Why are barbs so weak?

Smiliess - Heavens Tear · December 2013

Isnt the idea of a barb to be main tank in pwi?
Means u got to survive long..correct? yes.
How come in Nation wars i get hit (no mather wich class) like 15k a hit sometimes even 30k
i have full stage 3 set, full mdef gems. 100% sage buffs/skills
Alsono mather wich class i attack, i cant kill them, because i have to be so close to hit them.

i think nation wars (PK)is more def lvl vs att lvl isnt it?
If yes...why doesnt barbs get extra 50 def lvl buff. or able to buff ourselfs in any form.
Barbs weak? yes.

Conalll - Archosaur · December 2013

Without seeing your full gear and build, I can't fully advise. I will say this.
Barbs are weak against magic.
This is a fact.
High end casters will hit with the numbers you've mentioned even against people of their own class and matching gear.
This is a fact.
Barbs, unless fully decked out in the absolute best gear to be had, will have a hard time killing people.
This is a fact.

Our job is to stay alive as best we can. Oddly enough, I find NW is more brutal than TW. Why I do not know, but I take more damage in NW than I ever did in the worst of TW's (and I've been through some brutal TW's in my time). All you can do is improve your gear as best you can, get as much HP as you can, get magic defense charms, and surrender to the incredible pain you will be facing.

Sorry I'm not more helpful.

WannaBM - Archosaur · December 2013

Hmm, i usually get 10k hits from strong casters in my G16 with citrine gems. 20k crits happen i guess.

Are you by any chance using mdef gems but wearing pdef ornaments ?
Or maybe exaggerating a bit ?

Other than that i blame this phenomenon in NW:

even though maybe only 5%-10% of the players in NW is OP as in full r9+10 or better and +12 weapon and at least vit stones, these players dont die much. They are in battle almost 100% of the time. During this time they target-kill, target-kill etc. So they kill 100s of people per hour. The weaklings like us on the other hands spend 2/3s of our time recovering from death and when we do fight, we are running half the time and trying to survive rather than killing and scaring people. Because of this, the small group of OP people totally make the battle field and make us feel like everyone is one-shotting us.

End game equiped barbs do not seem so weak.

Berthabusti - Heavens Tear · December 2013

Weak?

I know a barb that can TANK without a charm ON JUST POTS in NW. c:

JinxRake - Momaganon · December 2013

Me, a seeker and a BM had fought a barb last night for full on to 5 minutes before finally killing the R9.3 beast, and that ONLY after I had managed to purge him.
So no...end game gear barbs are NOT weak, not by a long shot.

Zoldi - Morai · December 2013

As said above, you should tell us which ornaments you use (and the refines)
But you should also tell us more about who he's hitting you wih 15k. If this i from huge DD in end-game gear (full R9.3 with +12 weapon, NW reforged items, ...) then this sounds fair...
Don't forget that end game geared barbs can reach 50k HP and you have your turtle thing

scruncy · December 2013

yes, barbs are weak. i fully support a 50 def lvl buff b:cute

Unholly - Morai · December 2013

Barbs are not weak, Gear is OP.

SylenThunder - Twilight Temple · December 2013

I always LOL at the APS barbs that I can take down in 2-3 shots on my cleric.

Most barbs are weak simply because they've forgotten how to play their class.

Kymraja - Raging Tide · December 2013

I agree, and give venos a "+100 attack levels" buff b:victory
oh oh oh, and an armor for petsb:dirty

...lol

post count +1

XXHotXx - Morai · December 2013

JinxRake - Momaganon wrote: »

Me, a seeker and a BM had fought a barb last night for full on to 5 minutes before finally killing the R9.3 beast, and that ONLY after I had managed to purge him.
So no...end game gear barbs are NOT weak, not by a long shot.

was that goumelle? b:dirty

Sien - Heavens Tear · December 2013

Pet armor ftw.

Desdi - Sanctuary · December 2013

It's mostly the gear in this case, not the class itself.
Based on your post, you seem to have 3rd cast Nirvana but I don't know the kind of refines, shards and ornaments you have.
Overall though, it's not really a surprise R9r3 +10/12 casters hit like trucks on you, and possibly some other classes that may use an effective combo. You didn't specify debuffs or particular situations either.

