test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc

Wizards skills need some tweaks

2»

Comments

  • Desdi - SanctuaryDesdi - Sanctuary Posts: 8,680 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Seriously?
    >Will Surge and Badge cripple SoS/SoSt (ex: bait SoSt, Psychic switches to black voodoo to try to kill, stunned target uses Badge of Coursge and retaliate against the now squishier Psychic)

    >We trade offense for defense when using White Voodoo. Wizards can keep an offensive no matter what barrier they use. Same for other arcanes with shield skills - Their offenses aren't hampered by them them (though venomancer fox-form is questionable)

    It kinda works a similar for venomancers, yes. In fox form, venomancers can't really hurt anyone damage wise.
    The damage of the attack skills is laughable and unless you have HA/LA build, your skills will miss anyway (though it appears they are making skills to hit regardless at the upcoming update).

    The only "damage" skill to consider is Fossilized Curse but it's more effective if you're HA (and probably use ToP to up your HP, it's like a weaker version of arma..much weaker) but most venomancers being AA, will just use it for the debuffs.

    On the other hand fox form has other uses..the debuffs...but if you're not fast/skilled/prepared enough the target may run away and your debuffs just got wasted!

    I also hate SoS and SoSt but Psychics don't have any other way to up their defence unless they give up their attack power. A White Voodoo Psychic won't die but will most likely not kill you either.
    To be fair though, I can only see if from the perspective of my class so I don't know how other classes deal with psychics. I also have a psychic so I quite know how they work.
    [SIGPIC]http://i.imgur.com/MtwcqjL.png[/SIGPIC]
    ★ Venomancer videos - tinyurl.com/k6ppkw4 ★ Desdi - Demon ♪ Wyvelin - Sage ★
  • ApocaIypto - DreamweaverApocaIypto - Dreamweaver Posts: 585 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Ok, but nerf SoS and Soul of stunning, those skills are stupidly annoying with +12 weapons, i cant kill psys because i get sealed every time hit them, and about getting p.def, cleric hve a buff, mystics have a buff, and venos gain more in fox form, so is not wrong to have SB.

    And isnt white vodoo a def buff, not p.def, but def level which is better

    never said stone barrier was the only shield that needed a nerf :P
    but yay, a 10k pdef boost is just too much.

    but SoS, and SoSt can be countered easily with genie skill, and white voodoo = no damage XD
  • DarkSkiesx - DreamweaverDarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,355 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    At least you guys get free defensive buffs! Or ones that cost like 30chi and last a while. Archers get WoG that lasts 15seconds or Winged Shell that lasts one hit.

    So sad for squishy defenceless archers b:surrender
    DarkSkiesx - Demon Archer
    mypers.pw/1.7/#114350

    DarkSeasx - Sage Assassin
    mypers.pw/1.7/#136481

    youtube.com/darkskiesx
    Tempest-dw.shivtr.com
  • Ursa - DreamweaverUrsa - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,634 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    you have range, purge, crit and control skills to kill and high evasion for surviving + buffs you named. Plus recently some really nice morai skills.
    You're not supposed to get hit much. If you do, learn to use your assets.
    ____________
    I have as much authority as the Pope, I just don't have as many people who believe it.
    George Carlin

    ~I listen to hardcore FIGHT songs when I visit the forum, just to get into the proper mood~

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • DarkSkiesx - DreamweaverDarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,355 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    you have range, purge, crit and control skills to kill and high evasion for surviving + buffs you named. Plus recently some really nice morai skills.
    You're not supposed to get hit much. If you do, learn to use your assets.

