After years of continuous play, pay-to-win may have finally driven me from the game.

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GlenRoss - Archosaur
GlenRoss - Archosaur Posts: 430 Arc User
edited September 2014 in General Discussion
I'm 105-105-103 third cast with near-top-of-the-line gear. Certainly enough to be competitive. I'm a pretty fair archer (I think). I just experienced TW where I was being one-or-two-shot all over the field. Not to disparage their players or to toot my horn but my experience is that there are very few people on the server who can do that.

Is it possible that maxxing out the spirit coins provides that much disparity? I have a spirit coin but decline to buy 500 to top it out. If that is the requirement now, I'm done.

This is not intended as a whine. Nobody owes me anything and I've never been averse to money changing hands in exchange for game items. It keeps the game going. I don't care for seeing the "Credit Card Cowboys" instantly buy competency but it's legal, so [shrug]. I'll do what I need to do to build my toon but if comptitiveness now requires that I mortgage the house, I'll find another way to spend my time. Not going to make a snap decision but this is a game-changer.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Post edited by GlenRoss - Archosaur on

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  • hiitsmeguys
    hiitsmeguys Posts: 126 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    GlenRoss - Archosaur wrote: »
    I'm 105-105-103 third cast with near-top-of-the-line gear. Certainly enough to be competitive. I'm a pretty fair archer (I think). I just experienced TW where I was being one-or-two-shot all over the field. Not to disparage their players or to toot my horn but my experience is that there are very few people on the server who can do that.

    Is it possible that maxxing out the spirit coins provides that much disparity? I have a spirit coin but decline to buy 500 to top it out. If that is the requirement now, I'm done.

    This is not intended as a whine. Nobody owes me anything and I've never been averse to money changing hands in exchange for game items. It keeps the game going. I don't care for seeing the "Credit Card Cowboys" instantly buy competency but it's legal, so [shrug]. I'll do what I need to do to build my toon but if comptitiveness now requires that I mortgage the house, I'll find another way to spend my time. Not going to make a snap decision but this is a game-changer.

    Did you just login after a few months or something? I'd think a player of your gear and level would know that 10-20 extra spirit for those people who open 500+ packs barely makes any difference in comparison to the person who opened 1.
  • SHIMBERLY - Heavens Tear
    SHIMBERLY - Heavens Tear Posts: 703 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    Well in fact,your right.You know its kinda lame when a decked out r9rrr just stands there taking hits with little dmg with the provided dmg reduction items that NW gives..then now the spirit ****.I play psy when I do do a NW and I basicly destroy anything in my way unless its r9rrr..though im not scared to rush in and do my duty but its basicly useless really to even try to cast on one.Plus NW most of the time aren't a equal battle anyways player vs player.

    But yeah game through the past 2 years has become so pay to win to a new epic scale.

    And its super sad that other r9rrr complain lol..when they even have s card sets,maxed lvls..etc...


    loooossseerrrrrrrrrrrr
  • GlenRoss - Archosaur
    GlenRoss - Archosaur Posts: 430 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    hiitsmeguys wrote: »
    Did you just login after a few months or something? I'd think a player of your gear and level would know that 10-20 extra spirit for those people who open 500+ packs barely makes any difference in comparison to the person who opened 1.

    No, I've been here all along. I'm just trying to make sense of why I'm suddenly prey instead of predator. I'm guessing, since the spirit coins have not been around for very long. I'm certainly willing to entertain any other guesses because the debacle I just experienced was shocking.
    SHIMBERLY - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Well in fact,your right.You know its kinda lame when a decked out r9rrr just stands there taking hits with little dmg with the provided dmg reduction items that NW gives..then now the spirit ****.I play psy when I do do a NW and I basicly destroy anything in my way unless its r9rrr..though im not scared to rush in and do my duty but its basicly useless really to even try to cast on one.Plus NW most of the time aren't a equal battle anyways player vs player.

    But yeah game through the past 2 years has become so pay to win to a new epic scale.

