as much as I want carriers at this point it's just beating a dead horse because all that happens is the threads get bombed by "haters" with dumb comments like "IT'S NOT CANON!" "FED WOULDN'T USE FIGHTERS!" PLAY KLINGONS!" and other such nonsensical arguments.
Yeah, don't count on it. Devs seem pretty strongly opposed to the notion, and I for one, and glad.
haha. way to twist the truth to meet your own agenda. if by "strongly opposed" you mean "no plans for immediate future", then yeah, that means strongly opposed...lmfao :rolleyes:
Other existing ship classes could serve as an ad hoc carrier. The Galaxy and Nebula come to mind. The Star Cruiser variants look large enough to use too.
haha. way to twist the truth to meet your own agenda. if by "strongly opposed" you mean "no plans for immediate future", then yeah, that means strongly opposed...lmfao :rolleyes:
"No plans for the immediate future" or however they worded it, is simply PR speak for "The answer is no, but we're covering our rears, just in case".
I don't think there should be Federation carriers, but it would be neat if the new fighters came with a combat pet. All of the other shuttles come with a non-combat pet, after all.
as much as I want carriers at this point it's just beating a dead horse because all that happens is the threads get bombed by "haters" with dumb comments like "IT'S NOT CANON!" "FED WOULDN'T USE FIGHTERS!" PLAY KLINGONS!" and other such nonsensical arguments.
+1 for federation carriers, anyway
except its the carrier lovers that lose their cool and shout and complain wile those that no better give you the same in universe reasons they shouldn't be added and
haha. way to twist the truth to meet your own agenda. if by "strongly opposed" you mean "no plans for immediate future", then yeah, that means strongly opposed...lmfao :rolleyes:
.... the fact that carrier lovers don't see that statement as anything other then NO must mean they don't understand tact. their statement means no absolutely not, but they said it nicely, because its their job to give what you think is bad news politely. you are delusional if you think it means something else.
why do I even try to spark up an Idea frame on these forums. I do apreciate your opinions and I respect them, though many of you have to understand the carriers may one day be availible on the fed side, this is to describe their real roles, again I take it you guys didnt even read the bottom parts of my first post.
Just brainstorm Ideas as to what your Ideal Federation Carrier would be if it was going to be made, DONT TRIBBLE AROUND BE SERIOUS, DONT NERF THEM TO HELL OR HAVE THEM DESCRIBED AS GIANT DONGS.
This would imply that we accept that the federation MUST have carriers. This isn't the case. In my opinion, this thread is just a disguised "we want fed carriers" thread.
It's not cool, and i don't recommend anyone against fed carriers actually aiding in the cause of the thread blindly. They should add alternative ideas and voice that they oppose fed carriers.
I saw one post somewhere about having specialized auxilary craft based on career choice, which is unique and partially rubs that carrier itch. Both sides get what they want, and something they don't want, while getting something unique.
This would imply that we accept that the federation MUST have carriers. This isn't the case. In my opinion, this thread is just a disguised "we want fed carriers" thread.
It's not cool, and i don't recommend anyone against fed carriers actually aiding in the cause of the thread blindly. They should add alternative ideas and voice that they oppose fed carriers.
I saw one post somewhere about having specialized auxilary craft based on career choice, which is unique and partially rubs that carrier itch. Both sides get what they want, and something they don't want, while getting something unique.
you my friend have been the one with the most sense, you actualy applied your own opinion instead of re-using one of the hundreds of statements.
I never disputed the fact that I love the carrier and all of its awesomness, but again.....ya know what maybe I shoulda named the thread something other than Federation Carrier Brainstorm, considering the fact that I want people to come up with their Ideal new ship for federation weather it be a battleship or carrier, I like the klingons I do but to me its more of a PvP faction, And I do have a carrier, I like it and I think its strong in numbers. possibly un-beatable with a whole team of them close together.
So yea I think Ima change the name of this later to, Next Gen Federation ships, or Federation nex gen Brainstorm.
but both sides of the Carrier for the federation arguments must realize this one thing, It is not up to you, and you must respect each others opinion.....unless the rebuttle of one comment was so weak or so desprate that it makes you laugh in which case Flame on.
Also, you must realize that even if the carrier does become a playable ship, and I gotta stress the if, YOU DONT HAVE TO PLAY IT. I also think it would add some nice new bends for players to plan for in PvP to come up with a new stratagy, hell I think it would add more to our still evolving MMO givivng it some more flavor, And even IF it is considered later on and not accepted then We move on and chill for a while. Don't cry or complain or think the devs hate the carriers, because I can guarentee you there has to be a few carrier fans in that office, If the devs dont put it in then it is either because of balancing or because of a vote with the Nays leading.
