passive buff protection skill for bms? lvl 100 skill

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · August 2013

As I am sure many of you have seen... I feel bms are by far the most disadvantaged class in mass pvp. They can neither kill with a large amount of realative ease nor do they generally have the resistances to withstand the onslaught of attacks that come their way. Not to mention they can't even truly lockdown their opponents like they used too.

I do not wish to make bms so ridicolously powerful that it just makes them the kings/queens of mass pvp allowing them to one shot everything. I do believe that they should be able to survive better than they currently do... without insane gears to make sure they aren't taking from the mediocre giving to the poor making it so they are both pushing weak stats... especially when purged and they are relying on self buffs. Also I think they should still be vulnerable to all phys/mag reductions skills as well as bleeds.

The only thing they would get from this skill is a better chance to survive in mass pvp by having this passive skill that makes them immuned to all froms of purging of "favorable" buffs.

I for one would one to see this implemented... maybe more bms would come/go back to their bms for nw.

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver · August 2013

You're trolling right b:shocked

Immune to purge.. dafudge

Get faith on your genie for those pesky venos and kite like a **** and request buffs if anything else purges you.

It might seem like only bm's get herpderped when purged but I assure you its every class. If anything the BMs have the best chance of surviving post purge being one of the tankier classes.

Getting facerolled by people that outgear you is still gonna happen buffs or no buffs. Implementing something like would make ENDGAME BMs (full r9rr +12 josd/vit) godlike in mass pvp/pk where sometimes the only way to kill them is to purge.

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · August 2013

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver wrote: »

You're trolling right b:shocked

Immune to purge.. dafudge

Get faith on your genie for those pesky venos and kite like a **** and request buffs if anything else purges you.

It might seem like only bm's get herpderped when purged but I assure you its every class. If anything the BMs have the best chance of surviving post purge being one of the tankier classes.

Getting facerolled by people that outgear you is still gonna happen buffs or no buffs. Implementing something like would make ENDGAME BMs (full r9rr +12 josd/vit) godlike in mass pvp/pk where sometimes the only way to kill them is to purge.

Aye I know its every class that gets pwned once purged... I only meant to give early end game bms a chance to pvp a little. Hince they would NOT be immuned to damage increasing debuffs as well as movement debuffs... unless of course we have will of the bodhista active.

Though you are right it would make true end game bms nigh impossible to take down ... I meant to address that issue by at least mentioning it... though really I think its less oped giving bms something like this than that truly pesky purify proc that r93r casters have... that pwe doesn't want to seem too change. This passive skill that I suggested seems to have far more limits and to me would take more skill to pull of and be effective unlike the aforementioned proc.

EDIT: You are definitely right if they are going to pwn you they will regardless if they are buffed or not... still it would at least allow most early endgame bms a chance to get near... albeit it would make those endgame bms all the more difficult to take down... still the chances of skill/being able to hinder the oped bm would still be insanely more likely than stopping a full R93r +12 all gears caster. At least inmho.

ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver · August 2013

end game bms have 30k+hp, lazy to do the calc but can probably reach 22k+ mag def with magic marrow. hard enough to kill

Marcusbadis - Raging Tide · August 2013

I agree that BMs are the most disadvantaged class in the game, but at the same time many BMs don't understand their class.

BMs are a support class: HF (increases damage), Glacial Spike (reduces defense), Myriad Sword Stance (reduces attack), Roar of the Pride (AOE stun), Blade Hurl (AOE disarms). If anything needs to be added to the BM, i think it is a magic defense buff or add magic defense to Aura of the Golden Bell. Maybe reduce the chi needed for their skills. BMs have to get in close for most of their skills and we can not produce enough chi to get in close and use most of our skills.

BMs require a squad in TW and NW to be effective, unless they are a fist BM, but then they are not a good support and they are less effective then another class at DDing. Fist BMs do not have stealth or the crits of sins, there for sins are better. They don't have range, therefor getting in close on seekers and magic classes is difficult.