    And its super sad that other r9rrr complain lol..when they even have s card sets,maxed lvls..etc...


    loooossseerrrrrrrrrrrr

    Loser? Me? Because I'm trying to understand what just happened?
    Somehow the fact that I've earned my way forward is offensive to you?
    [smh] Sorry to have bothered you.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • hiitsmeguys
    hiitsmeguys Posts: 126 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    GlenRoss - Archosaur wrote: »
    No, I've been here all along. I'm just trying to make sense of why I'm suddenly prey instead of predator. I'm guessing, since the spirit coins have not been around for very long. I'm certainly willing to entertain any other guesses because the debacle I just experienced was shocking.

    Buy 1 spirit coin, use the buff, also the new apo from the weekly event gives 100 spirit, so if you're not using either of those the average tw'er will have a 200+ spirit advantage over you. All you need to get the same advantage is 1 gold and 10mins of time every couple weeks to do the event.
  • GlenRoss - Archosaur
    GlenRoss - Archosaur Posts: 430 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    Point taken. I had forgotten about that buff. That's clearly more effective than the additional coins (though having both would be ideal.) Thanks for the reminder.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • laiwaisan
    laiwaisan Posts: 1,123 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    yup i have 100 spirit coin equip i see small amount extra damage kinda joke really another pwi saleing scam
  • Fail_BM - Raging Tide
    Fail_BM - Raging Tide Posts: 929 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    GlenRoss - Archosaur wrote: »
    Loser? Me? Because I'm trying to understand what just happened?
    Somehow the fact that I've earned my way forward is offensive to you?
    [smh] Sorry to have bothered you.

    Don't ever listen to SHIMBERLY, he likes to find reasons to annoy others.
    [SIGPIC]http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=15031077002&dateline=1409280330[/SIGPIC]
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  • Anri_Rose - Archosaur
    Anri_Rose - Archosaur Posts: 346 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    Boy , i was gonna get on and say hi in game for a bit , maybe even play for kicks but now im scared to even get in game cus it sounds like its pretty awful :(
    I dont even want to see it with my own eyes. I really am saying I would rather remember my time here for what it was when I enjoyed it, Hell i enjoyed it all the way up til NW started, I thought they were good fun.
    If this is the end I really am sad to see it go out like this instead of pushing all people to a final endgame they just keep adding on more and more crazy numbers to buff your toon to godhood.b:sad
    Where have all the mages gone. Long time casting.
    Who altered my siggy im
    kinda scared b:shocked
  • freygin
    freygin Posts: 737 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    If 1 spirit equals to 0.1% dmg or reduction, then having 100 spirit difference means 10% more damage and 10% less damage taken (cmiiw). Having 200 spirit more than a target is like using Extreme Poison on him permanently, 20% more damage while if the target attacks, the damage will be reduced by 20%.

    By putting spirit buff for sale is like selling nothing except extra cash for the publisher, everyone buys it just to cancel each other's advantage.
  • mechabeastmc666
    mechabeastmc666 Posts: 346 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    freygin wrote: »
    If 1 spirit equals to 0.1% dmg or reduction, then having 100 spirit difference means 10% more damage and 10% less damage taken (cmiiw). Having 200 spirit more than a target is like using Extreme Poison on him permanently, 20% more damage while if the target attacks, the damage will be reduced by 20%.

    By putting spirit buff for sale is like selling nothing except extra cash for the publisher, everyone buys it just to cancel each other's advantage.
    I knew that already, just didn't want to believe it. It makes too much sense though. The Rich get Richer, The Non-paying players are like worthless Meat-bags, Targets, a lvl 1 mob to a lvl 100 character if you will. It prolly wont end here though, no sense to dwell on it!
  • zhangwuj1
    zhangwuj1 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    Glen, it's the card system that spoilt the balance of the game.
  • laiwaisan
    laiwaisan Posts: 1,123 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    b:pleased He is right thats why spent 50 bucks wanted that s card so bad
  • MageMERC - Harshlands
    MageMERC - Harshlands Posts: 1,600 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    mechabeastmc666 wrote: »
    I knew that already, just didn't want to believe it. It makes too much sense though. The Rich get Richer, The Non-paying players are like worthless Meat-bags, Targets, a lvl 1 mob to a lvl 100 character if you will. It prolly wont end here though, no sense to dwell on it!

    b:cry....."worthless Meat-bag....."
  • HideYoHubby - Archosaur
    HideYoHubby - Archosaur Posts: 995 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    I mean no offense when I say you arent being objective. From what I remember your gear isnt at the standards you think it is. Archo has few toons, which are completely gamebreaking, even top the line gear will struggle with them. Sins are absolutely broken with their elimination these days and the spark + elimination **** will be hard to deal with even at top of the line gear.