I want people to respect one anothers opinion. please.
you my friend have been the one with the most sense, you actualy applied your own opinion instead of re-using one of the hundreds of statements.
I never disputed the fact that I love the carrier and all of its awesomness, but again.....ya know what maybe I shoulda named the thread something other than Federation Carrier Brainstorm, considering the fact that I want people to come up with their Ideal new ship for federation weather it be a battleship or carrier, I like the klingons I do but to me its more of a PvP faction, And I do have a carrier, I like it and I think its strong in numbers. possibly un-beatable with a whole team of them close together.
So yea I think Ima change the name of this later to, Next Gen Federation ships, or Federation nex gen Brainstorm.
but both sides of the Carrier for the federation arguments must realize this one thing, It is not up to you, and you must respect each others opinion.....unless the rebuttle of one comment was so weak or so desprate that it makes you laugh in which case Flame on.
Also, you must realize that even if the carrier does become a playable ship, and I gotta stress the if, YOU DONT HAVE TO PLAY IT. I also think it would add some nice new bends for players to plan for in PvP to come up with a new stratagy, hell I think it would add more to our still evolving MMO givivng it some more flavor, And even IF it is considered later on and not accepted then We move on and chill for a while. Don't cry or complain or think the devs hate the carriers, because I can guarentee you there has to be a few carrier fans in that office, If the devs dont put it in then it is either because of balancing or because of a vote with the Nays leading.
I want people to respect one anothers opinion. please.
The primary problem with having Xindi ships in Starfleet is, they don't join the Federation until the 26th Century, and STO is in 2409. Your idea is a century too early.
The primary problem with having Xindi ships in Starfleet is, they don't join the Federation until the 26th Century, and STO is in 2409. Your idea is a century too early.
Do we know that for 100% certain? I was always under the impression that in the new timeline created by the destruction of the spheres, they joined pretty early on.
Do we know that for 100% certain? I was always under the impression that in the new timeline created by the destruction of the spheres, they joined pretty early on.
yea I always had that impression too, since those sphere builders messed with their home I would have thought they'd make more nice nice with earth.... especially since they conspired to destroy their world.
Do we know that for 100% certain? I was always under the impression that in the new timeline created by the destruction of the spheres, they joined pretty early on.
It would have made sense that the Xindi would be secondary founding members of the Federation, after all that happened in that arc.
Some Xindi inspired designs, though plainly federation, would be nice. Maybe after a couple more factions get added
I don't think it would be the end of the world if we had a Fed Carrier. I don't think it needs to happen. In the same vain i think a Klingon sci ship would be nice too.
Equal access will make this not a concern, and it puts more ships in the game, which is never a bad thing.
Personally I see a kind of a mixture between an Akira class and a modern day aircraft carrier. It would probably have a mixture of fighters. Some configured for assault, others for bombing runs, and some with special abilities like energy drain or tractor beams. After all, if starfleet loves anything, it's variety.
Per Wishstone, the forums are for everyone, and all threads are open for everyone. That's why posts addressed to specific people, like the devs, get locked.
I personaly would like to see an ancient japanese structure style ship. something that Kind of looks like a palace from the old dynasty's. give it a unique style to it. I cant really describe it any better in text form.
Something a host commented on RSA's podcast last night when the idea of the Enterprise F was brought up. Neither faction, Klingons or Federation, had Starfighter carriers shown on screen, or (from what I've read, and it's been most) the novels.
So let's throw out the 'It's not canon' argument:
Carriers are NOT canon, for either side. You never saw a Federation of a Klingon Starfighter carrier on screen. The Bird of Prey / Defiant was intended to fill that role (as a fighter-like craft) from DS9 onward. Until the introduction of the Peregrine.
However, as seen on screen, the Federation does in fact send men and women into battle in fighters. It's canon, it's on screen, it's in stone. The Klingons however are not shown to have Fighter craft or make use of them in any on screen media.
So the 'it's not canon!' argument is a moot point. Let's drop that one, shall we? Let's look at this topic from a game play standpoint where it belongs.
Who says those were fighters? They might have been LACs.
"Sacrifice of Angels"
DS9, Episode 6x06
Production number: 40510-530
First aired: 3 November 1997
← 128th of 173 produced in DS9 →
← 128th of 173 released in DS9 →
← 488th of 727 released in all
As the Defiant crew survey the task ahead of them, Sisko prepares his strategy: groups of Federation attack fighters will make strafing runs at the blockade, focusing their fire only on the Cardassian ships. Nog is at a loss, and Garak explains that Sisko is hoping to provoke the Cardassians into breaking formation and opening a hole in the Dominion lines. It is the only chance the Federation has of reaching Deep Space 9 before the minefield is taken down. As they prepare to attack, O'Brien and Bashir quote from Tennyson's "The Charge of the Light Brigade", something which only makes a nervous Nog more agitated. Finally, Sisko orders the attack fighters forward, and the battle is joined.
