Seekers: What class do you struggle with the most in PvP?

Zheii - Archosaur · July 2013

So recently I've been spending a lot of time trying to improve my knowledge of other classes so that I can combat them better on my seeker.

I'm learning new stuff and getting a lot better but I still struggle with a few classes, Clerics being the main one.
For a seeker I honestly think they are one of the hardest classes to fight because of our lack of ability to lock them down, our inability to heal and remove arrays and our very low chance to avoid GoS.
I've found the only way to win is to tank/survive/be on the defensive and attack in the gap between being slept and sealed (when they attack you) and then relying on a lucky zerk crit...
And I mean very lucky, basically the only skill that can one shot is Gemini and that's only if you get them without Winged/Pious/Guardian.
(btw I'm talking fully decked out end game classes here, like +12/JoSD vs +12/JoSD; an even match in gear.)

So;

What class(es) do you have trouble with and why? And how do you take them down?

Feel free to also share pk stories if it helps to explain why you have trouble with a certain class!

_tannerru_ - Archosaur · July 2013

Clerics are not that difficult, Just do what I do and either make one of all classes to learn animations and such. Or two, for your case particularly go fight Auer and Ahns. I use to PK countless times with both of them. So much fun, and it's really the only way to get any better.

Zheii - Archosaur · July 2013

_tannerru_ - Archosaur wrote: »

Clerics are not that difficult, Just do what I do and either make one of all classes to learn animations and such. Or two, for your case particularly go fight Auer and Ahns. I use to PK countless times with both of them. So much fun, and it's really the only way to get any better.

I know most of the skill animations, and I can actually play basic cleric (I'm not a very good one cause my reaction time isn't fast enough because I haven't played long enough but I sorta know what i'm doing XD)
Also; I have pked with Auer, 1v1ed and such. But I still struggle with the cleric class.
+You didn't really tell me HOW to take one down

?

Kniraven - Lost City · July 2013

Immobilize with genie skills as well as your own control skills. Things like whirlwind or occult depending on your genie setup.

Get heart of steel if you're having trouble surviving them, it basically makes clerics useless since they rely heavily on setting up combos by sleeping you and this gives it plenty of time to cool down after using it. It is also very handy against archers.

Attack in tandem with edged blur as it completely bypasses their plume shell.

Don't forget to use your auto-attacks, you use a god of frenzy melee weapon and they are a robe class.

Zanryu - Dreamweaver · July 2013

Kniraven - Lost City wrote: »

Immobilize with genie skills as well as your own control skills. Things like whirlwind or occult depending on your genie setup.

Get heart of steel if you're having trouble surviving them, it basically makes clerics useless since they rely heavily on setting up combos by sleeping you and this gives it plenty of time to cool down after using it. It is also very handy against archers.

Attack in tandem with edged blur as it completely bypasses their plume shell.

Don't forget to use your auto-attacks, you use a god of frenzy melee weapon and they are a robe class.

Too bad Purify is a thing. No, not Purify Spell, Purify. Oh wait, there's Purify Spell too.

During a fight against a Seeker the Cleric has ample time to set up Plume Shell at almost any given moment simply because they can't lock very well. Even with HoS it can be hard to tank a Cleric out because of just how much they can lock you down.

Try putting Adrenaline Surge on your genie to break the SoG>Chromatic Seal combo. Sleep will get put on cooldown and you'll be free to attack for at least 15 seconds. Edged Blur is a good idea, even without Shell being up. Combine that with your stun proc or your pet's stun. Be careful of the Cleric's Belief though. If they haven't used anything costly chances are it's at the ready. Find a way to break through that then go for the kill. I don't play Seeker much, or Cleric, so perhaps I can't offer a whole lot of advice but you know me. Helpful as always.

Zheii - Archosaur · July 2013

Kniraven - Lost City wrote: »

Immobilize with genie skills as well as your own control skills. Things like whirlwind or occult depending on your genie setup.

Get heart of steel if you're having trouble surviving them, it basically makes clerics useless since they rely heavily on setting up combos by sleeping you and this gives it plenty of time to cool down after using it. It is also very handy against archers.

Attack in tandem with edged blur as it completely bypasses their plume shell.

Don't forget to use your auto-attacks, you use a god of frenzy melee weapon and they are a robe class.

Immobilizing isn't useful against a cleric that doesn't kite (making whirlwind useless) :P
seekers have... 3 control skills? and Heart-seeker isn't even counted against a cleric that doesn't kite. Void Step costs a spark, oh and I forgot ParchedBlade dance, but that doesn't even go off most of the time and you only have a very small window with that.
I always have HoS on my genie I fight other seekers and archers way too often to not have it, of course I also use it in 1v1s against clerics.
I can surive them until they get a lucky crit then it's game over.
Using Edged Blur on a cleric is a way to instantly get them to kite and if you're trying to get them locked down with Parched Blaade that's not what you want, + ED is mag and most clerics have an insane amount of mag def, so it's not going to be all that effective.

Auto attacking anything these days is pretty much useless. you can do 5x as much damage with a skill that takes less than a second to cast. Plus any decent cleric is going to puri proc and run for the hills as soon as you try that.