    Ursa. I was trolling. O.o

    And is the same one as in Relic. You talk alot of pvp you should come join the pvp events :o
    DarkSkiesx - Demon Archer
    mypers.pw/1.7/#114350

    DarkSeasx - Sage Assassin
    mypers.pw/1.7/#136481

    youtube.com/darkskiesx
    Tempest-dw.shivtr.com
  • Ursa - DreamweaverUrsa - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,634 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    wish I had time for it. :/
    I do quite often NW (that's not PvP, I know), but I just don't have time in the evening ( server time). Most of my play time is 4-8AM server time....:/
    past few months I've been working hard to get my wiz up to date (sort of) with the gear so yeah...not much time to wonder around doing PvP...
    ____________
    I have as much authority as the Pope, I just don't have as many people who believe it.
    George Carlin

    ~I listen to hardcore FIGHT songs when I visit the forum, just to get into the proper mood~

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Aeliah - DreamweaverAeliah - Dreamweaver Posts: 784 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Drag is saying some skills aren't useful, because their cost to benefit ratio is too low, when compared with other wizard skills. I honestly don't know much about some of the more obscure wizard skills... are they obscure because they are too resource costly? I know I've seen the elemental invocation used effectively against me before in NW, where my chi went from 1.5 sparks to 0 when I was carrying flag and getting stun-locked. It seems like such a useful skill aught to be used more often... but maybe the 1 spark cost is just too high to every justify using it?
    YOUTUBE CHANNEL:
    youtube.com/user/csquaredcsquared

    CLERIC PV GUIDE (complete):
    pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1531411

    CLERIC PK GUIDE (Incomplete):
    pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=18027931
  • Adroit - Lost CityAdroit - Lost City Posts: 4,628 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Drag is saying some skills aren't useful, because their cost to benefit ratio is too low, when compared with other wizard skills. I honestly don't know much about some of the more obscure wizard skills... are they obscure because they are too resource costly? I know I've seen the elemental invocation used effectively against me before in NW, where my chi went from 1.5 sparks to 0 when I was carrying flag and getting stun-locked. It seems like such a useful skill aught to be used more often... but maybe the 1 spark cost is just too high to every justify using it?

    Most of our skills are very useful, not really sure what he's referring to. Elemental invocation is useful, but has a pretty long cd and generally not worth it on targets that can purify themselves.. but against bms or something, it is great.
    Youtube Channel: youtube.com/user/D2VeT/videos?flow=grid&view=0
    Current gear: pwcalc.com/6ab2893fbfb080a8
    [SIGPIC]http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=684hgk&s=5[/SIGPIC]
  • Dragslave - DreamweaverDragslave - Dreamweaver Posts: 253 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Finally someone got what i meant right! thank you Aeliah...
    What i meant is that some of wizard skills dont have MUCH uses, or just cost too much of chi, or have longs cooldowns for what they do.
    Im not saying we have to get better skills, just having well adjusted from the ones we have.

    -Ice prison is getting pretty much what i wanted, even more really, so we will be able to spam it more often.
    -Manifest virtue, 5min cooldown really! -.- is a nice skill when u have tons of mp, but u cant use it more often, when it can help a lot in 1 vs 1 to increase a spark combo damage for example.
    -soporific whisper is a joke on cooldown, range and duration. at least 2 more secs so we can cast something
    -Barriers (water and fire) will have an upgrade, so at least we will use them, even if it is mostly for pve for not losing p.def, unless we fighting casters, that way we might have a slight advantage over other casters. (and before someone says we are ok and dont need anything, not all wizzies are r9r +12 josd, im not, so when i find a better sharded/refined enemy, is not bad to also have a help)
    -Elemental invocation is nice, but should get less chi cost maybe or less cooldown, nice on TW and NW mostly

    im not saying wizards need more ubber skills or anything, i would just like to use all my skills more often and not running out of chi everytime i cast lol...
  • mynameiswizymynameiswizy Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Finally someone got what i meant right! thank you Aeliah...
    What i meant is that some of wizard skills dont have MUCH uses, or just cost too much of chi, or have longs cooldowns for what they do.
    Im not saying we have to get better skills, just having well adjusted from the ones we have.

