FPS in enemy base during tw

Allisandre - Sanctuary · February 2013

Hellies - Harshlands wrote: »

...
And BTW if you live outside the US/Canada you can reduce high ping with a "latency fixing program" that will modify some settings in the windows registry. I don't know if I can post any links here so just posting the name.

Beware those programs. They only work on Windows XP/98-ME, and sometimes on Vista. Usually on Vista/Win7-8 they will actually break it because your OS in 7/8 automatically makes these changes.

Also, you should note that a lot of those programs don't get configured properly and/or are just malware/snake oil.

Besides, making a change on your computer is not going to do anything for the bad hops in the route between you and the servers. Especially if your hopping a trunk line overseas.

I would recommend heavily against using such programs.
If you're tecchy enough and using Windows XP/98-ME, there are tons of guides that can show you how to edit those settings manually depending on what your particular setup is.

Hellies - Harshlands · February 2013

Allisandre - Sanctuary wrote: »

Beware those programs. They only work on Windows XP/98-ME, and sometimes on Vista. Usually on Vista/Win7-8 they will actually break it because your OS in 7/8 automatically makes these changes.

Also, you should note that a lot of those programs don't get configured properly and/or are just malware/snake oil.

Besides, making a change on your computer is not going to do anything for the bad hops in the route between you and the servers. Especially if your hopping a trunk line overseas.

I would recommend heavily against using such programs.
If you're tecchy enough and using Windows XP/98-ME, there are tons of guides that can show you how to edit those settings manually depending on what your particular setup is.

I'm not going to try to persuade anyone to use anything but I suggest you type : latency fixing program in any decent search engine like google/yahoo and enter the first found page to learn more about it.

You can of course make the changes manually since there are lots of examples how to do it on youtube but it's easier with a known program.

BTW this fix is for Windows 8, Windows 7, Windows Vista (SP1 or higher) or Windows XP (SP3). I highly doubt anyone would still use Win98/Me.

Allisandre - Sanctuary · February 2013

You're still missing the key point of the issue...

Leatrix can't reduce packet travel times. All it can do is smooth out spikes in latency on your PC. It absolutely CAN NOT make your IP packets traverse the internet faster. Which is the main cause for lag.

Without Leatrix:
240-260 ping ingame

speed test
20 ping
11mbps download
.67mbs upload
0% packet loss
0ms jitter

With Leatrix
250-255 ingame

speed test
22 ping
11mbps download
.7mbs upload
0% packet loss
1ms jitter

I'm running Windows 7 btw. As you can see, it's going to have very little effect on a modern system. Older systems, with older OS's, you may see some small improvement.

In the end though, it's not going to do a damn thing about the latency coming from the numerous routers that your signal has to traverse between yourself and the server.
Also, it has absolutely nothing to do with FPS.

John_Smith - Harshlands · February 2013

On my old PC (2.442Ghz Athlon64 3700+ Single Core, 2GB of ram and a heavily overclocked Nvidia 7900GS 256mb) I got a solid 55+ unless I was in the middle of archosaur, usually. In the base with all the effects I'd have to have the settings turned down (Bar character draw distance) and get a decent 15fps.

On my new PC (3.5 Ghz i7 3770K HT enabled Quad core cpu, 2x 2Gb NVidia 660Ti in SLI and 8GB of 1600Mhz RAM) I get about 40FPS average in towns (Although it looks oh so pretty with SLI AA/AF) and no matter what I do, sub 10fps in base in TW (graphics card settings making absolutely no difference).

Game just hates new kit. b:cry

Oh, and at whoever said it doesn't use PhysX, it does have the PhysX DLL's in the Element folder, so it may use it discreetly. Or, you know, I got lost when I was doing something at some point. b:chuckleb:surrender

Coincidentaly has an official NVidia supplied SLI profile too. Recognises it as "Xhu Zian 2 (elementclient.exe)" and forces Alternate Frame Rendering method 2. (One frame by one card, other by the other, basically). Doesn't seem to visually change anything however.

EDIT: Actually, after having tested it, the SLI profile seems to introduce a even more microstuttering. So I'll stick to single GPU+SLI AA thanks.