Barbarians are strong, don't underestimate them. Maxed endgame Barbarians won't die easily (unless heavily ganked of course).

Korpinsulka - Raging Tide · December 2013

Barbs weak? What? Lol?

Against r9rr casters I'm in trouble but assuming the fight has T3 geared players or lower, I can tank (depending on classes) 8-20 people at once without issues and usually also kill them before they get me down.

The trick is to time your defensive skills (Cornered beast, invoke, bestial rage, genie, apoth) when enemy is going to hit a nuke, debuff you badly or triple spark.

opkossy · December 2013

Barbs... weak?

Whaaaaaaaaaaat?

This is purely gear and/or skill. Endgame barbs are tough as nails to bring down... but endgame casters hit like a train on steroids that took crack if you aren't endgame too.

WannaBM - Archosaur · December 2013

There is however 1 thing you can do even if youre not end gear:

Just keep running from everything until you find a flying caster. Berserkers Wrath sometimes even feels a little OP to me

Man - Raging Tide · December 2013

Barbs to be effective are kind of gear reliant (outside of invoke and solid shield, OR playing a support role like debuff + raging slap + chi burn)

They have their strengths and weaknesses. They aren't the best killers in the world as the barb pvp ranking page can testify.

With nation war buff + full buffs im sitting on 53k hp 20k+ mdef and 40k pdef, and 130 defense levels (w/ 8.5 wep) I imagine these stats are a bit better than yours, and keep in mind a marginal increase in stats can really make a difference in life and death, in buying time for your charm to tick etc.

All things being equal don't expect a barb with +5 refine g7 citrines to tank a caster with +10 or +12 wep.

Knownase - Heavens Tear · December 2013

Well in that case, so glad Barbs are getting an amp for PvP now.b:cute

OoArCsTeRoO - Sanctuary · December 2013

That guy said it right, barbs are not weak the gear is OP.

If you give barb 50 def level buff what that will mean is that end game r999+12 JOSD barbs would be really hard to kill in PvP, true it will help non +12 JOSD barbs against casters with better gear than them but will make +12 JOSD barb unbalanced.

The balance in this game rests on a thin line if you make a change it might help one set of people but make the other set unbalanced.

PvP is just totally unbalanced by gears and class advantages but barbs are not weak they got pretty good defensive skills however the gear difference is just too big. A +12 wep caster will hit a +5 non r999 barb in 1 shot that is just how it is.

thatguy123456 · December 2013

JinxRake - Momaganon wrote: »

Me, a seeker and a BM had fought a barb last night for full on to 5 minutes before finally killing the R9.3 beast, and that ONLY after I had managed to purge him.
So no...end game gear barbs are NOT weak, not by a long shot.

There aren't many of these beasts around, most of us who have barbs don't pour billions of coins into every single one of our toons.

I feel the pain though because my fully decked out G16 barb gets sliced and diced by R9 squads....

Flash_man - Lost City · December 2013

from end game perspective, full str barb = squishy af, full vit barb = weak af, hybrid = kinda balanced. even end game others can tank better then barbs, especially if it's a arcane class with purify >_>

OoArCsTeRoO - Sanctuary · December 2013

JinxRake - Momaganon wrote: »

Me, a seeker and a BM had fought a barb last night for full on to 5 minutes before finally killing the R9.3 beast, and that ONLY after I had managed to purge him.
So no...end game gear barbs are NOT weak, not by a long shot.

Lol if you and the BM were both r999+12 weapons then it was you guys lack of coordination/skills if you guys are not then why are you giving this example when it is to do we gear difference?

I have a seeker friend who loves damage testing on me, and he has done maximum of 128k damage on me in our damage tests, he is +12 r999 full JOSD, I am r999+11 vit stones vit built with about 10.7k mdef unbuffed.

Unholly - Morai · December 2013

Flash_man - Lost City wrote: »

from end game perspective, full str barb = squishy af, full vit barb = weak af, hybrid = kinda balanced. even end game others can tank better then barbs, especially if it's a arcane class with purify >_>

Dem cata wiz so hard to kill.

