element of the game for new players. You really have three choices here: (1) double or triple baseline warp speed across the board, for everyone; (2) make some amazingly beautiful spacescapes for sector space; or (3) keep ALL the missions in Vulcan sector and DV through LTC. Actually you have a fourth option as well, which is just shrinking the entire map to 1/2 it's current size in all dimensions. None of these other than (1) seem like something that you could actually do in a reasonable time. But something has to be done.

Even at LTC, warp travel is still unreasonably tedious and boring. But at least once you hit LTC most of your missions within the tier tend to be within the same sector block. It's ironic that you force people to do more running around at LT than at higher ranks just to progress through the pre-set storylines.

Seriously, staring at a black screen for 1/2 to 2/3 of your time in-game is going to cause F2P players to just sign off before they ever get to anything good. Keep in mind, there is right now basically no way to get around this until you get to the STFs or grind to Ambassador (which I haven't even figured out yet, since it looks like now diplomacy is tied into the DOFF system). The game has so much great content, but a LOT of new players are going to leave before they ever see it, because they get sick of sitting there staring into the void.
Post edited by Unknown User on

Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Definitely agree with this but how is this for a notion.. combine the tutorial into a short FE series run?

    FE1 start off at starfleet academy where people can learn about basic movement and then for a finale send them off in a shuttle to Delta Volanis on a sort of courier run which of course ends in a bit of a battle with pirates.

    FE2 would again be set in delta volanis against our orion pirates. The character is sent off in a Peregrine fighter to provide fighter support for a small fleet sent out to pacify the pirates. The admiral of the fleet is kidnapped off the bridge as the orions ambush the fleet using klingon technology showing their allegiance to the empire. The orions send an ultimatum to the fleet ordering it to stand down or the admiral will be killed. The character is ordered to take advantage of the small size of their craft to infiltrate the nearby asteroid field to attempt to locate the base as a starship would be too easily detected. Queue character engaging orions in the base.

    FE3 gets you sent off as part of a crew to the Vega system on a survey mission when obviously the borg 'invade'. This would give the character getting their ship and field promotion and existing storylines can be expanded.

    Just a basic top of my head idea but pretty sure ts what the OP sort of means. FE3 could even have an FE2.5 where the SS Azura is carrying a cargo which contains evidence of a possible future event to occur in the Vega system hence why its important to rescue it. Informaton could also be given of the conflict happening further out in Gamma orionis wit the Borg as a forerunner to the endgame STF's.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Heezdedjim wrote:
    Also, the Miranda really, really needs some help. It is far too slow and weak, and when you're hobbled with Mk I gear at LT9, it's downright painful. Even full impulse feels like swimming through cheese in this ship. Seriously, this little rowboat is single-handedly going to cull your F2P playerbase by 50% before they even see their first T2 ship. It's that bad.
    And now that the truth about the "switch to dilithium" is slowly coming out, I realize of course that the Miranda being SO crappy is just the way to force everyone to pay for the C-Store starter ships. Though I have to say again, if as a brand new player I tried a "free" game that was this much of a lousy chore to suffer through without IMMEDIATELY forking over cash for basic gear, I would be looking for another game pretty soon.

    Even for testing purposes, I don't see how they expect most existing players to put up with it until C-Store is turned on and everyone can get access to their inventory of unlocked ships. And then they'll have Tribble being tested exclusively by regular C-Store customers; which basically validates the approach they have chosen.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    This is definatly true, Lt Levels suck as they always have. Which is why at Lt 5 they should introduce the DOFF system so it breaks up how boring the game is at early levels.

    I think they should go further then that, where you start the game in a runabout and for 1-3 or so levels you stay in it, then you get a miranda. So at least SOMETHING interesting happens.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    The Miranda isn't so bad. Honestly I found the accelerated leveling on Tribble made flying my beloved Centaur bearable again.

    I do agree that some shiny new Lt. gear would be necessary, though. As it stands there isn't enough shiny new stuff to really engross someone.

    Might I recommend adding a few more options from the P'Jem mission? A blue Mk II shield and phaser would be great, so you can replay it to get multiple phaser arrays after you get the shield.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Jexsam wrote: »
    The Miranda isn't so bad. Honestly I found the accelerated leveling on Tribble made flying my beloved Centaur bearable again.
    It is that bad. I actually think they hit it with a stealth nerfbat, because they realized nobody would buy the C-Store starter ships if it was even bearable.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Heezdedjim wrote:
    It is that bad. I actually think they hit it with a stealth nerfbat, because they realized nobody would buy the C-Store starter ships if it was even bearable.

    Well now you just sound paranoid.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    What is it with all the Miranda hate? The ship is not that bad, the problem is, that now there is a huge lack of decent equipment in the game. It is hard to get MK II stuff without Dilithium, crafting only gives MK I, ...