If evened geared, a BM is the worst class to be in 1v1, but it is one of the best classes to have in your squad for TW if it is played right. An end game BM with 30k hp has a lot of Vit and can not do much damage to some one that is even geared. 22k magic defense with magic marrow on reduces our physical defense greatly and a sin can pop out of stealth and kill that BM, but if that BM did not have marrow on then the sin would only be scratching him. I know this cause Sins have killed me many times while in magic marrow, but i can take the hits easy with no marrow on. Depending on the level of marrow, it can change our stats from heavy to arcane. Which is great 1v1 vs a magic class, but vs archers, seekers, and clerics who have both physical and magic damage it is worthless.

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Marcusbadis - Raging Tide wrote: »

I agree that BMs are the most disadvantaged class in the game, but at the same time many BMs don't understand their class.

BMs are a support class: HF (increases damage), Glacial Spike (reduces defense), Myriad Sword Stance (reduces attack), Roar of the Pride (AOE stun), Blade Hurl (AOE disarms). If anything needs to be added to the BM, i think it is a magic defense buff or add magic defense to Aura of the Golden Bell. Maybe reduce the chi needed for their skills. BMs have to get in close for most of their skills and we can not produce enough chi to get in close and use most of our skills.

BMs require a squad in TW and NW to be effective, unless they are a fist BM, but then they are not a good support and they are less effective then another class at DDing. Fist BMs do not have stealth or the crits of sins, there for sins are better. They don't have range, therefor getting in close on seekers and magic classes is difficult.

If evened geared, a BM is the worst class to be in 1v1, but it is one of the best classes to have in your squad for TW if it is played right. An end game BM with 30k hp has a lot of Vit and can not do much damage to some one that is even geared. 22k magic defense with magic marrow on reduces our physical defense greatly and a sin can pop out of stealth and kill that BM, but if that BM did not have marrow on then the sin would only be scratching him. I know this cause Sins have killed me many times while in magic marrow, but i can take the hits easy with no marrow on. Depending on the level of marrow, it can change our stats from heavy to arcane. Which is great 1v1 vs a magic class, but vs archers, seekers, and clerics who have both physical and magic damage it is worthless.

Your right about everything you said... I rarely see other bms use all three debuffs that you mentioned... I am one of the rare few who do on my server. I even use the fist ultimate to be able to debuff physical immuned mobs/bosses. Its true bms have some very decent skills if used properly they are still very lackluster in mass pvp...though it is true if you can remain in a group/near each other bms are much more enjoyable hell all classes are that way.

I would love to see bms get buffs to magic res... but tbh I think that is unlikely to happen. I know bms in true endgame gears are extremely difficult to take down... but still I feel that my suggestion isn't as flawed as the casters seem to want to make it out to be. They could still easily be locked down and become a non factor if their opponents are smart enough to keep the bm chiless (so he or she doesn't will of the bodhistva)/from moving too far away to stop their onslaught.

Its not an offensive skill and it can still countered by a majority of the masses.

I also realize this may not be the best solution to "fix" bms in mass pvp... but I and others... many others like me have stopped playing their bms in mass pvp. In my serious and honest opinion something needs to change... for the better for bms if they (pwe) wants an arguably even amount of classes in nw.

ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver · August 2013

http://pwcalc.com/6dbeec0694b8c3d3

quite tanky in my opinion

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · August 2013

ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver wrote: »

http://pwcalc.com/6dbeec0694b8c3d3

quite tanky in my opinion

Apoc... I have not denied that. As I pointed out at least twice now... they could still easily be locked down... also as I said in my most recent post it may not be the best solution to early endgame bms... they still so need some kind of boost. I get they are tanky endgame... but anything before it is quite easy to take down.

I am classifying early end game as mostly g15/g16 +5 I know my gear isn't the greatest and I may not be the best bm to have ever played this game... still I have seen how much bms are targeted in mass pvp and what the exact same gear does for a barb/seeker in mass pvp.

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 · August 2013

Slivaf - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Apoc... I have not denied that. As I pointed out at least twice now... they could still easily be locked down... also as I said in my most recent post it may not be the best solution to early endgame bms... they still so need some kind of boost. I get they are tanky endgame... but anything before it is quite easy to take down.

