Why did a lot of people leave Perfect World?

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver · August 2013

HyperNoob - Sanctuary wrote: »

playerbase before pack & ranksales was much bigger and less greedy, dont need to be an analist to say that b:bye

did it monetize better? having chickens isn't enough, they have to produce eggs.

GlenRoss - Archosaur · August 2013

HyperNoob - Sanctuary wrote: »

playerbase before pack & ranksales was much bigger and less greedy, dont need to be an analist to say that b:bye

How are the players greedy? Because they seek the best deal they can get? Don't we all?

Not necessarily referring to the above post but why do these threads always boil down to class warfare and condemnation of the way other people choose to play? If someone has R9, why assume bad things about how they got it? I have rrr9 and I worked my butt off for it over the past 3 years. That's not to say that I've spent zero real money on the game but I defy anyone to say that I bought my way up.

There's no shame in farming. There's no shame in spending some money on the game. It's the only way the game continues to exist. And there's no shame in having less gear than the next guy. There are plenty of people with better gear than mine. I can live with that ...... but will continue to work up toward better gear.

QQing about the success of others is lame. QQing about a business trying to stay in business is lame. Disagree with their choices but understand that no matter what choice they make it will always rankle someone who knows a "better" way to have done it.

Now go, play ..... and have fun. It's why we're here ..... or at least it should be why.

HeavenxDoom - Lost City · August 2013

GlenRoss - Archosaur wrote: »

How are the players greedy? Because they seek the best deal they can get? Don't we all?

Not necessarily referring to the above post but why do these threads always boil down to class warfare and condemnation of the way other people choose to play? If someone has R9, why assume bad things about how they got it? I have rrr9 and I worked my butt off for it over the past 3 years. That's not to say that I've spent zero real money on the game but I defy anyone to say that I bought my way up.

There's no shame in farming. There's no shame in spending some money on the game. It's the only way the game continues to exist. And there's no shame in having less gear than the next guy. There are plenty of people with better gear than mine. I can live with that ...... but will continue to work up toward better gear.

QQing about the success of others is lame. QQing about a business trying to stay in business is lame. Disagree with their choices but understand that no matter what choice they make it will always rankle someone who knows a "better" way to have done it.

Now go, play ..... and have fun. It's why we're here ..... or at least it should be why.

sorry but game did not have r9 or r8 when it come out and the server was not dying
it ws doing great selling cosmetic stuff

GlenRoss - Archosaur · August 2013

HeavenxDoom - Lost City wrote: »

sorry but game did not have r9 or r8 when it come out and the server was not dying
it ws doing great selling cosmetic stuff

Correlation does not equal causality.

Mayfly - Dreamweaver · August 2013

The only thing we really know re: pre-pack relative to post-pack is that gold prices were lower. Whether this is because more people were selling gold (increased supply depressing prices) or fewer people were buying it (decreased demand depressing prices), and how that relates to zen sales if it does at all (some zen is used by the original purchaser in the boutique, and never enters the gold market), is information that isn't public, and most likely never will be.

HeavenxDoom - Lost City · August 2013

all i know it worked before op gear,packs with just cosmetics there for rest i pure greed

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Mayfly - Dreamweaver wrote: »

The only thing we really know re: pre-pack relative to post-pack is that gold prices were lower. Whether this is because more people were selling gold (increased supply depressing prices) or fewer people were buying it (decreased demand depressing prices), and how that relates to zen sales if it does at all (some zen is used by the original purchaser in the boutique, and never enters the gold market), is information that isn't public, and most likely never will be.

there is also an inflation factor (especially since packs give BLT). while I wasn't playing when gold was 100k, people sya that back then 50k for a res scroll was a big deal; when gold was 400k I remember that I could easily farm 300k in 1h; now I can easily farm ~1.3m in one hour.

HeavenxDoom - Lost City wrote: »

all i know it worked before op gear,packs with just cosmetics there for rest i pure greed

you can't know if it worked. initially a company makes an investment and isn't profitable from day 1. for all we know, they could be losing money till they made packs.