@Zambie thanks for the suggestions hun, I'll give it a shot, I usually don't use pets in PvP because I don't have Archangels yet.
AEU hates me q-q.

Also Guys this thread isn't just about my problem with clerics it's about other seekers problems with whatever class they have problems with, STOP FOCUSING IT ALL ON ME DAMNIT T_T

DionDagger - Dreamweaver · July 2013

Zheii - Archosaur wrote: »

Immobilizing isn't useful against a cleric that doesn't kite (making whirlwind useless) :P
seekers have... 3 control skills? and Heart-seeker isn't even counted against a cleric that doesn't kite. Void Step costs a spark, oh and I forgot ParchedBlade dance, but that doesn't even go off most of the time and you only have a very small window with that.
I always have HoS on my genie I fight other seekers and archers way too often to not have it, of course I also use it in 1v1s against clerics.
I can surive them until they get a lucky crit then it's game over.
Using Edged Blur on a cleric is a way to instantly get them to kite and if you're trying to get them locked down with Parched Blaade that's not what you want, + ED is mag and most clerics have an insane amount of mag def, so it's not going to be all that effective.

Auto attacking anything these days is pretty much useless. you can do 5x as much damage with a skill that takes less than a second to cast. Plus any decent cleric is going to puri proc and run for the hills as soon as you try that.

@Zambie thanks for the suggestions hun, I'll give it a shot, I usually don't use pets in PvP because I don't have Archangels yet.
AEU hates me q-q.

Also Guys this thread isn't just about my problem with clerics it's about other seekers problems with whatever class they have problems with, STOP FOCUSING IT ALL ON ME DAMNIT T_T

And that's why most seekers are bad. You ever wondered why using a stance lowers the proc rate of skills? Because the stance proc was mainly meant for auto attacks, which most herp-a-derp seekers dont seem to use. Proc a stun>edged blur>blade affinity> gemini. One dead cleric.

Kniraven - Lost City · July 2013

Zheii - Archosaur wrote: »

Immobilizing isn't useful against a cleric that doesn't kite (making whirlwind useless) :P
seekers have... 3 control skills? and Heart-seeker isn't even counted against a cleric that doesn't kite. Void Step costs a spark, oh and I forgot ParchedBlade dance, but that doesn't even go off most of the time and you only have a very small window with that.
I always have HoS on my genie I fight other seekers and archers way too often to not have it, of course I also use it in 1v1s against clerics.
I can surive them until they get a lucky crit then it's game over.
Using Edged Blur on a cleric is a way to instantly get them to kite and if you're trying to get them locked down with Parched Blaade that's not what you want, + ED is mag and most clerics have an insane amount of mag def, so it's not going to be all that effective.

Auto attacking anything these days is pretty much useless. you can do 5x as much damage with a skill that takes less than a second to cast. Plus any decent cleric is going to puri proc and run for the hills as soon as you try that.

@Zambie thanks for the suggestions hun, I'll give it a shot, I usually don't use pets in PvP because I don't have Archangels yet.
AEU hates me q-q.

Also Guys this thread isn't just about my problem with clerics it's about other seekers problems with whatever class they have problems with, STOP FOCUSING IT ALL ON ME DAMNIT T_T

If clerics aren't kiting on your server, and you are losing to them, then either they heavily outgear you or you're just bad...

Of course they kite when you use edged blur, that's because it hurts. It bypasses their shields and defense levels. This is the best time to take advantage of your control skills such as your 1 spark stun. You wait for them to use a genie skill to put it on cooldown for a, bit, tele-stun to them, edged blur and **** face with physical attacks.

Good ways to get them to waste their genie are to use the tried and true sacrificial slash + quid pro quo combo, or to avoid their second sleep/seal skill while the first is still on cd which will quickly put them on the defensive.

Finally, auto attacks are perfectly viable for a seeker to use on an AA. You wield a god of frenzy melee weapon with high patk.

You asked for ideas to improve, perhaps you should go try out the suggested strategies before disregarding them for not being what you are used to. Clearly what you are doing already is not effective, or you wouldn't be here.

I play a full +10 third cast seeker in TW every week and pvp on it daily.

Zanryu - Dreamweaver · July 2013

Kniraven - Lost City wrote: »

If clerics aren't kiting on your server, and you are losing to them, then either they heavily outgear you or you're just bad...

Of course they kite when you use edged blur, that's because it hurts. It bypasses their shields and defense levels. This is the best time to take advantage of your control skills such as your 1 spark stun. You wait for them to use a genie skill to put it on cooldown for a, bit, tele-stun to them, edged blur and **** face with physical attacks.

Good ways to get them to waste their genie are to use the tried and true sacrificial slash + quid pro quo combo, or to avoid their second sleep/seal skill while the first is still on cd which will quickly put them on the defensive.

Finally, auto attacks are perfectly viable for a seeker to use on an AA. You wield a god of frenzy melee weapon with high patk.

You asked for ideas to improve, perhaps you should go try out the suggested strategies before disregarding them for not being what you are used to. Clearly what you are doing already is not effective, or you wouldn't be here.