    -Ice prison is getting pretty much what i wanted, even more really, so we will be able to spam it more often.
    -Manifest virtue, 5min cooldown really! -.- is a nice skill when u have tons of mp, but u cant use it more often, when it can help a lot in 1 vs 1 to increase a spark combo damage for example.
    -soporific whisper is a joke on cooldown, range and duration. at least 2 more secs so we can cast something
    -Barriers (water and fire) will have an upgrade, so at least we will use them, even if it is mostly for pve for not losing p.def, unless we fighting casters, that way we might have a slight advantage over other casters. (and before someone says we are ok and dont need anything, not all wizzies are r9r +12 josd, im not, so when i find a better sharded/refined enemy, is not bad to also have a help)
    -Elemental invocation is nice, but should get less chi cost maybe or less cooldown, nice on TW and NW mostly

    im not saying wizards need more ubber skills or anything, i would just like to use all my skills more often and not running out of chi everytime i cast lol...

    :)
    well that is exactly what I think about..

    :( undine 27Meters(why no 30 m? meh).
    elemental shell, 4 sec , 4 element.
    really really hard to belief it's used for defensive purpose.

    and the other skills:
    how come skill that really have long cooldown give less effective result? (you name it)
    b:infuriated b:chuckle

    I mean this is something that 'what???'
    but not only 1, not only 2, or 3 skill of 'What??'
    b:puzzled
    and then combination of those 'what?? what?? what??' become
    'I not comfortable with this @#$%, Wizards skill need some tweaks'

    but again I'm not QQ-ing here.
    the class is unique.
    debuff from undine is wow.
    spark fire combo is trolololol.
    we were hungering of chi since thousand years ago. lol
  • Pwnallagain - Heavens TearPwnallagain - Heavens Tear Posts: 206 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    LOL @ the main point of this thread. You wizzys have massive p def and damage. you shouldnt complain. Adroit's first post was the most apt response I have ever read.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Dragslave - DreamweaverDragslave - Dreamweaver Posts: 253 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    LOL @ the main point of this thread. You wizzys have massive p def and damage. you shouldnt complain. Adroit's first post was the most apt response I have ever read.

    deficiency to read?
    im not saying wizards need more damage or p.def, im saying we have skills that have stupidly long cooldowns or costs of chi... so either read well, or dont troll a post please
  • Aeliah - DreamweaverAeliah - Dreamweaver Posts: 784 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Try not to mock somebody just because English isn't their first language... so not classy.

    To paraphrase: I think Drag is saying 'most wizard skills are ok, but some of the ones I'd like to use more often have cooldowns that are too long, or chi costs that are too high'.

    Do I agree with this? I'm not sure. I haven't played a wizard all that much. However, I can't see a problem in, say, reducing a few cooldowns from 5 minutes to, say, 2 minutes.

    The one idea I do disagree strongly with is increasing the duration of wizard sleep. 4 seconds is already enough time for wizards with any scrap of -channeling to shoot off an ulti or a spark combo. Making it even longer sounds a bit scary.
    YOUTUBE CHANNEL:
    youtube.com/user/csquaredcsquared

    CLERIC PV GUIDE (complete):
    pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1531411

    CLERIC PK GUIDE (Incomplete):
    pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=18027931
  • DeathProof - DreamweaverDeathProof - Dreamweaver Posts: 109 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with the wizard skills as it is. We probably have the best ability to kite out of any class (apart from Sin stealth, which isn't kiting) and can kill most HA and LA classes quite easily with spark combo. If Ice prison becomes no chi cost, it will be even easier to kill BMs/Barbs close range since a lot of people at least on DW server don't even know what the skill is.
    Long stun + amp -> fire combo = Happy wizzy <3

    I can see some of points Drag made, simply because he's a Demon wizard. That means he will have trouble getting chi, and 2/3 of the 2 spark AOE skills are not as good as the Sage versions. And I guess I do agree on Manifest Virtue, but Elemental Invocation is great on high priority targets.
  • ApocaIypto - DreamweaverApocaIypto - Dreamweaver Posts: 585 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    and before someone says we are ok and dont need anything, not all wizzies are r9r +12 josd, im not, so when i find a better sharded/refined enemy, is not bad to also have a help

    you cant judge a class fighting someone with better gears. if lets say you have to get a skill to fight +12 as +10, what will hapen when you will be +12 yourself?

