Part of what puts this off is the curved side of the wall with the windows. Which is not a TOS style, TOS was more boxy. This reminds me more of Voyager or something TNG related.
The curve of the wall is canon though. Here's a pic of the mess hall:
While I myself am a purist and would prefer a bulkhead over a window, I'd rather deal with windows and have a to-scale interior set than an out of scale interior and bulkheads.
On an unrelated note, look at the panelling on the "window cover" here and the panelling on the "would be" windows/coverings (behind Worf's head) here. Very similar. So that's kinda cool.
While I myself am a purist and would prefer a bulkhead over a window, I'd rather deal with windows and have a to-scale interior set than an out of scale interior and bulkheads.
On an unrelated note, look at the panelling on the "window cover" here and the panelling on the "would be" windows/coverings (behind Worf's head) here. Very similar. So that's kinda cool.
Yeah. I mentioned that earlier in the thread. It does seem that the defiant actually has metal bulkheads that can be opened to see out the windows. I hope that when and if they do a defiant interior pack, they will give us the option to open the metal bulkheads and see the stars.
Hah... the conference room from the original pilot! I think that was only shown once ever, and infers from its shape that it's in the middle of the saucer section somewhere.
I have a feeling they'll go with the more often seen conference room shown throughout the rest of TOS, which was a redressing of the mess hall/lounge.
It might not look like the mess from TOS, but I like it! Having the OS mess would just be really boring. All it would be is 4 grey walls with a red door.
I'm a big TOS fan and I think the pic looks great, but yeah....as others point out it doesn't look like how we remember from the show. But it does look great. Maybe it's not the lounge we saw in the show. But actually, in the show it seemed like more of a cafeteria so maybe this is ok.
Anyway we could have this as a variant, please? I like looking out at space when I'm eating a sandwhich. Seriously.
Give that room to the Intrepid class or the Sovreign. Definitely not TOS
How so? It has a commonly seen TOS shape, it has the commonly seen TOS metallic strips running up the walls, and it has commonly seen TOS chairs. The only difference is the windows, which the devs said they might remove due to player feedback.
How so? It has a commonly seen TOS shape, it has the commonly seen TOS metallic strips running up the walls, and it has commonly seen TOS chairs. The only difference is the windows, which the devs said they might remove due to player feedback.
Here are some reference pictures to confirm that this feels like a TOS era room:
See to me, it's just the color and lighting that I find to be a little off. The current colors fit the more cold modern look that Cryptic uses now. Maybe with green or purple lighting on the walls along with some flat gray walls without the texture? Other than that, the shape is great!
*added*
If Cryptic wants to offer a TOS pack, use what was in TOS, no need to change what was there. If you don't like the cheap look of TOS, use something modern. Haha I love that cheap look!
See to me, it's just the color and lighting that I find to be a little off. The current colors fit the more cold modern look that Cryptic uses now. Maybe with green or purple lighting on the walls along with some flat gray walls without the texture? Other than that, the shape is great!
I wish they could set it up so that players could customize color schemes, lighting, etc. It would be nice if players could change things to give the rooms a mood that's sutiable for them.
I wish they could set it up so that players could customize color schemes, lighting, etc. It would be nice if players could change things to give the rooms a mood that's sutiable for them.
I think that's gonna happen with the Foundry. Didn't Dan say that he wants the Foundry to allow people customize the color and where items are placed in your ship?
I think that's gonna happen with the Foundry. Didn't Dan say that he wants the Foundry to allow people customize the color and where items are placed in your ship?
Well, I know we're supposed to be able to make customized layouts from any existing foundry pieces (which I'm assuming means we could layout every single deck as long as we have all the pieces we need). I'm not sure if I ever heard about color or lighting customization through the foundry. It would be nice though.
We'll do some more digging and deliberation on this next week to make sure we either have a clear reference for it having windows or we'll remove the windows and put in the flat panels with lighting.
There is something to be said for "Special Editioning" where it needs to be. The reason there were not windows in the old show was because it would have been too expensive for the show who was already special effects heavy. Even NG outside of the window was just a curtain with holes in it, but it made the set HUGE.
I there a possibility of having both as an option?
There is something to be said for "Special Editioning" where it needs to be. The reason there were not windows in the old show was because it would have been too expensive for the show who was already special effects heavy. Even NG outside of the window was just a curtain with holes in it, but it made the set HUGE.
