Digging flag with igs

Orouhimie - Heavens Tear
Orouhimie - Heavens Tear Posts: 21 Arc User
edited April 2013 in Nation Wars
im sure im not the only one who has seen this countless times, there will be a huge fight around the flag and someone cant grab it so they just ad/antistun and then IG to dig the flag.

There is nothing you can do to stop this once they have used ityou just get to sit idly by as they dig the flag.

I dont know i im the only one who thinks that while digging the flag you should not be able to use immune to damage items/skills so i am posting here to see what you all think.
Post edited by Orouhimie - Heavens Tear on

Comments

  • ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver
    ApocaIypto - Dreamweaver Posts: 585 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    ig is used before digging, not while digging
  • SashaGray - Heavens Tear
    SashaGray - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,765 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    2 things:

    1: if you IG during dig, you cant use apoth for 2 minutes
    2:absorb soul goes through IG
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  • Orouhimie - Heavens Tear
    Orouhimie - Heavens Tear Posts: 21 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    i know this but they can simply make the flag purge those kind of buffs when you begin to dig it to fix that.
  • Orouhimie - Heavens Tear
    Orouhimie - Heavens Tear Posts: 21 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    with things like purify for mages and bms speed skills/ archer speed skills and barbs natural speed you dont need apoth to capture the flag..... 90% of the battle is to get the flag lol.
  • Knownase - Heavens Tear
    Knownase - Heavens Tear Posts: 6,959 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Orouhimie - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    i know this but they can simply make the flag purge those kind of buffs when you begin to dig it to fix that.

    The flag would need to be recoded, along with the purge debuff itself.

    I consider IG digging a legit tactic, just how spawn killing can be as well. As mention before, IG will kill off any other speed apoth options, as well as last minute survival ones, not to mention you cannot use a genie too.

    In dead even fights, where the timer is running out and tied scores, IG digging can easily make or break the score


    I've done it before, and personally hate it because I prefer speed apoth to IGs. I've also seen others do it too on both sides. I've won and lost to this tactic too sometimes.
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  • Kremia - Lost City
    Kremia - Lost City Posts: 507 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Shouldn't this be on NW sub forum?
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  • SashaGray - Heavens Tear
    SashaGray - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,765 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    why dont we remove IGs altogether, since having any person being invulnerable is unfair to the people trying to kill them.

    lets have damage removed too, since its unfair to people trying to stay alive.
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  • Zsw - Dreamweaver
    Zsw - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,087 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Orouhimie - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    with things like purify for mages and bms speed skills/ archer speed skills and barbs natural speed you dont need apoth to capture the flag..... 90% of the battle is to get the flag lol.

    This is why purify should be removed.
    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1586221

    As for other classes, non of them will run fast enough without the apoth. You can always stop them mid way.
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  • Crixxix - Raging Tide
    Crixxix - Raging Tide Posts: 848 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    SashaGray - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    why dont we remove IGs altogether, since having any person being invulnerable is unfair to the people trying to kill them.

    lets have damage removed too, since its unfair to people trying to stay alive.

    That's just plain trolling and unproductive. I agree that this should be moved by a MOD to the NW sub-forum, but I'll put my 2 cents in the meanwhile.

    I think that it's a great tactic, for those that prefer this over speed pots. I'm a little annoyed that we can't use genies at all, but it is what it is. Using IG doesn't mean that your always gonna survive, only against certain classes. Some skills still hit through IG, such as Absorb Soul, and I believe DoT can also hit through. Maybe if your able to use the DoT skill before, only the damage ticks. Not sure how that part works lol. b:chuckle
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  • klys
    klys Posts: 283 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Dafaq guys. IG makes u immune to everything. Absorb soul is no exception.
    Dueling mechanics =/= pvp mechanics.
    And stop with all these whiny nw threads.
  • CapnK - Sanctuary
    CapnK - Sanctuary Posts: 1,166 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Unless you are an OP barb who doesn't care about speed, digging with IG means you have already lost. It's just a delaying tactic to keep the other team from getting the flag. Not having access to your apoth while running is generally game over for a flag carrier.
  • Crixxix - Raging Tide
    Crixxix - Raging Tide Posts: 848 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    klys wrote: »
    Dafaq guys. IG makes u immune to everything. Absorb soul is no exception.
    Dueling mechanics =/= pvp mechanics.
    And stop with all these whiny nw threads.

    Do you read the other threads about this topic? Yes, Absorb Soul hits through these kinds of things. b:shutup
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  • Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands
    Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands Posts: 7,231 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    If they use IG to dig that mean they won't be able to use charger orbs.