Hellies - Harshlands · February 2013

Allisandre - Sanctuary wrote: »

You're still missing the key point of the issue...

Leatrix can't reduce packet travel times. All it can do is smooth out spikes in latency on your PC. It absolutely CAN NOT make your IP packets traverse the internet faster. Which is the main cause for lag.

I'm running Windows 7 btw. As you can see, it's going to have very little effect on a modern system. Older systems, with older OS's, you may see some small improvement.

In the end though, it's not going to do a damn thing about the latency coming from the numerous routers that your signal has to traverse between yourself and the server.
Also, it has absolutely nothing to do with FPS.

That is why I said "If you live outside the US/Canada". Of course it's not going to reduce a ping which is already around 200ms. But it will help a lot if you have pings around 600 - 700ms (reducing it to 200-300). Especially with a lot of other people in the same area - like TW.

Also I never said it would affect FPS counter. It's only a tweak to reduce high ping which is often the cause of major lag especially in TWs.

ArmaniEx - Harshlands · February 2013

Somebody a few months ago posted a file which contained what was somehow a patcher for the element client which when installed allowed the client to run past it's limit which when doing so made it crash. However, the ppl who took the patch and downloaded it before mods deleted the thread no longer crash before nw. Not sure why it was deleted but I can assure you it works like a charm lol.

bluestuffzzz · February 2013

John_Smith - Harshlands wrote: »

On my old PC (2.442Ghz Athlon64 3700+ Single Core, 2GB of ram and a heavily overclocked Nvidia 7900GS 256mb) I got a solid 55+ unless I was in the middle of archosaur, usually. In the base with all the effects I'd have to have the settings turned down (Bar character draw distance) and get a decent 15fps.

On my new PC (3.5 Ghz i7 3770K HT enabled Quad core cpu, 2x 2Gb NVidia 660Ti in SLI and 8GB of 1600Mhz RAM) I get about 40FPS average in towns (Although it looks oh so pretty with SLI AA/AF) and no matter what I do, sub 10fps in base in TW (graphics card settings making absolutely no difference).

Game just hates new kit. b:cry

Oh, and at whoever said it doesn't use PhysX, it does have the PhysX DLL's in the Element folder, so it may use it discreetly. Or, you know, I got lost when I was doing something at some point. b:chuckleb:surrender

Coincidentaly has an official NVidia supplied SLI profile too. Recognises it as "Xhu Zian 2 (elementclient.exe)" and forces Alternate Frame Rendering method 2. (One frame by one card, other by the other, basically). Doesn't seem to visually change anything however.

EDIT: Actually, after having tested it, the SLI profile seems to introduce a even more microstuttering. So I'll stick to single GPU+SLI AA thanks.

PhysX is a proprietary real-time physics and partical renderer. The original game engine for Perfect World was created before the NVDIA acquisition of PhysX. Even if the game engine could utilize PhysX (which it can't), there would be no point. This isn't Crysis 3. There isn't dynamic lighting/shaders, and the textures in this game are very dull. There aren't any particles besides the glow on the weps. That can be fully rendered with the current game engine.

Just a note: As far as I'm aware, because it's proprietary to NVDIA, the developer has to get special permissions to use PhysX.

ArmaniEx - Harshlands wrote: »

Somebody a few months ago posted a file which contained what was somehow a patcher for the element client which when installed allowed the client to run past it's limit which when doing so made it crash. However, the ppl who took the patch and downloaded it before mods deleted the thread no longer crash before nw. Not sure why it was deleted but I can assure you it works like a charm lol.

PWE still has that strict rule where posting about anything that touches just about any file in the game folder is considered against the rules, and thus bannable. Even if it's a fix, which is really unfortunate. I mean, if Wanmei/PWE doesn't deem that they want to fix it, why wouldn't the players have a right to fix that cap? Thankfully, I did some research around the time bubbles did, and came up with the same little fix. But really, it's sad that the game must stay in a broken state in order to please the people who hold power, aye.

