Is ΩFeather Armageddon worth it?

Xirayaa - Sanctuary · February 2014

So, I was debating on which primal skills I want to work on first, and I'm kinda undecided on ΩFeather Armageddon.

1) Does anyone know if it's a close range skill? By that, I mean will it do 1/2 damage to close range targets, such as Barrage of Arrows or Arrow Inferno? If not, then..
2) Is it worth losing the two close range skills, Wing Burst and Wing Strike, for ΩFeather Armageddon, which I hear is a very unnoticeable (if any) damage increase?

Asterelle - Sanctuary · February 2014

It works basically the exact same as Wing Burst (wingspan).

Same channel time, same cooldown, same mana cost, same range
Small improvements over wingspan:
- 0.4s cast time instead of 1s cast time
- 2152 more fixed damage
- 10m AOE instead of a 8m AOE (same 5m range)

I don't see anything else different. Personally I like the old animation a lot better because it is easier to see how many things you are hitting. Those purple spikes of light are a lot more satisfying than the whirlwind effect on Armageddon.

I really don't think those improvements are noticeable enough to justify losing half of your physical melee skill set. The only other close range skills are the metal skills but those have longer cooldown and eat chi.

Burnout - Harshlands · February 2014

I wouldn't get it just for the stupid name it has. Seriously? You're gonna f.ck stuff up by summoning a bunch of feathers at them? No wonder the skill is lackluster.

Quilue - Sanctuary · February 2014

I'd rather have 0.4 chan time instead to get the shield up faster...though 0.4s cast is better than 1s cast, it'd be much better if you can follow up the faster cast with say...Winged Pledge...

Cawcawwww - Archosaur · February 2014

I use both mele skills one after the other so often it is hard for me to imagine giving one of them up for something not spectacular. My bloods are going into passives anyways atm so I don't feel any pressure to choose or not to choose.

Astraelys - Raging Tide · February 2014

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

The only other close range skills are the metal skills but those have longer cooldown and eat chi.

Frost Splash is another close range skill.

Brigittelin - Sanctuary · February 2014

Yes, worth it b:laugh

Socqar - Lost City · March 2014

Still wondering about this skill... Is people actually geting it?

Bhavyy - Raging Tide · March 2014

I think I will get this one. Only because it does more damage and will just make Pv easier. In pvp I'm not sure why you'd use pledge and burst one after the other rather than kiting away since most targets that come that close are usually HAs where magic would be better or a sin in which case you should definitely be moving away.

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver · March 2014

The 'improvements' are not worth losing winged strike for. Unless this changes in a future update/upgrade I won't be getting it.

The only two skills I have learnt (demon) are Frost splash and Kiss of the snake.

Winged Shell upgrade there is no reason to get as far as I can see. The amount of damage absorbed being marginally increased makes no difference to how this skill works since WS is like a 95% def charm, costing 45 chi granted, but useful to block a seeker combo/used as a mini deaden to get to the next charm tick, and I'm worried the upgrade might nerf this.. We'll see.

Bhavyy - Raging Tide wrote: »

I think I will get this one. Only because it does more damage and will just make Pv easier. In pvp I'm not sure why you'd use pledge and burst one after the other rather than kiting away...

I actually use WStrike more in PvE, its pretty spammable and on physical bosses I find WStrike spam does more overall dps than auto attack spam, especially in squads with debuff periods.

In PvP it's a nice finisher vs melee classes, hits fast and full damage at melee range, admittedly lately it get more use on dropping squishy sins in NW after their deaden ticks but even still I would hate to lose it for an upgrade to a skill that does marginal (almost negligible) more damage that its predecessor..

The only thing that is appealing is the lower cast time so you can start moving away quicker after using it.

Socqar - Lost City · March 2014

Bhavyy - Raging Tide wrote: »

I think I will get this one. Only because it does more damage and will just make Pv easier. In pvp I'm not sure why you'd use pledge and burst one after the other rather than kiting away since most targets that come that close are usually HAs where magic would be better or a sin in which case you should definitely be moving away.

That + the 10m range makes it appealing for making PV's even more pleasant (or at least, less charm-****)

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver wrote: »

The 'improvements' are not worth losing winged strike for. Unless this changes in a future update/upgrade I won't be getting it.

The only two skills I have learnt (demon) are Frost splash and Kiss of the snake.

Winged Shell upgrade there is no reason to get as far as I can see. The amount of damage absorbed being marginally increased makes no difference to how this skill works since WS is like a 95% def charm, costing 45 chi granted, but useful to block a seeker combo/used as a mini deaden to get to the next charm tick, and I'm worried the upgrade might nerf this.. We'll see.