I play a full +10 third cast seeker in TW every week and pvp on it daily.

Finally, its no wonder you're having trouble when you don't know what your own skills do.

You are wrong, Edged Blur is not a magic attack. It is a physical attack which also does additional metal damage. Not only is it a physical attack which bypasses Shields and Defense Levels, it also does not activate your opponents purifyspell proc. Finally, you can deal additional physical attacks as I have already suggested, while it is up. This makes it very easy to bypass a charm if you can keep them in place, again, with control skills.

The thing about the QPQ combo is it gives the Cleric ample time to:

A) Use Will Surge over Belief and Purify the debuffs before Gemini can hit.

Use Wind shield and tank out even a zerk crit
C) Use a Pdef charm to reduce the incoming Gemini Slash to half damage
D) Any combination of the above

Chances are they're gonna use a charm, use windshield, do both, or Will Surge > Purify. On a high mag/vit genie they'll be able to Belief again very soon. Also, keep in mind that the Cleric can Shell right after Belief. That's 15 seconds of "lolcan'ttouchdis" since even with Edged Blur it's doubtful metal attacks will be able to cut it. That's assuming you don't get SoG'd, Slept, or the Cleric doesn't use Winged Shell, Guardian Light, or Pious Blessing once Belief has worn off.

You're only gonna do around 20k or so on a Gemini Zerk crit to an equally geared end game Cleric. That's with Mire and Sacrificial Slash QPQ'd to them and assuming the Cleric is in offensive gear. Perhaps a Strength genie would boost those numbers, but that would pretty much leave you as nothing but setup fodder. If you're using your genie trying to lock the Cleric down (assuming you have Occult, what Strength genie doesn't?) as well as debuff them you're gonna have a hard time avoiding their sleep/seal lock if they tank out what you throw at them.

Clerics are tricky, have to hope for a well timed zerk crit (under max HP) or get them locked up nice and tight and go for the kill. However, due to the nature of a Seeker's crowd control preventing the use of a Pdef charm to prevent Gemini Slash charm bypasses is a difficult task.

You make it sound like the Cleric will sit there and let you wail on them. The reality is they won't. How do you deal with those conservative Clerics that know full well they can tank your Gemini Slash without needing to use their genie heavily? What happens when they Belief through your Edged Blur and tank out your damage? Do tell kind sir.

The amount of damage done by Gemini is taken from +12 refines and full jades on each side. This also assumes the Cleric is Demon and camps UV mode. Say they don't? Say they go regular and spam Demon Seal of Rejuvination for Pdef? Say they're Sage? They spam Vangaurd Spirit for the Pdef buff while trying to kill you? Say they play pure defense and use an O'Malley's Blessing + Warsong Belt? What do you do then to land a kill O' wise and powerful one?

Kniraven - Lost City · July 2013

Zanryu - Dreamweaver wrote: »

The thing about the QPQ combo is it gives the Cleric ample time to:

A) Use Will Surge over Belief and Purify the debuffs before Gemini can hit.
Use Wind shield and tank out even a zerk crit
C) Use a Pdef charm to reduce the incoming Gemini Slash to half damage
D) Any combination of the above

Chances are they're gonna use a charm, use windshield, do both, or Will Surge > Purify. On a high mag/vit genie they'll be able to Belief again very soon. Also, keep in mind that the Cleric can Shell right after Belief. That's 15 seconds of "lolcan'ttouchdis" since even with Edged Blur it's doubtful metal attacks will be able to cut it. That's assuming you don't get SoG'd, Slept, or the Cleric doesn't use Winged Shell, Guardian Light, or Pious Blessing once Belief has worn off.

You're only gonna do around 20k or so on a Gemini Zerk crit to an equally geared end game Cleric. That's with Mire and Sacrificial Slash QPQ'd to them and assuming the Cleric is in offensive gear. Perhaps a Strength genie would boost those numbers, but that would pretty much leave you as nothing but setup fodder. If you're using your genie trying to lock the Cleric down (assuming you have Occult, what Strength genie doesn't?) as well as debuff them you're gonna have a hard time avoiding their sleep/seal lock if they tank out what you throw at them.

Clerics are tricky, have to hope for a well timed zerk crit (under max HP) or get them locked up nice and tight and go for the kill. However, due to the nature of a Seeker's crowd control preventing the use of a Pdef charm to prevent Gemini Slash charm bypasses is a difficult task.

You make it sound like the Cleric will sit there and let you wail on them. The reality is they won't. How do you deal with those conservative Clerics that know full well they can tank your Gemini Slash without needing to use their genie heavily? What happens when they Belief through your Edged Blur and tank out your damage? Do tell kind sir.

The amount of damage done by Gemini is taken from +12 refines and full jades on each side. This also assumes the Cleric is Demon and camps UV mode. Say they don't? Say they go regular and spam Demon Seal of Rejuvination for Pdef? Say they're Sage? They spam Vangaurd Spirit for the Pdef buff while trying to kill you? Say they play pure defense and use an O'Malley's Blessing + Warsong Belt? What do you do then to land a kill O' wise and powerful one?