DATALEC - Dreamweaver · August 2013

I agree with most of the reasons posted,leaving a game after a certain amount of time is always the case after all once youve done everything there is to do theres no reason to play.
Ok some people come on still to chat or do dailys then log off some make alts to try those since you can make a lvl 100 toon easy now.Which brings the point of why there
is not many new players or why lower lvl people get no help now if your new and dont
know anyone its hard to find people to help you since 80%+ of the player base are alts
of hi level people.Unless you can cash and pay for fc your going to struggle.
Constant sales are a problem pre pack it was a sale for a week then no sale maybe for a month so people with coin would buy the sale item sell it later for profit.
Now theres a sale on all the time and no much point in selling items since why bother there going to be onsale again soon. Having short sales that last one week then no sale for a month was an insentive to farm coin for the next sale and invest that farmed coin to make more but now with a constant sale of all the hi end items like r.orbs/mog/gst there basically saying go charge and buy r9 no work required.
Not alot can be done now to change things the damage is done biggest reason for people leaving PWI wanted more profit so they made the game easyer for cash players
which in turn made none-cashers leave the game knock on effect some of those none cashers had cash friends those cash friends left coz there friends left..
And yeah GM's in game would be nice maybe stop the 1000 bots out there which is another reason people leave why farm ya *** off when u know joe bloggs is botting 50m a day

Kinjeto - Raging Tide · August 2013

WannaBM - Archosaur wrote: »

Waste a lot of time on a game, always trying te get better equipment day in day out.

Realise you are just wasting your life on a game.

Blame the game and QQ about the direction of updates or whatever.

Or indeed, you probably logged in shortly after an update because even though at times we realise the futility of spendig our days on a game, most of us keep doing it anyway.

Yeah the realization that nothing (super end game -- if you want to call it that) is achieveable for the F2P players (losing potential customers) or the players that spend only a bit of cash just to unlock their inventory and bank (or even pet slots). Since you can create lots of characters. But everything gear wise has to be merchanted off people who open packs.

Hence the additionally the "Pay for Power cash shop" not the "Pay for Convenience cash shop

Then there is the whole buying of health in the form of charms. That is hardly a "convenience" when you need/require them to run dungeons. The pots in-game don't even cover a lot of that bullcrap.

Unless they merchant and leave their computer on. That a player can't just play the game and get end-game gear (considering everyone in some ways likes to have this mythical end-game/endgame achievement these days. I am not saying super end game isn't achieveable, but the access is very sub-par.

I understand a company has to make money and all but a lot of the things should be achieve-able on an either or basis. If it takes 2500 stones to make 1 Diamond of Tiger then all right. But these things just aren't really avaliable to everyone. It is just all the packs.

Not to forget to mention that you also have a youtube channel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqUkvrZ5lvo&feature=c4-overview-vl&list=PL32E66E4F04CEE08B

Which you are under utilizing and not using to communicate with your community of players.
http://www.twitch.tv/perfectworld_community/profile

Do you even have a community manager? Where did Frankie go? Oh yeah -- you fired him (or he moved on.)

You've got the youtube channel and you've got the twitch account, why aren't you using them?

Also do your daily events take people back 'into the world' you created or just back into the instanced dungeons? Well so far instanced dungeons, not the "actual world" minus the 'Paperclip' (as people call it on PWI) quest.

Kittennice - Heavens Tear · August 2013

1. Pw had much better service and fun things to do before everyone grew greedy causing rage quitters (The packs were promised to be only a temp thing and we were lied to)

2. School / Real life

3. Found a better game

4. Lost interest

5. Friends quit, they quit

WannaBM - Archosaur · August 2013

What is the problem with the packs ?

PWI needs money. Quite a lot of money.

Packs have gambling element in them. Some people like gambling so they overpay for those packs. Helping PWI get lots of money.

People who dont have this gambling issue buy the items they need from the open market for prices much better than the chances * pack price would dictate.

If they did not do this, they could probably sell the items directly in the boutique, but prices would be higher than they are with the current market economy. Most likely very few people would be willing to pay for the items and PWI might even fail to get enough income to pay their bills.

The only one who is disadvantaged here is the one who likes to gamble and loses money on the packs. All others only gain

bluestuffzzz · August 2013

WannaBM - Archosaur wrote: »

What is the problem with the packs ?

PWI needs money. Quite a lot of money.

Packs have gambling element in them. Some people like gambling so they overpay for those packs. Helping PWI get lots of money.

People who dont have this gambling issue buy the items they need from the open market for prices much better than the chances * pack price would dictate.

If they did not do this, they could probably sell the items directly in the boutique, but prices would be higher than they are with the current market economy. Most likely very few people would be willing to pay for the items and PWI might even fail to get enough income to pay their bills.

The only one who is disadvantaged here is the one who likes to gamble and loses money on the packs. All others only gain

Problems with packs?

1.) With the anniversary pack being established in the market, -int gear became reasonable and around this time it was the main mechanic. This essentially hindered your abilities of making coins unless you (at the time) were -int.