I actually use WStrike more in PvE, its pretty spammable and on physical bosses I find WStrike spam does more overall dps than auto attack spam, especially in squads with debuff periods.

In PvP it's a nice finisher vs melee classes, hits fast and full damage at melee range, admittedly lately it get more use on dropping squishy sins in NW after their deaden ticks but even still I would hate to lose it for an upgrade to a skill that does marginal (almost negligible) more damage that its predecessor..

The only thing that is appealing is the lower cast time so you can start moving away quicker after using it.

(Demon) I'll get those 2 as well once I finish pasives just to reduce the amount of skills I have, at least those 2 MIGHT be worth using, like... sometimes. Oh well if it's new just go get it.

About WingedShell I really think that won't be a nerf, otherwise Sage EA's shouldn't have that effect as they have that boost in dmg absorved as well, sooo worth geting after a bazilion Bloods... Just to have somewhere to spend them I guess

Finally WStrike... It is indeed usefull on paper, but I rather find myself using it less than I should. As said, CC's hit hard in Pvp, making it nearly imposible to use as you MUST kite or will just die.
For PVE matters... mhm... close-ranged bosses where you get agro or solo make this of some use and it's the reason I'm in bigger doubts to get it or not... **** Pwi U.U You screwed a bit bunch of much **** with this update U.U

Let's pray for a CS item that lets us re-learn merged skills? O.o xD

Verenor - Morai · March 2014

In the hope someone has gotten it already and had some thorough testing-time:

I currently have every possible skill you can get with primal bloods except for Feather Armageddon (demon) and trying to decide whether or not I should get this one as well (yes I even got the lame upgraded version of winged shell b:beatup).
I at first thought the new wingspan had the channel/cast times of wing strike but it's shows to be only slightly faster than old wingspan/still slower than wingstrike on Astrelle's New Horizon's Skill info-tread, which was a bit of a letdown.
2m more range/1m each side is nice but, still not convinced to lose wingstrike over that.

With all those "points of improvement" being more of a downer than "yay lets learn that awesomeness" I pretty much wanted to ask someone who has indeed learned it and can tell me the in-game channel time and if you notice a big difference in the damage. I still want to keep a fast-channeling strike to counter-slap sins when everything else on cooldown b:irritated

Walpurga - Dreamweaver · March 2014

losing winged pledge is a big no-no

especially not sage pledge; sage pledge is love

Damn sage got hit marginally harder than demons. They can't even get frost splash for lulz b:shutup

Roeham - Archosaur · March 2014

i have it its not worth losing winged pledge better to just keep what you got and hope something better comes along later

Quilue - Sanctuary · March 2014

Find me another melee ranged skill that takes 1.4s chan + cast, that is on par with skills of melee classes.

It doesn't miss and has chance to purge, so there is certainly use for it, especially against people who try to hug close but aren't really melee classes...

Jarkhen - Archosaur · March 2014

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

It doesn't miss and has chance to purge, so there is certainly use for it, especially against people who try to hug close but aren't really melee classes...

like... archers using melee skills?

Zanryu - Lothranis · March 2014

Jarkhen - Archosaur wrote: »

like... archers using melee skills?

It's the perfect tactic, who would see it coming? "Oh look an Archer, let me just get up cl--" BAM

Verenor - Morai · March 2014

Since reading is indefinitely difficult for some people:

Verenor - Morai wrote: »

I still want to keep a fast-channeling strike to counter-slap sins when everything else on cooldown b:irritated

Meaning when AD/alacrity/WoG/Leaps are all on cooldown or any other skill that could get me to kite the melee.

Jarkhen - Archosaur wrote: »

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

Find me another melee ranged skill that takes 1.4s chan + cast, that is on par with skills of melee classes.

It doesn't miss and has chance to purge, so there is certainly use for it, especially against people who try to hug close but aren't really melee classes...

Like... archers using melee skills?

Wingstrike is the only melee skill with almost no cooldown so it's always available. But exactly your attitude of archer's never use it makes it easier to slap people coming up closeb:bye

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver · March 2014

....seriously

This 'upgrade' has already been established as a scam.

Don't get it. End of discussion.

Socqar - Lost City · March 2014

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver wrote: »

....seriously

This 'upgrade' has already been established as a scam.

Don't get it. End of discussion.

+1 to that, even if some in my server are spamming it to say "it's amazing, hits like a truck" and more bla bla.... When you see r9rr+12 nw.... saying that skill it's worth, you realize something is really wrong U.U

At least we have forums for fair knowledge!

Walpurga - Dreamweaver · March 2014

Jarkhen - Archosaur wrote: »

like... archers using melee skills?

Sage Winged Pledge is amazing. Period.

_blood_rain - Sanctuary · April 2014

Jarkhen - Archosaur wrote: »

like... archers using melee skills?