I said to use stun and edged after you knew their genie was in cd.

I never advocated metal attacks.

All and all i don't know why you quoted me, as your post has almost nothing to do with mine.
Frankly it just looks like you're arguing for no reason.

On Topic:
On my seeker i have the most trouble with wizards,
Genie Spark, need i say more?

Zanryu - Dreamweaver · July 2013

Kniraven - Lost City wrote: »

I said to use stun and edged after you knew their genie was in cd.

I never advocated metal attacks.

All and all i don't know why you quoted me, as your post has almost nothing to do with mine.
Frankly it just looks like you're arguing for no reason.

On Topic:
On my seeker i have the most trouble with wizards,
Genie Spark, need i say more?

Asking you how to get around certain things or around the counters to what you do. PvP isn't about blindly going in with a wtframbo combo, it's about knowing how to exhaust your opponent's resources enough that you can go in for the kill. Simply exhausting the opponent's genie isn't going to be enough to kill a skilled player. Especially not if they're predicting something like that or are in the process of sealing you.

I'd say my post has quite a lot to do with you.

I agree with the statement about Wizards. They have insane amounts of both Physical and Elemental defense along with an easy way out of range of most of your attacks, all in most cases (those rare times where they're frozen facing you and you hit them from a few meters away, allowing for an extra attack or two after they Distance Shrink.) It doesn't help that they have insane amounts of damage in the form of Spark combo and can buff their elemental defense in a pinch. With limited amounts of CC a Wizard seems to be a Seeker's worst nightmare given their powerful defense, immense attack power, and high mobility.

Can't say I've played Seeker long enough to know how to counter Wizards on one.

Kniraven - Lost City · July 2013

Zanryu - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Asking you how to get around certain things or around the counters to what you do. PvP isn't about blindly going in with a wtframbo combo, it's about knowing how to exhaust your opponent's resources enough that you can go in for the kill. Simply exhausting the opponent's genie isn't going to be enough to kill a skilled player. Especially not if they're predicting something like that or are in the process of sealing you.

I'd say my post has quite a lot to do with you.

I agree with the statement about Wizards. They have insane amounts of both Physical and Elemental defense along with an easy way out of range of most of your attacks, all in most cases (those rare times where they're frozen facing you and you hit them from a few meters away, allowing for an extra attack or two after they Distance Shrink.) It doesn't help that they have insane amounts of damage in the form of Spark combo and can buff their elemental defense in a pinch. With limited amounts of CC a Wizard seems to be a Seeker's worst nightmare given their powerful defense, immense attack power, and high mobility.

Can't say I've played Seeker long enough to know how to counter Wizards on one.

Genie is the only counter to the combo i suggested, because it is the only thing they can use while they are already stunned.

I only suggested the qpq combo as a method of exhausting enemy resources.

My post was about how control skills were useful and how edged blur bypasses all of a clerics class specific defenses.

Zheii didn't even know edged blur did physical damage, said control skills were usesless because her opponents did not even need to kite her, and thinks that auto attacks will only do 1/5 skill damage.

I was pretty much just pointing out she was factually wrong (ie it is not opinion) on all accounts.

Perhaps now that she has this new knowledge of her class she will be able to do better against clerics.

Zanryu - Dreamweaver · July 2013

Kniraven - Lost City wrote: »

Genie is the only counter to the combo i suggested, because it is the only thing they can use while they are already stunned.

I only suggested the qpq combo as a method of exhausting enemy resources.

My post was about how control skills were useful and how edged blur bypasses all of a clerics class specific defenses.

Zheii didn't even know edged blur did physical damage, said control skills were usesless because her opponents did not even need to kite her, and thinks that auto attacks will only do 1/5 skill damage.

I was pretty much just pointing out she was factually wrong (ie it is not opinion) on all accounts.

Perhaps now that she has this new knowledge of her class she will be able to do better against clerics.

Pre-emptive strike yo.

Anyway I'm a let this here die down.

Zheii - Archosaur · July 2013

DionDagger - Dreamweaver wrote: »

And that's why most seekers are bad. You ever wondered why using a stance lowers the proc rate of skills? Because the stance proc was mainly meant for auto attacks, which most herp-a-derp seekers dont seem to use. Proc a stun>edged blur>blade affinity> gemini. One dead cleric.

Oh Yes I have wondered why the stances lower the proc rate of a heartseeker (that's right only one skill)
And it's actually something to do with the formatting of the skills and buffs/stances and how they stack, not something that is meant to be a part of the game, it was not on purpose.
Skill spam > Auto Attack even on AA, unless the AA is under geared, in which case whack 'em all day. But unless the cleric is afk you are not going to kill them or any thing else with Auto attack.
In theory your "Dead Cleric" plan seems like a good idea, but in practice, unless you get a zerk crit with Gemini you really don't stand a chance of killing anyone who has half decent gear.
(And as I said in the OP, you have to rely on a zerk crit so I was...right? O.o)

Kniraven - Lost City wrote: »

If clerics aren't kiting on your server, and you are losing to them, then either they heavily outgear you or you're just bad...