    Someone on charger orb with anti stun is unstoppable while when they IG dig usually just after they got it IG is out and they can't use genie or charger orb which make it more easy to stop.
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  • Knownase - Heavens Tear
    Knownase - Heavens Tear Posts: 6,959 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    CapnK - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Unless you are an OP barb who doesn't care about speed, digging with IG means you have already lost. It's just a delaying tactic to keep the other team from getting the flag. Not having access to your apoth while running is generally game over for a flag carrier.

    Yes and no.

    IG digging will guarantee that 1 point to the overall score. It's a good tactic when a battle is dead even.

    I've been in battles where the timer runs out and no side has successfully delivered the flag, the score was determine whoever grabbed it the most.
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  • ovenusarmanio
    ovenusarmanio Posts: 6,695 Community Moderator
    edited April 2013
    I disagree, I think IG while digging is a perfectly legitimate tactic for getting a point in a battle. They can't use speed apoth once they do, so you can always lock them down afterwards. Too many people won't cooperate and try to overwrite other people's stuns, that's one of the problems. I've had bms with great gear attempt to overwrite my lowbies stun before instead of doing literally anything else. Or wait til mine wears off and assist in a lock, since it does not overwrite. Too many are not paying attention to what others are doing, that's the real problem.

    edit: Also moved to NW forum.

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  • Orouhimie - Heavens Tear
    Orouhimie - Heavens Tear Posts: 21 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Have any of you seen a op bm or barb use ig to dig it? In battles where both teams are equal gear wise we would all be fighting and out of no where some bm or barb runs up and ad/ig to dig the flag..... carrying the flag to the cap point isnt hard even as a mage without speed buffs. the hard part is digging it without getting interupted this is where ppl are supposed to use teamwork/skill to get the flag stunlock enemys long enough to hold them off while your team grabs it not just any random nub running in and using that combo so they can dig it and there is nothing anyone can do to stop it.... im not surprised about the votes though the pwi community as a whole wants everyting handed to them....
  • Orouhimie - Heavens Tear
    Orouhimie - Heavens Tear Posts: 21 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    if you want to keep igs active should at least make ppl be able to be stunned while using it no where in the IGs description does it say its supposed to be a antistun pot as well.....
  • Knownase - Heavens Tear
    Knownase - Heavens Tear Posts: 6,959 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Orouhimie - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Have any of you seen a op bm or barb use ig to dig it? In battles where both teams are equal gear wise we would all be fighting and out of no where some bm or barb runs up and ad/ig to dig the flag..... carrying the flag to the cap point isnt hard even as a mage without speed buffs. the hard part is digging it without getting interupted this is where ppl are supposed to use teamwork/skill to get the flag stunlock enemys long enough to hold them off while your team grabs it not just any random nub running in and using that combo so they can dig it and there is nothing anyone can do to stop it.... im not surprised about the votes though the pwi community as a whole wants everyting handed to them....

    Ultimately then, it comes down to controlling the flag areas again, similar response to the last thread you created about using speed apoth in NW.

    If you have control over the flag areas, then no one would be IGing in the first place. In dead even fights, IG would be a valuable option as a last resort, because you can delay the flag further, and turn the tides. It's a game mechanic as well, players were just smart enough to utilize it, I don't think there's any need to change it. It's balance in the sense that there's many cons to it, like:

    -Flag user can't use genie.
    -No speed apoth.
    -You can still kill them off along the way thru any means.

    As for your "OP BM Barb" situation, that's not even relevant, because the problem doesn't lie with IG digging, it lies with the fact they are +12 full JoSD. If its a squad issue, them simply your squad just doesn't have enough DD power to counter.
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  • CapnK - Sanctuary
    CapnK - Sanctuary Posts: 1,166 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Crixxix - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Do you read the other threads about this topic? Yes, Absorb Soul hits through these kinds of things. b:shutup

    Do *you* read the other threads? Absorb Soul, Edged Blur, etc. go through invulnerability in duels only. Not in PK, TW, NW. And even if it did you wouldn't use it against someone digging flag anyway because it doesn't stop them from digging flag - doesn't count as a hit.
  • Magnanimous_ - Heavens Tear
    Magnanimous_ - Heavens Tear Posts: 384 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Considering that you are the psychic with white voodoo and a purify weapon, you would be the one gaining the most advantage from an IG-Dig. Even the best catabarb without speed pots cannot run in the flag without support.