    And with all due respect for your C-Store hate, the other starter ships are not so much better compared to the Miranda. The exception might be the NX with its better turn rate so players get the feeling of an escort earlier, but that's it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    I thought it was just me that found LT ridiculously hard on Tribble. Unseen Threat (part of Stop the Signal) was literally impossible to solo. It is unlikely you're going to hook people with this type of play, Cryptic. Don't let Perfect World turn this game into an impossible grind fest (which it is between Dilithium and impossible to win noobie missions).
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Lennan wrote: »
    I thought it was just me that found LT ridiculously hard on Tribble. Unseen Threat (part of Stop the Signal) was literally impossible to solo. It is unlikely you're going to hook people with this type of play, Cryptic. Don't let Perfect World turn this game into an impossible grind fest (which it is between Dilithium and impossible to win noobie missions).

    That part is bugged horribly, it's not that difficult intentionally.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    That is good to know. I'm aware of the OPness of the Phantasm Devidian in that Drozana mission as well but that's a problem on live too. Were these the only two?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Take Elitist propaganda with a huge grain of salt. These people who come around saying "Its great, still easy and not that bad" do no represent the common user, and if they think its fine, its a good indication things are horrible wrong. Cryptic hopefully knows to go by in game chatter and all the bug reports about these problems rather then the Elitists spamming the fourm with their agenda to destroy the game for everyone but the Top 1% of hardcore type players who love long grinds and action games with little substance.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Lennan wrote: »
    That is good to know. I'm aware of the OPness of the Phantasm Devidian in that Drozana mission as well but that's a problem on live too. Were these the only two?

    The Phantasm has always been disproportionately difficult, though I can't say I'd compare it to the showstopper that is the Tethys from Stop the Signal. It's certainly killable with enough zerg tactics, but it's easily the most aggravating PvE boss encounter in the game, IMO.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    I found I had lots to do during LT rank. I was busy find how I could level my dip xp with missions (as I had forgotten them almost). I was trying to collect anomolies so I could start crafting myself some better gear - so I was running exploration missions. I was also trying to do the main storyline and get around the difficult parts (either by design or by bug). And I was also busy talking to people, starting a little fleet with people and trying to get my bearings in general, just like a new player would. So there is PLENTY to do. Heck I would STILL be there trying to figure out my skill system if I didn't already know that they will try and change it before f2p.

    I really tried to pick apart the "how can I do this" points so I could collect more accurate feedback as a reborn new player.

    The addition of a few more revamped style missions during lt and captain and RA UH would be great.

    The miranda class is very limiting, but pretty sturdy. With 3 bridge officer slots and 3 powers it serves well to cover the basics. I had torpedo high yield, emergency power to shields and jam sensors. But I found my turn rate to be annoying and my travel speed up and down sirius sector to be very bad - but since I'm used to faster speeds I have bias. I guess my worst criticism about the old miranda is that is visually unappealing in the context of what other ships in startrek have on offer, like a connie or a galaxy. Like the oberth it is really a ship desired by a few fans of WoK and I would have really preferred a greaty variety in starter ships for f2p.

    Ofc there will be an NX, and Oberth and a Connie on offer in the Cstore, and bought via dilithium. So I could pay cash or grind dilithium missions for a week or two at lt rank. (guess based of comments that the full economy isn't implemented yet as missions reward the wrong currency and wrong values).

    I really would have preferred to start off in a Shuttle. The reason would be my ship being destroyed during the tutorial and I get out and save the day in my shuttle (lets face it those npcs in the tutorial in space would still be easy versus a type 8). Then after a mission or two (but before stranded in space - because its hard - so like exploration or SFA missions), I then qualify for a Runabout, and so on, I eventually get a Miranda at Lt rank 7 ot 8 and then I get a tier 1/2 ship like a nova on lt. commander rank.

    That way I can very quickly see that I can progress in ships. That the ships get bigger and better. With more options. Benefits and drawbacks. And it keeps the new layer experience fresh because your not stagnating for long in one ship which you may not like. It also adds to the achievement buzz you get when you step up in games, and I'd like to start off small in a shuttle to do so.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    I don't feel I am an elite player, in any regards. I found the climb to where I am now (Commander 4) only bogged down at LT because I wasn't playing efficiently. Once I started playing the episodes, I climbed fast. Once i knew how to avoid the bug with the transmission upload in Stop the Signal, and that I needed to be teamed to finish the boss, it was cake. For most of it I parked the Miranda, and used the captain's yacht. It gimped me, but I could maneuver.

    I also didn't have any problems with gear. Maybe the loot tables were looking after me, but I always had decent white or green drops. What I didn't use I sold for the EC's, and when I ranked up to Commander I bought some shiny new weapons for my escort. There's nothing elite or exceptional about my gameplay experience over the last couple days. In retrospect, when fixing the bugs in some of the missions, they should consider leaving in the difficulty, to push you towards grouping to complete the mission. This is a social game after all.
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