    Ps. At full +10 armors, missing several pieces of NW gear, I dont get 1shot all that much outside of +12 elimination sins, seekers zerk crits and couple of gamebreaking toons. Point being, I consider my gear pretty damn far from top tier and I dont struggle that much. Either I do something phenomenal, which I doubt, or something in your first statements really wont hold weight.
    __Sami__ - Archer - 105/103/102 - mypers.pw/1.8/#132088 - Active
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  • Evryn - Morai
    Evryn - Morai Posts: 1,437 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    Rebirth, boundary level and cardset aren't listed. Got C and B cards maybe?
    I'm so P.R.O... I Press Respawn Often.

    Ulsyr 103/103/104 BM. Working on the last R9 part (Axe).
    Khelvan 103/103/103 LA Cler. LA? LA. Deal with it.
    Evryn 103/102/101 Sagely Mystical Myst of Mystiness.
    Gromth 102/102/102 Sage Panda.
    StoneSnake - Snakeshop for everyone's common stones.
  • Thilina - Archosaur
    Thilina - Archosaur Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    HideYoHubby - Archosaur wrote: »
    I mean no offense when I say you arent being objective. From what I remember your gear isnt at the standards you think it is. Archo has few toons, which are completely gamebreaking, even top the line gear will struggle with them. Sins are absolutely broken with their elimination these days and the spark + elimination **** will be hard to deal with even at top of the line gear.

    Ps. At full +10 armors, missing several pieces of NW gear, I dont get 1shot all that much outside of +12 elimination sins, seekers zerk crits and couple of gamebreaking toons. Point being, I consider my gear pretty damn far from top tier and I dont struggle that much. Either I do something phenomenal, which I doubt, or something in your first statements really wont hold weight.

    You are phenomenally good at running around. >.< That's meant as a compliment btw.
  • Cawcawwww - Archosaur
    Cawcawwww - Archosaur Posts: 75 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    You didn't mention passives either. On archer I notice passive def skill a LOT.

    Also when you are in TW on an archer without proper support a quick death is eminent unless you are a monster like durex. The fac you tw'd against has a few of the hardest hitters out there. Is it ok to name when it is not a shame? >.<
  • Zsw - Dreamweaver
    Zsw - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,087 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    Back in my days, Full R9rr +12 with JoSD was the be-all and end-all. Now you can get 1 shot with that gear cause lol S Card Nuema Portal set bonus 80/80.
    Zsw -104 Sage Assassin
    TehZsw - 100 Demon Archer


    All Luck No Skillz PvPer: youtube.com/user/zsw007
  • Zanryu - Lothranis
    Zanryu - Lothranis Posts: 1,998 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Back in my days, Full R9rr +12 with JoSD was the be-all and end-all. Now you can get 1 shot with that gear cause lol S Card Nuema Portal set bonus 80/80.

    Not if you aren't on Harshlands. We don't have those pesky nuema sets yo
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Thanks to the beautiful and talanted Zheii for the sigb:dirty

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  • Zsw - Dreamweaver
    Zsw - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,087 Arc User
    edited August 2014
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    Zanryu - Lothranis wrote: »
    Not if you aren't on Harshlands. We don't have those pesky nuema sets yo

    w0w don't even have nuema set. cs more or gtfo
    /sarcasm
    Zsw -104 Sage Assassin
    TehZsw - 100 Demon Archer