Of course they kite when you use edged blur, that's because it hurts. It bypasses their shields and defense levels. This is the best time to take advantage of your control skills such as your 1 spark stun. You wait for them to use a genie skill to put it on cooldown for a, bit, tele-stun to them, edged blur and **** face with physical attacks.

Good ways to get them to waste their genie are to use the tried and true sacrificial slash + quid pro quo combo, or to avoid their second sleep/seal skill while the first is still on cd which will quickly put them on the defensive.

Finally, auto attacks are perfectly viable for a seeker to use on an AA. You wield a god of frenzy melee weapon with high patk.

You asked for ideas to improve, perhaps you should go try out the suggested strategies before disregarding them for not being what you are used to. Clearly what you are doing already is not effective, or you wouldn't be here.

I play a full +10 third cast seeker in TW every week and pvp on it daily.

Finally, its no wonder you're having trouble when you don't know what your own skills do.

You are wrong, Edged Blur is not a magic attack. It is a physical attack which also does additional metal damage. Not only is it a physical attack which bypasses Shields and Defense Levels, it also does not activate your opponents purifyspell proc. Finally, you can deal additional physical attacks as I have already suggested, while it is up. This makes it very easy to bypass a charm if you can keep them in place, again, with control skills.

I did say +12 JoSD vs +12 JoSD, the same level of gearing.
I don't see why a good cleric has to kite? They can have you locked down 90% of the time, and when they don't have you locked down they can just tank you with stupid amounts of mag def and their phys defensive skills.
-They also tend to stay in close range because one of their arrays requires the Cleric being close to the target. Let's also not forget that if they stay too far away it's a simple matter for the target to kite away as they go for that killing blow.

I don't see why they have to use their genies for a QPQ combo they have a skill called purify... most of them abuse the hell out of it, especially those OCD clerics that purify themselves as soon as even a stance marker appears on them (you have no idea how annoying that is Dx)

I didn't ask for ways to improve o_o?
The thread is about sharing what class you have the most trouble taking down on a seeker. Not how to help Zheii battle clerics, I didn't ask for that at all.

If Edged Blur was a phys attack then it would go through HoS, but it doesn't it's a magic attack and it deals Metal damage.
It may go through defensive levels and any winged shell/etc that they may have up. But they still have their insanely high mag def to rely on, and unless they are just standing there they are going to be able to survive.

Also: FYI the average on an auto attack is 1k with a skill I can get anywhere from 3k to 20k+ depending on how I use it, unlike auto attack who's highest hit is going to be 4k with zerk crit, where as zerk critting with a skill will land me (depending on the skill) in the 10k+ zone which is where I want to be. (I realize that I can get quite a few more attacks in with Auto attack but the dmg of using skills still out weighs it. especially when the cleric sees that you're just autoing and starts kiting or the just pop winged shell and start hurting you)
Just so we're clear though no-cleric or any other class for that matter is just going to stand there and let you auto attack them, and even if you use control skills;
Auto attacking an AA is just begging for them to Puri Proc and run away making your control skills useless.

Deceptistar - Sanctuary · July 2013

Psychics, cause their buff skills are irritating as ****

HideYoHubby - Archosaur · July 2013

I dont quite understand the problems you got with clerics, the basic thing already came out. Heart of Steel and the and the genie skill that wakes you from sleep. Clerics rely on sleeping you to set up combo, if you arent slept, they have to wait on CDs to try again, during which time they dont have much if any CC to keep you locked down. Add def charms on auto-pot for 99% and watch how clerics have to spark on you to kill you, which really should increase your odds on taking them down. While clerics can be scary in PvP, they really do lack ways to truly drop high hp targets that spam defense charms. Clerics are hard to kill but in return they really have trouble killing you back.

Zheii - Archosaur · July 2013

Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »

Psychics, cause their buff skills are irritating as ****

Agreed. XD

HideYoHubby - Archosaur wrote: »

I dont quite understand the problems you got with clerics, the basic thing already came out. Heart of Steel and the and the genie skill that wakes you from sleep. Clerics rely on sleeping you to set up combo, if you arent slept, they have to wait on CDs to try again, during which time they dont have much if any CC to keep you locked down. Add def charms on auto-pot for 99% and watch how clerics have to spark on you to kill you, which really should increase your odds on taking them down. While clerics can be scary in PvP, they really do lack ways to truly drop high hp targets that spam defense charms. Clerics are hard to kill but in return they really have trouble killing you back.

Well I think my problem Is mostly to do with the fact that I do indeed need a new genie. And maybe I should make one just for fighting clerics, but since I'm usually jumped without warning I don't think that's going to really help me all that much.
Another thing is though I am lacking mag def massively, so.. I have a few things to work on x3.

HideYoHubby - Archosaur · July 2013

Zheii - Archosaur wrote: »

Another thing is though I am lacking mag def massively, so.. I have a few things to work on x3.

50% mag def charms break cleric damage. Easy way to test this is you make say 50 of em, set em to 99% on auto-pot, ask one of your R9T3 +10 clerics to try to kill you in some remote place. I am pretty sure he/she will need lucky crits/spark/offensive genie use to take you down while you "afk".