I am classifying early end game as mostly g15/g16 +5 I know my gear isn't the greatest and I may not be the best bm to have ever played this game... still I have seen how much bms are targeted in mass pvp and what the exact same gear does for a barb/seeker in mass pvp.

Everyone with that gear is easy to take down. As a support class though a BM with that gear can contribute a lot since their stuns and HFs are great at any level. A DD class with that gear would be nearly worthless since they won't be killing anything.

An endgame BM is actually one of the strongest in 1v1 because of their marrows and wide range of control skills. With their weapon disable they are one of the few classes with a counter to the purify proc. I think they are probably 3rd behind wizard and sins. I'm not sure how well they stack up with Barb and cleric, probably on par. At engame 1v1 the bottom is veno, psychic, archer, and mystic. Veno is probably a bit better than the others due to their morai skills and new pet skills.

By the way, if you ever get purged you can just pop a defense pot and instantly get back to fully buffed. Being purged these days just means relying on your genie for a couple of mins to cover your apoth cooldown.

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

Everyone with that gear is easy to take down. As a support class though a BM with that gear can contribute a lot since their stuns and HFs are great at any level. A DD class with that gear would be nearly worthless since they won't be killing anything.
That is assuming they have the chi to do those things, and if they are doing more dying than helping it isn't a very viable option. Also with this exact same gear I fare a lot better on my barb and seeker... because their options are A LOT more friendly to those who go at it alone in mass pvp, not to mention their built in skills are far better than bms for mass pvp. In my honest opinion they are anyways. Ranged for the seeker which is just pure ownage in pvp nigh regardless of what armor/weapon you have on
... and barbs have their haxed *** shields.

Also one more thing I am afraid I yet again exaggerate how often I die on my bm... still its clear as day to me at least how few bms are in NW.

An endgame BM is actually one of the strongest in 1v1 because of their marrows and wide range of control skills. With their weapon disable they are one of the few classes with a counter to the purify proc. I think they are probably 3rd behind wizard and sins. I'm not sure how well they stack up with Barb and cleric, probably on par. At engame 1v1 the bottom is veno, psychic, archer, and mystic. Veno is probably a bit better than the others due to their morai skills and new pet skills.

Aye I am aware that 1 on 1 bms are much more likely to be able to survive... I am talking about mass pvp... I don' t find it fair/cool w/e else you want to say to describe this phenomenon where bms are getting pretty much owned left and right without a group/insane *** gears. Arguably so much so that 90% of them have jumped ship so to speak, and went to another class, and they really aren't badly geared, nor are they that bad of players on them.

EDIT: @ The purify proc tidbit.. and how viable is that option when it is not only a skill that is gotten from one place it isn't a built in skill... (one they had from the beginning) gratned my suggestion wouldn't be either.... not to mention the fact that there are so few bms in nw to combat that pos proc. (meh I so don't want to go on about that proc anymore.) After all that proc isn't why I am even making this suggestion

By the way, if you ever get purged you can just pop a defense pot and instantly get back to fully buffed. Being purged these days just means relying on your genie for a couple of mins to cover your apoth cooldown.

[color]=yellow]Aye we could do that, but that so isn't a built in skill... EVERY other class does quite well imho with either defending themselves, or getting to others before they are seen (sins, and every ranged class). Blademasters in my honest opinion by far have the worse built in skills to combat multiple attacks/getting to others. (Not even leaps are a damn near guaranteed success of getting near others.

Hell my suggestion wouldn't even guarantee it... but it would make it a lot more plausible than it is now.[/color]

Meh other replies in quote... in yellow.

Zsw - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Bms were never meant to be a solo class. If they die soloing in mass pk, thats not the problem. They need to find a squad and stop soloing.

But yeah, nerf purify proc. That pretty much made communicating with each other to lock down a target pointless.

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Zsw - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Bms were never meant to be a solo class. If they die soloing in mass pk, thats not the problem. They need to find a squad and stop soloing.

But yeah, nerf purify proc. That pretty much made communicating with each other to lock down a target pointless.