    moreover, everyclass has skills they dont use because they are too costly or not efficient enough
  • Dragslave - DreamweaverDragslave - Dreamweaver Posts: 253 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    moreover, everyclass has skills they dont use because they are too costly or not efficient enough

    Exactly THAT is the point of the post, whats wrong in wanting to have all usefull skills? if all classes has useless or costly skills, fix them too! i talk about wizzies cause they are the one i care about
  • ApocaIypto - DreamweaverApocaIypto - Dreamweaver Posts: 585 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Exactly THAT is the point of the post, whats wrong in wanting to have all usefull skills? if all classes has useless or costly skills, fix them too! i talk about wizzies cause they are the one i care about

    dont think they care enough
  • Slivaf - DreamweaverSlivaf - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,106 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Exactly THAT is the point of the post, whats wrong in wanting to have all usefull skills? if all classes has useless or costly skills, fix them too! i talk about wizzies cause they are the one i care about

    Perhaps more people would be opened up to the idea if this was reopened for a discussion on just that.... skills that cost too much, or are useless and there for in need of tweaks.

    There is indeed way too many skills that are nigh useless/too heavy in costing chi, etc to be feasibly used in pvp/pve.

    I for one realize some of it (not all of it) is necessary for this or that reason, but there is definitely certain skills that are way too costly/useless to be considered using.
    Ah, Mistakes are so easily made. ~ laura resnick

    What kind of message are you sending when you insult my intelligence? ~ Me ~ 5/29/2015 (Yes it is possible someone said this before just no idea who/where.)
  • Breannak - Raging TideBreannak - Raging Tide Posts: 642 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    ok, im bored so im making a thread, besides i dont see many new wizzies threads,
    so... even though wizzies are one of the highest hitting class in game, i still think we are pretty much screwed comparing to other classes, we have great 79 skills, but crappy 100 ones, morai and AEU are good, but some expensive to use, and since we are an aoe DD class, we could use at least one more ranged (chi free) hit like hailstorm...
    So i was thinking something like:

    Ice prison should cost 1 spark only, or decrease cooldown so we could spam it often
    Yes
    Elemental invocation either needs to cost no chi, or at least have decent damage.
    Not really sure i understand you on that 1?
    Manifest virtue, another useless skill, either take off chi cost, or at least make the increase worth it
    I have that skill now i use it sometimes tho because of the long cool down.
    Soporific whisper... either should last long, or better cast range, or less cooldown, one of those 3 please!
    Amen!
    Tactical and Mortal reversion should work in all maps, not only open map
    pretty useless skills b:surrender
    Will of the phoenix.... knockback to players too!!!! not fair mystics are the only ones who can abuse it
    Maybe.
    And about demon skills... BT should have a better effect... 50% chance of 2x damage???
    I'm sage so n/a
    any thoughts fellow wizzies?

    I really like your suggestions +1 b:dirty
  • Aeliah - DreamweaverAeliah - Dreamweaver Posts: 784 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    I really like your suggestions +1 b:dirty

    Tactical and mortal reversion 'useless'... just lol. Do you have any idea how badly you label yourself 'noob' by saying this? The truth is, these skills are amazing when used properly.
    YOUTUBE CHANNEL:
    youtube.com/user/csquaredcsquared

    CLERIC PV GUIDE (complete):
    pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1531411

    CLERIC PK GUIDE (Incomplete):
    pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=18027931
  • FistToDeath - DreamweaverFistToDeath - Dreamweaver Posts: 482 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Tactical and mortal reversion 'useless'... just lol. Do you have any idea how badly you label yourself 'noob' by saying this? The truth is, these skills are amazing when used properly.