    All Luck No Skillz PvPer: youtube.com/user/zsw007
  • MyMate - Dreamweaver
    MyMate - Dreamweaver Posts: 558 Arc User
    edited September 2014
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    Zanryu - Lothranis wrote: »
    Not if you aren't on Harshlands. We don't have those pesky nuema sets yo

    DW got one too tho b:quiet
    "In the beginning, it was claimed that all in Perfect World were equal. But now it seems that some are more equal than others..." ~ Lost City Recluse
  • Anri_Rose - Archosaur
    Anri_Rose - Archosaur Posts: 346 Arc User
    edited September 2014
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    Just seen this flipping thru the interwebz thought it was pretty relevant to our topic :) and a good bit for laughs too


    http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/721/043/d25.gif
    Where have all the mages gone. Long time casting.
    Who altered my siggy im
    kinda scared b:shocked
  • jwillson123
    jwillson123 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2014
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    Before it was possible for f2p player to reach fully end game with hard work but since primal came it has become impossible.
    S Cards are ridiculous expensive and auto culti destroyed the coin value on pve servers.
    Now we f2p players have nothing to offer to ex-cashers now they do not need f2p players to get coins now they get it from botting and also buy gold now instead of selling gold like they used to.
    Do you want PWI to fix the economy before is to late?
    please support Perfect World International Forum > Suggestion Box
    > Limit Auto Cultivation to 1 hour just like Hyper stones
  • Evryn - Morai
    Evryn - Morai Posts: 1,437 Arc User
    edited September 2014
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    That was true for a while but earning time seems to have obliterated most botting. The folk who do bot tend to be booted from FWS/FSP/UCH and other squads because people don't want to miss out on the loot. This reduces autoculti to an activity to be done on alts (or to be used briefly to automatically kill xx number of mobs for a quest). With people not earning a few mils a day per main character, the balance between needing coin and generating it is a bit better. People can also no longer pop out a lvl 100 char in a matter of days with FC out of commission...
    I can already see it in the AH on Morai - there's gold available in the AH again. A lot of coins at 4M a piece, but they aren't being bought for that as quickly anymore. It is only a matter of time before prices start to drop again.

    Earning time was a great way to put botters, be they autoculti or cheaterprogram, out of commission. Now it's just the wait before the market stabilises on a new balance.
    I'm so P.R.O... I Press Respawn Often.

    Ulsyr 103/103/104 BM. Working on the last R9 part (Axe).
    Khelvan 103/103/103 LA Cler. LA? LA. Deal with it.
    Evryn 103/102/101 Sagely Mystical Myst of Mystiness.
    Gromth 102/102/102 Sage Panda.
    StoneSnake - Snakeshop for everyone's common stones.
  • LostPoet - Dreamweaver
    LostPoet - Dreamweaver Posts: 396 Arc User
    edited September 2014
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    GlenRoss - Archosaur wrote: »
    I'm 105-105-103 third cast with near-top-of-the-line gear. Certainly enough to be competitive. I'm a pretty fair archer (I think). I just experienced TW where I was being one-or-two-shot all over the field. Not to disparage their players or to toot my horn but my experience is that there are very few people on the server who can do that.

    Is it possible that maxxing out the spirit coins provides that much disparity? I have a spirit coin but decline to buy 500 to top it out. If that is the requirement now, I'm done.

    This is not intended as a whine. Nobody owes me anything and I've never been averse to money changing hands in exchange for game items. It keeps the game going. I don't care for seeing the "Credit Card Cowboys" instantly buy competency but it's legal, so [shrug]. I'll do what I need to do to build my toon but if comptitiveness now requires that I mortgage the house, I'll find another way to spend my time. Not going to make a snap decision but this is a game-changer.

    Well it used to be pay to win back in the day too, but only "pay so much" or "farm so much". Now its more like "super luck" or "super mega cash" where you don't need luck because you spend so much.

    Before it was just cash R9, no luck no w/e. You got it done, pretty much OP.
    Shards and stuff ya, but refines you got Orbs to guarantee it... And shards people sell, so there was a value.