Longknife - Harshlands · February 2013

I actually don't remember lulz. I'm usually on defense and TUNNEL SNAKES R FRIGGIN PRO b:cool so they never make it into our base, nor do we often have a chance to enter theirs (for very long, anyways).

Nevertheless I think I have pretty good FPS. Here's an example, first 7 minutes or so is purely in their base, so are the last couple minutes. My computer is an Acer Aspire X3960 with an Intel Core i5 processor @2.90 GHz with 6GB of RAM. Graphics card is NVidia something-something (legit don't remember which nor can I even find it listed in my computer settings, wtf?). The computer is like a year or two old, so I think any decent comp should be able to run the game. NW entrance is a different story; get like 5 FPS there.

Lastly, and I know PWI will never condone this....
About a month or two ago, someone posted a "fix" to these forums to prevent crashing to desktop, explaining WHY PWI tends to crash in heavily trafficked areas. Of course, the thread was locked immediately because it had an external download link from some random yahoo, but I saw the logic in the person's explanation of why the game crashes and decided to download the link and give it a try. I used to crash in the enemy base constantly; I wouldn't lag, but I WOULD crash. Now? I never crash. Never ever ever ever ever. So sadly, PWI has some limit in place where if the game takes up a certain amount of space on your computer (not percentage-based), it's designed to crash. Unfortunately, although many of us have comps that can handle that particular size, it'll still crash. PWI might wanna rethink that since I'm sure the fix is kinda hard to get a hold of.

getdenoobedkk · February 2013

Heleghir - Raging Tide wrote: »

outside enemy base, i'm capped at 80 fps on max settings. inside enemy base with 10 million aoes and 100-120 people on screen at once, i switch to best perform and drop to about 10-15 fps.

CPU: 2 Intel Core2Duo @ 2.4 per core
GPU: 4GB nVidia 9800 GTX overclocked
RAM: 16GB ddr3

also have a PhysX accelerator in a PCI slot to help boost the graphic performance

PWI engine does not support PhysX technology b:laugh

TCHP - Lost City · February 2013

keep in mind PWI is still a 32 bit system and there are limitation the the hardware it can use.

The best way to improve the fps on this game is to get more calculation per sec from the CPU.

The game was build before the video card started to replace the CPU to remove work load from it and allow the system to run faster. So video card won't improve PWI a lot.

While OCing your CPU will get you a lot more FPS I was never a fan of OCing cause it's simply dangerous.

On a 32 bit program like PWI there is a cap of 2 Gi of memory addressing it can use. Unlike on a 64 bit made program. This is what makes the game crash sometimes, has it's addressing get full, and it needs more.

Also the game is not built to run on multiple core and multiple video card. To do this you need an os or program that will do it for the game. For example, on win 7 the OS is program to handle older program. It uses a kind of virtual CPU to let the application believes it's on 1 cpu. BUT this has an impact on the fps because the CPU need time to reorganize the splitting, and joining of the information it has to calculate on it's multiple core. While the impact is minimized by a faster core, it can still be hold has it wait for 1 core to finish the calculation.

An OCed single core CPU at 4 Ghz ( if you find one ) will deliver more/same performance in FPS on this game then a muliti core of 3 Ghz. Using more then 4 gi of memory for this game is useless has it can only aces 2 gi. And usually it will crash around 1.4 and 1.7 Gi load.

SSD drives will improve performance a lot in principle, has it a lot faster then any normal HD. CPU and memory can access the info a lot faster and wait less to execute calculation.

For AMD multicore, since I have 1, I can say that Ocing the HT improve the game FPS and also OCing the CPU speed. The FX-6100 runs at 3300 Ghz and has 2Gi of HT. I run mine on a low OC that was determine by the motherboard has stable. It curently runs at 3.6 Ghz and has a 2.1gHz HT OC. I don't think the HT can be pust a lot. But has Hz can, I seen this system spec OCed to close to 5Ghz on forums. Some succeed to OC it at 4.7 and have a stable system. The FPS gain is not much, whit a lot of player in TW I can get down to 7 FPS. So far I havent seen lower except on normal operation were I see 4 and 5 FPS.