2.) Packs provide gear that should be farmed. How is pressing my right mouse button after charging my digits (credit card) a form of earning my gear? The point of any game is to play, but PWE has a different sense of this word.

3.) Fashion became accessible in more recent packs. Along with mounts and flyers for quite some time. When there is such an insignificant chance of obtaining them, the price of it becomes reliant on how many people are currently opening packs and winning the item. Normally? 150m for a flyer/mount, and 50m for the fashion set. Lol?

4.) The tokens of best luck from the packs keep gold elevated, making gold more expensive for normal players. Having two tokens of best luck (~5m a pop) can be transferred into a 10m big note. Here's the problem: That's a flat 10m. Meaning, the price of those tokens can't ever be lower than 5m a pop, and every time someone turns this into a big note, it pushes 10m coins out of thin air - wrecking the economy slowly over time (inflation).

5.) Some gear is only accessible through packs. How is that playing the game for your gear, or earning it? The point of the game is to go through a series of (often repetitive) events to earn a set (or pieces) of gear. If the gear is only obtainable in packs, then there is no way to farm the gear at all.

Haila - Sanctuary · August 2013

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »

did it monetize better? having chickens isn't enough, they have to produce eggs.

So you are saying pwe got rid of those chickens who dont lay eggs aka free to play players XD
Bad potatoe b:shutup

GlenRoss - Archosaur · August 2013

Every time I read the word "greedy", I'm going to move on to the next post. Buzzwords and class warfare are losing arguments.

Kinjeto - Raging Tide · August 2013

GlenRoss - Archosaur wrote: »

Every time I read the word "greedy", I'm going to move on to the next post. Buzzwords and class warfare are losing arguments.

Every time I look at a game that has concepts like "power creep cash shop" and not "convenience & cosmetic cash shop" I see another dead MMOG. b:laugh

Apostasy - Raging Tide · August 2013

Hunt - Raging Tide wrote:

if you make content/sales more player friendly will be more players,and yes,you'll get more profit from a lot of players buying small things than few players selling their houses to buy r9

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »

is that your expect opinion as a game producer/analyst?

They do not need to be an expert to understand very simple things.

As far as "content/sales more player friendly" goes... PWE should at least figure out the costs of playing their game on the basis of the average amount of money the average player can afford. But nope... PWE bases their game costs on what rich people can afford when you really look at the costs of everything. Now of course, if the average player took their ENTIRE year's paycheck... then MAYBE, they could afford to compete at the top. Most people, apparently outside of your little bubble (which must look like some of these other peoples' little bubbles, which are the minority of players in the rpg mmo world of players mind you), can not afford what amounts to ridiculous prices that PWE apparently expects the average player to fork over to enjoy the full content of their game.

GlenRoss - Archosaur wrote: »

There's no shame in farming. There's no shame in spending some money on the game. It's the only way the game continues to exist. And there's no shame in having less gear than the next guy. There are plenty of people with better gear than mine. I can live with that ...... but will continue to work up toward better gear.

QQing about the success of others is lame. QQing about a business trying to stay in business is lame. Disagree with their choices but understand that no matter what choice they make it will always rankle someone who knows a "better" way to have done it.

Now go, play ..... and have fun. It's why we're here ..... or at least it should be why.

Of course there is no shame in farming or dropping real money into a game... However, the company PWE goes WELL above and beyond just keeping their business running and WELL beyond maintaining profits as being a business. Now of course they need to make a profit, but the game is barely continuing to exist based on just observing populations over the last year or two especially. It amounts to my above reply to potato. And again, you would be right as far as no shame in having lesser gears than the next person. However, when you spend what amounts to OBSCENE amounts of money compared to other games and still can not fully be competitive with the next person... then there is a problem.

The average player or majority of players, do not have enough income to enjoy this game... that majority is crucial for a game to sustain a healthy life. PWE has MORE than neglected this majority. So it does amount to a "better" way... as in do not neglect the majority of the world population of players... or keep your rich peoples' club and stick it... SEE? b:question

It is the reason why, although people like myself will likely continue to play PWI for a while longer, we will continue to spend less and less until the day comes that we leave. And the only reason we can stay is due to our having characters that are already built up and competitive enough so far, so we can. But what about people that are not built up? Oh yeah, "**** them," right?

This game does have great potential due to the aspects it has, but that will not be enough to stay eventually... and when that time comes, another PWE game is not going to be our next stop in the rpg mmo industry at all.

PS ... Still waiting...