I don't get why bms can't/shouldn't be able to solo at least a little... like barbs, and seekers can even when they aren't end game though they still die... hell even sins can imo at least. Though that is more to do with their built in skills and not the person behind the character at least imho it doesn't. (It's hard to see/be at 'peace' on a bm when you feel like all you are doing is dying, be it from a one shot, or just being unable to withstand the onslaught of attacks.) EDIT: Though yes generally skill triumphs gear.. but it doesn't hold true for bms. (Marrows is and always has been a double edged sword... one that can get duller as time... more gear progresses but still... before they have epic gear bms are such a joke... and I don't think that... its just me either... people aren't afraid of bms, and most of the time they can be killed with an insane amount of ease regardless of what marrow they have on.)

While my suggestion... can obviously easily be argued against, I still absolutely feel they need some kind of boost. It's not always plausible for everyone to stay together for various reasons during nw, I don't like feeling like I am using my teammates because I don't have any abilities that will truly keep me from getting hammered time and time again.

I know that after reading that long *** thread about the purify proc... bm's are the one class I would prefer not to be on if I was full r93r +12, (1 vs 3+) and the 3ish were anywhere near r93r. Yes i am sure they could do it, but it would be nothing short of a miracle if the bm could pull off that victory. (Though there are obviously far more intangibles to weigh in on than just the gear... still I would NOT like my odds)

Eoria - Harshlands · August 2013

Stop playing a BM and reroll to something else for mass PVP then.

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Been there done that... solves nothing for the bm class. If nothing changes and for the better for bms their will be so few bms in mass pvp ppl will question if they even still exist, and questioning why/where they have gone.

ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Slivaf - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Been there done that... solves nothing for the bm class. If nothing changes and for the better for bms their will be so few bms in mass pvp ppl will question if they even still exist, and questioning why/where they have gone.

problem is, if you boost bm for "average" gears, they will become insane at end game.

some classes are good at 1v1, some at small group pk, some at mass pvp

Zanryu - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Nobody wants BMs to receive buffs of any kind. They're "fine" as is, and nothing should be done to improve them. Honestly BMs need some way of either: getting combos off for less than a minimum of two sparks or being able to fly on the wings of an angel. I want the first. BMs are the most chi starved class you'll find, a BM without chi is literally useless. A BM that uses HF/GS and doesn't get the kill is useless. It can do literally nothing to kill you. Unless you know.. you're undergeared and it gets a delicious zerk crit.

If they had some way of landing killing combos without the need for insane amounts of chi I'd be a happy camper, Seekers can do it for less than half a spark, Archers can do it for a fairly low cost, Wizards take two sparks for their most well known combo and that's MUCH more effective. The list goes on. BMs are pretty much limited to getting a well timed Blade Tornado off or being able to HF/GS in a stunloop while the opponent's genie is on cooldown, which is difficult to do in the first place because our un-amped damage is easily tanked by just about anything. Let's not forget that stuns can be broken for minimal genie cost, allowing for a few things:

1) Stun evasion throughout and counter CC forcing the BM to waste chi/genie to stay alive

2) Belief/AD/Expel during HF/GS

3) Stunbreak the HF/GS

Pretty much for however the fight lasts. If you play even a shred defensively then you could very well survive a BM all day err day.

Slivaf - Dreamweaver · August 2013

ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver wrote: »

problem is, if you boost bm for "average" gears, they will become insane at end game.

some classes are good at 1v1, some at small group pk, some at mass pvp

Aye apoc I have at the very least implied I already know that.... still you could give bms a shield like invoke that would work far better than marrows do... but imho it would need to be low chi cost and highish cooldown... or make it take chi and give bms a more plausible way of getting chi to be able to use it.

I for one would prefer my idea over just shields/chi skills thrown towards bm.... despite how flawed it MAY be.

ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver · August 2013

well way to get chi, or use less chi would be good i think. but a shield, no. look what they did to improve/buff some classes that looked weak. clerics and barbs. barbs are the tankiest and ofc its normal. but it makes them very strong in 1v1 pk with r9rr and zerk weap.
same thing for clerics, they have lot of shields to protect themselves in group pvp, but this, added to sleep/sog and morai healing absorb skills, make them strong in 1v1.

thats the problem with a rpg, a buff at low lvl might sounds fine, but at high lvl will be either useless or too strong.

passive buff protection skill for bms? lvl 100 skill

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