I have actually had another r999 archer consistently try to kill me like this, Holy pathing in , EPing, and spamming close range skills. It was very ineffective and silly. I was embarrassed for him b:embarrass

Although originally opposed to halving my amount of close range, full damage melee skills, I have found that Feather Armageddon is a pretty fair trade off for demon archers(LOLsages). Sure, there are somewhat scarce situations where I wish I had that extra melee skill(Idiot mages), but it is not a significant loss and Feather Armageddon is b:dirty in my PV runs. The damage increase is quite noticeable in other PVE activities as well.

All I really used Winged Pledge for anyway was as an occasional finisher in PvP when a target was in my face but a hair from death. Even a half-damaged autoattack can still do it in some of those situations.

Plus Feather Armageddon kind of looks like break-dancing.

Socqar - Lost City · April 2014

_blood_rain - Sanctuary wrote: »

I have actually had another r999 archer consistently try to kill me like this, Holy pathing in , EPing, and spamming close range skills. It was very ineffective and silly. I was embarrassed for him b:embarrass

Although originally opposed to halving my amount of close range, full damage melee skills, I have found that Feather Armageddon is a pretty fair trade off for demon archers(LOLsages). Sure, there are somewhat scarce situations where I wish I had that extra melee skill(Idiot mages), but it is not a significant loss and Feather Armageddon is b:dirty in my PV runs. The damage increase is quite noticeable in other PVE activities as well.

All I really used Winged Pledge for anyway was as an occasional finisher in PvP when a target was in my face but a hair from death. Even a half-damaged autoattack can still do it in some of those situations.

Plus Feather Armageddon kind of looks like break-dancing.

Is it really noticeable in PV? That's the main reason that was tempting me to get it.. (Demon EA here), making me burn less charms and have smoothers runs looks pretty tempting.. But not sure if it's worth the cost of losing this close-range skill... I find myself spamming it pretty usually in close-ranged bosses in PVE (metal combo + mele combo) so... ñsldfkjasñdflkj Hate Pwi now U.U

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver · April 2014

Unequip your bow and Feather Armageddon a mob repeatedly, post the damage log, post your current lvl, physical attack w/o bow equipped, att levels, spirit, and skill damage passive level and which mob you were hitting.

Preferably the damage test mob.

We can work backwards from the results to see what the true damage increase is. PWI sucks at skill descriptions so we should do our own tests.

Cookies for doing this.

Socqar - Lost City · April 2014

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Unequip your bow and Feather Armageddon a mob repeatedly, post the damage log, post your current lvl, physical attack w/o bow equipped, att levels, spirit, and skill damage passive level and which mob you were hitting.

Preferably the damage test mob.

We can work backwards from the results to see what the true damage increase is. PWI sucks at skill descriptions so we should do our own tests.

Cookies for doing this.

Hope someone can test it... Even ... Bow shouldn't matter when it comes to PVing, right?

Flare the magic of your wings into a blast that attacks
all enemies within 8 meters, dealing base physical damage
plus 4347.0 and knocking non-player targets back 9.0 meters.

Btw, no idea what the "base physical damage" should be

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver · April 2014

ΩFeather Armageddon

Range 5 Meters
Mana 445
Channel 1.0 seconds
Cast 0.4 seconds
Cooldown 6.0 seconds
Chi Gained 10
Weapon Any

Requisite Cultivation Aware of the Void
Turn your feathers into razor-sharp projectiles, launching
them at all enemies within 10 Meters. Deals base physical
damage plus 6499 and knocks non-player targets back 9 Meters.

Demon Version also grants you a also grants you a Level 5 Winged Shell.

oWing Burst

Range 5 Meters
Mana 445
Channel 1.0 seconds
Cast 1.0 seconds
Cooldown 6.0 seconds
Chi Gained 10
Weapon Any

Requisite Cultivation Aware of the Void
Flare the magic of your wings into a blast that attacks
all enemies within 8 Meters. Deals base physical
damage plus 4347 and knocks non-player targets back 9 Meters.

Demon Version also grants you a also grants you a Level 5 Winged Shell.

So the only difference in terms of damage should be 6499-4347= 2152 additional constant damage.

skill damage = ( ( base weapon attack multiplier + skill weapon attack multiplier ) * weapon attack ) + constant damage

In this case there is no skill weapon multiplier so you can simplify to;

skill damage = base damage + constant damage

where base damage is the phys attack in your character info, and constant damage is 6499/4347 depending on primal/demon.

