R9r2 Weapon proc question

Bhavyy - Raging Tide
Bhavyy - Raging Tide Posts: 1,083 Arc User
edited July 2014 in Archer
I was chilling with some homeboy's today on PWI and this question arose.

I think most archers agree that the other R9R2 weapon procs are better than purge. If you don't you're probably a deranged, deluded or otherwise impaired.

Hypothetically though, out of the 2 (GOF and Purify Spell) which would you pick?
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Post edited by Bhavyy - Raging Tide on
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Comments

  • ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide
    ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide Posts: 397 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    The few times I've run with Clergy in TW and in PvE is sure looks like every 3rd hit is purify but stun lock is not an issue. I'd take GoF from a range attack any day.
  • Verenor - Morai
    Verenor - Morai Posts: 699 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide wrote: »
    I'd take GoF from a range attack any day.

    Amen to that.
    Can't do any "surprise!"-damage, just steady predictable hits/crits. Purge has it's uses but eh..let the classes with purge-skills purge, let dd-classes dd.
  • Zsw - Dreamweaver
    Zsw - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,087 Arc User
    edited March 2014
    I'm surprised that despite everyone being full buffed these days, Purge still isn't recognized for its usefulness.
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  • XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear
    XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear Posts: 278 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    I'm surprised that despite everyone being full buffed these days, Purge still isn't recognized for its usefulness.

    We aren't saying purge isn't useful, it still is, but as an archer the arguments against us boils down to "QQ you main a purge weapon". And every single one of us is tired of hearing it. In any organized sort of squad setting PvP, if there's a veno or several there's a good chance you wont have buffs. And after you don't have buffs you get facerolled, end of story. Overall I'm just tired of hearing that purge a class maining a purge weapon is OP, every class dies without buffs. Archers, BMs, Sins, Barbs, Clerics, Venos, Mystics, Seekers, and Wizards. We're all about equally or more ***** without buffs. Though every class besides an archer has a buff that makes them survive better. Dat evasion and speed buff be OP, ijs. b:laugh
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    It's not that these procs are better than Purge, because post-Purge is like hitting crits every hit on a previously fully buffed target...Many physical classes sport a purge weapon for a damn good reason, unless you're a seeker and just has BS debuffs.

    That's just it: You don't need purge on r999 bow to be able to purge people.

    I guess the biggest argument for purge on R999 bow is barrage though.
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  • trands
    trands Posts: 2
    edited April 2014
    b:dirty Yes please, take away purge of that bow for either of them.

    But more seriously, that would be a massive nerf. All archers QQ they are so weak, why suggest making them weaker ?
    XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Dat evasion and speed buff be OP, ijs. b:laugh

    And range. But that's a passive, not really a buff.
    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    That's just it: You don't need purge on r999 bow to be able to purge people.

    I'm always surprised that archers don't see how ridiculously scary that damage of the purge shot is with their crit rate and the fact that there is no possible counter to that. Things like bms and sins using a weak purge weapon are just a sad joke in comparaison.
    Well, maybe in fully buffed 1vs1 it matters...
  • ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide
    ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide Posts: 397 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    trands wrote: »
    I'm always surprised that archers don't see how ridiculously scary that damage of the purge shot is with their crit rate and the fact that there is no possible counter to that. Things like bms and sins using a weak purge weapon are just a sad joke in comparaison.
    Well, maybe in fully buffed 1vs1 it matters...

    I'm sure it is perception, but I feel purge proc happens far less frequent than the other two. Having GoF connect on a range attack. b:shocked
  • trands
    trands Posts: 2
    edited April 2014
    ToyMaker_NOT - Raging Tide wrote: »
    I'm sure it is perception, but I feel purge proc happens far less frequent than the other two. Having GoF connect on a range attack. b:shocked

    Purge proc happens less then GoF for sure. But GoF is way less dangerous for the receiving side. For me, archer class + strong bow makes the purge proc very dangerous. It forces me to go after the class that has more range and more mobility then me. GoF is just a harder hit, purge is a harder hit that can go through psychic will, expel, white voodoo, bubble, takes of buffs (not just defensive but also ressurect and attack buffs, which can be a big factor) and in TW/NW forces others in squad to spend extra time on me.

    GoF or a weak weapon with purge (with a strong one to equip after proc) or even veno purge leave way more counters. It's a pain for the archer that it's unpredictable, but that's also an issue for the one being hit. Since archers with a refined r9.3 bow don't have to change weapon and cast anything after to do serious damage, I take at least 1 big hit, probably 2 before I could even cast something. And that's being a psychic, the AA class best suited vs purges.