Budget had some involvement but not that much. Most of the TOS set design was done from a design aspect where they wanted the viewers to feel as if they were in a naval ship (and someone posted earlier Matt Jeffries' complaint to Gene Roddenberry about the TNG sets that they took his ship and turned it into a hotel). In the HD remastered TOS series they could've added more windows but decided against it b/c it would've looked out of place. The TOS sets were designed to look practical and spartan b/c that's what they were supposed to be. Oddly enough they were even more ergonomically minded than the TNG designs which were designed more for looks than practicality. Even Okuda himself says that his famed LCARS designs would make a horrible user interface in reality.
1. Just because Roddenberry did not have the budget to build the sets in a way to show windows does not mean the windows could not have been there.
2. Our ships in STO may look like the older ships, but that does not mean they are the originals that got pulled out of mothballs. It could be that Starfleet needed to quickly produce a large number of vessels in a short time and with limited resources to support a war effort on multiple fronts and so ordered the ship yards to efficiently produce ships based on simpler, older designs with some appropriate modifications and upgrades.
3. They look nice.
(But maybe make them look less TNGy. Smaller, maybe?)
In the TV show, the characters rarely linger - save the Bridge - for very long. And the view is generally focused upon the participating actors. Within context of this game that changes and calls for a bit of innovation. I like the Art Departments innovative effort regarding the set design of TOS. With that screenshot as example, IMO, they haven't broken anything. I think that lounge looks fine with windows.
In the TOS screenshots they clearly function as lampshades for the 1960's mood-lighting projected upward along the curved wall. Instead make those covers the actual windows. And attach the mood lighting to what would become the upper window frame. We could have windows and the ambiance of the original set designs.
So yeah - it's best labelled the 'recreation room' for map purposes, and those are pretty conclusively not windows.
As for the 'windows/no windows' argument, I think it's worth applying the 'George Lucas' argument here - it's not a question of windows being 'better', or that allegedly the budget wouldn't allow for windows that would might have otherwise been there. The bottom line is there weren't any, in the same way that the TOS Constitution doesn't have visible phaser/torpedo hardpoints like the TMP version. Yes, it might make sense to have them from a certain standpoint, but if the intention is to include replicas of fan-favourites in-game, then they're going to want them as they remember them - not someone else's idea of a 'better' version.
On a similar note, any word as to how 'ready rooms' are going to be handled? Obviously, they weren't in use in TOS - the equivalent was the 'office' section of the Captain's quarters, with a similar desk, monitor, etc. Likewise, it wasn't on the same deck as the bridge - the TOS bridge module is literally the one room, with a single door at the back for turbolift access. Instead, it's on the crew deck - is that going to be the case with the TOS interior pack, or are we looking at a 'like-for-like' 'reskin' of the current interior layouts?
Comments
Yeah, no reason why the set couldnt include multiple variants with some differences that arent too major.
The curve of the wall is canon though. Here's a pic of the mess hall:
http://tos.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/3x15/Let_That_Be_Your_Last_Battlefield_201.JPG
All that cryptic has done is replace the wall and light behind the grate with windows.
Here's another of the officer's lounge, which is presumably an identical room to the mess hall, based on the way the wall looks:
http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/File:Enterprise,_officer%27s_lounge.jpg
The in-game lounge seems to have the chairs of the officer's lounge.
On an unrelated note, look at the panelling on the "window cover" here and the panelling on the "would be" windows/coverings (behind Worf's head) here. Very similar. So that's kinda cool.
Yeah. I mentioned that earlier in the thread. It does seem that the defiant actually has metal bulkheads that can be opened to see out the windows. I hope that when and if they do a defiant interior pack, they will give us the option to open the metal bulkheads and see the stars.
On another note, can we get this room for Diplomatic Missions?
Well, for TOS, they could just use the conference/briefing room.
I'm hoping that they'll eventaully do a Connie refit interior pack, which would include that one, which really does look pretty cool:
http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/File:Officer%27s_lounge,_Constitution_class_refit.jpg
Also, I really want this observation lounge if they do a Connie refit pack:
http://st-spike.org/images/interiors/enterprise-a_observationlounge.jpg
This the one you're talking about:
http://st-spike.org/images/interiors/enterprise_conferenceroom.jpg
I do think they need to do that one.
That link gives me an access denied image.
Hah... the conference room from the original pilot! I think that was only shown once ever, and infers from its shape that it's in the middle of the saucer section somewhere.
I have a feeling they'll go with the more often seen conference room shown throughout the rest of TOS, which was a redressing of the mess hall/lounge.
TRIBBLE Continuity..., (and that coming from a Die Hard Original Trekkie..)
I want something that looks as good as that..., not what's Practical...!
If I were stuck in a Space Vessel for prolonged periods of time, I sure as shootin' wouldn't want to have to stare at a Blank Wall all the time!!
Hell, even the SEAVIEW had windows in it!!
This ain't real life... It's STAR TREK...
And some of you folks need to go back and review your Trek Production History...