    Tactical is quite useless with all the not working in TW or NW thing, tbh. Mortal is nice but very eventual in NW and TW as well. Both are good for 1x1 mostly in open world pvp, which makes them kinda useless on a PVE server, though.
  • Breannak - Raging TideBreannak - Raging Tide Posts: 642 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Tactical and mortal reversion 'useless'... just lol. Do you have any idea how badly you label yourself 'noob' by saying this? The truth is, these skills are amazing when used properly.

    Still doesn't change my opinion that they are useless, If I can't use them where I want to. Last I check I'm on a PVE server.
  • Adroit - Lost CityAdroit - Lost City Posts: 4,628 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Still doesn't change my opinion that they are useless.

    Tactical and mortal reversions are AMAZING in PvP.. do you just pve or something?
    Youtube Channel: youtube.com/user/D2VeT/videos?flow=grid&view=0
    Current gear: pwcalc.com/6ab2893fbfb080a8
    [SIGPIC]http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=684hgk&s=5[/SIGPIC]
  • AshenSkies - Heavens TearAshenSkies - Heavens Tear Posts: 949 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Still doesn't change my opinion that they are useless, If I can't use them where I want to. Last I check I'm on a PVE server.

    Your opinion is wrong.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    _Surreal_
    Thank you Silvychar for my siggy :)
  • Breannak - Raging TideBreannak - Raging Tide Posts: 642 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Tactical and mortal reversions are AMAZING in PvP.. do you just pve or something?

    Okay so I looked into it.b:surrender

    I have both mortal/tactical reversion when I go pking doesn't seem to work, I guess its because higher soulforce, opponents have. So I'm go with your word on it Adroit that the 2 skill are good in pvp.
    Your opinion is wrong.

    Yes half of it was, again still can't use the skill where I would like to tho.

    To Dragslave: My apologies for not gathering this information sooner.
  • Aeliah - DreamweaverAeliah - Dreamweaver Posts: 784 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Fist+Adroit = 'the skills are very good when they work, but they don't work everywhere, which is annoying'.

    @Adroit, can you see any good reasons for making sure they don't work in TW or NW? Do you think the skills were designed to not work in these instances, or was it accidental?
    YOUTUBE CHANNEL:
    youtube.com/user/csquaredcsquared

    CLERIC PV GUIDE (complete):
    pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1531411

    CLERIC PK GUIDE (Incomplete):
    pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=18027931
  • Adroit - Lost CityAdroit - Lost City Posts: 4,628 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Fist+Adroit = 'the skills are very good when they work, but they don't work everywhere, which is annoying'.

    @Adroit, can you see any good reasons for making sure they don't work in TW or NW? Do you think the skills were designed to not work in these instances, or was it accidental?

    Well, mortal reversion does work everywhere, it is only tactical reversion that only works on the world map. I'm really not exactly sure why tactical wouldn't work in other instances, my best guess is that it is for balance reasons. I could just see things like in nw/tw where several wizards could keep reverting cata pullers or flag carriers back to back so they couldn't really get anywhere.. which would give wizards one of the best CC skills in the game (i.e. ranged nearly instant way to stop someone for 6 seconds that cannot be resisted by faith/anti stun, cannot be purified, and relatively low cd and cost) on top of already being an amazing DD. One of the weaknesses of wizards is the lack of CC, we have trouble stopping people if they are trying to run past us.. so if we were also the most capable class to say.. stop/slow an archer that is speeding anti-stunned to cap point with flag, I think other classes would be a little up in arms why they even exist. Anyway that is just a guess, but I think it does promote a little more teamwork when the support classes are the ones that stop/cc/amp a target, and the DD classes are really only able to DD. Obviously this isn't really as much an issue in world pvp, tactical reversion is primarily used to stop somebody from kiting out of range (kinda falls under something that you'd expect a DD class could do), but those instances where a large part of your team's job is to stop somebody from getting somewhere.. I could see why the devs disabled it.
    Youtube Channel: youtube.com/user/D2VeT/videos?flow=grid&view=0
    Current gear: pwcalc.com/6ab2893fbfb080a8
    [SIGPIC]http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=684hgk&s=5[/SIGPIC]
Sign In or Register to comment.