Kittysama - Raging Tide_1432680721 · July 2013

Kitty has most problems against a psy when playing a seeker.
They just use Earth Vector and couple other attacks. Yay, poor seeker ish dead. If poor seeker tries to attack the ebil fishie, poor seeker gets silenced. If the poor seeker ish lucky, fishie might have got 1-shot(which doesn't usually happen f:weep). If poor seeker doesn't get silenced, poor seeker sees "Resist" hovering above fishie's head. If that doesn't happen, poor seeker sees a ridiculously low number as that psy was in White Voodoo. And fishie's HP bar get back to full in seconds.

Kitty thinks that almost only way to kill a psy ish to get them by surprise when they are least expecting it.f:sneaky

And getting sage skills would probably help, too.

_Nottunyx_ - Heavens Tear · July 2013

Clerics due to their shield spam and sog (without sog is loloneshotgemini)

Archers that has heart of steel/expel and know when to time it right

b:surrender

_SoulSin_ - Archosaur · July 2013

Zheii - Archosaur wrote: »

Well I think my problem Is mostly to do with the fact that I do indeed need a new genie. And maybe I should make one just for fighting clerics, but since I'm usually jumped without warning I don't think that's going to really help me all that much.
Another thing is though I am lacking mag def massively, so.. I have a few things to work on x3.

trolololol.

Zheii - Archosaur · July 2013

HideYoHubby - Archosaur wrote: »

50% mag def charms break cleric damage. Easy way to test this is you make say 50 of em, set em to 99% on auto-pot, ask one of your R9T3 +10 clerics to try to kill you in some remote place. I am pretty sure he/she will need lucky crits/spark/offensive genie use to take you down while you "afk".

Well in theory that sounds awesome but I'm desperately trying to farm and I pk too much- if I was to have def charms on constantly I would go through hundreds daily, which will be very bad for my farming efforts.
+I In some ways I don't like def charms (feel like I'm cheating ;-;), especially on auto pot, I mean yes it is useful but I'd like to be able to use my own skill and ability to read the opponent and predict their movements to pop a charm at the appropriate moment. Instead of just having them on auto spam.

_SoulSin_ - Archosaur wrote: »

trolololol.

Admitting to a weakness and saying that you need to improve something is now something to laugh at? O,o
Strange person o_o.

_tannerru_ - Archosaur · July 2013

I beat Auer 2 out of 4 yesterday

His gear is insane.

We did 2 1v1's self buffed
1 with both cleric buffs
1 with with both barb and clerics buffs

Zheii - Archosaur · July 2013

_tannerru_ - Archosaur wrote: »

I beat Auer 2 out of 4 yesterday His gear is insane.

We did 2 1v1's self buffed
1 with both cleric buffs
1 with with both barb and clerics buffs

Well good for you, Please do teach me how to be as much of an egotistical *** as you, I'm OH SO CURIOUS as to how you do it.
Please and thank you in advance.

Zanryu - Dreamweaver · July 2013

_tannerru_ - Archosaur wrote: »

I beat Auer 2 out of 4 yesterday His gear is insane.

We did 2 1v1's self buffed
1 with both cleric buffs
1 with with both barb and clerics buffs

Man... did you see all the help he just gave? I learned so much.

Bro, if you're gonna post at least tell us how you beat them so something can be learned. Though considering the mention of gear, I'm guessing he outgears you. Which would mean he lost due to a severe lack of skill. Which means we wouldn't learn anything anyway.

Go home, you're drunk.

Raphxelion - Raging Tide · August 2013

Hardest classes for seekers to beat endgame would probably be: Clerics,Mystic,Wiz,Barb...Noting they are insanely geared and know how to PK. Because my weapon is warsoul and I don't have zerk, for me its even harder to near impossible to defeat a +12 full JOSD cleric.

How To defeat an OP cleric that knows how to pk (without counting on lucky zerk crit) -
1) Start the battle with your omalley and R8r Defense level enhanced sword
- The reason for doing this isn't really to kill the cleric right off, but to play defense, allow the cleric to use her finishing combo.
2) Keep you r8r swords on, chances are the cleric will silence you followed by sleep. After the sleep the cleric will hit you with extreme poison
3) As soon as you see extreme poison on you, use Heart of Steel, The cleric usually follows Extreme poison with there heavy hitters like Tempest(lightening storm thing) and Cyclone. With your r8r sword on and heart of steel you shouldn't die.
4) As soon as the cleric sleep wears out
-Use Unfetter(hopefully you have sage)
-Use Sacrificial Slash+qpq/genie debuffs, (the cleric will usually react with them trying to purify because they can't sleep you and they're silence may still be on cooldown
-Switch to offense weapon and voidstep to the the cleric
- Your (sage)Unfetter stun resist should be out by now
5) Immediately use your Vaculty potion or another movement resist potion
6) You now have roughly 12 seconds to bring hell on the cleric. Get ready for a chase if the cleric is smart he'll run or purify proc will help him
7) If you can't kill the cleric in 14 seconds, chances are the cleric will sleep you. without ur def marrow or r8r on chances are you might die

. Longer the battle goes, higher chance the cleric will win.