    Purify proc has the same rate I believe, but it procs on being hit so it can get much higher. I couldn't care less about archers with purify proc tbh, but that's partially because of my class. My only debuff can't be purified and archers have way more mobility then me. Given there are 2/3 moments where purify proc is really strong, I don't see it give much to archers tbh.

    That sums up the main reasons why I really don't get the recent archer QQ. It's THE class that makes purge dangerous, and it's not the purge that defines the use of the class. Comparing it with sin using G15 bow or bm using a r8r is just hilarious from a caster's pov. I don't find archers particularly OP, but they aren't underpowered or obsolete. If you want GoF or purify proc, I hope your wish will be granted so I can laugh at you for doing something so stupid.
  • _blood_rain - Sanctuary
    _blood_rain - Sanctuary Posts: 2,532 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    trands wrote: »
    Purge proc happens less then GoF for sure. But GoF is way less dangerous for the receiving side. For me, archer class + strong bow makes the purge proc very dangerous. It forces me to go after the class that has more range and more mobility then me. GoF is just a harder hit, purge is a harder hit that can go through psychic will, expel, white voodoo, bubble, takes of buffs (not just defensive but also ressurect and attack buffs, which can be a big factor) and in TW/NW forces others in squad to spend extra time on me.

    GoF or a weak weapon with purge (with a strong one to equip after proc) or even veno purge leave way more counters. It's a pain for the archer that it's unpredictable, but that's also an issue for the one being hit. Since archers with a refined r9.3 bow don't have to change weapon and cast anything after to do serious damage, I take at least 1 big hit, probably 2 before I could even cast something. And that's being a psychic, the AA class best suited vs purges.

    Purify proc has the same rate I believe, but it procs on being hit so it can get much higher. I couldn't care less about archers with purify proc tbh, but that's partially because of my class. My only debuff can't be purified and archers have way more mobility then me. Given there are 2/3 moments where purify proc is really strong, I don't see it give much to archers tbh.

    That sums up the main reasons why I really don't get the recent archer QQ. It's THE class that makes purge dangerous, and it's not the purge that defines the use of the class. Comparing it with sin using G15 bow or bm using a r8r is just hilarious from a caster's pov. I don't find archers particularly OP, but they aren't underpowered or obsolete. If you want GoF or purify proc, I hope your wish will be granted so I can laugh at you for doing something so stupid.

    The recent archer QQing comes mostly from the time after r999/before RB. The defenses of casters reached a point at which archers would proc their purify several times before even getting near killing them...or never even getting close at all. Even with a +12 weapon, it was very difficult to kill even the worst of casters, as long as they were well refined.The purify advantage screwed everyone who didn't get purify on their weapon, and it boosted a caster's mobility above an archer's. An archer still retains the worst mobility of all classes, especially with the new paralyze effect. So if you are claiming to have inferior mobility, this tells me you are either undergeared or ignorant.

    These days with card stats, archers don't have it so bad. Arcanes still get free-of-charge complete cop-out every few seconds, but if you are observant, you will notice that many casters have picked up very bad habits from their purify proc. I find many of the less intelligent, overly-puri reliant casters will just stand there and try to tank archers...which was very possible for even non josd casters before cards were released because archers didn't do enough damage and puri was always there if they needed to take a kite...but it just doesn't work these days. <3 clerics who don't even shell anymore

    The only problem I have with purge, is that the most OP buffs are all unpurgeable. For some reason, archers still lack any of these buffs for themselves. It is so ironic and awkward to hear other classes complaining about our purge when we are the one's who are most affected by purge b:shocked
    and what happens when an opponent is purged already? Our proc has done what it can do and pre-card days, it probably would not have even been enough. But melees can purge someone and then GOF them to death, and arcane's always have the chance to get out of jail free. Our proc is the most limited out of all three and has the lowest proc rate, and hurts other archers more than it hurts any one else. Even so, I'm not sure I would say it is the "worst". It has defined limits, but not enough to be considered incompetent next to GoF and Puri.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Last NW I was surprised how long it took for two R999 archers to kill a R999 wiz, and that was just because the wiz was stopping to fight back. Even when he got purged, he could just move away to self buff. We were timing stuns and alternating to deuff hp and everything. It wasn't til an extremely unlucky stream of not procing purify on his part that he died; again, that was just because he was stopping to fight back.