    Now with cards; not trade able, individual luck base, pretty much sucks for some people. I quit gearing up, doing dailies, and what not for 4-5 months because of this ****. 700-800m thrown at cards on top of farming FSP daily and 4 A cards total even though I was opening B to S packs. Now, like another 700m later, I'm finally at like 1 S card and 10 A cards, but mainly because of that promotion. I opened 12 B to S packs and I got 2 A cards. Where as other people will open and get 5 A cards, or 2 S cards, or "pay-to-winners" will open 50 packs...

    But whatever, I watch their videos and get a good laugh at them. b:chuckle
    They use 3 to 5 skills, and randomly AD or Expel for no reason. its cute.
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  • shauntee
    shauntee Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited September 2014
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    Evryn - Morai wrote: »
    That was true for a while but earning time seems to have obliterated most botting. The folk who do bot tend to be booted from FWS/FSP/UCH and other squads because people don't want to miss out on the loot. This reduces autoculti to an activity to be done on alts (or to be used briefly to automatically kill xx number of mobs for a quest). With people not earning a few mils a day per main character, the balance between needing coin and generating it is a bit better. People can also no longer pop out a lvl 100 char in a matter of days with FC out of commission...
    I can already see it in the AH on Morai - there's gold available in the AH again. A lot of coins at 4M a piece, but they aren't being bought for that as quickly anymore. It is only a matter of time before prices start to drop again.

    Earning time was a great way to put botters, be they autoculti or cheaterprogram, out of commission. Now it's just the wait before the market stabilises on a new balance.

    well if they wanted to stop the botters why didn't they just take the bot skill abiltiy out of the game, this is all so lame
  • opkossy
    opkossy Posts: 11,177 Community Moderator
    edited September 2014
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    shauntee wrote: »
    well if they wanted to stop the botters why didn't they just take the bot skill abiltiy out of the game, this is all so lame

    Because China gave up on fighting botters directly. The DQ price nerfs, changes to low level decomposition, and adjustment of low level instance drops were all attempts by China to deal with their botting issue that failed. So then they created the auto-cultivation system to let everyone bot... but their auto-culti had earning time from day 1 as a way of saying "Bot all you want but after X time it won't help you and will make squads reject you because of its negative impact".

    When we got auto-culti, we didn't have earning time included in it the way China does... which is a very bad thing considering what botting does to a game. With the update changing a large amount of our settings to be like China's (happens every time there's a major update) we now do have the built-in dissuasion to botting.
    (Insert fancy image here)
    image
  • SylenThunder - Twilight Temple
    SylenThunder - Twilight Temple Posts: 7,908
    edited September 2014
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    OPKossy wrote: »
    Because China gave up on fighting botters directly. The DQ price nerfs, changes to low level decomposition, and adjustment of low level instance drops were all attempts by China to deal with their botting issue that failed. So then they created the auto-cultivation system to let everyone bot... but their auto-culti had earning time from day 1 as a way of saying "Bot all you want but after X time it won't help you and will make squads reject you because of its negative impact".

    When we got auto-culti, we didn't have earning time included in it the way China does... which is a very bad thing considering what botting does to a game. With the update changing a large amount of our settings to be like China's (happens every time there's a major update) we now do have the built-in dissuasion to botting.
    Hit the nail on the head right there Kossy.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Deceptistar - Sanctuary
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary Posts: 10,454 Arc User
    edited September 2014
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    GlenRoss - Archosaur wrote: »
    Is it possible that maxxing out the spirit coins provides that much disparity? I have a spirit coin but decline to buy 500 to top it out. If that is the requirement now, I'm done.
    i would think those are more for the merchanters, than they are for the rare REAL cashshoppers. ;o
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]lagunal8.deviantart.com
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  • opkossy
    opkossy Posts: 11,177 Community Moderator
    edited September 2014
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    Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »
    i would think those are more for the merchanters, than they are for the rare REAL cashshoppers. ;o

    Pretty sure the only reason to buy 500 is that temporary flier... which nobody is actually gonna buy 500 for. You can prob get the max bonus of 135 within the 100 bundle people usually buy when merching these things.
    (Insert fancy image here)
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