Decus - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Eh, I'd rather be a **** than **** like you

Comments like this coming from someone who mentions "logic" in any way shape or form is quite amusing. Here is a question for you, since your sig states enough that makes you "sound" like maybe you understand math...

How does math apply to science? b:question b:sin

You still have not answered the question... I am gonna take a bet that it is because you do not know the answer. I actually had to explain it to a 4.0 math major, so you do not need to be ashamed. Add to that, even Steven Hawking has not figured out the answer to that question. And being you likely will not answer the question or just can not... the rest of the self-proclaimed science/math geniuses can feel free to help him. I already know he needs it b:chuckle

bobyjoee · August 2013

toks are basically non existant on my server and if they are they are 18k, gold prices are rising as if they arent already high enough, pwi creating all these bonus zen offers and charge point rewards... its all over...b:surprised

Kinjeto - Raging Tide · August 2013

Apostasy - Raging Tide wrote: »

They do not need to be an expert to understand very simple things.

Of course there is no shame in farming or dropping real money into a game... However, the company PWE goes WELL above and beyond just keeping their business running and WELL beyond maintaining profits as being a business. Now of course they need to make a profit, but the game is barely continuing to exist based on just observing populations over the last year or two especially. It amounts to my above reply to potato. And again, you would be right as far as no shame in having lesser gears than the next person. However, when you spend what amounts to OBSCENE amounts of money compared to other games and still can not fully be competitive with the next person... then there is a problem.

The average player or majority of players, do not have enough income to enjoy this game... that majority is crucial for a game to sustain a healthy life. PWE has MORE than neglected this majority. So it does amount to a "better" way... as in do not neglect the majority of the world population of players... or keep your rich peoples' club and stick it... SEE? b:question

It is the reason why, although people like myself will likely continue to play PWI for a while longer, we will continue to spend less and less until the day comes that we leave. And the only reason we can stay is due to our having characters that are already built up and competitive enough so far, so we can. But what about people that are not built up? Oh yeah, "**** them," right?

This game does have great potential due to the aspects it has, but that will not be enough to stay eventually... and when that time comes, another PWE game is not going to be our next stop in the rpg mmo industry at all.

This totally, also the bonus ZEN offers say the last of the cow is being milked for all it's worth.

darknessofmy · August 2013

Kinjeto - Raging Tide wrote: »

This totally, also the bonus ZEN offers say the last of the cow is being milked for all it's worth.

spend or gto

Kinjeto - Raging Tide · August 2013

darknessofmy wrote: »

spend or gto

Another boring anonymous random troll. Why not use your main account? b:laugh
No balls? Yeah pretty much sums it up. Can't even use the term "gtfo" either.

But then again, this anonymous thing pretty much sums up where the community is going if it isn't there already (what is left of it). I feel if I was a 'new player' I wouldn't want to be treated like this or even if say I was a returning player.

Mayfly - Dreamweaver · August 2013

There have been bonus zen offers since before packs.

darknessofmy · August 2013

Kinjeto - Raging Tide wrote: »

Another boring anonymous random troll. Why not use your main account? b:laugh
No balls? Yeah pretty much sums it up. Can't even use the term "gtfo" either.

But then again, this anonymous thing pretty much sums up where the community is going if it isn't there already (what is left of it). I feel if I was a 'new player' I wouldn't want to be treated like this or even if say I was a returning player.

grow up or gto

Apostasy - Raging Tide · August 2013

darknessofmy wrote: »

spend or gtFo

darknessofmy wrote: »

grow up or gtFo

fixxed... now take your own advice b:bye

HeavenxDoom - Lost City · August 2013

is darknessofmy potatos alt main cos i swear bouth hide behind the alts

cant show mains

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver · August 2013

bluestuffzzz wrote: »

2.) Packs provide gear that should be farmed. How is pressing my right mouse button after charging my digits (credit card) a form of earning my gear? The point of any game is to play, but PWE has a different sense of this word.

potatoes should also be farmed

Haila - Sanctuary wrote: »

So you are saying pwe got rid of those chickens who dont lay eggs aka free to play players XD
Bad potatoe b:shutup

well in theory you want to keep all the chickens since chickens attract more chickens b:avoid

Apostasy - Raging Tide wrote: »

They do not need to be an expert to understand very simple things.

but you need to be an expert to realise that those very simple things are bull****.

GlenRoss - Archosaur · August 2013

Apostasy - Raging Tide wrote: »

Of course there is no shame in farming or dropping real money into a game... However, the company PWE goes WELL above and beyond just keeping their business running and WELL beyond maintaining profits as being a business.