    I have to wonder how many archers it would take to kill a fully geared veno. You can't even hold robes still anymore. A veno can run circles around archers...

    Again, I say the only thing purge on R999 bow is still good for is barrage. There is no time I can think of when a target really needed to die and a veno was not called upon to purge...because relying on archer purge is so realistic... I wasn't even thinking of GoF TBH, that's just boring.

    As for what proc I would have in place of purge for R999 wep, probably something different than all the other ones we have already. You don't actually get the chance to attack much when any class starts applying pressure anyway (another reason purge on R999 bow is overrated)...I think it's better to have a survival proc instead.

    Maybe something that has a decent chance to interrupt/immobilize on hit and place a Winged Shell on yourself. Maybe something that has decent chance to proc Winged Shell when getting hit..
    trands wrote: »
    I'm always surprised that archers don't see how ridiculously scary that damage of the purge shot is with their crit rate and the fact that there is no possible counter to that. Things like bms and sins using a weak purge weapon are just a sad joke in comparaison.
    Well, maybe in fully buffed 1vs1 it matters...

    The counter is not allowing an archer to attack...not very hard in small fights. Even in TWs coordinated melee immune runs can break up a line of ranged DDs very effectively while your own cats/DDs gain ground.
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  • ablabahabla
    ablabahabla Posts: 67 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    if u guys want some ranged zerk why dont u play a seeker?
    and if u want purify why dont u play mage, psy, veno, mystic or cleric?

    thing is that purge is the stuff that decieds whos gonna win unless its fullbuffed 1v1 and one of them is a sin.

    And if u want a facerollclass maybe go reroll as sin instead of ea, since u only need 2 buttons now to kil anything as sin
  • Walpurga - Dreamweaver
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,028 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    pls devs

    Let me switch -int for -6chant
    Gimme -10chant Gof+SBH crossbow
    Gimme -6chan stones
    So archers can be a factor
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  • Socqar - Lost City
    Socqar - Lost City Posts: 511 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    pls devs

    Let me switch -int for -6chant
    Gimme -10chant Gof+SBH crossbow
    Gimme -6chan stones
    So archers can be a factor

    Archers becoming the new mag. DD class and every single EA rolling to sage ? xD
  • XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear
    XShadowshotx - Heavens Tear Posts: 278 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    ablabahabla wrote: »
    if u guys want some ranged zerk why dont u play a seeker?
    and if u want purify why dont u play mage, psy, veno, mystic or cleric?

    thing is that purge is the stuff that decieds whos gonna win unless its fullbuffed 1v1 and one of them is a sin.

    And if u want a facerollclass maybe go reroll as sin instead of ea, since u only need 2 buttons now to kil anything as sin

    So what you're saying is if we want to become a non-support DD we should roll another class. Thanks for the support on that fact.
  • LostPoet - Dreamweaver
    LostPoet - Dreamweaver Posts: 396 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    I'm surprised that despite everyone being full buffed these days, Purge still isn't recognized for its usefulness.

    Purging and hitting someone after is probably equal to or more effective than GoF. As you don't need to rely on a proc, and you can hit them probably multiple times before they get and buffs back.

    Purge is definitely OP, probably better than GoF when it hits.

    On a side note, if i had to pick between those 2, GoF for sure. Who needs to purify when your attacking from a long range. + Who needs to purify.. when you can ZERK BoA... b:victory

    Like seriously.... anyone who wants purify.. just go get Faith on genie....
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  • Walpurga - Dreamweaver
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,028 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    LostPoet - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Purging and hitting someone after is probably equal to or more effective than GoF. As you don't need to rely on a proc, and you can hit them probably multiple times before they get and buffs back.

    Purge is definitely OP, probably better than GoF when it hits.

    On a side note, if i had to pick between those 2, GoF for sure. Who needs to purify when your attacking from a long range. + Who needs to purify.. when you can ZERK BoA... b:victory

    Like seriously.... anyone who wants purify.. just Not have AD/Expel and rely on a 60 sec CD genie skill that renders your genie dead after 1 use and thus makes you entirely vulnerable for almost a minute with 100 mag genie on genie....

    Fixed, because archers totally don't spam defensive genie 24/7
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  • Horosho - Lost City
    Horosho - Lost City Posts: 305 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Fixed, because archers totally don't spam defensive genie 24/7

    Please, what do you know about archers b:laugh
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  • Narcillatrix - Dreamweaver
    Narcillatrix - Dreamweaver Posts: 461 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Horosho - Lost City wrote: »
    Please, what do you know about archers b:laugh
    PvE server players think they're good oh god. New level of being ****.