After the first Pilot, Desilu and Paramount put Trek on a much leaner budget that shrank with each season...
Hell, GUNSMOKE had a bigger budget per episode than Trek did.
What the Original Crew did with their shoe-string budgets was absolutely amazing for the time...
That is the credit they greatly deserve, their Inginuity.... not that they had a lot of money to use.
Anyway we could have this as a variant, please? I like looking out at space when I'm eating a sandwhich. Seriously.
How so? It has a commonly seen TOS shape, it has the commonly seen TOS metallic strips running up the walls, and it has commonly seen TOS chairs. The only difference is the windows, which the devs said they might remove due to player feedback.
Here are some reference pictures to confirm that this feels like a TOS era room:
Briefing room, showing the same shape, metallic strips, and chairs.
Mess hall showing the same shape
See to me, it's just the color and lighting that I find to be a little off. The current colors fit the more cold modern look that Cryptic uses now. Maybe with green or purple lighting on the walls along with some flat gray walls without the texture? Other than that, the shape is great!
*added*
If Cryptic wants to offer a TOS pack, use what was in TOS, no need to change what was there. If you don't like the cheap look of TOS, use something modern. Haha I love that cheap look!
I wish they could set it up so that players could customize color schemes, lighting, etc. It would be nice if players could change things to give the rooms a mood that's sutiable for them.
I think that's gonna happen with the Foundry. Didn't Dan say that he wants the Foundry to allow people customize the color and where items are placed in your ship?
Well, I know we're supposed to be able to make customized layouts from any existing foundry pieces (which I'm assuming means we could layout every single deck as long as we have all the pieces we need). I'm not sure if I ever heard about color or lighting customization through the foundry. It would be nice though.
There is something to be said for "Special Editioning" where it needs to be. The reason there were not windows in the old show was because it would have been too expensive for the show who was already special effects heavy. Even NG outside of the window was just a curtain with holes in it, but it made the set HUGE.
I there a possibility of having both as an option?
Budget had some involvement but not that much. Most of the TOS set design was done from a design aspect where they wanted the viewers to feel as if they were in a naval ship (and someone posted earlier Matt Jeffries' complaint to Gene Roddenberry about the TNG sets that they took his ship and turned it into a hotel). In the HD remastered TOS series they could've added more windows but decided against it b/c it would've looked out of place. The TOS sets were designed to look practical and spartan b/c that's what they were supposed to be. Oddly enough they were even more ergonomically minded than the TNG designs which were designed more for looks than practicality. Even Okuda himself says that his famed LCARS designs would make a horrible user interface in reality.
1. Just because Roddenberry did not have the budget to build the sets in a way to show windows does not mean the windows could not have been there.
2. Our ships in STO may look like the older ships, but that does not mean they are the originals that got pulled out of mothballs. It could be that Starfleet needed to quickly produce a large number of vessels in a short time and with limited resources to support a war effort on multiple fronts and so ordered the ship yards to efficiently produce ships based on simpler, older designs with some appropriate modifications and upgrades.
3. They look nice.
(But maybe make them look less TNGy. Smaller, maybe?)
http://yfrog.com/h0q4cpaj
In the TOS screenshots they clearly function as lampshades for the 1960's mood-lighting projected upward along the curved wall. Instead make those covers the actual windows. And attach the mood lighting to what would become the upper window frame. We could have windows and the ambiance of the original set designs.
Nice wide shot, with a near-complete view of the set
Similar shot - showing the rec room being used as a dining area...
...while this one shows it being used for general down-time
So yeah - it's best labelled the 'recreation room' for map purposes, and those are pretty conclusively not windows.
As for the 'windows/no windows' argument, I think it's worth applying the 'George Lucas' argument here - it's not a question of windows being 'better', or that allegedly the budget wouldn't allow for windows that would might have otherwise been there. The bottom line is there weren't any, in the same way that the TOS Constitution doesn't have visible phaser/torpedo hardpoints like the TMP version. Yes, it might make sense to have them from a certain standpoint, but if the intention is to include replicas of fan-favourites in-game, then they're going to want them as they remember them - not someone else's idea of a 'better' version.
On a similar note, any word as to how 'ready rooms' are going to be handled? Obviously, they weren't in use in TOS - the equivalent was the 'office' section of the Captain's quarters, with a similar desk, monitor, etc. Likewise, it wasn't on the same deck as the bridge - the TOS bridge module is literally the one room, with a single door at the back for turbolift access. Instead, it's on the crew deck - is that going to be the case with the TOS interior pack, or are we looking at a 'like-for-like' 'reskin' of the current interior layouts?
For reference's sake: TOS Captain's quarters, with office area