Play conservative if you have to. Play defense untill you find a weakness. Stay calm, don't use needless attacks without sometype of debuff or plan.
Reacting to Clerics Tripple Sparks:If the Cleric Tripple sparks, Run away if you can. If you can't run, get on your flying device(dmg is reduced by 50% or more) IF you can't get on your flying device, use heart of steel.
IF you manage to get on ur flying device use heartseeker+ Transpostion+extreme poison/debuffs and edgeblur. with Voidstep right before heartseeker goes out.

I know this combos is a lot for just one class, but it geared towards a JOSD high refined cleric. You might not be used to combos like this because your zerk crit is usually enough to kill most people pretty quickly but since I don't have zerk on my seeker almost all my combos are crazy, this is probably one of my simplier ones.

http://pwcalc.com/855a53bb9fc072b6 (I haven't played pwi in months, Uni is starting back up soon, I may log on soon or next summer. depends how everything goes.)

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver · August 2013

Zheii - Archosaur wrote: »

Well in theory that sounds awesome but I'm desperately trying to farm and I pk too much- if I was to have def charms on constantly I would go through hundreds daily, which will be very bad for my farming efforts.

um, you can remove them from auto-pot at any time. of course you can forget that in which case... ooops! while manually clicking them can result in better use, it's also quite hard to do while frantically mashing buttons to click a hp + an elixir + an apo i+ a skill in the tiny bit of time you are left unstunned in a gank xd

Zheii - Archosaur · August 2013

Raphxelion - Raging Tide wrote: »

Hardest classes for seekers to beat endgame would probably be: Clerics,Mystic,Wiz,Barb...Noting they are insanely geared and know how to PK. Because my weapon is warsoul and I don't have zerk, for me its even harder to near impossible to defeat a +12 full JOSD cleric.

How To defeat an OP cleric that knows how to pk (without counting on lucky zerk crit) -
1) Start the battle with your omalley and R8r Defense level enhanced sword
- The reason for doing this isn't really to kill the cleric right off, but to play defense, allow the cleric to use her finishing combo.
2) Keep you r8r swords on, chances are the cleric will silence you followed by sleep. After the sleep the cleric will hit you with extreme poison
3) As soon as you see extreme poison on you, use Heart of Steel, The cleric usually follows Extreme poison with there heavy hitters like Tempest(lightening storm thing) and Cyclone. With your r8r sword on and heart of steel you shouldn't die.
4) As soon as the cleric sleep wears out
-Use Unfetter(hopefully you have sage)
-Use Sacrificial Slash+qpq/genie debuffs, (the cleric will usually react with them trying to purify because they can't sleep you and they're silence may still be on cooldown
-Switch to offense weapon and voidstep to the the cleric
- Your (sage)Unfetter stun resist should be out by now
5) Immediately use your Vaculty potion or another movement resist potion
6) You now have roughly 12 seconds to bring hell on the cleric. Get ready for a chase if the cleric is smart he'll run or purify proc will help him
7) If you can't kill the cleric in 14 seconds, chances are the cleric will sleep you. without ur def marrow or r8r on chances are you might die . Longer the battle goes, higher chance the cleric will win.

Play conservative if you have to. Play defense untill you find a weakness. Stay calm, don't use needless attacks without sometype of debuff or plan.
Reacting to Clerics Tripple Sparks:If the Cleric Tripple sparks, Run away if you can. If you can't run, get on your flying device(dmg is reduced by 50% or more) IF you can't get on your flying device, use heart of steel.
IF you manage to get on ur flying device use heartseeker+ Transpostion+extreme poison/debuffs and edgeblur. with Voidstep right before heartseeker goes out.

I know this combos is a lot for just one class, but it geared towards a JOSD high refined cleric. You might not be used to combos like this because your zerk crit is usually enough to kill most people pretty quickly but since I don't have zerk on my seeker almost all my combos are crazy, this is probably one of my simplier ones.

http://pwcalc.com/855a53bb9fc072b6 (I haven't played pwi in months, Uni is starting back up soon, I may log on soon or next summer. depends how everything goes.)

Thanks so much for this- It's awesome advice for fighting clerics, I have been practicing myself, and have been getting a lot better (I'm learning Yay! XD)
But this thread wasn't about me having trouble fighting clerics... OTL

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »

um, you can remove them from auto-pot at any time. of course you can forget that in which case... ooops! while manually clicking them can result in better use, it's also quite hard to do while frantically mashing buttons to click a hp + an elixir + an apo i+ a skill in the tiny bit of time you are left unstunned in a gank xd

I just have something against autopotting charms

Idk what it is, just seems like cheating for some reason q.q
I only have them on autopot in TW, and even then sometimes I don't bother with that.
What I have been trying to teach myself though is using the Q and E keys for def charms, my problem is remembering to use them... xD'

Blossorn - Lost City · August 2013

what about mystics?+ are mystics a hard counter for seeker?