    Wow arrogant PvP player. That's something I haven't seen before. x.x;;
    No need to bash entire server populations, is rude D:

    b:surrender

    But to topic, if I absolutely had to pick one for my archer I would go with GoF because of just about every single reason posted already.
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  • Walpurga - Dreamweaver
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,028 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Horosho - Lost City wrote: »
    Please, what do you know about archers b:laugh
    PvE server players think they're good oh god. New level of being ****.

    Kid is mad he got dropped twice by an unbuffed demon aps EA while healed by a good cleric

    Go back to sucking Area****'s **** please

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  • Jesusisback - Raging Tide
    Jesusisback - Raging Tide Posts: 480 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Lol mofos be mad gg
  • Pwnallagain - Heavens Tear
    Pwnallagain - Heavens Tear Posts: 206 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Guys, this entire post was about PURIFY SPELL vs GOF, NOT PURGE. You all went on a rant about nothing related to the initial question. Maybe you should read before starting a long series of unrelated responses.
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  • Horosho - Lost City
    Horosho - Lost City Posts: 305 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Kid is mad he got dropped twice by an unbuffed demon aps EA while healed by a good cleric

    Go back to sucking Area****'s **** please

    maximum trisomy 21

    I don't even play PWI..
    Wow good try. Very mad.
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  • Verenor - Morai
    Verenor - Morai Posts: 699 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Horosho - Lost City wrote: »
    I don't even play PWI..
    Wow good try. Very mad.

    You clearly are playing the PW Forum Ranting - New Horizons edition. QQ'ing on the forums and denying you play?

    Can someone clear out like 2 out of 3 pages of this thread so we're back on track b:lipcurl
  • Horosho - Lost City
    Horosho - Lost City Posts: 305 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Verenor - Morai wrote: »
    You clearly are playing the PW Forum Ranting - New Horizons edition. QQ'ing on the forums and denying you play?

    Can someone clear out like 2 out of 3 pages of this thread so we're back on track b:lipcurl

    I don't play PWI. Just on forums. Baddie. I'm not QQing.
    ...
  • LostPoet - Dreamweaver
    LostPoet - Dreamweaver Posts: 396 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Horosho - Lost City wrote: »
    I don't even play PWI..
    Wow good try. Very mad.

    Why be on PWI forums if you don't play?

    Any threads or discussions here shouldn't even matter to you... b:thanks
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  • Horosho - Lost City
    Horosho - Lost City Posts: 305 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    LostPoet - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Why be on PWI forums if you don't play?

    Any threads or discussions here shouldn't even matter to you... b:thanks

    It's funny to see that you guys think you're any good. When in reality you'll suck vs anyone from a private server in a 1v1. b:thanks
    ...
  • Jarkhen - Archosaur
    Jarkhen - Archosaur Posts: 990 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Horosho - Lost City wrote: »
    It's funny to see that you guys think you're any good. When in reality you'll suck vs anyone from a private server in a 1v1. b:thanks

    Funny how you could claim that when you don't actually play PWI. Hard to make a comparison if you only know one of the two you're comparing.

    Sure, most people on PWI suck at PvP, but not all do -- just like not everyone on private servers are good, by any means.
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  • Horosho - Lost City
    Horosho - Lost City Posts: 305 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Jarkhen - Archosaur wrote: »
    Funny how you could claim that when you don't actually play PWI. Hard to make a comparison if you only know one of the two you're comparing.

    Sure, most people on PWI suck at PvP, but not all do -- just like not everyone on private servers are good, by any means.

    I played both versions.
    If you wanna 1v1 with equal gear just say it baddie. b:bye
    ...
  • Walpurga - Dreamweaver
    Walpurga - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,028 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Horosho - Lost City wrote: »
    I played both versions.
    If you wanna 1v1 with equal gear just say it baddie. b:bye

    Horosho getting trolled by PWI forums. What else is new?
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  • porphy
    porphy Posts: 123 Arc User
    edited April 2014
    Horosho - Lost City wrote: »
    I played both versions.
    If you wanna 1v1 with equal gear just say it baddie. b:bye

    Jar has also played PWS and he is a decent archer, just saying.
    Been more than a year since I quit playing, but still on rankings.

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