You know their profit margin? I'm curious as to how you've decided how much they need? And may I see one of your pay stubs so that I may determine whether you are making more than I decide that you need?

The vilifying of for-profit business has become a world-wide religion. Please look at the basic economics of how and why businesses exist and don't depend on pop-culture condemnation of easy, ambiguous targets.

Now of course they need to make a profit, but the game is barely continuing to exist based on just observing populations over the last year or two especially.

So how does this work in the real world? They're making too much profit but barely continuing to exist?

It amounts to my above reply to potato. And again, you would be right as far as no shame in having lesser gears than the next person. However, when you spend what amounts to OBSCENE amounts of money compared to other games and still can not fully be competitive with the next person... then there is a problem.

I don't like seeing people buy their way to the top but that's the design of the game. I work my butt off to keep up, settle for second best or I quit. But in the end, I'm responsible for me and don't require other people be brought down to my level.

The average player or majority of players, do not have enough income to enjoy this game

Nonsense. A great many players enjoy the game without matching gears with the top-end players. Enjoyment of the game is within the player, not within the money.

... that majority is crucial for a game to sustain a healthy life. PWE has MORE than neglected this majority. So it does amount to a "better" way... as in do not neglect the majority of the world population of players... or keep your rich peoples' club and stick it... SEE? b:question

The fallacy is in thinking that the forum screeds represent the player mainstream. My (anecdotal, of course) experience is that most of us have some issues with the way things are done but are generally happy and enjoying the game. Certainly it irks me to see "credit card babies" who skip the work and max out their gears but they owe me nothing. PW owes me nothing, as far as leveling the playing field. In this regard, PW is like real life. I have to do my own thing and not worry about others having more than me.

It is the reason why, although people like myself will likely continue to play PWI for a while longer, we will continue to spend less and less until the day comes that we leave. And the only reason we can stay is due to our having characters that are already built up and competitive enough so far, so we can.

You are correct. This is your prerogative. I have a similar criterion. I will play until I no longer find it to be fun, then I'll leave. I won't worry about money or time spent though. Anything I spend here is just money that would otherwise go toward buying the next fps game. I don't spend anything I'm unwilling to walk away from.

But what about people that are not built up? Oh yeah, "**** them," right?

I hope you're not projecting that attitude onto me. It's been a pretty good discussion and I'd hate to see it lowered to that level. The ones not yet built up can follow the same path, often with my help. I don't seem them as making a difference in this particular discussion.

This game does have great potential due to the aspects it has, but that will not be enough to stay eventually... and when that time comes, another PWE game is not going to be our next stop in the rpg mmo industry at all.

One of the great things about this is we only have to stay as long was we want to stay and play.

Side note: You make some good arguments. Don't get bogged down with name-callers and those who offer emotion in lieu of reasoned discourse. Ad hominems don't move the ball forward. Those posts/posters should be ignored.

Thanks for good debate.

thumbs · August 2013

summer break; they should be returning soon.

SylenThunder - Twilight Temple · August 2013

thumbs wrote: »

summer break; they should be returning soon.

Three years ago Summer break was best TW season ever

Decus - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Apostasy - Raging Tide wrote: »

PS ... Still waiting...

Comments like this coming from someone who mentions "logic" in any way shape or form is quite amusing. Here is a question for you, since your sig states enough that makes you "sound" like maybe you understand math...

How does math apply to science? b:question b:sin

You still have not answered the question... I am gonna take a bet that it is because you do not know the answer. I actually had to explain it to a 4.0 math major, so you do not need to be ashamed. Add to that, even Steven Hawking has not figured out the answer to that question. And being you likely will not answer the question or just can not... the rest of the self-proclaimed science/math geniuses can feel free to help him. I already know he needs it b:chuckle

I was on vacation.

I don't really peruse the forums much anymore though, so my interest in posting has sort of waned.

In my admittedly amateurish experience with mathematics, I'd say math is a tool like any other. That's like asking how does grammar apply to literature. Allow me to clarify, though. I'm not a mathematician nor have I ever said I was "good" or claimed to have any proficiency in mathematics. I just didn't like the stereotype that only archers studied it. Hence the sig. Math was always and continues to be quite beautiful to me. I enjoy math in the same way I enjoy cooking. It's just something I do. It is not my career nor my field of study. I don't see where I ever proclaimed to be a "genius" so I'm not sure why you lump me into that category. Congrats on explaining it to a math major though. I guess you're proud of it, so yay?

I'd welcome the help though, since I'm not an expert at math and stuff

Why did a lot of people leave Perfect World?

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