I'm glad you asked, because I'm sure other folks were wondering the same thing. I should of probably put that in my original post
WHich itself reminds me of that scene in "The Blind Side":
"They're all gonna die aren't they?"
"Yes.. yes they will."
EDIT: Okay I just watched the battle scenes from SoA and you know.... I could have sworn I saw a flight of fighters WITH the Klingons as they ride in to the rescue. Now those could be Federation fighters in formation with the Klingons but I suspect they are similar light attack craft.
The problem is that STO handles Anti-Air fire totally different than the shows did. If you watch you see a TON of Beams just dancing all over and rarely hitting the small fighters. Which makes sense. A phaser beam isn't meant to hit a small target. They're meant to hit another capital ship.
What STO would need to do is massively boost fighter dodges and then strip them of shields.
Excelsior - MV Adv Escort - D'kyr - Nebula: each of these ships could be considered the best in their respective class (the SVs being healing/tanking SVs).
Wait are you saying the Excelsior is the beast crussier?! It 1. its survivable I have seen escourts last twice as long as exselsers 2. doesnt even have that great abilatys or damage. When I got it I went back to my star crusser in ten min. or so...
I think im gonna improvise a fed carrier in my own design by physicly making a small model with 13 gauge wire and some soder, Ill post the pics later in the month, I suck at actual modeling so Im just gonna do it physicly, but if anyone else wants to post their favorite pics or make their own concept of what a federation carrier could look like then great.
Something a host commented on RSA's podcast last night when the idea of the Enterprise F was brought up. Neither faction, Klingons or Federation, had Starfighter carriers shown on screen, or (from what I've read, and it's been most) the novels.
So let's throw out the 'It's not canon' argument:
Carriers are NOT canon, for either side. You never saw a Federation of a Klingon Starfighter carrier on screen. The Bird of Prey / Defiant was intended to fill that role (as a fighter-like craft) from DS9 onward. Until the introduction of the Peregrine.
However, as seen on screen, the Federation does in fact send men and women into battle in fighters. It's canon, it's on screen, it's in stone. The Klingons however are not shown to have Fighter craft or make use of them in any on screen media.
So the 'it's not canon!' argument is a moot point. Let's drop that one, shall we? Let's look at this topic from a game play standpoint where it belongs.
Tell you i am all for federation having a carrier
when
1. Klingons a full PVE Content equal to that of Federation.
2. Klingons can be started with need to level a Federation character to any rank
3. Klingons have equal number of ship options as the Federation. Including ship customization options and bridges.
4. Klingons have the same number of outfit options as Federation.
In other words once the Klingons are an equal faction. Because then only then it would be unfair that the klingons have something the federation those not.
WHich itself reminds me of that scene in "The Blind Side":
"They're all gonna die aren't they?"
"Yes.. yes they will."
EDIT: Okay I just watched the battle scenes from SoA and you know.... I could have sworn I saw a flight of fighters WITH the Klingons as they ride in to the rescue. Now those could be Federation fighters in formation with the Klingons but I suspect they are similar light attack craft.
The problem is that STO handles Anti-Air fire totally different than the shows did. If you watch you see a TON of Beams just dancing all over and rarely hitting the small fighters. Which makes sense. A phaser beam isn't meant to hit a small target. They're meant to hit another capital ship.
What STO would need to do is massively boost fighter dodges and then strip them of shields.
Comments
+1 for federation carriers, anyway
haha. way to twist the truth to meet your own agenda. if by "strongly opposed" you mean "no plans for immediate future", then yeah, that means strongly opposed...lmfao :rolleyes:
"No plans for the immediate future" or however they worded it, is simply PR speak for "The answer is no, but we're covering our rears, just in case".
except its the carrier lovers that lose their cool and shout and complain wile those that no better give you the same in universe reasons they shouldn't be added and
.... the fact that carrier lovers don't see that statement as anything other then NO must mean they don't understand tact. their statement means no absolutely not, but they said it nicely, because its their job to give what you think is bad news politely. you are delusional if you think it means something else.
This would imply that we accept that the federation MUST have carriers. This isn't the case. In my opinion, this thread is just a disguised "we want fed carriers" thread.
It's not cool, and i don't recommend anyone against fed carriers actually aiding in the cause of the thread blindly. They should add alternative ideas and voice that they oppose fed carriers.