Using my archer that has 40-49k patt

i.e. with WB 44.3k-53.3k
with FA 46.5-55.5k

In PvE equates to an additional constant 7k raw damage when my raw damage with WB is 146.1k - 175.8k. i.e. negligible

In PvP assuming opponent has equal spirit, and 50 def lvls, this is 5k more raw damage, after PvP reduction of 75% and assuming the opponent has like 80% pdef reduction (16k pdef), this is a whopping 250 more damage..

This is why constant damage addons on skills are trash, whereas other classes get 320% base damage multipliers on skills..

_blood_rain - Sanctuary · April 2014

What I posted was my own personal experience with it, it is up to you to judge if you dont mind losing pledge based on how often you use it and whatever other personal, silly, trivial, and/or stupid reasons you may have...you people are way too eager to do math b:sweat

Socqar - Lost City · April 2014

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver wrote: »

ΩFeather Armageddon

Range 5 Meters
Mana 445
Channel 1.0 seconds
Cast 0.4 seconds
Cooldown 6.0 seconds
Chi Gained 10
Weapon Any

Requisite Cultivation Aware of the Void
Turn your feathers into razor-sharp projectiles, launching
them at all enemies within 10 Meters. Deals base physical
damage plus 6499 and knocks non-player targets back 9 Meters.

Demon Version also grants you a also grants you a Level 5 Winged Shell.

oWing Burst

Range 5 Meters
Mana 445
Channel 1.0 seconds
Cast 1.0 seconds
Cooldown 6.0 seconds
Chi Gained 10
Weapon Any

Requisite Cultivation Aware of the Void
Flare the magic of your wings into a blast that attacks
all enemies within 8 Meters. Deals base physical
damage plus 4347 and knocks non-player targets back 9 Meters.

Demon Version also grants you a also grants you a Level 5 Winged Shell.

So the only difference in terms of damage should be 6499-4347= 2152 additional constant damage.

skill damage = ( ( base weapon attack multiplier + skill weapon attack multiplier ) * weapon attack ) + constant damage

In this case there is no skill weapon multiplier so you can simplify to;

skill damage = base damage + constant damage

where base damage is the phys attack in your character info, and constant damage is 6499/4347 depending on primal/demon.

Using my archer that has 40-49k patt

i.e. with WB 44.3k-53.3k
with FA 46.5-55.5k

In PvE equates to an additional constant 7k raw damage when my raw damage with WB is 146.1k - 175.8k. i.e. negligible

In PvP assuming opponent has equal spirit, and 50 def lvls, this is 5k more raw damage, after PvP reduction of 75% and assuming the opponent has like 80% pdef reduction (16k pdef), this is a whopping 250 more damage..

This is why constant damage addons on skills are trash, whereas other classes get 320% base damage multipliers on skills..

Thanks for the elaborate post, as usual. Meaning this proofs that this skill is not worth for sage nor demon, only for the increase range-of-strike which is quite... well, usefull for pv and useless for anything else, and the slightly-nearly-unnoticeable reduced casting time U.U

I want new skills worth using U.U

Coudln't they reduce the cooldown to make it like a no-loss? Couldn't they put some DECENT dmg increase? Perhaps just increase the real range of action of the skill? SOMETHING worth loosing 1/2 mele skills we have? U.U

I don't need a Head Hunter-like skill, just something new and shiny to use... Bad thing is now we got an "upgrade", so we won't see any change related to skills in a long while (1 year?), which is what hurts me the most... We won't see improvements on this skills, we should just start geting over it...

Socqar - Lost City · April 2014

_blood_rain - Sanctuary wrote: »

What I posted was my own personal experience with it, it is up to you to judge if you dont mind losing pledge based on how often you use it and whatever other personal, silly, trivial, and/or stupid reasons you may have...you people are way too eager to do math b:sweat

Maths are the truth, anything else is not ment to be in EA's forum or Dark - Aster will kick the OP xD

Quilue - Sanctuary · April 2014

Some robes might try to keep close in small fights. Of course you don't want to stick it out at melee for too long, but those are situations where I'd just hit them with Strike + Span once before leaping or sprinting away just to see what happens. Strike still has a chance to purge at least.

It used to be that I could tank wizards forever with melee skills, then they got Spark. Now with the 0cd Cyclone it's pretty unhealthy to stick around near an offending cleric too. So I'll admit the list of classes melee skills are usable against is getting smaller and smaller.

RavensKing - Heavens Tear · April 2014

It is a nice skill to have, i got it on my demon archer.

For PvP it is nice to use cause instead of casting span then pledge you can just click one skill that hits similar to the two skills combined and then leap away out of the nerfed damage range.

For PvE it is nice cause it hits harder and knocks mobs back a longer distance giving you another second or two

honestly its all up to you if you get it or not, i would suggest getting it but it all depends on situation and play style.

Is ΩFeather Armageddon worth it?

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