    Even pop-ing an IG does not guarantee that the flag will be yours. Sure, you cannot interupt someone digging the flag with IG. But there are more than 1 strategy to prevent someone with IG to dig the flag: and it starts with digging the flag before he does. Even if he tries to interrupt you, you can still spam click on the flag to prevent him from start digging: the more you delay him, the more likely that he will waste his IG. Maybe you should blame the flag diggers in your squad for doing a crappy job?
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  • Hannsel - Dreamweaver
    Hannsel - Dreamweaver Posts: 90 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    lol wut!! ironguards are OP now b:chuckle

    on a serious note: if they use IG then they can't charger orb for 2mins. if you can't kill them in this time frame then your side is fail
  • Kniraven - Lost City
    Kniraven - Lost City Posts: 2,620 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Orouhimie - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Have any of you seen a op bm or barb use ig to dig it? In battles where both teams are equal gear wise we would all be fighting and out of no where some bm or barb runs up and ad/ig to dig the flag..... carrying the flag to the cap point isnt hard even as a mage without speed buffs. the hard part is digging it without getting interupted this is where ppl are supposed to use teamwork/skill to get the flag stunlock enemys long enough to hold them off while your team grabs it not just any random nub running in and using that combo so they can dig it and there is nothing anyone can do to stop it.... im not surprised about the votes though the pwi community as a whole wants everyting handed to them....

    Hi, I'm a full R9RR BM +10 everything including necklace, ring, etc.
    I have over 130 attack levels and about 55 defense levels.

    I'm generally considered a very skilled BM on my server as well.

    If I use an IG to dig then it's because the team I'm facing is even or is superior. Generally speaking in this situation i will have used antistun and IG to dig then I will holypath right before digging ends in order to escape and then use my normal sprint skill. Despite that, i can tell you that 9/10 times if I have been forced to dig this way then i soon after am stunned, purged, and destroyed. If your team is incapable of this, then the aforementioned BM or Barb didn't really need to use an IG in the first place.

    That is all.
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  • Ouka - Heavens Tear
    Ouka - Heavens Tear Posts: 410 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    Orouhimie - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    if you want to keep igs active should at least make ppl be able to be stunned while using it no where in the IGs description does it say its supposed to be a antistun pot as well.....


    IG isn't an anti stun pot, i just used my anti stun skill before I Iged in front of you. Also since your r9 didn't kill my barb before i capped the flag. You should be focusing on learning how to play instead of blaming your fails on the IG.
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  • Azura - Lost City
    Azura - Lost City Posts: 2,281 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    For my team it's generally easier to kill someone who used ironguard for digging flag, than someone who kept that pot to run. As many others have said already: If someone used IG to dig, they have nothing else for their defense except their own skills.

    Many after using IG, use holy path a second before getting the flag, or use a skill to run faster. When IG's effect is over, I debuff their holy path or running skill (along with all their buffs).
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  • deathbytuna
    deathbytuna Posts: 113 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    The ctf in this game is lame and crappy..if you drop a flag it should fall in field,if team mate is there he/she should be able to pick it up and take it.

    bleh anywyas NW was ok untill i got what i needed out of it,now its just one of those stank events just like all the rest.b:bye

    eep eep more 105's,must be some more epic exp **** goin around again.
  • XSonOfCircex - Sanctuary
    XSonOfCircex - Sanctuary Posts: 1,173 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    I'm gonna second all the people saying stop whining. IG digging basically guarantees you exactly 1 point, and buys you 2 minutes to get a better position. First, there is nothing "unfair" about it since you all have the opportunity to IG and dig as well. Unless you have a lot of good support after digging it, you won't survive long enough to deliver the flag with apoth in CD anyway, unless you're an OP r9r3 caster fighting noobs. If you would like to continue that debate, there are threads for it elsewhere.

    Less QQ over this OP thing or that OP thing
    More cake
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  • Azura - Lost City
    Azura - Lost City Posts: 2,281 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    XSonOfCircex - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I'm gonna second all the people saying stop whining. IG digging basically guarantees you exactly 1 point, and buys you 2 minutes to get a better position. First, there is nothing "unfair" about it since you all have the opportunity to IG and dig as well. Unless you have a lot of good support after digging it, you won't survive long enough to deliver the flag with apoth in CD anyway, unless you're an OP r9r3 caster fighting noobs. If you would like to continue that debate, there are threads for it elsewhere.

    Less QQ over this OP thing or that OP thing
    More cake

    /thread
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  • Bhavyy - Raging Tide
    Bhavyy - Raging Tide Posts: 1,083 Arc User
    edited April 2013
    If theres that much of a fight around the flag point (and I guess the easiest one for this to happen around is the middle one since people can attack from all directions making them harder to kill) that someone has to IG to dig it then they're left in a position of vulnerability for the majority of the duration of time between that flag spawn point and the capture point. In this time, if you cant kill that person, they probably deserved that capture in all honesty.
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