I have a r9 mystic, but i left game about a year ago, it awas a good time, but with the morai skills, every class was op and mystic just got a fking reveal that doesnt really revealed sins if +1 lv you.. and my mystic is only 102... soo i rage quited and went to *** (i love it but my pc right now cand handle wvw as i handle TW on pwi), and LOL ( but i hate when i lose just cause a troll just... troll the game)

ive a seeker lv 20 now, i love her its OMG WTF OP, on same lv i just use x2 skills on them and they are dead, i dont even melee them so i feel like a battle mage.
that opness may be cause the initial weapons that the game gives us with the new item called the dreamchaser

now i have x3 opportunities, 1. continue my mystic and r9rrr her, 2. use my lv 81 psy and R9rrr him, or continue my lv20 seeker and R9rrr it?

i dont know what to do... btw i took infinity of time just gearing my r9 mystic (about a year or so

), now that its abit easier to get things it would be a little easyer i think, or maybe ill just to NVrrr in case of psy/seek.

what do you guys think?

tsyfall · August 2013

Is white the absence of color, or the combination of light?

Raphxelion - Raging Tide wrote: »

Hardest classes for seekers to beat endgame would probably be: Clerics,Mystic,Wiz,Barb...Noting they are insanely geared and know how to PK. Because my weapon is warsoul and I don't have zerk, for me its even harder to near impossible to defeat a +12 full JOSD cleric.

How To defeat an OP cleric that knows how to pk (without counting on lucky zerk crit) -
1) Start the battle with your omalley and R8r Defense level enhanced sword
- The reason for doing this isn't really to kill the cleric right off, but to play defense, allow the cleric to use her finishing combo.
2) Keep you r8r swords on, chances are the cleric will silence you followed by sleep. After the sleep the cleric will hit you with extreme poison

Full JOSD cleric assumes that the seeker is also endgame. In this case it's stupid to Heart of Steel. A cleric can just cancel and go back into the debuff cycle. Better to let them hit you with 1 skill first. No need to worry about tempest; endgame seekers won't get bypassed by it.

3) As soon as you see extreme poison on you, use Heart of Steel, The cleric usually follows Extreme poison with there heavy hitters like Tempest(lightening storm thing) and Cyclone. With your r8r sword on and heart of steel you shouldn't die.

Exactly my point. You can survive the first hit, and allow it to wake you up. Waking you up gives you a whole lot of more options than just tanking while still slept.

4) As soon as the cleric sleep wears out
-Use Unfetter(hopefully you have sage)
-Use Sacrificial Slash+qpq/genie debuffs, (the cleric will usually react with them trying to purify because they can't sleep you and they're silence may still be on cooldown
-Switch to offense weapon and voidstep to the the cleric
- Your (sage)Unfetter stun resist should be out by now

It's easy enough to time purify with QPQ/sac slash, and it's near impossible to land debuffs on a sage cleric with a .3 second purify. It's more sure to telestun first, but that's a waste of stun time.

5) Immediately use your Vaculty potion or another movement resist potion

Clerics can tank magic damage pretty well and purify debuffs. They also have a handy thing that blocks nearly all physical damage. Good luck doing that without CC.

6) You now have roughly 12 seconds to bring hell on the cleric. Get ready for a chase if the cleric is smart he'll run or purify proc will help him
7) If you can't kill the cleric in 14 seconds, chances are the cleric will sleep you. without ur def marrow or r8r on chances are you might die . Longer the battle goes, higher chance the cleric will win.

Play conservative if you have to. Play defense untill you find a weakness. Stay calm, don't use needless attacks without sometype of debuff or plan.

In all honesty you should not be using such an unwieldy setup. You're gambling on purify not going off, cleric's purify not being timed well, genie being on cooldown (if they're vit/mag genie you have no chance), you zerkcritting enough damage, cleric having no plume shell, and vacuity being off cooldown.

I'm going to keep suggesting bypass attempts with Gemini. It requires a little more finesse, since you have to whittle down to 60% HP on a class that self heals, as well as ensure that a cleric does not have a physical defense charm up. However, each Gemini bypass attempt has a 30 second cooldown. Considering most endgame seekers will have a crit of 40%, it's reasonable to assume that a seeker will bypass once in 15 hits. Should take less than 10 minutes to kill the cleric even simply by going pure defense except for 2 seconds out of 30 (and most seekers have enough survivability to go offense for longer).

Long attempts are usually stupidly obvious and easy to counter/plan ahead for. Small attempts cost less, can be repeated more often, and aren't easy to counter. The way you're talking, it sounds like you're still at midgame, where it doesn't take much thinking to kill someone.

Blossorn - Lost City wrote: »

-load of **** about how level 30 characters can be judged as to how they perform at late endgame-

i dont know what to do... btw i took infinity of time just gearing my r9 mystic (about a year or so ), now that its abit easier to get things it would be a little easyer i think, or maybe ill just to NVrrr in case of psy/seek.

what do you guys think?

How about you actually learn to play the class that you just R9'd? Instead of buying a car that looks nice, then going shopping to buy a new one, how about you just learn to drive?

Blossorn - Lost City · August 2013

there are a few things i hate about mystic, i cant handle archers, clerics and some sins, and from what ive see and heard about psy is that r9 psy is just god mode.

Seekers: What class do you struggle with the most in PvP?

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