Jaabg - Sanctuary · February 2013

TCHP - Lost City wrote: »

Thank you b:cute.

Last night in NW, i closed down my second client. Restarted the pc, closed all programs, services i could find, had windows 8 running on a one gig or ram, processes were 35 i think.

Before i did the above, i used to have 300~700 ping, fps at 15~30, for the whole nw.

I did the above changes, my ping was 100~300 (no one using the net). My fps was 80~100, mostly 100.

One would expect with those numbers to have a smooth gameplay, but my game play experience was very choppy still. There were times where it would take me 2~4 seconds before things would move on the screen.

I don't believe my issues are coming out of the machine, it is the way the game is interacting. There is some option, some feature, service that is causing problems, and i can't seem to find it.

A thing i noted, when my fps was 100, my graphics card fan started demanding attention, when i increased to full settings, the same thing happened. I am guessing the gpu is used after all, otherwise fan speed would constant, and not jump by 15~25%.

MythTiger - Harshlands · February 2013

Well I play on a HP dm1 netbook and I do fine.
I have to lower my distances though, any more than 20 meters and I'm scrwd. I haven't tried NW or TW with effects like soften on though... guess I'm afraid my lap dies on me

Allisandre - Sanctuary · February 2013

Jaabg - Sanctuary wrote: »

Last night in NW, i closed down my second client. Restarted the pc, closed all programs, services i could find, had windows 8 running on a one gig or ram, processes were 35 i think.

Before i did the above, i used to have 300~700 ping, fps at 15~30, for the whole nw.

I did the above changes, my ping was 100~300 (no one using the net). My fps was 80~100, mostly 100.

One would expect with those numbers to have a smooth gameplay, but my game play experience was very choppy still. There were times where it would take me 2~4 seconds before things would move on the screen.

I don't believe my issues are coming out of the machine, it is the way the game is interacting. There is some option, some feature, service that is causing problems, and i can't seem to find it.

A thing i noted, when my fps was 100, my graphics card fan started demanding attention, when i increased to full settings, the same thing happened. I am guessing the gpu is used after all, otherwise fan speed would constant, and not jump by 15~25%.

Just out of curiosity...

That the hell kind of system do you have that the CPU and GPU are good enough to run the client at 100FPS, but has only 1GB of RAM?
Any halfway decent system would have a minimum of 4GB of RAM, especially if you're planning on running Vista or newer. I mean, the absolute minimum you can reasonably get by running the OS with is 1GB, and the client will eat 2GB easily. At a minimum you're thrashing your HD with pagefile usage because you have no RAM to speak of, and that will kill your FPS.

And of course the client uses the GPU, how else do you think things appear on your screen? It's not the primary core that's used for processing the interface though, your CPU is.

Jaabg - Sanctuary · February 2013

Should have made clear, my bad. 1 gb ram being used by the sytem. Total is 8gb. Client takes 700m mostly, unless playing for long, goes up to 900mb range.

It was the sudden increase in gpu fan speed that got me intrigued. 2 clients = low fan speed, switch to one client, fan speed increases, same settings on both clients.

Allisandre - Sanctuary · February 2013

Jaabg - Sanctuary wrote: »

Should have made clear, my bad. 1 gb ram being used by the sytem. Total is 8gb. Client takes 700m mostly, unless playing for long, goes up to 900mb range.

It was the sudden increase in gpu fan speed that got me intrigued. 2 clients = low fan speed, switch to one client, fan speed increases, same settings on both clients.

That makes more sense. Are you running fullscreen with one client? Also, with two clients, unless you're using a 3rd party program or have manually edited elementclient.exe, the client that is out of focus does not use the GPU at all and it's processes are cut in half as it slows to 50% speed.

Jaabg - Sanctuary · February 2013

Allisandre - Sanctuary wrote: »

That makes more sense. Are you running fullscreen with one client? Also, with two clients, unless you're using a 3rd party program or have manually edited elementclient.exe, the client that is out of focus does not use the GPU at all and it's processes are cut in half as it slows to 50% speed.