SakuLv - Dreamweaver · December 2013

Smiliess - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Isnt the idea of a barb to be main tank in pwi?
Means u got to survive long..correct? yes.
How come in Nation wars i get hit (no mather wich class) like 15k a hit sometimes even 30k
i have full stage 3 set, full mdef gems. 100% sage buffs/skills
Alsono mather wich class i attack, i cant kill them, because i have to be so close to hit them.

i think nation wars (PK)is more def lvl vs att lvl isnt it?
If yes...why doesnt barbs get extra 50 def lvl buff. or able to buff ourselfs in any form.
Barbs weak? yes.

Barb are not weak...

i could say venos r weak, im full g16 and most ppl can do 20k on me
so give venos 100 def lvl ;D

lmao

Smiliess - Heavens Tear · December 2013

i have full r9s3 all+10 wep+12, i have 45k hp all mdef gems and mdef ornaments (even my rings) and i am not aps build.
stil get hit for 15k+ and i dont mean just psy/clerics/wizzards or veno's, i even mean bm/sins/seekers(blurr and i die)

I have a family to suport, i cant spend 10.000$ to get end game. ( i thought i already was with my gear)

Invoke need 2 sparks wich u dont have when u die. and debuff skills is pointles, because u die by then.

WannaBM - Archosaur · December 2013

I cannot speak for myself, but appearently this guy on my sever owns everyone with his

R9+10ish - vit stoned APS barb.

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · December 2013

Smiliess - Heavens Tear wrote: »

i have full r9s3 all+10 wep+12, i have 45k hp all mdef gems and mdef ornaments (even my rings) and i am not aps build.
stil get hit for 15k+ and i dont mean just psy/clerics/wizzards or veno's, i even mean bm/sins/seekers(blurr and i die)

I have a family to suport, i cant spend 10.000$ to get end game. ( i thought i already was with my gear)

Invoke need 2 sparks wich u dont have when u die. and debuff skills is pointles, because u die by then.

Maybe its the difference in servers or something else thats intanigible... but seriously I have NEVER been hit for 15kish by a bm/sin/or even other barbs while I was on my barb in this crappy gear. Granted My defense has went up some since then, but still... they are far from weak imho.

As for invoke needing 2 sparks to pull off I actually find it easyish to keep going when I need too... we doa after all get 1 and a half spark back when we respawn in nw. (Demon barbs hp buff gives enough chi to pull it off with the chi return, and then sage barbs have the master li technique, all of that with the skill beastial rage, I for one find it easy to keep up invoke if its really needed. Oh and don't forget about solid shield on genies, frighten, etc. There is PLENTY of ways to get enough chi to invoke.

As for the def/atk lvls of everyone in pk these days... sadly the only way to combat that is get more def/atk lvls. Still it is imho one of the easier melee classes to enjoy in nw/mass pvp... especially if you are in a group/are getting heals/using genie/apo.

Jesusisback - Raging Tide · December 2013

WannaBM - Archosaur wrote: »

I cannot speak for myself, but appearently this guy on my sever owns everyone with his

R9+10ish - vit stoned APS barb.

headsslicer gg b:laugh

Deceptistar - Sanctuary · December 2013

Smiliess - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Isnt the idea of a barb to be main tank in pwi?
Means u got to survive long..correct? yes.
How come in Nation wars i get hit (no mather wich class) like 15k a hit sometimes even 30k
i have full stage 3 set, full mdef gems. 100% sage buffs/skills
Alsono mather wich class i attack, i cant kill them, because i have to be so close to hit them.

i think nation wars (PK)is more def lvl vs att lvl isnt it?
If yes...why doesnt barbs get extra 50 def lvl buff. or able to buff ourselfs in any form.
Barbs weak? yes.

every single shard is mdef? :0

Adroit - Lost City · December 2013

One thing going for barbs is that they handle purges better than any other class. Most classes get absolutely graped after a purge, barbs still have high hp + high pdef and ofc turtle which cannot be purged. They also have a lot of really annoying support skills and if unharassed/not a total derp.. can purge more than a veno.

WannaBM - Archosaur · December 2013

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

One thing going for barbs is that they handle purges better than any other class. Most classes get absolutely graped after a purge, barbs still have high hp + high pdef and ofc turtle which cannot be purged. They also have a lot of really annoying support skills and if unharassed/not a total derp.. can purge more than a veno.

how can we purge more than a veno ?
Cleansweep: 20% chance, 30 sec cooldown.....

Dont know much about venos, but i thought they could do better than that

Why are barbs so weak?

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