I saw one post somewhere about having specialized auxilary craft based on career choice, which is unique and partially rubs that carrier itch. Both sides get what they want, and something they don't want, while getting something unique.
you my friend have been the one with the most sense, you actualy applied your own opinion instead of re-using one of the hundreds of statements.
I never disputed the fact that I love the carrier and all of its awesomness, but again.....ya know what maybe I shoulda named the thread something other than Federation Carrier Brainstorm, considering the fact that I want people to come up with their Ideal new ship for federation weather it be a battleship or carrier, I like the klingons I do but to me its more of a PvP faction, And I do have a carrier, I like it and I think its strong in numbers. possibly un-beatable with a whole team of them close together.
So yea I think Ima change the name of this later to, Next Gen Federation ships, or Federation nex gen Brainstorm.
but both sides of the Carrier for the federation arguments must realize this one thing, It is not up to you, and you must respect each others opinion.....unless the rebuttle of one comment was so weak or so desprate that it makes you laugh in which case Flame on.
Also, you must realize that even if the carrier does become a playable ship, and I gotta stress the if, YOU DONT HAVE TO PLAY IT. I also think it would add some nice new bends for players to plan for in PvP to come up with a new stratagy, hell I think it would add more to our still evolving MMO givivng it some more flavor, And even IF it is considered later on and not accepted then We move on and chill for a while. Don't cry or complain or think the devs hate the carriers, because I can guarentee you there has to be a few carrier fans in that office, If the devs dont put it in then it is either because of balancing or because of a vote with the Nays leading.
I want people to respect one anothers opinion. please.
New thread then?
Do we know that for 100% certain? I was always under the impression that in the new timeline created by the destruction of the spheres, they joined pretty early on.
yea I always had that impression too, since those sphere builders messed with their home I would have thought they'd make more nice nice with earth.... especially since they conspired to destroy their world.
nah im just gonna keep this one, hopefuly it will keep going along the lines of good discussions instead of flame wars.
It would have made sense that the Xindi would be secondary founding members of the Federation, after all that happened in that arc.
Some Xindi inspired designs, though plainly federation, would be nice. Maybe after a couple more factions get added
Equal access will make this not a concern, and it puts more ships in the game, which is never a bad thing.
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Atari Community Rules and Policies ~InfoNinja
Per Wishstone, the forums are for everyone, and all threads are open for everyone. That's why posts addressed to specific people, like the devs, get locked.
There's a separate forum for people who don't want their messages seen and replied to by others. It's accessed here:
http://forums.startrekonline.com/private.php
So let's throw out the 'It's not canon' argument:
Carriers are NOT canon, for either side. You never saw a Federation of a Klingon Starfighter carrier on screen. The Bird of Prey / Defiant was intended to fill that role (as a fighter-like craft) from DS9 onward. Until the introduction of the Peregrine.
However, as seen on screen, the Federation does in fact send men and women into battle in fighters. It's canon, it's on screen, it's in stone. The Klingons however are not shown to have Fighter craft or make use of them in any on screen media.
So the 'it's not canon!' argument is a moot point. Let's drop that one, shall we? Let's look at this topic from a game play standpoint where it belongs.
Who says those were fighters? They might have been LACs.
DS9, Episode 6x06
Production number: 40510-530
First aired: 3 November 1997
← 128th of 173 produced in DS9 →
← 128th of 173 released in DS9 →
← 488th of 727 released in all
http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Sacrifice_of_Angels_%28episode%29
WHich itself reminds me of that scene in "The Blind Side":
"They're all gonna die aren't they?"
"Yes.. yes they will."
EDIT: Okay I just watched the battle scenes from SoA and you know.... I could have sworn I saw a flight of fighters WITH the Klingons as they ride in to the rescue. Now those could be Federation fighters in formation with the Klingons but I suspect they are similar light attack craft.
The problem is that STO handles Anti-Air fire totally different than the shows did. If you watch you see a TON of Beams just dancing all over and rarely hitting the small fighters. Which makes sense. A phaser beam isn't meant to hit a small target. They're meant to hit another capital ship.
What STO would need to do is massively boost fighter dodges and then strip them of shields.
Oh and give them to both sides.
Wait are you saying the Excelsior is the beast crussier?! It 1. its survivable I have seen escourts last twice as long as exselsers 2. doesnt even have that great abilatys or damage. When I got it I went back to my star crusser in ten min. or so...
Tell you i am all for federation having a carrier
when
1. Klingons a full PVE Content equal to that of Federation.
2. Klingons can be started with need to level a Federation character to any rank
3. Klingons have equal number of ship options as the Federation. Including ship customization options and bridges.
4. Klingons have the same number of outfit options as Federation.
In other words once the Klingons are an equal faction. Because then only then it would be unfair that the klingons have something the federation those not.