Never knew that, thank you.

prof · February 2013

TCHP - Lost City wrote: »

keep in mind PWI is still a 32 bit system and there are limitation the the hardware it can use.

all games are ran in x86 for compatibility, because x86 will run natively on x64; however, x64 will not run at all on x86. this is not a limitation, you're an idiot.

TCHP - Lost City wrote: »

The game was build before the video card started to replace the CPU to remove work load from it and allow the system to run faster. So video card won't improve PWI a lot.

the current version of pwi, as well as the game engine, is from 2009. your opinion is moot.

TCHP - Lost City wrote: »

On a 32 bit program like PWI there is a cap of 2 Gi of memory addressing it can use. Unlike on a 64 bit made program. This is what makes the game crash sometimes, has it's addressing get full, and it needs more.

x86 caps at 3.5gb of memory, not 2. this is also not a fault of the architecture of the program, it's that the client doesn't dump memory that's not in use. this has been an issue ever since pw upgraded past 1.3.

TCHP - Lost City wrote: »

Also the game is not built to run on multiple core and multiple video card. To do this you need an os or program that will do it for the game. For example, on win 7 the OS is program to handle older program. It uses a kind of virtual CPU to let the application believes it's on 1 cpu. BUT this has an impact on the fps because the CPU need time to reorganize the splitting, and joining of the information it has to calculate on it's multiple core. While the impact is minimized by a faster core, it can still be hold has it wait for 1 core to finish the calculation.

you can't "make" a program utilize multiple cores; this is a limitation set to the program, not the operating system. the developers(or anyone skilled in hex) would have to edit core files and the client in order to use more than one core. changing the affinity, or pretending you can "simulate a single core", is stupid.

TCHP - Lost City wrote: »

An OCed single core CPU at 4 Ghz ( if you find one ) will deliver more/same performance in FPS on this game then a muliti core of 3 Ghz. Using more then 4 gi of memory for this game is useless has it can only aces 2 gi. And usually it will crash around 1.4 and 1.7 Gi load.

obviously, the game is single threaded.

TCHP - Lost City wrote: »

SSD drives will improve performance a lot in principle, has it a lot faster then any normal HD. CPU and memory can access the info a lot faster and wait less to execute calculation.

no. the extent of the use of a faster hdd would be opening and closing the client. any performance gain you might be able to gain in any other aspect of the game would be unnoticeable.

TCHP - Lost City wrote: »

For AMD multicore, since I have 1, I can say that Ocing the HT improve the game FPS and also OCing the CPU speed. The FX-6100 runs at 3300 Ghz and has 2Gi of HT. I run mine on a low OC that was determine by the motherboard has stable. It curently runs at 3.6 Ghz and has a 2.1gHz HT OC. I don't think the HT can be pust a lot. But has Hz can, I seen this system spec OCed to close to 5Ghz on forums. Some succeed to OC it at 4.7 and have a stable system. The FPS gain is not much, whit a lot of player in TW I can get down to 7 FPS. So far I havent seen lower except on normal operation were I see 4 and 5 FPS.

every time you say gi i cringe

Joe - Momaganon · February 2013

All these Problems seem to be Caused by the poor Memory Management of the Client itself. We are all aware of the damn memory leak crashes aso...just recently found a Post on the JD forums (which uses the same Engine as PWI) and someone mentioned a Program which drastically reduced the memory usage of the JD Client which I think could work well on PWI too.

Like Jaab said he got a performance Boost after he restarted and ofc that can only mean that the memory management, nvm if it's GRAM or common RAM, is simply ****. After a restart all Memory will be unloaded so everything is fresh and free from memory garbage that was collected from the client.

So if that program really is able to keep the client clean all the time...then that could practically solve all our problems but I wasn't able to test it yet due to the fact that I'm still at work. I will test it in about 6 hours away from that post and will give you the results afterwards.

OFC I can't name the Programm due to the fact of possible Ban. Just google for "Kerkia" and Click on the download for something containing a word similiar to "very small" and that has something to do with mem-ory.

If you like to try it out for yourselfes then be free to post your results here (:

Allisandre - Sanctuary · February 2013

prof wrote: »

all games are ran in x86 for compatibility, because x86 will run natively on x64; however, x64 will not run at all on x86. this is not a limitation, you're an idiot.

Actually, if the engine is managed properly, and the game in question isn't stuck in "Program Files (x86)", it will utilize the faster processing speed of x64. No it won't run in a true 64-bit environment, but it will get a noticeable improvement.

prof wrote: »

the current version of pwi, as well as the game engine, is from 2009. your opinion is moot.

Actually, the game engine is from 2004. At that time high-end video cards had 64MB of RAM. The majority of the actual video processing was performed by the CPU. As of the Sirens of War update, the interface has been updated to support he 2006 DirectX 9.0c standards, but still primarily uses DirectX8.
A super-powerful SLI rig won't help your game much at all because of this. It's all in the CPU.
What TCHP states is a fact, not an opinion. You stand looking the idiot here.

prof wrote: »

x86 caps at 3.5gb of memory, not 2. this is also not a fault of the architecture of the program, it's that the client doesn't dump memory that's not in use. this has been an issue ever since pw upgraded past 1.3.

Modern x86 caps at 3.5. Older programs are capped at 2. This is an older program. The client is unable to utilize more than 2GB of RAM.
Again, this is because the game engine is circa 2004 and the only place you saw 4GB systems with multi-core processors back then was in servers.
Once more you are showing your ignorance.

prof wrote: »

you can't "make" a program utilize multiple cores; this is a limitation set to the program, not the operating system. the developers(or anyone skilled in hex) would have to edit core files and the client in order to use more than one core. changing the affinity, or pretending you can "simulate a single core", is stupid.

What TCHP stated is entirely true. I have tested it on the client using similar software. After all is said and done, there is hardly an improvement.

prof wrote: »

obviously, the game is single threaded.

Well obviously, as previously stated. So you've shown you're not a complete moron and do have some understanding of reality.

prof wrote: »

no. the extent of the use of a faster hdd would be opening and closing the client. any performance gain you might be able to gain in any other aspect of the game would be unnoticeable.

Opening and closing the client, loading areas, and anytime you're moving and it's loading textures. It's not much, but testing I have done shows about a 5% improvement when switching the game from a standard SATA drive to two SATA drives running in a RAID stripe.

prof wrote: »

every time you say gi i cringe

I do agree with you here. not sure how GB turns into Gi.

Joe - Momaganon · February 2013

Maybe the "Gi" is intentionally?! OFC GB would also be more wrong then Gi, just because we are talking about potences of 2 which can't be GB Gigabyte (Giga = 1.000.000.000). The right version would be GiB Gibibyte (Gibi = 1.073.741.824).

Seems like his name is a reference on DHCP so I assume he is definitly one from the IT-Sector^^

BTW: I'm often too lazy myself to pay attention to it so I useally use GB as well =P

Moranine - Lost City · February 2013

CPU - Intel Core i7 2600k 3.4 GHz (OC'd to 4) (PWI still no support multi cores)
HDD - 1 120 GB SSD and 2 500 GB HDDs in a RAID0 Solution
GPU - 2x EVGA GeForce GTX 570 in SLi (Too bad PWI doesn't Support SLi yet)(Base Clock)
RAM - 16GB DDR2 (Don't remember the speed, not at home to check)

I don't do TW much but I average a 100-200 ping and about 40-90 fps in world, 70-90 fps in an instance 20-30 in West ADC and about 20-30 in NW as well, and this is usually with running the max 2 clients and a few other programs running (Firefox, Linux VM, Winamp, Skype, and sometimes Vent/TS). When in NW i turn my settings down from High to Moderate, it lags from time to time but thats generally my connection and not my computer.

Overall, the only bottleneck in my system is the speeds of the HDDs, but when it comes to playing PWI, PWI itself is the bottleneck, since they don't support multi-cores or SLi/CrossfireX your fps will be rather low. I'm still surprised they haven't added these supports yet. I still wouldn't expect much more then 30 fps even with the highest end gaming box with PWI, there's just no support for all the new technologies that came out in the past 3-4 years.

FPS in enemy base during tw

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